The Conservative Cave
Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: dandi on September 07, 2010, 10:14:59 PM
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Wherever you come down on the issue of the Florida Koran burners - good, bad, indifferent, increased danger to troops, no change in danger, etc. - you have to admit it has taken The Hive to soaring new heights of hypocrisy.
Where were these assholes when Andres Serrano was publishing photos of a crucifix submerged in urine? Where were they when Chris Ofili presented his portrait of the Virgin Mary covered with elephant dung? Where were they when Salman Rushdie was writing books that earned him a death fatwa from the Ayatollah Khomeini? Where were they when the Dutch newspapers were publishing cartoons depicting Mohammed with a bomb in place of a turban? Where were they when Muslims danced in the streets celebrating the deaths of 3000 Americans? Where are they when Muslims shout "Death to America!" and burn our flag? Where were they when our President was burned in effigy or suffering the Muslim insult of having shoes thrown at him? Finally, where are they when fellow DUers on a daily basis post the most vile, sick and insulting polemics and "jokes" about Christians and Jesus Christ Himself?
Silent, or solidly in the corner of those expressing such sentiments. That's where they are.
But now, since it's "Christian fundies" doing the insulting, they finally find their outrage.
The book burners (books they bought themselves, not confiscated from homes or libraries) are the "Nazis," while those screaming in bloodlust and threatening death for the affront are the "aggrieved party" and have to be understood and accommodated.
But at least, on the bright side, it's taken their minds off Glenn Beck for a while.
howard112211 (742 posts) Tue Sep-07-10 06:18 AM
Original message
It's just plain dumb to invoke Freedom of Speech Re: Quran Burning.
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Claiming to be making a "statement against radicalization" and a "statement for free speech" in this particular form is just idiotic.
Burning books is not a statement towards free speech, it is a statement against it. By burning a book one seeks to destroy the words
written in this book, seeking to keep people from reading them or to suppress their meaning. A book burning is actually
authoritarianism and anti-freedom-of-speech in its purest form.
That said, I wonder when christians have ever had to endure this type of twisted "free speech". Yes, christianity gets mocked. Usually
in an intelligent form that exposes the weird behavior patterns it generates, such as Monty Python has done. Call me again when
we have "wipe your ass with the bible" videos on youtube...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=9088251&mesg_id=9088251
diveguy (30 posts) Tue Sep-07-10 06:31 AM
Response to Original message
2. I'll be damned
I tried to look it up on youtube. I cant watch the videos on this piece of crap work computer, but it's there. look up bible toliet paper. Also, a bunch of bible burning.
I wonder if it would be such an issue if it was a muslim burning a bible.
howard112211 (742 posts) Tue Sep-07-10 06:49 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. Really? Crap, I stand corrected on that...
Owned, like DUmbasses always are.
gophates (171 posts) Tue Sep-07-10 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #1
45. Got no problem seeing a big old bunch of Bibles burned.
I'll bring the marshmallows.
And not a single DUer jumped on you for that remark.
ejpoeta (1000+ posts) Tue Sep-07-10 07:26 AM
Response to Reply #2
11. you can bet that it would be a different story if it were someone burning a bible.
they would be pitching a fit. this crap is what the terrorists want, though. these people are doing the terrorists bidding. they are giving the terrorists what they want.
Someone would say something, for sure. But when was the last time you saw Christians rioting in the streets over a perceived insult?
Lots of other threads in GD on the subject, and to give the Devil his due, many come down on the side of free speech although they too hypocritically condemn the "hate and intolerance" of the Koran burners without a single mention of the same coming from the Muslims calling for violence and death.
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I'd like to ask these same people if they would react the same way if a Bible was burned? or when the Flag is burned? I won't be a hypocrite, I'm against Bible, Flag and Koran burning.
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I read that thread earlier and one thing struck me besides their hypocrisy . They look at burning the Koran as a book burning, like Fahrenheit 451, whereas most would look at it as burning a revered symbol of the Muslims.
The DUmmies outrage would be no less if this church was burning pornography.
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I don't see anything offensive about it. It would not be hypocritical if the Bible, Koran, Torah, etc. got burned.
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This man has the freedom to burn the Koran, freedom of speech. Just like it's freedom of speech to build a mosque near Ground Zero. I do not condone it, but it's his right to do it.
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This guy is a nobody who is getting way more attention than he deserves. If he didn't serve a purpose for the current media cause of the week...proving Conservatives/Republicans/Christians are all bigoted Islamophbes and to further their reasons WHY the GZM should be built...he wouldn't get 30 seconds mention on state news.
But because the MSM are kissing ass to Raouf and others who think it's just peachy ****ing keen to build a victory mosque within site of the hole where the world trade center towers used to be...this guy has been promoted to national level to the point where Gen. Petreus has to comment on it.
The left created this kerfuffle in my opinion...but America as a whole will get blamed.
Way to go guys.
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What this pastor is doing is unconscionable and seems very anti-Christian. Still, it has a lot in common with the whole mosque issue. He certainly has the RIGHT to burn the Quran but that doesn't mean he SHOULD do it.
Cindie
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I'd like to ask these same people if they would react the same way if a Bible was burned? or when the Flag is burned? I won't be a hypocrite, I'm against Bible, Flag and Koran burning.
Christianity states you will be known by your actions, not your statements.
Jesus stated "love thy enemy", "love thy neighbor.
Mohammad stated "KILL the infidel".
Jesus told the whore, after forgiveness, "go and sin no more".
The last thing Jesus stated before he died on the cross, "My Father, forgive them for they know not what they do."
That means forgiving our fellows for up to and including Crucifixion . Mohammad the pedophile says what?
To me, this tells me we must forgive the DUmmys for their inbred hate of Christians and their love for Mohammad's suicide bombers...BUTT, doesn't mean we can't make fun of them.
We *ARE* sinners by the way...
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Two words:
Piss Christ
google away
remind me when the "artist" was beheaded for that...
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When was the last time a liberal group decided to skip burning the flag or defacing something Christian for fear that it "would cost lives." ::)
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He's free to do it, I'm also free to think he's an idiot who is drumming up hatred during a time our forces are trying to win hearts and minds in that region.
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Seems like less of a statement than attention-whoring. He's as goofy as some of the emotion-stirring imams of Islam.
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Seems like less of a statement than attention-whoring. He's as goofy as some of the emotion-stirring imams of Islam.
We all gotta make a buck somehow.
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Mohammed said, "Make a wide slaughter in the land and when the infidel feel themselves subdued........."
Do you "Build the mosque", "Don't burn the koran" infidels feel sudued?
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He's free to do it, I'm also free to think he's an idiot who is drumming up hatred during a time our forces are trying to win hearts and minds in that region.
Sure!! Just like the idiots wanting to build a "victory" mosque at GZ! Sort of like that, right?!? ::) ::)
As for "winning the hearts and minds" of those over there. Do you "really" think that they will be won over and accept what has happened to their Country?!?! I, for one don't think so one bit.
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As for "winning the hearts and minds" of those over there. Do you "really" think that they will be won over and accept what has happened to their Country?!?! I, for one don't think so one bit.
Care to expand on that?
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I'd like to ask these same people if they would react the same way if a Bible was burned? or when the Flag is burned? I won't be a hypocrite, I'm against Bible, Flag and Koran burning.
Yep! They're all protected free speech. None of them are appropriate behavior.
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Care to expand on that?
Are the Iraqis grateful for us "liberating" them? I have my opinion, that they still hate us. (Just my opinion.)
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Wherever you come down on the issue of the Florida Koran burners - good, bad, indifferent, increased danger to troops, no change in danger, etc. - you have to admit it has taken The Hive to soaring new heights of hypocrisy.
Where were these assholes when Andres Serrano was publishing photos of a crucifix submerged in urine? Where were they when Chris Ofili presented his portrait of the Virgin Mary covered with elephant dung? Where were they when Salman Rushdie was writing books that earned him a death fatwa from the Ayatollah Khomeini? Where were they when the Dutch newspapers were publishing cartoons depicting Mohammed with a bomb in place of a turban? Where were they when Muslims danced in the streets celebrating the deaths of 3000 Americans? Where are they when Muslims shout "Death to America!" and burn our flag? Where were they when our President was burned in effigy or suffering the Muslim insult of having shoes thrown at him? Finally, where are they when fellow DUers on a daily basis post the most vile, sick and insulting polemics and "jokes" about Christians and Jesus Christ Himself?
BINGO!!!! :cheersmate:
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Are the Iraqis grateful for us "liberating" them? I have my opinion, that they still hate us. (Just my opinion.)
Then your opinion is based upon flawed reasoning. Do you really think that a majority of them who suffered under saddam and sons aren't grateful for being "liberated"?
If you think that hussein's pulling out combat troops caused all the Iraqis to jump for joy, think again.
The fear of political divisions, aggravated by the struggle for control of Iraq's oil potential, is ever present. Some Iraqis worry that without the American soldiers, their country will revert to a dictatorship or split along religious and ethnic fault lines.
"They should go, but the security situation is too fragile for the Americans to withdraw now," said Mohammed Hussein Abbas, a Shiite from the town of Hillah south of Baghdad. "They should wait for the government to be formed and then withdraw."
http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/71930
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Then your opinion is based upon flawed reasoning. Do you really think that a majority of them who suffered under saddam and sons aren't grateful for being "liberated"?
If you think that hussein's pulling out combat troops caused all the Iraqis to jump for joy, think again.
I really don't know. Like I said, just my opinion.
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I really don't know. Like I said, just my opinion.
So why come on to a forum to scream and flail like you do? Doesn't seem to make much sense...
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Sure!! Just like the idiots wanting to build a "victory" mosque at GZ! Sort of like that, right?!? ::) ::)
As for "winning the hearts and minds" of those over there. Do you "really" think that they will be won over and accept what has happened to their Country?!?! I, for one don't think so one bit.
Even General Patraeus has said it will put our troops in danger. We live in an instant information age where internet access can even be had while hiding in caves. Our troops do work closely with Afghani Muslims. They train together, patrol together and get to know each other one on one. Surely you've seen those pictures of children surrounding soldiers and Marines with huge smiles on their faces (even when they don't have candy to pass out). They can have a different, perhaps less suspicious, view of the west than their parents' generation. Do you really think they were happy when the Taliban were in charge? It's been a place of tribal rivalries for centuries. But at least women and girls can work and go to school without worrying about being beheaded when they get home.
Cindie
Cindie
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Somebody needs to drop kick this idiot into next week! Just what we need when our troops are in Muslimland! Just when we are tryin' to prove a point to Maha Rauolfie that he's being insensitive to those who lost loved one's in NYC!
This dipshit is no Christian!
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These controversies are so informative of the differences between the two religions. If a small church burns some books, Muslims will riot and kill many people. This is somehow the fault of the small American church.
If Muslims choose to build a mosque on a sacred site, against the wishes of the families of those slain, Christians will protest and side with the bereaved...and that'll be it. Yet, somehow, Christians are judged to be at fault here, also, by many people.
:thatsright:
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Sure!! Just like the idiots wanting to build a "victory" mosque at GZ! Sort of like that, right?!? ::) ::)
As for "winning the hearts and minds" of those over there. Do you "really" think that they will be won over and accept what has happened to their Country?!?! I, for one don't think so one bit.
The hearts and minds argument went out the window way back when. That being what it may it's counterproductive to intentionally stir the pot.
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The hearts and minds argument went out the window way back when. That being what it may it's counterproductive to intentionally stir the pot.
I do agree fully. The last thing I want is for our troops to be in greater danger than they are in now.
(I guess I didn't think my response out long enough before I wrote it.)
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I do agree fully. The last thing I want is for our troops to be in greater danger than they are in now.
(I guess I didn't think my response out long enough before I wrote it.)
Nothing wrong with your previous response. I was just tossing in my two cents. :cheersmate: