The Conservative Cave
Current Events => General Discussion => Topic started by: Gina on February 19, 2011, 08:43:58 AM
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Just was thinking about something. We went to an Eagle Scout ceremony. There were cops there, letters from the governor, city council, and even a letter from the President congratulating the kid.
I was kind of surprised that nothing has been said about this from the left considering that the Boy Scouts are anti-gay member. What are your thoughts?
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The primitives are notorious anti-Boy Scouts, with a record of that going back mucho years.
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I think the anti homosexual policy is gone, but the BSA is so loosely controlled, if some scoutmaster somewhere is a homophobe, then no homosexuals will likely be in that troop.
I used to be a Boy Scout, so I have a general understanding of the politics of it. The BSA may have official policies on things, but it doesn't have a whole lot of control over each troop.
Alot of the anti homosexual sentiment will come from the other scouts themselves. Seeing as you can be as like ten or in fifth grade to be a boy scout, theres alot of immature behavior. Kids are going to make fun of any kid that doesn't follow their idea of normal.
But the policy itself is terrible, it encourages closet homosexuality, which is not good for any developing child.
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I think the anti homosexual policy is gone, but the BSA is so loosely controlled, if some scoutmaster somewhere is a homophobe, then no homosexuals will likely be in that troop.
I used to be a Boy Scout, so I have a general understanding of the politics of it. The BSA may have official policies on things, but it doesn't have a whole lot of control over each troop.
Alot of the anti homosexual sentiment will come from the other scouts themselves. Seeing as you can be as like ten or in fifth grade to be a boy scout, theres alot of immature behavior. Kids are going to make fun of any kid that doesn't follow their idea of normal.
But the policy itself is terrible, it encourages closet homosexuality, which is not good for any developing child.
Not sure about your comment about encouraging closet Homosexuality in kids. Why should kids unsure of their sexual identify not keep that question from others. Some kids waver on the brink of their new found sexuality, Hell these are kids whose hormones have kicked in and have no idea what to do about sudden urges that they have never felt before.
Whole new life for a male or female when their body's go on a rampage of hormones and make the kids scared of what is happening to them.
This is a time when the youth grow hair on their private parts, girls begin to develop boobs and shave their legs. Their childhood is past, and now these kids are going into uncharted territory. Who is to help them, not their fathers for girls and the boys cannot go to their mothers .
Kids get their sex education on the street, they talk with others and have to learn that way. For a young man that is all so confused this may mark him as gay or at least very strange. The boy may be picked on or even bullied at home from a father that expect his son to be a man but never took the time to tell his son what a REAL man is.
Scout Leaders have no business getting into this sex thing as they have to except each kid as they get them. If they try speaking to a Scout about sex, they loose their job. Heck of a problem for the Scout Leaders, they see a kid that needs to have help but have to ignore them.
The number of parents that refuse to discuss sex with their children is amazing, mostly because of their own ignorance on the subject. You can just imagine being a 30 year old man with a wife at work and your 12 year old daughter comes to you upset as she has blood in her pants. What do any man do, ----tell her to wait until her mother comes home and ask her.
A 15 year old boy comes to his mother and tells her there is something wrong with his dick, he cannot pee and the color of it is blue. Will that mother LOOK at the problem or take him into emergency without any idea what the problem is.?
Lots to think about here on kids that go over night from a child to a sexual being. How do expect outsiders to take on the job we parents should be doing but because of our own hang ups refuse to do.?
Then if one teacher or Scout Master tries to help the kid , you sue them or have them arrested.
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They try to screen out gay scout masters.
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Not sure about your comment about encouraging closet Homosexuality in kids. Why should kids unsure of their sexual identify not keep that question from others. Some kids waver on the brink of their new found sexuality, Hell these are kids whose hormones have kicked in and have no idea what to do about sudden urges that they have never felt before.
Whole new life for a male or female when their body's go on a rampage of hormones and make the kids scared of what is happening to them.
This is a time when the youth grow hair on their private parts, girls begin to develop boobs and shave their legs. Their childhood is past, and now these kids are going into uncharted territory. Who is to help them, not their fathers for girls and the boys cannot go to their mothers .
Kids get their sex education on the street, they talk with others and have to learn that way. For a young man that is all so confused this may mark him as gay or at least very strange. The boy may be picked on or even bullied at home from a father that expect his son to be a man but never took the time to tell his son what a REAL man is.
Scout Leaders have no business getting into this sex thing as they have to except each kid as they get them. If they try speaking to a Scout about sex, they loose their job. Heck of a problem for the Scout Leaders, they see a kid that needs to have help but have to ignore them.
The number of parents that refuse to discuss sex with their children is amazing, mostly because of their own ignorance on the subject. You can just imagine being a 30 year old man with a wife at work and your 12 year old daughter comes to you upset as she has blood in her pants. What do any man do, ----tell her to wait until her mother comes home and ask her.
A 15 year old boy comes to his mother and tells her there is something wrong with his dick, he cannot pee and the color of it is blue. Will that mother LOOK at the problem or take him into emergency without any idea what the problem is.?
Lots to think about here on kids that go over night from a child to a sexual being. How do expect outsiders to take on the job we parents should be doing but because of our own hang ups refuse to do.?
Then if one teacher or Scout Master tries to help the kid , you sue them or have them arrested.
We sure do live in a backwards society....
They try to screen out gay scout masters.
I don't think that has anything to do with the issue.
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I don't think that has anything to do with the issue.
Actually, it does. I'm pretty sure the word, "moral" is somewhere in the Scout's "rules" or creed. Homosexuality is immoral. The same could apply to a Bigamist, a pedophile or a known fornicator.
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Actually, it does. I'm pretty sure the word, "moral" is somewhere in the Scout's "rules" or creed. Homosexuality is immoral. The same could apply to a Bigamist, a pedophile or a known fornicator.
Okay then. Explain why homosexuality is immoral.
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Okay then. Explain why homosexuality is immoral.
Any sex outside marriage is immoral.
The "anti-homosexual" requirement for leaders is to protect the scouts. Just as we wouldn't send our girl scouts out for a 2 week camping trip with a bunch of middle-aged men that would find those girls very enticing, we don't want to send our boys out with leaders that would find them very enticing. It has a lot less to do with general immorality and a lot more to do with the requirement to protect our children from abuse.
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Any sex outside marriage is immoral.
The "anti-homosexual" requirement for leaders is to protect the scouts. Just as we wouldn't send our girl scouts out for a 2 week camping trip with a bunch of middle-aged men that would find those girls very enticing, we don't want to send our boys out with leaders that would find them very enticing. It has a lot less to do with general immorality and a lot more to do with the requirement to protect our children from abuse.
Correct, essentially we don't want the scouts being accosted into a makeshift "Greek symposium" because some bleeding heart liberal wants to be "inclusive".
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Any sex outside marriage is immoral.
The "anti-homosexual" requirement for leaders is to protect the scouts. Just as we wouldn't send our girl scouts out for a 2 week camping trip with a bunch of middle-aged men that would find those girls very enticing, we don't want to send our boys out with leaders that would find them very enticing. It has a lot less to do with general immorality and a lot more to do with the requirement to protect our children from abuse.
Morality: Sex outside marriage is not related to homosexuality in a morality sense. Why did you bring it up?
I thought this thread was about the scouts, not the Scout leaders....
(I acutally can't check, my mouse decided to stop working)
But I agree, there is sufficent reason to not allow homosexual scout leaders. But what about the scouts themselves? The current policy still does (I checked) dissalow homosexual scouts from joining?
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Morality: Sex outside marriage is not related to homosexuality in a morality sense. Why did you bring it up?
You asked why homosexuality is immoral, I answered. Why did you bring it up?
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Any sex outside marriage is immoral.
The "anti-homosexual" requirement for leaders is to protect the scouts. Just as we wouldn't send our girl scouts out for a 2 week camping trip with a bunch of middle-aged men that would find those girls very enticing, we don't want to send our boys out with leaders that would find them very enticing. It has a lot less to do with general immorality and a lot more to do with the requirement to protect our children from abuse.
Nor would we put a sixteen year-old girl in the same two-man tent with a sixteen year-old boy, which would be the rough equivalent of integrating homosexual scouts into a troop.
It also has to do with the "honor code" that scouts are taught to live by. It would be likely difficult for an "enlightened" Canadian to understand, but most of us down here in the lower 48 really don't give a crap which gender you prefer.....it is the actual "acts" that the vast majority of us find abhorrent.
Promiscuity, the spread of STD's, high levels of mental illness and suicides indicate that practicing homosexuals are really not conducive to an ordered environment like the Boy Scouts. Parents encourage their children to enter scouting to learn integrity, honor, patriotism, and life skills. not to learn how to participate in a gay pride parade.
doc
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You asked why homosexuality is immoral, I answered. Why did you bring it up?
Homosexuality isn't just about sex. It's a state of identity.
You then said sex outside of marriage is immoral. That didn't really answer. But never mind. Why is sex outside of marriage immoral?
People seem to throw the word immoral out at anything they disprove of now adays.
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Homosexuality isn't just about sex. It's a state of identity.
You then said sex outside of marriage is immoral. That didn't really answer. But never mind. Why is sex outside of marriage immoral?
People seem to throw the word immoral out at anything they disprove of now adays.
Hello, McFly? Any identity derived from "Homosexuality" is done so exclusively from the penchant for sexual intercourse with those of the same gender of those who choose to so identify. Get it? Without the lusting after same-sex booty, the homosexual identity dissolves into nothingness.
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Homosexuality isn't just about sex. It's a state of identity.
You then said sex outside of marriage is immoral. That didn't really answer. But never mind. Why is sex outside of marriage immoral?
People seem to throw the word immoral out at anything they disprove of now adays.
Bertram.....your question has been asked and answered. I won't allow this thread to be derailed into a discussion of the pros and cons of homosexuality. Should you wish to discuss that topic further, either start another thread, or do a little research and reading and you will find that the subject has been discussed ad nauseum, and our position on it made quite clear.
Please stay on topic.....
Thank you.
doc
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Homosexuality isn't just about sex. It's a state of identity.
You then said sex outside of marriage is immoral. That didn't really answer. But never mind. Why is sex outside of marriage immoral?
People seem to throw the word immoral out at anything they disprove of now adays.
Sex outside marriage has always been immoral. This isn't something that we just happen to think "now adays." And as you say, homosexuality isn't just about sex. In fact, any homosexual that avoids sex also avoids the immoral aspect of it.
Sorry, doc, didn't see your post until after I replied. I'm off this thread. Bye!
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Just was thinking about something. We went to an Eagle Scout ceremony. There were cops there, letters from the governor, city council, and even a letter from the President congratulating the kid.
I was kind of surprised that nothing has been said about this from the left considering that the Boy Scouts are anti-gay member. What are your thoughts?
I pinned on (no, that's not right -- my mother pinned it on) my Eagle Scout rank in September, 1970. At that time, the only reference made to homosexuality was done as an expression of disgust on the part of the other scouts. I utterly fail to understand how Boy Scouts can be wrapped around the entire issue of homosexuality these days. By definition, Boy Scouts -- being teenagers -- are unsure about themselves, their own identity, and perhaps in a few rare cases, about their own sexuality.
These things even out in time, most often without any "help" from the "enlightened ones" who continue to push their leftist agenda.
That said, things have changed. When I was a Scout, women were NOT included as Boy Scout leaders. They can, and often were, Den Mothers for Cub Scouts, but Boy Scouts were led by men.
Of course, that's all changed now. Women are now Boy Scout leaders.
I don't get that. Not at all. No slam against women, but I just don't understand why a woman would want to be involved with leading a bunch of teenage boys.
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Sorry, doc, didn't see your post until after I replied. I'm off this thread. Bye!
That's OK......the subject of Boy Scouts is one that is near and dear to my heart. I was involved in scouting from age 11 until they tossed me out due to age at 21, and since I lost my father at a young age, scouting was of immense value to me. I strongly object to those casting aspersions on scouting for ANY reason, their position on homosexuality included.
Oh, and Euph....I didn't know that there were women scoutmasters....when the hell did THAT happen??
doc
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Hello, McFly? Any identity derived from "Homosexuality" is done so exclusively from the penchant for sexual intercourse with those of the same gender of those who choose to so identify. Get it? Without the lusting after same-sex booty, the homosexual identity dissolves into nothingness.
I suppose that one COULD conceivably be a homosexual & celibate. But, as you stated, that would diverge into nothingness.
TVDOC, apparently 1988...
http://timpanogos.wordpress.com/2006/12/16/first-woman-scoutmaster-catherine-pollard/
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My son just this weekend spent 2 days/nights in the mountains backpacking/camping with his Boy Scout Troop. Do you think I'd let him go on these trips if they were accompanied by a couple of flaming homos?
accompanied: in out troop the boys lead...my son is senior patrol leader so he leads.
couple: don't get a hard-on Bertram...because of homos it is scout policy that there must at all times be 2 adult leaders with the scouts and an adult leader can not be 'alone' with a scout at any time. An adult leader can tent with a scout "if" that scout is "his" son.
Lot of other rules to but this discussion isn't about scouting, it's about destroying anything moral in this country.
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I pinned on (no, that's not right -- my mother pinned it on) my Eagle Scout rank in September, 1970.
knew I liked you :cheersmate:
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I suppose that one COULD conceivably be a homosexual & celibate. But, as you stated, that would diverge into nothingness.
TVDOC, apparently 1988...
http://timpanogos.wordpress.com/2006/12/16/first-woman-scoutmaster-catherine-pollard/
My stepdad took over as Scoutmaster of the same troop I was involved in as a boy. He would regale me of all the PC leftist bullshit that the Boy Scouts found themselves having to fight off after I left for the Army.
After I retired and came back (briefly) to Michigan, I rejoined the troop as an assistant Scoutmaster and went through the required training. Yeah, the two-up requirement for two leaders to be present with Scouts at all times was shoved down our throats and repeated ad nauseum.
Never would have even thought of such bullshit when I was a boy. It just wasn't necessary.
Thanks, you ****ing pedophile, faggot pukes. You went after just about the only decent organization intended for the development of young men and turned it into a ****ing PC travesty.
Asshats.
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knew I liked you :cheersmate:
Thanks. Doing the work was a challenge, especially after I had to do a second community project. My first one wasn't good enough. :banghead:
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Thanks. Doing the work was a challenge, especially after I had to do a second community project. My first one wasn't good enough. :banghead:
I am hoping my son makes it to Eagle Scout. :bawl:
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Thanks. Doing the work was a challenge, especially after I had to do a second community project. My first one wasn't good enough. :banghead:
The last kid in our troop to make Eagle did 3....well....he started 2 others. they weren't done right or something and finally finished the third one.
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My stepdad took over as Scoutmaster of the same troop I was involved in as a boy. He would regale me of all the PC leftist bullshit that the Boy Scouts found themselves having to fight off after I left for the Army.
After I retired and came back (briefly) to Michigan, I rejoined the troop as an assistant Scoutmaster and went through the required training. Yeah, the two-up requirement for two leaders to be present with Scouts at all times was shoved down our throats and repeated ad nauseum.
Never would have even thought of such bullshit when I was a boy. It just wasn't necessary.
Thanks, you ****ing pedophile, faggot pukes. You went after just about the only decent organization intended for the development of young men and turned it into a ****ing PC travesty.
Asshats.
^5! Back in the day, when I was in scouting, of course there was no such requirements, however, I can't remember any campout, trip, or event what wasn't attended by both the scoutmaster, and at least one of the assistants. Our troop actually had a cabin in the woods, on about a hundred acres that we used frequently for weekends......and (gasp) on several occasions we even had joint campouts with the local girlscout troop (they, of course camped in their own group). We also had (another gasp) a rifle range, an archery range, and built or repaired our "cabin" and storage facility.
BTW, Euph, just a few miles north of you, Great Rivers Council built a scout camp called "Camp Thunderbird". I don't know if it is still even there, but I was part of building it back in the '60's. Have absolutely no idea of what it is like today, but we spent two summers building a dock for the lake, boathouse for canoes, and platforms for permanent wall tents (for those that participated it was counted as our Eagle "project"). The Council had a contractor build a mess hall and a couple of other ancillary buildings. All of the troops had fundraising efforts for several years to build it. I took my OA "Ordeal", and "Brotherhood" initiations there, as well as working on the staff the first summer that it was opened. Compared to the camp we formerly used down at Lake of the Ozarks, it was very "rustic"......but a lot of fun.
doc
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^5! Back in the day, when I was in scouting, of course there was no such requirements, however, I can't remember any campout, trip, or event what wasn't attended by both the scoutmaster, and at least one of the assistants. Our troop actually had a cabin in the woods, on about a hundred acres that we used frequently for weekends......and (gasp) on several occasions we even had joint campouts with the local girlscout troop (they, of course camped in their own group). We also had (another gasp) a rifle range, an archery range, and built or repaired our "cabin" and storage facility.
BTW, Euph, just a few miles north of you, Great Rivers Council built a scout camp called "Camp Thunderbird". I don't know if it is still even there, but I was part of building it back in the '60's. Have absolutely no idea of what it is like today, but we spent two summers building a dock for the lake, boathouse for canoes, and platforms for permanent wall tents (for those that participated it was counted as our Eagle "project"). The Council had a contractor build a mess hall and a couple of other ancillary buildings. All of the troops had fundraising efforts for several years to build it. I took my OA "Ordeal", and "Brotherhood" initiations there, as well as working on the staff the first summer that it was opened. Compared to the camp we formerly used down at Lake of the Ozarks, it was very "rustic"......but a lot of fun.
doc
Back in my day, the GS and the BS would have shared outings as well. The camps were close enough that we could do that. Camp Iti Kana (GS) Camp Tiak (BS). I loved camping, but I hated the water moccasins.
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Bertram, why is it that the Gay male community is fixated on infiltrating an organization that has a concentration of young boys/men?
You don't find that...........strange?
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Bertram, why is it that the Gay male community is fixated on infiltrating an organization that has a concentration of young boys/men?
You don't find that...........strange?
I don't believe that your suggested motivation is the real reason for their interest.
What REALLY pisses off the homos and liberals is that the Boy Scouts is a "private organization", which doesn't rely on government funding, and is therefore, entitled to set their own standards as to who can or cannot participate. They cannot be "forced" to comply with the PC agenda, either through public pressure or through the courts.........they tried in the courts, and got their butts kicked.
What the PC crowd DID accomplish was, again "back in the day", when our troop participated on long trips to Jamborees (I went to two), we would lease a bus, and en route we would stay at various military bases.
The Army, Navy, or Air Force would put us up overnight in a barracks, feed us in their mess halls, give us a tour, and generally welcome us to their "home".........I think that is gone now, as the PC crowd determined that having the military provide temporary accommodations to scouts, was a defacto method of "government support", and in order for it to continue, the BSA had to comply with all of the PC agenda.......
doc
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^5! Back in the day, when I was in scouting, of course there was no such requirements, however, I can't remember any campout, trip, or event what wasn't attended by both the scoutmaster, and at least one of the assistants. Our troop actually had a cabin in the woods, on about a hundred acres that we used frequently for weekends......and (gasp) on several occasions we even had joint campouts with the local girlscout troop (they, of course camped in their own group). We also had (another gasp) a rifle range, an archery range, and built or repaired our "cabin" and storage facility.
BTW, Euph, just a few miles north of you, Great Rivers Council built a scout camp called "Camp Thunderbird". I don't know if it is still even there, but I was part of building it back in the '60's. Have absolutely no idea of what it is like today, but we spent two summers building a dock for the lake, boathouse for canoes, and platforms for permanent wall tents (for those that participated it was counted as our Eagle "project"). The Council had a contractor build a mess hall and a couple of other ancillary buildings. All of the troops had fundraising efforts for several years to build it. I took my OA "Ordeal", and "Brotherhood" initiations there, as well as working on the staff the first summer that it was opened. Compared to the camp we formerly used down at Lake of the Ozarks, it was very "rustic"......but a lot of fun.
doc
I've not been involved in Scouting since I left Michigan, and probably won't ever again, though I still think of Scouting as THE organization for young men to become involved in. It does build character, inner strength, and courage, and the experience helps make men out of boys.
I have no idea what troops are here in this area or where they have their activities/campouts, though I know of one guy at church who is heavily involved in Scouting.
I never got involved in OA, though. Not sure why, but it's just something I never did.