http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7075624
This is from last Monday, before the stock market tanked.
The sparkling husband primitive:
Stinky The Clown (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 07:38 PM
Original message
Wow, home sales up by record amount.
The stock market's smokin' hot.
I guess everything's getting closer to being okay. Really. I'm sure of it. Gettin' better.
after which image of a balloon being pricked
Jobs?
Huh?
Shhhhhhhhhhh .........
GMA (323 posts) Mon Nov-23-09 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
1. Who says tax breaks don't spur economic activity?
dysfunctional press (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #1
74. actually, wasn't it the impending end of the tax break that did it in october?
a lot of americans tend to procrastinate.
paulsby (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 11:58 PM
Response to Reply #74
88. i just closed on a sale today
talkin' to my broker etc. there is little doubt that the incentive for first time home buyers really spurred some buying
dysfunctional press (1000+ posts) Tue Nov-24-09 12:07 AM
Response to Reply #88
89. as did the definition of 'first-time buyer'.
The rich kid the grazing primitive:
jgraz (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 11:01 PM
Response to Reply #1
78. Every honest economist.
You know, the ones who aren't Republican.
DJ13 (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 07:42 PM
Response to Original message
2. Stop it!
We must drink the Kool Aid, reality is not allowed.
girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #2
82. No kidding, but it isn't very complicated to see what's really going on.
Courtesy of Calculated Risk:
After the expected spike in existing home sales last month, I quoted legendary basketball coach John Wooden:
"Never mistake activity for achievement."
It is worth repeating this month.
First, it is important to remember that existing home sales are largely irrelevant for the economy. What matters for the economy are new home sales, housing starts and residential investment. And there has been little improvement in these key indicators.
This really shows up on the following graph:
after which a humungous, but easy to understand, chart
This graph shows existing home sales (left axis) through October, and new home sales (right axis) through September.
The initial gap was caused by the flood of distressed sales. This kept existing home sales elevated, and depressed new home sales since builders couldn't compete with the low prices of all the foreclosed properties.
The recent spike in existing home sales was due primarily to the first time homebuyer tax credit.
But what matters for the economy - and jobs - is new home sales, and new home sales are still very low because of huge overhang of existing home inventory and rental properties.
Second, normally a decline in inventory and the months-of-supply would be considered a positive for the existing home market, however much of the apparent recent improvement in months-of-supply is related to the artificial - and likely short lived - boost in activity.
* * * * * PRIMITIVE BRAWL! * * * * *
PRIMITIVES WIGGLE-WAGGLING THEIR ARMPITS AT EACH OTHER!
WIGGLE-WAGGLING IN DISAGREEMENT AND HOSTILITY!
The high fructose corn syrup primitive:
HiFructosePronSyrup (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 07:42 PM
Response to Original message
3. I'm so sorry, Stinky.
Economic recovery must hurt you deeply.
Stinky The Clown (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. I would welcome real recovery
We don't have that, much as you wish it were so. We have a growing housing bubble. We continue to lose jobs. The rich get richer by the day, in partt as a result of using bailout money to bail out the "Too Big To Fails".
But you keep on snarking and remaining willfully delusional.
HiFructosePronSyrup (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. No you wouldn't.
Not that you'd recognize it when you see it.
Stinky The Clown (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Do you have anything "discussional" to say?
I would expect that from The Smartest Person On DU.
HiFructosePronSyrup (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. Do you?
I mean, all you did was post some good news and then whine about it.
Maybe you can post some bad news and be happy about that?
Stinky The Clown (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. Yup .... things are going swimmingly
We're so in control of things.
At this rate, we're not going to "recover" until all we have is the underwear on our butts.
jpak (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 07:58 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. Some people are under the delusion that recovery for a deep recession is going to happen overnight and then there are some people do not want a recovery at all to prove some kind of sick point.
just sayin'
Stinky The Clown (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 08:02 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. Some people are sick of seeing that trickle down bullshit, bailing out the top 1% and .....
..... the Too Big To Fails. All the while, my neighbors - and maybe even yours - are losing their jobs.
Then they lose their houses.
That's what getting bought. The debris, the economic flotsam and jetsam, of actual, real lives. Tell those people how great it is.
Nah. Let's cheer for those home sales.
And hey! How 'bout that DOW, Huh?
jpak (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 08:06 PM
Response to Reply #20
24. How is the Stimulus Bill which is totally responible for the rise in home sales "trickle down" BS
How do you turn the economy around without supporting home sales?
clue
YOU CAN'T
sorry to break this to you...
Stinky The Clown (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 08:09 PM
Original message
Of course ...... you're right
after which a cartoon
jpak (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 08:13 PM
Response to Original message
30. Sorry to inform you of this - but when people buy new homes they buy stuff to go in it and buying that stuff stimulates the economy and puts people back to work.
So yeah - I am right.
Unemployment in my state dropped two months in a row and is 2% below the national average.
Unemployment dropped in 13 states last month.
...and all that is Bad Bad Bad news according to the Sad Sacks.
yup
dana_b (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #30
41. except most of that stuff is made in other countries. Unemployment in my state went up to over 13%. Whooopee!!!
jpak (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #41
55. Yes - that's Obama's fault too
Stinky The Clown (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #55
60. I thought we were talking fact? Why raise an issue of personalities?
That statement is pretty much true.
Look around the room you're in right now. What was purchased in the last 5 years and was made in the USA? In the last 10 years? Seriously. What products will, in your view, be sold that were made in the USA and support other than minimum wage retail jobs? And longshoreman jobs unloading sea containers?
jpak (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 09:15 PM
Response to Reply #60
62. They make mattresses in my state and bed frames and tables and chairs
and they still make Kenmore appliances in the USA and lots more
http://www.stillmadeinusa.com/appliances.html
and in the Northeast, people might buy American made wood and pellet stoves to heat their new homes too.
Oh yeah - they would get a Bad Obama Bad Democratic tax credit for them too.
Is Kool-aid still made in the USA????
The six-pack primitive must live in North Carolina; Broyhill and all that.
Stinky The Clown (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 09:24 PM
Response to Reply #62
66. What is with you and the personality crap? Is the irony completely lost on you that it must be .....
..... pretty bad if there is a need for a web site that lists a few hundred things still made in the USA?
No one is saying this is Obama's fault. This crap started under St Ronnie. Or earlier. Obama is simply the latest caretaker of this bleak, bullshit legacy.
But you go ahead. Make it about personalities. That's a good way to sidestep issues. <--- sarcasm. Not to be taken seriesly
Call people "haters" too. That will help. <---sarcasm. Not to be taken like a moran might.
jpak (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #66
72. Personality crap? Naw - it's all about the DOOOOOOOOOM
Any good economic news is bad.
all bad economic news is good.
Doom - the new black
It's cool!
The Zbigniew primitive:
nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 09:40 PM
Response to Reply #60
73. Actually I bought a new set of mixing bowls when I started baking
The brand is Anchor and they ARE made in the US.
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00805059000P?v...
I was pleasantly surprised.
There is a brand of socks I use for my diabetes, that again is made in the US.
I'd like to see more, but actually we are starting to see some jobs come back... and you can thank the weak dollar for that.
The hugely moronic primitive:
HughMoran (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 07:58 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. The recession didn't stop outsourcing?
Is that all you got??
I lost my last job to China along with thousands of tech-pros. Welcome to the REAL world. Oh, unless you have some nice protectionist measures that you think will fix everything? No? Then put that red herring down you clown.
Uh, franksolich does not like that, and so the hugely moronic primitive is in the doghouse now.
franksolich doesn't care for the sparkling husband primitive either, but on the other hand the sparkling husband primitive is a tiered primitive and a PoP, while the hugely moronic primitive is merely an unterprimitiven, one of the faceless lynch mob.
franksolich doesn't like it when lesser primitives sass greater primitives.
Stinky The Clown (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #18
23. Hey! Hugh!
Right on cue. You just can't help yourself. I post, and there you are. You Love me, dontcha?
:smoooooooch:
HughMoran (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. Paranoia
big destroyia
I saw your thread, read your silly response, then read your even more silly ad hominem lack of response to my very real point.
Stinky The Clown (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-23-09 08:10 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. Hugh .... and I quote:
"That's it"
All the rest is pathetic follow-on.
It's a big bonfire, an enormous burner, but I'll stop here.