The Conservative Cave
Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: dutch508 on June 08, 2009, 02:54:38 PM
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it's all love and hippie make-out session at the DUmp:
babylonsister (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-08-09 03:16 PM
retard comments by retard posters (http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x5805320)
Why Are We Not Detaining Christianists?
Edited on Mon Jun-08-09 03:18 PM by babylonsister
I don't agree with some of this, but they are interesting questions.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/20...
by hilzoy
Jack Balkin thinks, as I do, that the person who killed George Tiller is a terrorist. And he has some excellent questions about what that implies. Here are some of them:
"(1) Should the United States be able to hold Roeder without trial in order to prevent him from returning to society to kill more abortion providers? If we believe that Roeder and other domestic terrorists will plan further attacks on abortion providers and abortion clinics if we let them free, can we subject them to indefinite detention?
(2) The Obama Administration is currently considering a national security court to make decisions about the detention of suspected terrorists, with the power to order continued preventive detention. Should this court be able to hear cases involving U.S. citizens, whether they are Muslim or Christian? (...)
(4) One of the most important reasons for detaining terrorists (suspected or otherwise) is to obtain information about future terrorist attacks that may save lives and prevent future bombings. To procure this information, can the government dispense with the usual constitutional and legal safeguards against coercive interrogation? Should it be able to subject Roeder to enhanced interrogation techniques, including waterboarding and other methods, to determine whether Roeder knows of any other persons who are likely to commit violence against abortion clinics or against abortion providers in the future? Would your answer change if you believed that an attack on an abortion provider or a bombing of an abortion clinic was imminent?
(5) Terrorists and terrorist organizations need money and resources to operate effectively. Often the only way to stop them is to dry up their sources of financial and logistical support. Can the U.S. government freeze the assets of pro-life organizations and make it illegal to contribute money to a pro-life charity that it believes might funnel money or provide material support to persons like Roeder or to organizations that practice violence against abortion providers? Can the government arrest, detain, and seize the property of anti-abortion activists who helped Roeder in any way in the months leading up to his crime, for example by giving him rides or allowing him to stay in their homes?"
Obviously, this is the problem with all these novel legal ideas: they are infinitely extensible. After all, why concentrate on terrorists? It's not as though murder, rape, and the like are not horrific for their victims. Rapists have pretty high recidivism rates; should we be able to detain them indefinitely lest they rape again? People who are caught engaging in various kinds of financial fraud would seem to offer excellent targets for waterboarding: they are likely to have intelligence about other criminals, and might not be able to hold out for very long. And who could possibly object to waterboarding, say, the senior leadership of Enron? Next time a pedophilia scandal pops up in the Catholic Church, we could put various Cardinals and Bishops in tiny little boxes with their own individual spiders, or pour holy water down their noses. (Seizing the Church's assets would be a special bonus: goodbye deficits!)
Don't even get me started on what we might do to the next televangelist caught violating sodomy laws. Don't you want to find out what all the other televangelists do when no one is looking? Can you think of a better way? And wouldn't it be fun to see whether their hair stays perfectly coiffed when they're hanging upside down?
Obviously, though, these tactics were never meant to be used against people like us. It's only other people -- scary, presumptively guilty other people -- whom we get to detain without trial, based on evidence that would not win a conviction in a normal court of law. Not people like us.
Personally, I think this would be a bad idea. But a lot of people seem to disagree. They seem to think it's fine to toss aside centuries of legal tradition, not to mention our civil liberties. What's really strange is that they claim that they are doing this because they love freedom.
—Hilzoy 1:44 AM Permalink
They want to free islamic terrorists and lock up Christians...
Rabrrrrrr (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-08-09 03:18 PM
Response to Original message
1. Send him to Gitmo! Waterboard him!
That'll teach the rightwing ****s a lesson.
I prefer just shooting the leftists.
cali (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-08-09 03:20 PM
Response to Original message
4. Are there any U.S. citizens being held at Gitmo?
We can hope...
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Jack Balkin thinks, as I do, that the person who killed George Tiller is a terrorist.
No, DUmpshit, he's a murderer. Plain and simple. He will get justice as will the "saintly" doctor.
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Personally, I think this would be a bad idea. But a lot of people seem to disagree. They seem to think it's fine to toss aside centuries of legal tradition, not to mention our civil liberties. What's really strange is that they claim that they are doing this because they love freedom.
Is he talking about Sotomayor and some of the more liberal justices on the SCOTUS? And Obama?
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babylonsister (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-08-09 03:16 PM
retard comments by retard posters
Why Are We Not Detaining Christianists?
Edited on Mon Jun-08-09 03:18 PM by babylonsister
...
Maybe it's because you know would be a sure way to end up lining a ditch yourself.
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babylonsister (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-08-09 03:16 PM
retard comments by retard posters
Why Are We Not Detaining Christianists?
Edited on Mon Jun-08-09 03:18 PM by babylonsister
You would if you could but since this guy has more on the ball then you evar will, I feel very secure - me and my pistolas.
[youtube=425,350]MaRdnOtjAIg[/youtube]
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One man. One gun. I guess everyone who ever shot and killed someone because of a disagreement is a terrorist. The Bloods and the Crips of LA better pack for Cuba and get some of those nose plugs.
The Little Goons' worship of this Tiller fool is troubling. I mean, the man's claim to fame was killing actual fully formed human beings. He was a murder-for-hire spooky creep. Yet the Little Goons love him. He was a hero in their eyes.
What draws someone so far away from a civilized society to actually think this Tiller character was some sort of necessary entity? Who in their brain can reconcile that for which he was known? He murdered people. Real people.
The fact Tiller was murdered was no act of heroism. Civilized people don't murder other people. I am not happy with Tillers murder. He should be alive and on trial.
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Retard at Burger King... A CLASSIC. Haven't seen that for a few years.
Thanks for the laugh.
If I could HI5!
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I wish the Dummie would make a go of it. It wouldn't last long.
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I wish the Dummiew would make a go of it. It wouldn't last long.
It sure would be fun dealing with it, wouldn't it be? :hammer:
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They can't tell the difference between a lone gunman and an organized transnational group with thousands of members?
If you DUMmies can find a camp where Roeder trained you have my blessings to shut it down by force of arms; I'll even help. But I'm still waiting for your CinC to strike the camp that trained the terrorist that killed 2 soldiers in Arkansas.
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One man. One gun. I guess everyone who ever shot and killed someone because of a disagreement is a terrorist. The Bloods and the Crips of LA better pack for Cuba and get some of those nose plugs.
The Little Goons' worship of this Tiller fool is troubling. I mean, the man's claim to fame was killing actual fully formed human beings. He was a murder-for-hire spooky creep. Yet the Little Goons love him. He was a hero in their eyes.
What draws someone so far away from a civilized society to actually think this Tiller character was some sort of necessary entity? Who in their brain can reconcile that for which he was known? He murdered people. Real people.
The fact Tiller was murdered was no act of heroism. Civilized people don't murder other people. I am not happy with Tillers murder. He should be alive and on trial.
That was my point in another thread, Undies! It's one thing to be of the mind that this was a necessary evil and to distastefully accept such a thing as what Tiller did(although I'll never agree with such a premise), it's quite another thing to put someone who is likely a legalized serial killer(given the glee and pride with which he did his job) up as some sort of hero. A civilized people/person will usually take some shame in doing despicable things, even if they see it as part of their duty. This man had no shame and that fact alone should make any civilized person(even one who supports what he did) pause or at least distance themselves from it/him. But no, as usual, leftist idiots align themselves with the truly inhumane, as they will continue to and have always done(Sanger, Stalin, Castro, Tiller, etc)
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That was my point in another thread, Undies! It's one thing to be of the mind that this was a necessary evil and to distastefully accept such a thing as what Tiller did(although I'll never agree with such a premise), it's quite another thing to put someone who is likely a legalized serial killer(given the glee and pride with which he did his job) up as some sort of hero. A civilized people/person will usually take some shame in doing despicable things, even if they see it as part of their duty. This man had no shame and that fact alone should make any civilized person(even one who supports what he did) pause or at least distance themselves from it/him. But no, as usual, leftist idiots align themselves with the truly inhumane, as they will continue to and have always done(Sanger, Stalin, Castro, Tiller, etc)
To confuse what Tiller was doing as some sort of "women's health issue" disgusts me. The idea is absurd. If a pregnancy, even in late term, causes a problem which threatens a woman's life, which it may have two or three times in history, because God doesn't ever make a mistake, every doctor in the USA will take care of the mother first. If the child must be sacrificed to save the mother, that's the way it is. Guest/Host stuff.
The Little Goons think this Tiller person was special because he murdered little babies women decided they didn't want to deal with. That is ghoulish stuff. This guy was worse than a serial killer. He charged money to murder kids.
I changed my mind in the last few days. Tiller's murder was a heroic act. Our society wouldn't stop him. He was a murderer as plain and simple as the man who shot him. Someone finally put a stop to his madness.
I am not brave enough to follow through with my convictions about abortion. I am ashamed of that. They murder babies and get rich doing it. We should all be proud this one devil was stopped. His life wasn't one iota more important than the ones he snuffed out.
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babylonsister (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-08-09 03:16 PM
retard comments by retard posters
Why Are We Not Detaining Christianists?
Go for it DUmmie. Go to the police and tell them you've made a citizens arrest on the first Minister you see for being a terrorist.
Let me know what they say to you when they stop laughing.