The Conservative Cave
Current Events => Politics => Topic started by: Carl on September 22, 2010, 08:33:31 AM
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http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/09/22/obama-divided-afghan-war-woodward-book/
"I want an exit strategy," he said at one meeting. Privately, he told Vice President Joe Biden to push his alternative strategy opposing a big troop buildup in meetings.
While Obama ultimately rejected the alternative plan, the book says, he set a withdrawal timetable because, "I can't lose the whole Democratic Party."
These men and women are fighting for our freedom and this asshole is only thinking about his political future. :bird:
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Carl everything he's done since he took office has been about political strategery.
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So basically everybody who said all the muj have to do is hunker in the bunker and keep up a modest pressure until the middle of 2011 nailed it. Which is basically everyone who has any cogent understanding of our defense policy, including the Taliban leadership.
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War itself is a political strategy - that's not my stance, it's essentially the philosophy as espoused by Sun Tzu Clausewitz, et. al.
The difference is, GWB truly cares about the people who go to fight and die. Obama cares for nothing and nobody except himself.
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So basically everybody who said all the muj have to do is hunker in the bunker and keep up a modest pressure until the middle of 2011 nailed it. Which is basically everyone who has any cogent understanding of our defense policy, including the Taliban leadership.
I don't think...in my PERSONAL opinion he was ever interested in Afghanistan anymore than he was Iraq.
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I don't think...in my PERSONAL opinion he was ever interested in Afghanistan anymore than he was Iraq.
Agreed. I always had the sense that, at the time when the Surge was being contemplated, since combat operations at the time were largely successful in the Stan (as compared to Iraq), Zero jumped on the Stan bandwagon. He doesn't look at any of these conflicts as being anything other than a political opportunity to be addressed in the best way to portray himself.
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http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/09/22/obama-divided-afghan-war-woodward-book/
These men and women are fighting for our freedom and this asshole is only thinking about his political future. :bird:
Don't be surprised with this imposter. He doesn't care about America's best interest. Only his socialist utopia. It's been proven over and over again with this guy.
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Agreed. I always had the sense that, at the time when the Surge was being contemplated, since combat operations at the time were largely successful in the Stan (as compared to Iraq), Zero jumped on the Stan bandwagon. He doesn't look at any of these conflicts as being anything other than a political opportunity to be addressed in the best way to portray himself.
I think that candidate Obama knew that the Iraq war was essentially won, so it was politically safe to take an accelerated withdrawal position (even though he knew he couldn't really follow it), however with Afganistan, he ran on continuing the effort there solely because if he didn't, he would have been labelled another "Mondale" pacifist, and would have lost the independents that got him elected.
That said, except for his far-left base, he basically "owns" Afganistan now.......win or lose in the eyes of most thinking Americans........if he pulls out, and it collapses, he has no chance of reelection in 2012.
The Woodward (a lefty) book described in the OP, which is coming out the 27th, was basically designed by its author to re-energize the lefty base before the election (Lets remember that he published a "hit" book on Bush right before the 2004 election as well) .......just based on the parts released so far, it appears to have backfired, and shows the unfortunate level of incompetince and division in the White House........leaving the overall impression that the president is, weak, and not in control.......it appears that Woodward blew it.....
doc
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I think that candidate Obama knew that the Iraq war was essentially won, so it was politically safe to take an accelerated withdrawal position (even though he knew he couldn't really follow it), however with Afganistan, he ran on continuing the effort there solely because if he didn't, he would have been labelled another "Mondale" pacifist, and would have lost the independents that got him elected.
That said, except for his far-left base, he basically "owns" Afganistan now.......win or lose in the eyes of most thinking Americans........if he pulls out, and it collapses, he has no chance of reelection in 2012.
The Woodward (a lefty) book described in the OP, which is coming out the 27th, was basically designed by its author to re-energize the lefty base before the election (Lets remember that he published a "hit" book on Bush right before the 2004 election as well) .......just based on the parts released so far, it appears to have backfired, and shows the unfortunate level of incompetince and division in the White House........leaving the overall impression that the president is, weak, and not in control.......it appears that Woodward blew it.....
doc
You said it far better than I did, doc. :cheersmate:
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Megyn Kelly just hammered B. Hussein Obama on this story. I love her. :)
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I think that candidate Obama knew that the Iraq war was essentially won, so it was politically safe to take an accelerated withdrawal position (even though he knew he couldn't really follow it), however with Afganistan, he ran on continuing the effort there solely because if he didn't, he would have been labelled another "Mondale" pacifist, and would have lost the independents that got him elected.
That said, except for his far-left base, he basically "owns" Afganistan now.......win or lose in the eyes of most thinking Americans........if he pulls out, and it collapses, he has no chance of reelection in 2012.
The Woodward (a lefty) book described in the OP, which is coming out the 27th, was basically designed by its author to re-energize the lefty base before the election (Lets remember that he published a "hit" book on Bush right before the 2004 election as well) .......just based on the parts released so far, it appears to have backfired, and shows the unfortunate level of incompetince and division in the White House........leaving the overall impression that the president is, weak, and not in control.......it appears that Woodward blew it.....
doc
Yep....it does appear that Woodward "blew it".....but what exactly did he "blow"?
If it was to help the Liberal Left on the mid-term election...then yes, he blew it.
If it was to help Obama and his Merry Band of Idiots look good....then yes, he blew it.
If it was to uncover, to the public....right before the mid-terms...that the Obama administration has no clue what they are doing....then I'd say he blew it with a 100 piece brass band!!!! :evillaugh:
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Yep....it does appear that Woodward "blew it".....but what exactly did he "blow"?
If it was to help the Liberal Left on the mid-term election...then yes, he blew it.
If it was to help Obama and his Merry Band of Idiots look good....then yes, he blew it.
If it was to uncover, to the public....right before the mid-terms...that the Obama administration has no clue what they are doing....then I'd say he blew it with a 100 piece brass band!!!! :evillaugh:
I'd play that gig for $50 plus cartage and mileage.
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I'd play that gig for $50 plus cartage and mileage.
And here, I thought you'd volunteer to do that one for free. :lmao:
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Of course controversy sells, timing is everything in pandering to that, and Woodward's desire to sell books and win another prize for his muckraking no doubt enters into the equation pretty heavily. His Leftiness in trying to discredit the war apparently outweighs his Leftiness in defending First President of the World Obama, though.
Anybody who took the time to actually talk to a few back-country advisors in Afghanistan even back in '05 or '06 could have found out that any modern government institutions ended at the outskirts of Kabul. Operational results against a then-crippled enemy were decent, but reformist ideas like Afghan officers actually paying their soldiers, or using the money provided to feed or equip them instead of just stealing it, had extremely limited penetration beyond that enclave.
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Yep....it does appear that Woodward "blew it".....but what exactly did he "blow"?
If it was to help the Liberal Left on the mid-term election...then yes, he blew it.
If it was to help Obama and his Merry Band of Idiots look good....then yes, he blew it.
If it was to uncover, to the public....right before the mid-terms...that the Obama administration has no clue what they are doing....then I'd say he blew it with a 100 piece brass band!!!! :evillaugh:
I've read Bob Woodward's stuff for decades........he's a left-wing journalist of the standard MSM variety, who is still trying vainly to repeat his Watergate moment of fame......unsuccessfully.......he is a beltway insider that is as out of touch with the rest of America as the rest of the MSM/DC Democrats.......his writing on national politics is veiled in subtlety, and generally disguised as being "fair", when he really isn't.........he just hides his bias much better than most.
As I understand it so far (and admittedly I haven't read the book, just exerpts) .......his "hidden agenda" was to stir up interest on the part of the left-wing of the democrat party to turn out for the midterms.......the "anti-war" left, that is really pissed at Obama right now........what appears to have happened, is that his portrayal of the White House actions on Afganistan has just further motivated the right, plus further pissed off the "independents".....
All of which is a good thing........there isn't (and never was) a plurality of votes in the anti-war bunch to really accomplish anything electorally, so he was really tilting at a windmill to start with......he just did it badly.
doc
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I only heard a little bit, the first hour of Fox & Friends this morning, when they were reading excerpts. They were the ones that were saying that "The White House" was not happy about this book.
They basically said "too bad, so sad"...regarding The WH's unhappiness.... :evillaugh:
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I only heard a little bit, the first hour of Fox & Friends this morning, when they were reading excerpts. They were the ones that were saying that "The White House" was not happy about this book.
They basically said "too bad, so sad"...regarding The WH's unhappiness.... :evillaugh:
Hi,
No one is putting their finger on what I consider to be the real problem. The goal of war is to destroy your enemy and their will to fight. Took a couple of nukes in Japan before they gave up and lay down their arms.
That is why the Israel/Palestine treaties never work, our government won't let Israel obliterate them until they no longer have a will to fight.
If you look at the libs, for decades now, just reinforced by Obama, they have shown little will to fight and win........and conversely their attitude and public pronouncements actually are encouraging the enemy to continue the fight..
Had nothing been said our country would have been better off and safer, instead this is just one more piece of evidence that if our enemies stay the course our elected leadership and the libs will pull out just like Vietnam. I have no doubt in my mind that the muslins feel very strongly that they will own America and Europe, it is just a matter of time. Now Russia and China are a totally different story.
regards,
5412
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And here, I thought you'd volunteer to do that one for free. :lmao:
I don't gig for free anymore. Life's too short.
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I will be surprised if book goes against the one. I do not trust Woodward a bit.
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Hi,
No one is putting their finger on what I consider to be the real problem. The goal of war is to destroy your enemy and their will to fight. Took a couple of nukes in Japan before they gave up and lay down their arms.
That is why the Israel/Palestine treaties never work, our government won't let Israel obliterate them until they no longer have a will to fight.
If you look at the libs, for decades now, just reinforced by Obama, they have shown little will to fight and win........and conversely their attitude and public pronouncements actually are encouraging the enemy to continue the fight..
Had nothing been said our country would have been better off and safer, instead this is just one more piece of evidence that if our enemies stay the course our elected leadership and the libs will pull out just like Vietnam. I have no doubt in my mind that the muslins feel very strongly that they will own America and Europe, it is just a matter of time. Now Russia and China are a totally different story.
regards,
5412
Bombing Afghanistan back to the Stone Age is just a mild recession in local terms for most of the place, it would have no long term effect on the Taliban will to fight (At least not a positive effect), and dropping nukes anywhere there would just kill hundreds of thousands of people who generally couldn't give two shits whether the Taliban attacks us or not, they're a lot more concerned about the Taliban not killing them.
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Bombing Afghanistan back to the Stone Age is just a mild recession in local terms for most of the place, it would have no long term effect on the Taliban will to fight (At least not a positive effect), and dropping nukes anywhere there would just kill hundreds of thousands of people who generally couldn't give two shits whether the Taliban attacks us or not, they're a lot more concerned about the Taliban not killing them.
Hi,
I totally agree with you. Perhaps we should capture the Taliban then cover them with pigs blood and hang them. We need to make their deaths so distasteful they cannot recruit or something. Indeed nuclear bombs would not work in Afganistan, we need to go after their funding, have some rules of engagement that make sense and set a policy to defeat them flat out. None of which liberals would even understand.
regards,
5412
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Has anyone clicked on the link in the original post? It seems the headline has changed to be a little more worrisome.
United States Could 'Absorb' Another Terror Attack, Obama Says in Woodward Book
President Obama, after being warned repeatedly by his advisers about the threat of another terror attack on U.S. soil, said in an interview two months ago that the United States could "absorb" another strike.
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I only heard a little bit, the first hour of Fox & Friends this morning, when they were reading excerpts. They were the ones that were saying that "The White House" was not happy about this book.
They basically said "too bad, so sad"...regarding The WH's unhappiness.... :evillaugh:
Yet it was perfectly ok for Woodward to write the same kinda stuff about President Bush.
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Has anyone clicked on the link in the original post? It seems the headline has changed to be a little more worrisome.
Yes, Obama's attitude toward another 9/11 type attack was discussed yesterday morning too.
Yet it was perfectly ok for Woodward to write the same kinda stuff about President Bush.
I think you might have misunderstood my post, Tx. I don't know if you ever watch Fox and Friends, but sometimes they have trouble hiding their distate/disgust for Obama. That was the case yesterday morning. The "3 on the Couch", pretty much don't care if Woodward offended Obama or the WH.
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Yes, Obama's attitude toward another 9/11 type attack was discussed yesterday morning too.
I think you might have misunderstood my post, Tx. I don't know if you ever watch Fox and Friends, but sometimes they have trouble hiding their distate/disgust for Obama. That was the case yesterday morning. The "3 on the Couch", pretty much don't care if Woodward offended Obama or the WH.
Nah I got what you meant. I was just being sarcastic about the WH double standard on this stuff and the MSM view in general. You didn't hear President Bush or the WH whine when Woodward wrote the same kind of books about them.
This white house whines about EVERYTHING. These kid of books were perfectly ok and Woodward got all kinds of advance publicity on 60 Minutes etc. Dems were quoting from the books in their all out thrashing of the Prez.
Not so much now.
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Nah I got what you meant. I was just being sarcastic about the WH double standard on this stuff and the MSM view in general. You didn't hear President Bush or the WH whine when Woodward wrote the same kind of books about them.
This white house whines about EVERYTHING. These kid of books were perfectly ok and Woodward got all kinds of advance publicity on 60 Minutes etc. Dems were quoting from the books in their all out thrashing of the Prez.
Not so much now.
I misunderstood you. :thatsright:
Now that I understand....I agree with you.
(I'm still in "moving mode"....and all the synapses are not properly firing...if firing at all :yawn: )