The Conservative Cave
Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: Carl on February 20, 2010, 05:29:00 PM
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http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7753903
truedelphi (1000+ posts) Fri Feb-19-10 08:10 PM
Original message
My Car over-accelerated today. Even the brakes didn't help.
Edited on Fri Feb-19-10 08:13 PM by truedelphi
I had a doctor's visit to make, I had groceries to buy.
M. had just overhauled the car yesterday, and it had never run better.
I pulled the 1989 Ford Passenger van out onto the local road, and it was purring nicely. Gone were all the clicks and annoying noises that the car had been making before the new voltage regulator and the new alternator had been put in place.
About a mile into my drive, I realized that I was not driving fast enough. It was a lovely spring afternoon, and I was too busy gawking at all the new buds on trees and the greenery and the happy birds. I glanced at the speedometer and realized I was driving under the speed limit.
Decided to tap the accelerator just a nudge, so that my car would accelerate from around 38 to 45 Mph (The speed limit on this road.) The instant I "nudged" the pedal, the car's engine var-roomed as though I were in a jet airplane and the plane was taking off.
The car took off, and stomping on the brake didn't help. I thought maybe the pedal had gotten caught under the floor mat, but no, M. had removed floor mats earlier while tuning up the car.
I shoved my foot between the pedal and the floor, all the while jamming my left foot on the brake. My foot went down hard, repeatedly, with seemingly little effect.
Due to all the publicity about Toyota cars with their accelerator problems, I knew
I could be endangering myself and others as I approached the main drag, HWY 29. Especially if I got there while the light was red for me, green for opposing traffic.
Since the car was not slowing, I knew the mini mall that was on my right immediately before the highway could perhaps save me. I did a radical turn quite fast into the lot, while hoping the van would not tip over.
The turn slowed the car and then braking became effective. Luckily for me, no one else was in my way - I had what is close to a full city block to bring the car to a slow enough speed. I finally just threw it into neutral, as it would not go below ten miles per hour by employing the brakes. (Bear in mind my foot was UNDER the gas pedal! for the last 40 seconds of my ride.)
Anyway I am grateful to be alive, and that this happened during a time when no one else was on Hwy 281. Had this happened 40 minutes later after arriving in the city of Clearlake, I would have probably crashed into other cars, with damage to property and other lives resulting.
If the resulting crash had occurred during the initial moments of all this, I probably would have concurred with the police that something I had done had caused the crash. The type of rapid acceleration is so scary that you can not really ascertain what is occurring as it happens, and the first thought in your head is, Why/how did I make the car go so fast?
I am safely home, and M. just researched our vehicle on the web. Apparently many vans, trucks and bigger cars put out by Ford in late eighties and early nineties were recalled due to this flaw being suspected. The advice on the web was to disconnect the Cruise Control (Something I never use, and was not using when the problem occurred.) And this quick fix has done the trick - the car no longer roars with a deafening sound like it has the combined super strength of half a dozen 747's.
M. just took vehicle around the block. No loud noise, and very controllable.
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They always have to make themselves part of the current events story. ::)
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89 Ford Passenger Van?
:whatever:
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Potential Bouncy.
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M. just took vehicle around the block. No loud noise, and very controllable.
Of course. M knew where the switch was to disengage the accelerator. How much was that policy worth that he took out recently? :rotf:
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If the resulting crash had occurred during the initial moments of all this, I probably would have concurred with the police that something I had done had caused the crash. The type of rapid acceleration is so scary that you can not really ascertain what is occurring as it happens, and the first thought in your head is, Why/how did I make the car go so fast?
.........I am safely home,
One more thing, she relays in PAINFUL detail how her accelerated got stuck, yet fails to mention how she got home?
:whatever:
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Interesting that the van would wait 20 years to show any accelerator problems, just in time to coincide with the Toyota issues. And, amazingly enough, the issues were a manufacturing defect that just took 20 years to show up, and they were easily resolved with a quick internet search. :p
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Okay, time to bitch again.
Why did the primitive light this campfire in "General Discussion," instead of in the automotive forum that my fellow alum Skins has so magnanimously gifted the primitives for discussion of automotive issues?
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...and they were easily resolved with a quick internet search.
Or regular maintenance.
Someone wants to be noticed... ergo, it was posted in GD instead of a more appropriate forum.
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Or regular maintenance.
Someone wants to be noticed... ergo, it was posted in GD instead of a more appropriate forum.
I just did a search for "89 ford passenger van recalls". The only thing involving the cruise control was a chance of fire, nothing about undue acceleration.
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Did you search the NTSB's website? I think they're the official dumping ground for all auto recalls.
It's a big-assed passenger van. The only way to get one of those things to over-accelerate would be to drop it off a cliff. I used to drive one when I did the mail runs for the bank I worked at. It was like driving a barstool... tall and tippy with a wimpy engine.
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Potential Bouncy.
When your adrenaline is flowing you cannot keep track of time. I doubt this DUmmie had their foot under the pedal for exactly 40 seconds.
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Did you search the NTSB's website? I think they're the official dumping ground for all auto recalls.
It's a big-assed passenger van. The only way to get one of those things to over-accelerate would be to drop it off a cliff. I used to drive one when I did the mail runs for the bank I worked at. It was like driving a barstool... tall and tippy with a wimpy engine.
Yeah, it's a damn Econoline...you could jump out the door and still pass the thing at a brisk pace.
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Pssssssst hey DUmmie. I have a clue for youuuu.
turn the fukin engine off. It'll stop then. No need to play NASCAR 4 wheel drift or poop a cinder block. One simple key position shuts any vehicle down ending the acceleration from hell.
Also you might want to slap M or whoever it was that did your recent tune-up for whatever it was that got stuck between the throttle linkage and the air cleaner cover.
There ya go, 2 clues for the price of one.
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but... but... he's SPECIAL.
Also, I'm thinking shift the damn thing into neutral. Derf.
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My 1997 F150 had the accelerator stick, but it had been wrecked once,stored and rebuilt for approx a year. It caused an accident. I took it to the local Ford dealer in MN and of course, they found NO problem with it. It still did it for about 6 more months, maybe more. I lubed the throttle body up real well and it hasn't done it in 11 more years.
After the accident, I practiced emergency procedures in case it ever stuck again (turning the key off while in motion, but not ALL of the way off)
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I have had the accelerator go all the way down to the floor and brakes go out on clunkers I have driven. Scary to say the least. Turning the ignition key off and yanking the emergency brake up works every time. This sounds like a bouncy with way too much information.
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Two things at play in this bouncy. First, the DUmbass M did something stupid to, or near, or around the 20-year-old throttle linkage. That is if anything similar to what the DUmmy describes actually happened, which it likely did not. Far, far more likely is that this DUmmy truedelphi has been reading in the news about how all kinds of scam artists are lining up to sue Toyota for a bogus accelerator condition, and are likely to get rich off settlements Toyota will pay to save the cost of defending itself against thousands of scam artists. But DUmmy truedelphi, living off welfare, SSI, EIC or whatever other handouts we pay these days, has never been able to afford a Toyota. She's stuck with a two-decade-old hippymobile, covered with PETA, legalize dope, Bushsux, and Rainbow Coalition stickers. So, she's trying to figure an angle that might let her cash in on the Toyota scam. And if she finds the right sleazy weasel of a trial lawyer, it may work.
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Two things at play in this bouncy. First, the DUmbass M did something stupid to, or near, or around the 20-year-old throttle linkage. That is if anything similar to what the DUmmy describes actually happened, which it likely did not. Far, far more likely is that this DUmmy truedelphi has been reading in the news about how all kinds of scam artists are lining up to sue Toyota for a bogus accelerator condition, and are likely to get rich off settlements Toyota will pay to save the cost of defending itself against thousands of scam artists. But DUmmy truedelphi, living off welfare, SSI, EIC or whatever other handouts we pay these days, has never been able to afford a Toyota. She's stuck with a two-decade-old hippymobile, covered with PETA, legalize dope, Bushsux, and Rainbow Coalition stickers. So, she's trying to figure an angle that might let her cash in on the Toyota scam. And if she finds the right sleazy weasel of a trial lawyer, it may work.
*ding**ding**ding*
We have a winner.
Even if this wasn`t an insurance scam test drive it still was a typical DUmmy story to make themselves part of the narrative which for some reason they always feel compelled to do.
I would like some genuine analysis as to why they feel they must do this to comment on something.
Is it just immature ego that is screeching "look at me look at me" or something deeper and more deranged?
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ZERO Bong.
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I would seriously hesitate to turn off the key when putting a car in neutral will do. It would be way too easy to turn a little too far and lock your steering wheel.
That said, having driven a Ford F150 (I even think it was an '89), for 185,000 miles, I can state without doubt that they don't have any weird problems...except they eat starters every 6 - 8 months. Luckily, those aren't hard to change.
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That said, having driven a Ford F150 (I even think it was an '89), for 185,000 miles, I can state without doubt that they don't have any weird problems...except they eat starters every 6 - 8 months. Luckily, those aren't hard to change.
I thought the starter in my car had crapped out... turns out it was a bad battery cable.
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I thought the starter in my car had crapped out... turns out it was a bad battery cable.
I think I put 6 or 7 starters in that F150 in the years I owned it. It got so bad, I actually carried a spare around in the back...with the battery charger and the tool kit. I once crawled under it after work, in my good clothes, and stuck the spare started on so I could go home. I was lucky they were cheap, like $40 each, and easy to put on...3 bolts and the cable nut. :-)
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I think I put 6 or 7 starters in that F150 in the years I owned it. It got so bad, I actually carried a spare around in the back...with the battery charger and the tool kit. I once crawled under it after work, in my good clothes, and stuck the spare started on so I could go home. I was lucky they were cheap, like $40 each, and easy to put on...3 bolts and the cable nut.
Man, madam, when I win the Powerball lottery, I'm going to hire you--with medical insurance, the whole bit--to be my personal automotive mechanic.
Have you ever replaced bent tie-rods and busted axles, by any chance?
Those seem to be my main hazards.
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Man, madam, when I win the Powerball lottery, I'm going to hire you--with medical insurance, the whole bit--to be my personal automotive mechanic.
Have you ever replaced bent tie-rods and busted axles, by any chance?
Those seem to be my main hazards.
I have not yet ever replaced a tie rod or an axle. I am really not much of a mechanic, but if my brother can tell me how to do something over the phone, I'll certainly give it a try. We've been so broke for so many years, I always had to try fixing stuff myself...and got lucky on occasion. :-) I hope you win the Powerball anyway...it should go to someone nice like you. :cheersmate:
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http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7753903
They always have to make themselves part of the current events story. ::)
It wasn't the floor mats?! :thatsright:
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truedelphi (1000+ posts) Fri Feb-19-10 08:10 PM
Original message
My Car over-accelerated today. Even the brakes didn't help.
Where is that brick wall when the nation needs it huh?
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89 Ford Passenger Van?
:whatever:
...and ROARING with a deafening sound like it has the combined super strength of half a dozen 747's.
The deafening sound was SEARED, S-E-A-R-E-D I tell you, into my mind!!!111
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One more thing, she relays in PAINFUL detail how her accelerated got stuck, yet fails to mention how she got home?
:whatever:
The happy singing birds happily gave her a lift home.
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The car took off, and stomping on the brake didn't help. I thought maybe the pedal had gotten caught under the floor mat, but no, M. had removed floor mats earlier while tuning up the car.
Well that's your problem. Everyone knows it's Q that works on the cars. M is there to give you your assignment.
Sheesh.
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Well that's your problem. Everyone knows it's Q that works on the cars. M is there to give you your assignment.
Now that's funny!
But whether your car is tuned up by M, Q, or bobbolink, why would they remove the floor mats to do it?
What a tangled web we weave.
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I worked as a fleet mechanic (as well as a driver) for 6, 1-ton Chevy/Grumman stepvans, all with 350 V-8's and automatic transmissions, for over 20 years.
The only time there were ANY accelerator problems, it usually boiled down to:
1. bad throttle cable (a very common problem, since the cable was about 6 feet long)...
2. broken, stretched, or fatigued throttle return spring...
3. worn bushings in the throttle body...
In ALL cases, the brakes were more than adequate to stop the vans, even with the throttle stuck wide open. The only cars I can think of that wouldn't have enough brakes to overcome the engine's power would be something from the former (or maybe current) Eastern Bloc/Soviet Union countries (ie think Yugo)....
I currently have a Ford F-250 diesel. 12 years ago, it started having problems with the engine not wanting to return to idle....
A new throttle cable fixed it....
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I worked as a fleet mechanic (as well as a driver) for 6, 1-ton Chevy/Grumman stepvans, all with 350 V-8's and automatic transmissions, for over 20 years.
The only time there were ANY accelerator problems, it usually boiled down to:
1. bad throttle cable (a very common problem, since the cable was about 6 feet long)...
2. broken, stretched, or fatigued throttle return spring...
3. worn bushings in the throttle body...
In ALL cases, the brakes were more than adequate to stop the vans, even with the throttle stuck wide open. The only cars I can think of that wouldn't have enough brakes to overcome the engine's power would be something from the former (or maybe current) Eastern Bloc/Soviet Union countries (ie think Yugo)....
I currently have a Ford F-250 diesel. 12 years ago, it started having problems with the engine not wanting to return to idle....
A new throttle cable fixed it....
You forget one thing. Toyota is also having brake problem with Prius' so this DUmmie is going for a twofer with throttle and brake.
Problem with shifting to neutral is the noise and abuse the engine gets by removing the load on it. The RPM's will go through the roof, maybe literally in a high milage ole wore out van that most likely has a huge amount of clatters and funky rattles already.
Removing the floor mats I can see happening easily because of the engine cover coming off. There's times while working in that hole those mats will flat out piss you off so removing them eliminates that.
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'89 Ford passenger van and no one took him to task for his Carbon Footprint over there?
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You forget one thing. Toyota is also having brake problem with Prius' so this DUmmie is going for a twofer with throttle and brake.
Problem with shifting to neutral is the noise and abuse the engine gets by removing the load on it. The RPM's will go through the roof, maybe literally in a high milage ole wore out van that most likely has a huge amount of clatters and funky rattles already.
Removing the floor mats I can see happening easily because of the engine cover coming off. There's times while working in that hole those mats will flat out piss you off so removing them eliminates that.
Yup, you are correct, sir. If she had mentioned hard steering as well, I'd say she was going for the trifecta....
My excuse is it was 2:40AM and the coffee hadn't started working yet.... :hyper:
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You forget one thing. Toyota is also having brake problem with Prius' so this DUmmie is going for a twofer with throttle and brake.
Problem with shifting to neutral is the noise and abuse the engine gets by removing the load on it. The RPM's will go through the roof, maybe literally in a high milage ole wore out van that most likely has a huge amount of clatters and funky rattles already.
Removing the floor mats I can see happening easily because of the engine cover coming off. There's times while working in that hole those mats will flat out piss you off so removing them eliminates that.
Yeah, but better to blow the engine than any other alternative. Especially on a 20 year old van. :lmao:
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Yeah, but better to blow the engine than any other alternative. Especially on a 20 year old van. :lmao:
Speaking of "blown engines" maybe M has a hobby?
[youtube=425,350]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/bcgSwnH73wY&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/bcgSwnH73wY&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/youtube]
:rotf:
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My 2002 Ford Expedition Over-accelerated as well. I was getting on the expressway and my SUV suddenly started taking off. I immediately pressed hard on my brakes and it did not help very much so I put it in natural and turn off the ignition. I cannot prove it like the man on TV this morning that could not prove it either but it happened. It's a mystery!
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I call bullshit. There's no way what really happened would be remembered in such detail.
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Toyota has decided to cut back on their production of Prius hybrid cars. Suck on that greenies.
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Years ago I had a Toyota Cressida that one day took off on me, pedal to the metal. I noticed the cruise control light was on. I turned it off. Problem solved.
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Years ago I had a Toyota Cressida that one day took off on me, pedal to the metal. I noticed the cruise control light was on. I turned it off. Problem solved.
Pfft. I've done that with my Blazer. And the other day, my wife left the interstate and started going 70 MPH down the state highway.
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Pfft. I've done that with my Blazer. And the other day, my wife left the interstate and started going 70 MPH down the state highway.
Yikes.
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Yikes.
She didn't notice until after a couple miles. That could've been a hefty fine.
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Interesting, I wonder if under certain rare conditions some kind of EM interference can fool a Toyota's computer into thinking cruise control has been engaged. Something from an external, fugitive source could never be replicated at a testing site. From the distribution of cases it would seem to be something as pervasive as cell tower signals and only rarely actually cause a hiccup.
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She didn't notice until after a couple miles. That could've been a hefty fine.
I'd be worried about hitting a slower vehicle than a fine.
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Interesting, I wonder if under certain rare conditions some kind of EM interference can fool a Toyota's computer into thinking cruise control has been engaged. Something from an external, fugitive source could never be replicated at a testing site. From the distribution of cases it would seem to be something as pervasive as cell tower signals and only rarely actually cause a hiccup.
ET's are un-usually interesting breed. If there are any resident on board I suspect you will receive a great theoretical answer. Me, I only know something in my neighborhood is now preventing my key-less locking system from working. It did work and works once out of the neighborhood. I currently have a call in to the dealer to find out the frequency the remote transmits on.
Now this is no $hit, my last occurence with sudden acceleration was when a Turbo Jag sedan pulled up to the lights, goosed his throttle a couple times somehow causing a sudden unexplained spasam in my right leg which then impact the accelerator pedel (which is connected to a wireless fuel delivery system). The better half often says my car is "pi$$ yer pants fast", she's right. Wasn't even close. :cheersmate: The guy wanted to go again for pinks but I don't have room for another car. :rotf:
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Interesting, I wonder if under certain rare conditions some kind of EM interference can fool a Toyota's computer into thinking cruise control has been engaged. Something from an external, fugitive source could never be replicated at a testing site. From the distribution of cases it would seem to be something as pervasive as cell tower signals and only rarely actually cause a hiccup.
Yes, it's electromagnetic interference causing a scam artist's brain to think about getting a jumbo out-of-court settlement from Toyota. Odds are overwhelming that's the cause of all these Toyota incidents. The discouraging thing is that thousands of scamsters will be successful at cashing in. It's much more expensive for Toyota to defend themselves than to just settle with these crooks.
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That was the answer I was going to give, but in much greater detail. Bottom line, any EM interference causing the cruise control to just magically engage?
Ain't happening.
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That was the answer I was going to give, but in much greater detail. Bottom line, any EM interference causing the cruise control to just magically engage?
Ain't happening.
Aren't most em sources required to be tested to see if they cause interference with othe electrical devices?
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Aren't most em sources required to be tested to see if they cause interference with othe electrical devices?
Ah-yup. And considering that the cruise control, even through an onboard computer, is a "hard-wired" system and therefore only marginally susceptible to manipulation from random EM signals (that is to say, ain't ****in happening), it's roughly akin to your hitting the button for your garage door opener and miraculously changing the CD in your six-disc changer to the exact disc and song you wanted to hear.
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Ah-yup. And considering that the cruise control, even through an onboard computer, is a "hard-wired" system and therefore only marginally susceptible to manipulation from random EM signals (that is to say, ain't ****in happening), it's roughly akin to your hitting the button for your garage door opener and miraculously changing the CD in your six-disc changer to the exact disc and song you wanted to hear.
read somewhere today at over half of the unintended acceleration problems have happened to people over 60.
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read somewhere today at over half of the unintended acceleration problems have happened to people over 60.
And the other half happen to DUmmies named Pam in front of laundromats.
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read somewhere today at over half of the unintended acceleration problems have happened to people over 60.
However that same description does fit every Prius driver around here.
I dunno, I'm keeping an open mind on the possibility of unforeseen external causes in a total drive-by-wire throttle control, the "It couldn't possibly be THAT, because I'm an engineer and I said so" mentality killed a good number of F16 pilots back in the day because of misplaced faith in the integrity of the bird's wiring harness.
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And the other half happen to DUmmies named Pam in front of laundromats.
Is that the same as a laundry mat?
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I can see this as much more likely to happen to Primitives than an over acceleration problems.
(http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/threatlevel/2010/03/tow1-300x153.jpg)
More than 100 drivers in Austin, Texas found their cars disabled or the horns honking out of control, after an intruder ran amok in a web-based vehicle-immobilization system normally used to get the attention of consumers delinquent in their auto payments.
Read More http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2010/03/hacker-bricks-cars/#ixzz0iYiLRxHD
But Stud-muffin, I thought you paid the Prius payment :rotf:
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Now that's funny!
But whether your car is tuned up by M, Q, or bobbolink, why would they remove the floor mats to do it?
What a tangled web we weave.
If it's anything like the POS Dodge van I had, everything had to be done from inside the passenger compartment.
The floor mats wrapped around the dog house.
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ET's are un-usually interesting breed. If there are any resident on board I suspect you will receive a great theoretical answer. Me, I only know something in my neighborhood is now preventing my key-less locking system from working. It did work and works once out of the neighborhood. I currently have a call in to the dealer to find out the frequency the remote transmits on.
Now this is no $hit, my last occurence with sudden acceleration was when a Turbo Jag sedan pulled up to the lights, goosed his throttle a couple times somehow causing a sudden unexplained spasam in my right leg which then impact the accelerator pedel (which is connected to a wireless fuel delivery system). The better half often says my car is "pi$$ yer pants fast", she's right. Wasn't even close. :cheersmate: The guy wanted to go again for pinks but I don't have room for another car. :rotf:
Heh, ya could always sell the thing! What the hell ya drivin? I had a '53 Ford F100 we hotrodded in the early ninety's. Would turn mid 11's. Fastest thing stop light to stop light I ever drove! Had a 289 Cobra, w/Ram air under the hood. Only problem was it still had the original drum brakes. Ya had to be damn careful to leave enough room between you and the car in front of you just in case he/she/it, slammed on the brakes! Scared the hell out of me several times! 'Specially when some knucklehead would cut me off in order to make a turn when they weren't payin' attention to what lane they needed to be in!
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Heh, ya could always sell the thing! What the hell ya drivin? I had a '53 Ford F100 we hotrodded in the early ninety's. Would turn mid 11's. Fastest thing stop light to stop light I ever drove! Had a 289 Cobra, w/Ram air under the hood. Only problem was it still had the original drum brakes. Ya had to be damn careful to leave enough room between you and the car in front of you just in case he/she/it, slammed on the brakes! Scared the hell out of me several times! 'Specially when some knucklehead would cut me off in order to make a turn when they weren't payin' attention to what lane they needed to be in!
:thatsright: Now why didn't I think of that? :-) My current driver is an older MB 320Sl.
Couple years ago I got cut off by an arsewhole one day driving my '68 'Cuda. Blew the right front wheel cylinder when I jumped on the binders. The verbal barrage I launched at the offender would have made a sailor blanch.
( The 'Cuda still has all four wheel factory 9" drum brakes and the stock /6 , but it looks fast :naughty:).
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Yes, it's electromagnetic interference causing a scam artist's brain to think about getting a jumbo out-of-court settlement from Toyota. Odds are overwhelming that's the cause of all these Toyota incidents. The discouraging thing is that thousands of scamsters will be successful at cashing in. It's much more expensive for Toyota to defend themselves than to just settle with these crooks.
While I fully agree that all of this Toyota shit IS a scam, back in the late 80's when anti-lock brakes were first introduced for the Corvette, some garage door openers would interfere with them!
You pull your `Vette into your driveway, hit the garage door opener remote, and the anti-lock brakes would engage. Seems the first revisions of those systems on the Corvette used some type of RF (Radio Frequency) based sensors to monitor wheel rotation.
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Okay, time to bitch again.
Why did the primitive light this campfire in "General Discussion," instead of in the automotive forum that my fellow alum Skins has so magnanimously gifted the primitives for discussion of automotive issues?
Where is that automotive forum hidden? I've not seen it.
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well...with more than 20 years of professionally turning wrenches...I believe something is going on with Toyotas DBW system..it has been a problem since 02 when it was introduced [a few TSB's were issued by Toyota]. I don't believe it is a mechanical issue...and may be a computer issue. But...God forbid an engineer admit he is wrong or missed something.
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well...with more than 20 years of professionally turning wrenches...I believe something is going on with Toyotas DBW system..it has been a problem since 02 when it was introduced [a few TSB's were issued by Toyota]. I don't believe it is a mechanical issue...and may be a computer issue. But...God forbid an engineer admit he is wrong or missed something.
Bingo!