The Conservative Cave
Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: GOBUCKS on August 05, 2009, 09:23:20 PM
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DUmmy TwixVoy, who now has two days' seniority as a trainee cable guy, after being fired from a clerk job by Target, feels qualified to lecture the DUmp on economics.
TwixVoy (1000+ posts) Wed Aug-05-09 05:01 PM
Original message
I only see one problem with cash for clunkers
The argument about good clunkers being destroyed is a good point, but I think there will still be a good supply of them out there for the poor.
The biggest problem I see is that the people who have the clunkers are not in debt for that car. Likely many (dare I say most) of the people using this program are getting IN DEBT in order to get a new car they otherwise may not have gotten so in debt for.... and I think debt is one of the things people should absolutely be avoiding right now.
I wish there would have been some requirement that they can finance a max of 50% or something. Other than that it's a good program.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6227596
I'm sure that anyone can PM DUmmy TwixVoy for financial advice and he'd be happy to help. Trainee cable guy by day, crack financial advisor by night.
madokie (1000+ posts) Wed Aug-05-09 05:04 PM
Response to Original message
1. bull *****
what you propose sounds like it would be a hand out to the well to do if you ask me. Debt in itself is not bad. Getting the clunkers off the hiway is good. Selling new cars so the workers can make new cars is good. Stimulating the economy as this is doing is good. I fail to see a downside at all. nothing personal ok
DUmmy madokie is every bit as stupid as DUmmy TwixVoy, and the two proceed to a DUmp pissing match.
TwixVoy (1000+ posts) Wed Aug-05-09 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Debt is not bad?
When people are still losing jobs, banks are needing bail outs because people can't pay the debt they currently have, and we are in debt both at the government and personal level you see nothing wrong with debt?
madokie (1000+ posts) Wed Aug-05-09 05:15 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. No, I don't have a problem with debt.
I make debt then I pay. I doubt that many of the cash for clunkers buyers are the ones who you are referencing either. so there
TwixVoy (1000+ posts) Wed Aug-05-09 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Let me guess....
If you add up all of your assets and all of your debt you have a negative number don't you? (thus a negative net worth)
DUmmy TwixVoy is astonished at the thought of positive net worth.
madokie (1000+ posts) Wed Aug-05-09 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Boy you're way out there aren't you
we barely owe any money at all, actually. And thats only because we choose too not because we have too.
TwixVoy (1000+ posts) Wed Aug-05-09 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Then why have debt?
If you have more assets than debt it would be foolish to "make debt" and pay interest on it.
Therefore your liquid assets are likely less than your debt. In other words, you have a negative net worth. Which is exactly what the banks want from you.
madokie (1000+ posts) Wed Aug-05-09 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #19
23. Hey wake up
Not everyone is in your shoes. Not everyone does things as you apparently do. k I mean what the **** over??? I can get money from our bank for a, well thats none of your business, actually I'd hate for your head to explode all over my monitor if I was to tell you.
TwixVoy (1000+ posts) Wed Aug-05-09 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. A home is different
(well, with the exception of a few years leading up to the housing bubble)
A home is a home. Owning it gives you financial strength, and it is an asset that APPRECIATES with time in a normal economic situation.
A car is a hole in your pocket and is exactly the opposite. It continues to lose value EVERY DAY with out exception. Especially a new one. Rather your car costs 50K or 3K - as long as it serves its primary purpose of transporation why go for the 50K if you have to finance it?
Getting your self in to debt for a vehicle when cheaper alternatives are available is extremely foolish.
Unlike you I can afford to buy a new car should I choose. CASH. Would I do that though? Hell no. The fact that I drive a "clunker" and always have enabled me to save that money rather than send it to the bank every month in the form of a payment.
I voluntarily quit my job several months ago. (as I posted about on DU) I was able to take it easy and casually look for work for MONTHS. I could have remained jobless for a couple years and been fine. Why? Because I have no debt and I have a hell of a lot of savings in foreign mutual funds, CDs, and (in worst case scenario) my retirement accounts. My home is paid for. I bought a home many times less than what I could have "financed" at the time.
You think it is smart to trade that for a car payment? Good luck with that. We are headed for a currency crisis likely by the end of this year. The dollar has dropped to the 70 range.... and when it goes under that cash will be king my friend. Anyone in debt is going to lose everything.
Now DUmmy TwixVoy claims to have money, which we know is not true, unless he is the only fired Target clerk in America who pays cash for new cars and homes.
In this thread, DUmmy TwixVoy has once again proven the well-worn maxim that DUmmies lie, all the time they lie.
And finally, DUmmy abumbyanyothername demonstrates why attitude makes a bum a bum:
abumbyanyothername (1000+ posts) Wed Aug-05-09 05:25 PM
Response to Original message
13. Debt is really the seed of all evil in our society.
It is one reason why corporate America sells college education so hard core. They want those young people indebted out of the gate.
Otherwise, they might all join together and protest the military-industrial complex or something.
In debt for college. In debt for a car. In debt for a house. Have to have a job to have health care.
How dare you speak out for what is right if it runs against corporate interests?
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Because I have no debt and I have a hell of a lot of savings in foreign mutual funds, CDs, and (in worst case scenario) my retirement accounts.
Translation: Because I have no debt and I have a hell of a lot of savings in a Canadian quarter I found, Coldplay CDs and my bong-shaped piggy bank.
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The only problem I see with Cash For Clunkers (other than it being a taxpayer funded giveaway) is that it is creating a short term bubble for the Automotive Industry by giving an incentive to people to buy today who probably would have over the next year anyway.
There will be a sharp increase in sales, thanks to Obama - followed by a pronounced drop-off in sales that will obviously be Bush's fault.
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The only problem I see with Cash For Clunkers (other than it being a taxpayer funded giveaway) is that it is creating a short term bubble for the Automotive Industry by giving an incentive to people to buy today who probably would have over the next year anyway.
There will be a sharp increase in sales, thanks to Obama - followed by a pronounced drop-off in sales that will obviously be Bush's fault.
This is why we had a dot com bust. Corporations, who are generally on a three year depreciation/replacement cycle for IT infrastructure, replaced all their tech gear in 1999, to prepare for Y2K. This left a three year depreciation gap when companies were not buying any IT crap.
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This is why we had a dot com bust. Corporations, who are generally on a three year depreciation/replacement cycle for IT infrastructure, replaced all their tech gear in 1999, to prepare for Y2K. This left a three year depreciation gap when companies were not buying any IT crap.
Oh, yeah. I'd forgotten about Y2K, the global warming of the 20th century.
All those airplanes falling out of the sky, collapse of civilization and all that.
I'm sure lots of DUmmies still have tons of chickpeas in food grade containers.
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The only problem I see with Cash For Clunkers (other than it being a taxpayer funded giveaway) is that it is creating a short term bubble for the Automotive Industry by giving an incentive to people to buy today who probably would have over the next year anyway.
There will be a sharp increase in sales, thanks to Obama - followed by a pronounced drop-off in sales that will obviously be Bush's fault.
One of the problems I see with this is that there's been some idiots saying, "People who have never been able to afford a new car are able to get one now." :thatsright: Hello! Maybe there's a reason they weren't able to afford one before, such as they couldn't handle the payments!!! So, what do you think is going to happen to all of those "new" cars in a few months, when they're repossessed? :banghead:
Effin' idiots.
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Bumbles says "Have to have a job to have health care." Gee, can't you think of anything else where a reliable income might come in handy?
This is the second time I'm nominating Bumbles for the stupidest post of the week. I'm beginning to really dislike this particular DUmbass.
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The dollar has dropped to the 70 range.... and when it goes under that cash will be king my friend.
Huh?
How's that work? When (not if) the dollar tanks, your CASH is going to be pretty much worthless.
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Oh, yeah. I'd forgotten about Y2K, the global warming of the 20th century.
All those airplanes falling out of the sky, collapse of civilization and all that.
I'm sure lots of DUmmies still have tons of chickpeas in food grade containers.
Yeah, I remember that, eating rat roasted over lumber scraps scavenged from the rubble of all those collapsed buildings, the incredible struggle to survive and rebuild civilization. It's pretty amazing how fast we few survivors got everything back up and running so quickly, really.
:-)
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Huh?
How's that work? When (not if) the dollar tanks, your CASH is going to be pretty much worthless.
yup. Better spend it before its worthless. Bulk food would be a good idea. 100 lbs of pinto beans for around $100
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yup. Better spend it before its worthless. Bulk food would be a good idea. 100 lbs of pinto beans for around $100
Where?
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Where?
Walton Feed offers a 50 lb bag for around $36 something
http://waltonfeed.com/category/4
I'm still looking for the other site
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Bottom line on C4C:
1. When one breaks things to make a demand the economy is net worse off.
2. 50+% of the total CO2 and energy used by a car during it's lifetime happens during birth.
3. The overall energy savings will be like I don't know saving $100 million when you are spending $3 trillion at a 2 trillion yearly deficit and $12 trillion in debt.
4. As intelligently stated above, all this does is compress demand and spikes short term sales. However, Obumbler needs some good news to get his horrendous economy bustin' pogroms through...AND FAST!!
5. Just another bailout for the UAW at the deficits expense...and your grandchildren.
6. Proves that the government can't do much of anything right, even run a 1/1000 of the size of the obumblacare?. Did they really think that the stooopid Americans that say a $4500 discount for a $1000 dollar car would not just jump all over it. I guess so because they think the same thing with healthcare.
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This is just another Fannie and Freddie.
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1. When one breaks things to make a demand the economy is net worse off.
Broken window theory stinks.
I guess the coming Civil War will be awesome for the economy. /sarc