The Conservative Cave
Current Events => Politics => Topic started by: seahorse513 on April 05, 2012, 09:16:47 PM
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This has been bothering me for awhile. What is it about national healthcare that bothers you??? Is it strricyly the ObamaCare that makes you nervous?
http://www.dh.gov.uk/health/category/policy-areas/nhs/primary-care/
The above link is generally what would be covered in England
I found this interesting link..
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/03/30/what-doctor-knows-about-obamacare/
I know you folks don't like Wikipedia, but ....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patient_Protection_and_Affordable_Care_Act
maybe I am not understanding it... I am not sure how to word it like what Romney wants to do in changing it, in order to google it....
I want to get as much information as I can on this..
What it sounds like is, I am going to still be paying deductibles, premiums through my own employer as well as my taxes going to people who are uninsured..is this correct???
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I'll just tell you my personal experience without going into too many explicit details about my illness. I was diagnosed with a rare tumor in 2007, I joined a community with the few others that had this type of tumor, since it's considered rare the community had people from all over the world posting so the board was pretty active. Those of us from the US were diagnosed pretty quickly and had surgery pretty quickly. I was diagnosed a couple of weeks after my symptoms became extremely noticeable, had a CT Scan the same day the Doctor suggested it, went for a surgical consult within a week and a half, had a biopsy done, tumor was determined to be benign but of course they need to remove the tumor to be 100% positive, surgeon told me I could have surgery in 3 weeks if I wanted. That's my story, what were the stories of others who had socialized medicine? 1 guy from Great Britain took months to get diagnosed via CT Scan, he had a biopsy done, since the biopsy came back as benign the health system in Great Britain said he'd have to wait up to 18 months to have surgery, and as I said before, even if the biopsy is benign you need the tumor out to be definite. Numerous people from Australia had to wait 6 months to a year for the surgery, 1 person in Canada said screw it because of the wait time, she ended up borrowing the money and had the surgery within weeks at the Mayo Clinic. Another person from Canada had to travel over 200 miles for a PET Scan because that was the closest 1 available, whereas in my area? within 20 miles? there are 8 PET Scan machines available.
The wait times for appts. in Canada are outrageous, even for a PCP, a specialist is longer, why else are private clinics in Canada booming? why are Canadians coming here if they can afford it? in Great Britain the system is going broke, and in some instances Great Britain is outsourcing medical care to India, it's cheaper to fly people to India for treatment then to treat them in the UK.
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When I was 1st diagnosed in 1965 with my birth defect, because "synthetic " growth hormone was still in its testing stage(in the USA), my particular situation would never have been covered by national health: not until almost 15 years later, by that time my bones has fused...
there's alot of fine print...
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My medical problems would most likely be covered by Obamacare, but I would never receive the level of care and service I get from a private practice. My neurosurgeon has known me since 1979 and is one of the most competent and skilled doctors I have met. I have no doubt he earns a six-figure income from his practice and I don't begrudge him a penny of it.
Sometimes, you get what you pay for. The alternative scares the shit out of me.
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My medical problems would most likely be covered by Obamacare, but I would never receive the level of care and service I get from a private practice. My neurosurgeon has known me since 1979 and is one of the most competent and skilled doctors I have met. I have no doubt he earns a six-figure income from his practice and I don't begrudge him a penny of it.
Sometimes, you get what you pay for. The alternative scares the shit out of me.
That's the thing, right now the way the system is? everyone gets treated if they can't afford it, but if we have something like Obamacare? no way can they afford treating most people, so cuts and decisions will have to be made.
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Insurance does not equal care. One patient’s needs can get in the way of another’s needs. My waiting room is like so many others in America, and when it is clogged with several patients with low-paying highly-regulated insurance, the waiting time goes up and the access to quality medical care goes down.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/03/30/what-doctor-knows-about-obamacare/#ixzz1rE5HyjG7[/quote
This is a problem we are going to face. and if we want to see a private dr because the new healthcare doesn't provide it, we have to pay that as well as the national healthcare...
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You kind of see that now, more and more Doctors are either dropping Medicare or only keeping their current patients on Medicare but not taking new ones on.
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You kind of see that now, more and more Doctors are either dropping Medicare or only keeping their current patients on Medicare but not taking new ones on.
did you mean medicaid??(general populace) over medicare(elderly)?
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You kind of see that now, more and more Doctors are either dropping Medicare or only keeping their current patients on Medicare but not taking new ones on.
It's going to get worse.
If you want to see what 'worse' looks like, drop by the public/city hospital ER one day. No thanks, I'll take my risk with a private hospital and the bill collectors. Hell, I'm already there. I owe $25k in medical bills as it stands now, but I wouldn't trade that to give some Indian resident or public school graduate an opportunity to carve on my eyeballs.
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did you mean medicaid??(general populace) over medicare(elderly)?
I mean Medicare, Doctors are either not accepting it at all or they're just retaining their current Medicare patients but not taking on new patients. In my area? it's almost impossible to find any Doctor that accepts Medicaid, patients have to either go to a clinic or the ER.
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I mean Medicare, Doctors are either not accepting it at all or they're just retaining their current Medicare patients but not taking on new patients. In my area? it's almost impossible to find any Doctor that accepts Medicaid, patients have to either go to a clinic or the ER.
I am not up to snuff on this information as I should be.. How does Tricare(veteernas medical) compare?? I think a couple of you said you were not happy with it...
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I am not up to snuff on this information as I should be.. How does Tricare(veteernas medical) compare?? I think a couple of you said you were not happy with it...
I have no idea, I never heard of it.
BTW, overheard 1 Doctor talking to another Doctor, he was talking about Obamacare, he said Obama and Biden are f**king a-holes! :lmao:
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What it sounds like is, I am going to still be paying deductibles, premiums through my own employer as well as my taxes going to people who are uninsured..is this correct???
Well, yeah, where have you been? Because you're not reading us and you'll only have your private insurance for as long as they can stay in business, and Obama's MAIN mission is killing the private sector insurance companies. They can't operate in the red. The government can, will, and has been for years.
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no, that is not right!! In England, everyone has access to national health, the only time , they pay out of pocket, is when they see private doctor. Okay, that is what I want to make sure of...
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And look at the conditions inside NHS hospitals. About 10 years ago, the ex and I went to Ireland and England. I asked my doctor and insurance what I needed to do if I got sick or injured there. BOTH of them answered, "Come home and get treated here."
Cancer survival rates in socialized medicine countries SUCKS. Well below the US in just about every type of cancer.
Go up to Canada some weekend. Better yet, go to NY state, or any clinic close to the US/Canada border and count all the plates from Ontario, Quebec, etc. Ask how long it takes to get an artificial joint. Or heart surgery. Or permission to see a specialist. Or ask that government hack who pimped the Canadian system but flies to the US for heart surgery--and he ain't the only one. My particular favorite, however, was from about five years ago when a woman from Calgary (Calgary!!!) had to fly to Great Falls, MT. Why, you ask? Because she gave birth to quadruplets, and a city FOUR TIMES THE SIZE OF GREAT FALLS DIDN'T HAVE THE ****ING NEONATAL INTENSIVE CARE BEDSPACE!!!
Want some more examples?
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It's really quite basic:
The Constitution does not provide a guarantee for health care and certainly does not grant the federal government the power to mandate it.
That is the biggest threat to personal freedom I can think of. When the federal government has the power to REQUIRE you to have health care insurance, where does it end? What else is the federal government going to mandate?
The Commerce Clause in the Constitution has been cited as being the overall authority for this abomination but, in point of fact, the Commerce Clause has been very loosely interpreted by a number of Supreme Courts in the past 60-70 years or so. It's even to the point that the present SCOTUS questions the intent of the Commerce Clause and the government's overall use/abuse of that power.
Regarding TriCare, being an Army retiree, I am authorized that benefit but routinely do NOT partake of it. I have other resources available to me (for which I pay a monthly premium). But in general, TriCare is a wonderful benefit provided at a very reasonable (some might say obscenely cheap) cost.
I was unemployed for a 9-month period 12 years ago and was covered under TriCare at that time. That was a very good thing, because I had to have surgery. Had I not had TriCare, that procedure and 3 days in the hospital would've cost me $20K plus. It didn't cost me a dime. I am still grateful for that.
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+1 on what Euph said. Now, think about this, I pay about $3500 a year for health ins. Under the Obummer plan the ESTIMATE is $6500. How is this "free"? Do you really think that ANYTHING the Government does will actually come out costing what they say it will?
This bullshit needs to get flushed.
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Ireland is cutting their number of publicly supported nursing home beds.
If you want to know how the Feds manage health care, talk to some who are eligible for Indian Health Services. No matter how dedicated the staff is, they don't have the supplies. They are over-regulated and care is fixed according to diagnosis. Primary diagnosis. My kids were eligible, but after seeing the conditions, we chose to bust our tails to provide private health care.
Even now, patients who's third party payor is Medicare or Medicaid, get so-called rationed care, in some ways. Not evey procedure, surgery, of med is covered. There are a lot of hoops for the patient, doctor and support personnel to jump through. Tricare is the same. Pre-authorization, even after having physician orders, and lots of hoops.
I understand some of the reasoning behind all this, but it sure makes providing reasonable care tough sometimes.
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This has been bothering me for awhile. What is it about national healthcare that bothers you??? Is it strricyly the ObamaCare that makes you nervous?
It's not about health care it's about wealth transfer.
It's the proverbial camel's nose under the tent flap on controlling your entire life...wrapped in the guise of healthcare.
IF this gets fully implemented...everything from the car you drive to the clothes you wear to the type of food you buy at the grocery store will be controlled by the Federal government over concern for your "health".
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no, that is not right!! In England, everyone has access to national health, the only time , they pay out of pocket, is when they see private doctor. Okay, that is what I want to make sure of...
And how long do they have to wait to see s doctor?
You do realize that NHS is bankrupting the Government in England right?
A big reason we in the U.S. do not want nationalized healthcare is because we have talked to people here who've been treated under NHS whether in Canada or England and we've read the horror stories.
Everyone in England may have access to health care...but it doesn't mean they get it.
We have guarantees here too that everyone gets treated.
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I could easily fill page after page on why we MUST destroy Obamacare, but instead, I will direct you to Ronald Reagan expaining it far better than I could:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRdLpem-AAs
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Ireland is cutting their number of publicly supported nursing home beds.
If you want to know how the Feds manage health care, talk to some who are eligible for Indian Health Services. No matter how dedicated the staff is, they don't have the supplies. They are over-regulated and care is fixed according to diagnosis. Primary diagnosis. My kids were eligible, but after seeing the conditions, we chose to bust our tails to provide private health care.
Even now, patients who's third party payor is Medicare or Medicaid, get so-called rationed care, in some ways. Not evey procedure, surgery, of med is covered. There are a lot of hoops for the patient, doctor and support personnel to jump through. Tricare is the same. Pre-authorization, even after having physician orders, and lots of hoops.
I understand some of the reasoning behind all this, but it sure makes providing reasonable care tough sometimes.
A friend of mine sees a pain management doctor. He goes every month for blood tests and refills. He also goes three to four times a year for shots. In September he learned that his remaining visits for the year would no longer be paid for by Medicaid because they will only pay for 12 visits a year. If he'd of known that, he would have scheduled his shots and refill visits on the same days....
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There should be a way for people with pre-existing conditions to get insured. That way is NOT forcing me into some f'n government ponzu scheme. Put'em on Medicare and leave the rest of us the hell alone.
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Also, costs are outrageous. We need to drop the damn state to state restrictions and allow the free market to work.
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And how long do they have to wait to see s doctor?
You do realize that NHS is bankrupting the Government in England right?
A big reason we in the U.S. do not want nationalized healthcare is because we have talked to people here who've been treated under NHS whether in Canada or England and we've read the horror stories.
Everyone in England may have access to health care...but it doesn't mean they get it.
We have guarantees here too that everyone gets treated.
Yes it is very bad over there....my mum can tell you horror stories personally..had my mother not been there for my grandmother, being asserative the woman that she is , my grandmother would have died earlier than she did....NHS wouldn't pay for my great aunt's cataracts because she was over the age limit...wtf??? Medical staff are overworked and underpaid. The sanitation is not the best either.
I think people who really want socialized healthcare really need to look into other countries, and see how bad it really it is, and how so many countries are going bankrupt because of it. You are all right, I don't think Obamacare is going to be all its supporters think it will.
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Sentenced to death for being old: The NHS denies life-saving treatment to the elderly, as one man's chilling story reveals
When Kenneth Warden was diagnosed with terminal bladder cancer, his hospital consultant sent him home to die, ruling that at 78 he was too old to treat.
Even the palliative surgery or chemotherapy that could have eased his distressing symptoms were declared off-limits because of his age.
His distraught daughter Michele Halligan accepted the sad prognosis but was determined her father would spend his last months in comfort. So she paid for him to seen privately by a second doctor to discover what could be done to ease his symptoms.
Daily Mail (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2126379/Sentenced-death-old-The-NHS-denies-life-saving-treatment-elderly-mans-chilling-story-reveals.html#ixzz1rQ2J8z59)