The Conservative Cave
Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: franksolich on October 21, 2011, 06:43:09 PM
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http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2162893
Oh my.
The Chronic Whiner of Skins's island.
Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Fri Oct-21-11 05:58 PM
Original message
An act we never faced up to. Dropping two atomic bombs on Japan.
I was fortunate enough to have as a friend an elderly man who had fought in WWII. And he believed that nuking Japan was one of the worst crimes in human history.
There are those who sit in bars and talk about how, if we didn’t drop those bombs, a million American troops would have died invading the Japanese mainland. No one really knows or can know if this was true.
And there are others who believe, as did my friend, that it was unnecessary and perhaps the most barbaric act in human history. He believed that a nuclear demonstration would have been sufficient.
Before you respond to this thread, keep in mind that those two bombs were dropped on cities. They weren’t dropped on military installations. They were dropped on civilian populations – children, women, old people – two cities filled with human beings.
None of us can fully put ourselves back into that era and we couldn’t know how we would have felt about it at the time.
Since then, no nuclear weapon has been used. Perhaps the horror was/is just too terrible to deal with.
So let me get to the bottom line. There are some here on DU who were alive back then. Most of us were not. But whether you were alive or not, what are your thoughts about nuking a civilian population?
On edit: And the reason I ask this is because I have heard too many people say "We should just stop screwing around and nuke (fill in the blank)."
Oscar Wilde went through all the time and trouble to post his whine, and then went away without commenting about the comments of the other primitives. There's a lot of comments, about half agreeing with Oscar, about half disagreeing with Oscar.
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Well, FDR was the one who set the victory terms of "Unconditionl Surrender" and nobody even knew that that meant, not even Truman when he took over.
So, since thatwas the condition that had been set Truman had no choice but to seek unconditional surrender.
Juxtaposed against this was the fact America wanted the war over. They wanted their civilian economy back.
Truman had to obtain surrender and FAST.
He couldn't pay the price in blood invading and starving the Japs would have taken too long.
So all he had left was that nifty bomb his predecessor left to him.
I don't understand the big deal anyway. An A-bomb is no more destructive than a fleet of bombers and we were sending those over daily.
Face facts, Japan is better today for the ass-waxing they took. Would he rather have the militant shintoist back?
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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Fri Oct-21-11 05:58 PM
Original message
An act we never faced up to. Dropping two atomic bombs on Japan.
I was fortunate enough to have as a friend an elderly man who had fought in WWII. And he believed that nuking Japan was one of the worst crimes in human history.
If true at all, I'm betting he was not in ground combat in the Pacific or CBI Theaters.
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If true at all, I'm betting he was not in ground combat in the Pacific or CBI Theaters.
I'm betting Oscar made him up.
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I'm betting Oscar made him up.
That is far and away the most likely explanation, of course WW2 had the same share of fake vets as every other war, that's also a possibility.
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The Japs raped Nanking...300,000 men, women and children in just one incident.
Battan Death March...I could go on about the Japanese cruelty but the DUmmies won't believe it.
AND DAMN IT, I was talking today to a 94 year old real WW2 vet. He served in Europe with the Third Armored Division, "The Spearhead" and don't confuse that with that with The Third Army. The Spearhead vets don't like that. Anyway he was the first one to cross the Siegfried Line. They pushed dirt with tanks to build a ramp over the dragons teeth. They crossed about 4 in the afternoon and took some German town. He said they got the hell shelled out of them that night......
Awh the hell with the DUmmies. Any DUmmies that entertains that kind of thinking should be shot as traitors. I might still be here but I probably would have been fatherless if they hadn't dropped the bombs. So you lily livered DUmmie pussies can kiss my ass.
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Cyrano, get the frack over it. It's been over 60 years. A dem president faced what many would view as a difficult decision and made the call that would save American lives. I know it's hard to believe that a dem president made a choice for America, but it did happen.
As far your friend thinking a nuclear demonstration would have been sufficient. If I remember correctly, President Truman warned them. Then he gave a nuclear demonstration on on August 6, 1945 in Hiroshima. It took yet another demonstration in Nagasaki before the Japanese were convinced to surrender.
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World War II was full of attacks on cities, the German Blitzkriegs, the firebombing of Dresden, etc. In the 40's we had no knowledge regarding the cancer causing affects of nuclear bombs, or that the affects would linger for decades.
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I think Oscar Wilde must have read some article about how B. Hussein Obama had intended to apologize to the Japanese, but the Japanese did NOT want him too.
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If you feel this badly about it, Oscar, why don't you self-imnukulate yourself on YouTube as a way to atone.
I'm just happy 2 million American military men didn't have to lose their lives invading Japan.
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If you feel this badly about it, Oscar, why don't you self-imnukulate yourself on YouTube as a way to atone.
I'm just happy 2 million American military men didn't have to lose their lives invading Japan.
You're happy....just think how those 2 million felt....they were probably ecstatic.
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I think Oscar Wilde must have read some article about how B. Hussein Obama had intended to apologize to the Japanese, but the Japanese did NOT want him too.
That's what I think too.
It's obvious Oscar Wilde reads Drudge, just like I do.
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World War II was full of attacks on cities, the German Blitzkriegs, the firebombing of Dresden, etc. In the 40's we had no knowledge regarding the cancer causing affects of nuclear bombs, or that the affects would linger for decades.
From ASK.COM....
The two nuclear bombs, combined, killed an estimated 130,000 people. The fire bombings of Tokyo killed an estimated 140,000 including 100,000 on a single night (March 8-9, 1945).
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I think Oscar Wilde must have read some article about how B. Hussein Obama had intended to apologize to the Japanese, but the Japanese did NOT want him too.
There's a very good reason for that. The Japanese government has NEVER, not once, ever apologized for a single atrocity committed during their expansion prior to and during WWII. Not about Nanking, not about the comfort women, not about their POW camps, not about their medical experimentation which would have made Mengele puke, none of it. To accept the US apology would mean the Japanese would have to acknowledge the wrongs they had done in that timeframe.
Not only that, it's simply NOT discussed in Japanese schools. There are at least a couple of generations of Japanese who are totally ignorant of the atrocities perpetrated in the name of the Emperor. I've literally seen Japanese teens and young adults laughing at the Arizona Memorial because they knew nothing of Pearl Harbor and thought it was all bullshit. Believe me, there are still a few survivors and a few folks set their shit straight real quick.
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There's a very good reason for that. The Japanese government has NEVER, not once, ever apologized for a single atrocity committed during their expansion prior to and during WWII. Not about Nanking, not about the comfort women, not about their POW camps, not about their medical experimentation which would have made Mengele puke, none of it. To accept the US apology would mean the Japanese would have to acknowledge the wrongs they had done in that timeframe.
Not only that, it's simply NOT discussed in Japanese schools. There are at least a couple of generations of Japanese who are totally ignorant of the atrocities perpetrated in the name of the Emperor. I've literally seen Japanese teens and young adults laughing at the Arizona Memorial because they knew nothing of Pearl Harbor and thought it was all bullshit. Believe me, there are still a few survivors and a few folks set their shit straight real quick.
I was talking to the mother of a Korean friend, and she was telling me that her mother never learned to read because her parents didn't let her out of the house when she was young out of fear that she would be kidnapped by the Japanese soldiers.
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You're happy....just think how those 2 million felt....they were probably ecstatic.
Don't forget the 10 million or so Japanese civilians that had their lives saved by the bombs.
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From what I've heard from a host of family members who were around at the time, the reaction to the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki was universal jubilation.
Everyone in uniform at the time expected a high probability of death in the coming invasion. They and their loved ones, a group that included nearly everyone in the country, were overjoyed at news of a weapon so powerful it would end the war.
It's only been since the democrat party went crazy with hatred for America that it's become popular to question the morality of America defending itself in the most effective manner available.
Prior to the onset of democrat insanity, which began in the late 60s, criticizing President Truman's decision was the province of lunatics. It still is.
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It's only been since the democrat party went crazy with hatred for America that it's become popular to question the morality of America defending itself in the most effective manner available.
Prior to the onset of democrat insanity, which began in the late 60s, criticizing President Truman's decision was the province of lunatics. It still is.
Hear, hear.
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From what I've heard from a host of family members who were around at the time, the reaction to the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki was universal jubilation.
Everyone in uniform at the time expected a high probability of death in the coming invasion. They and their loved ones, a group that included nearly everyone in the country, were overjoyed at news of a weapon so powerful it would end the war.
It's only been since the democrat party went crazy with hatred for America that it's become popular to question the morality of America defending itself in the most effective manner available.
Prior to the onset of democrat insanity, which began in the late 60s, criticizing President Truman's decision was the province of lunatics. It still is.
To this day, every Purple Heart medal issued is one that was originally ordered in anticipation of the invasion of Japan.
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I didn't read all the posts... but I will say this:
Back in the 80's, the libbies were screaming about the x yrs anniversary of the A-bombs being dropped on Japan. Best political cartoon I have ever seen was in my local paper. Had a jap guy with a sign that said "No more Hiroshima". Next to him was an American guy with a sign that said "Easy, no more Pearl Harbor".
Enough said.
Edited to fix a html error.
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I didn't read all the posts... but I will say this:
Back in the 80's, the libbies were screaming about the x yrs anniversary of the A-bombs being dropped on Japan. Best political cartoon I have ever seen was in my local paper. Had a jap guy with a sign that said "No more Hiroshima". Next to him was an American guy with a sign that said "Easy, no more Pearl Harbor".
Enough said.
Edited to fix a html error.
The American guy should have held a sign that said: "No more Hiroshima? That may take more bombs."
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Tune in again in a few years after some Muzzies have turned some fellow DUmmies into radioactive fallout and lets see what their thoughts and attitudes are then.
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Tune in again in a few years after some Muzzies have turned some fellow DUmmies into radioactive fallout and lets see what their thoughts and attitudes are then.
Their demogogues, flacks, and shills in the press will no doubt proclaim it was all Bush's fault.
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An act we never faced up to. Dropping two atomic bombs on Japan.
What's to own up to? Surrender, or we'll bomb you back to the stone age. They're lucky we didn't fly 100 atomic bombs instead of 2.
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Actually, dropping the second bomb was a HUGE bluff, as all the fissile material that the US had produced to date was contained in the bomb tested at Alamagordo or the ones dropped on Japan. Had they decided not to surrender, we would have been left with no option but to invade.
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Actually, dropping the second bomb was a HUGE bluff, as all the fissile material that the US had produced to date was contained in the bomb tested at Alamagordo or the ones dropped on Japan. Had they decided not to surrender, we would have been left with no option but to invade.
Well...or wait a few months. We weren't really ready to invade yet anyway, at that point, it probably would've been Spring of 1946.
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Well...or wait a few months. We weren't really ready to invade yet anyway, at that point, it probably would've been Spring of 1946.
While fire-bombing the shit out of 'em, which is something I really don't have a problem with.
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Actually, dropping the second bomb was a HUGE bluff, as all the fissile material that the US had produced to date was contained in the bomb tested at Alamagordo or the ones dropped on Japan. Had they decided not to surrender, we would have been left with no option but to invade.
I read somewhere once that we had enough bomb grade material to put together one more...but the next one after that third one would have been sometime after november 1, 1945.
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To this day, every Purple Heart medal issued is one that was originally ordered in anticipation of the invasion of Japan.
Mine was.
The current issue are not.