The Conservative Cave
Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: Ralph Wiggum on December 17, 2008, 01:04:42 PM
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El Supremo (1000+ posts)
Tue Dec-16-08 03:06 PM
Original message
Metric System. I know there are more pressing issues, but do you think Obama... (http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x4662716)
might finally let us go on it?
-picture of world with metric/non-metric system countries not included-
anigbrowl (1000+ posts)
Tue Dec-16-08 03:36 PM
Response to Original message
8. It would cost a lot of money, which is a good reason to do it
:thatsright:
El Supremo (1000+ posts)
Tue Dec-16-08 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. All right! A MPA. Metrics Progress Administration.
Sound great. Employ people to change all the signs and markings.
question everything (1000+ posts)
Tue Dec-16-08 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
14. Sure. He keeps talking about resoring science to the glory days
of... pre-Reagan so why not?
We've made no scientific innovations since Reagan was President? :whatever:
yurbud (1000+ posts)
Wed Dec-17-08 04:39 AM
Response to Original message
40. how many kilograms are there to a stone? or a dime bag?
The all important question, how to measure your drugs. :whatever:
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Another thread! Teh stupid, it burns!
RGBolen (1000+ posts)
Wed Dec-17-08 02:19 PM
Original message
Include switching the US to the metric system in the stimulus package (http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x4669112)
It's long overdue, we need to join the world. For the people who don't like it, just include it when you bitch and whine about Spanish being spoken here and you mumble about how great the country used to be. Oh, and a hint about that, they actually aren't "talking about you." As far as the ignorant, I think President Obama has made it clear with his last few appointments, we are thankfully finished pandering to the ignorant.
It is needed for competitiveness in business and science and it is perfect timing to go with the infrastructure spending. Changing all road signs to kilometers, gasoline pumps to measure in liters, so and so on.
The idea came from here: Metric thread
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I dunno about this.
The British used to have the most-excellent monetary system in the world, four farthings to the penny, twelve pennies to the shilling, five shillings to the crown, four crowns to the pound, and twenty-one shillings to the guinea.
A wonderful system.
But then the British decided that instead of being British, they wanted to be like everybody else, and switched their system to decimal.
One supposes it "simplified" things for idiots and the retarded--reasonable people of course knew the system--but it had an unintended consequence.
Inflation.
Inflation, either price-wise or size-wise.
Newspapers that had been sixpence (6d) under the old system, or exactly the equivalent of 6 cents, American (the British pound was then waving between $2.38 and $2.42, making a penny worth an American cent), suddenly became three new pence (3p) under the new system, the equivalent of 7.2 cents, American.
This was in 1971, and there existed then no compelling reason for the inflation.
Twenty percent inflation.
Multiply that by all the other things the British bought and paid for.
Or look at the standard 12-ounce aluminum can of soda in this country, which is .355 of a liter. If we converted to this fad, one could easily see a soda producer thinking, "Well, .350 of a liter is easier to deal with than .355," and downsize his product accordingly.....without also downsizing the price.
Conversion costs money, and I'm not talking about repainting road-signs here.
People who HAVE to figure out things by tens are pretty stupid anyway.
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The all important question, how to measure your drugs. :whatever:
Hey, the drugs went metric long ago, grams and kilograms, except for a few burnout hippies still dealing marijuana by the ounce.
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I used to design a lot of equipment that went to europe (pre CE) and would get a a good chuckle every time we sent one over all SAE and no tool kit.
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El Supremo (1000+ posts)
Tue Dec-16-08 03:06 PM
Original message
Metric System. I know there are more pressing issues, but do you think Obama...
might finally let us go on it?
They truly want him to be the Jimmy Carter of our time.
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Quote
anigbrowl (1000+ posts)
Tue Dec-16-08 03:36 PM
Response to Original message
8. It would cost a lot of money, which is a good reason to do it
Quote
El Supremo (1000+ posts)
Tue Dec-16-08 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. All right! A MPA. Metrics Progress Administration.
Sound great. Employ people to change all the signs and markings.
What a GREAT idea!
Maybe he could carpet bomb a few cities!!
Think of all the employment THAT would create!
:thumbs:
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DUmbasses might want to learn about the "Broken Window" school of economics.
I doubt their lizard brains will understand but WTH.
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Oh for cryin' out loud!!!!!!!
We're in deep shit economically, and these asshats want to throw needle bearings down the carburetor! What a frikkin' wonderful idea!
These pukes are to stupid to be sharing our air!!!
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It's the "broken window" economics theory. All the (currently emplyed) mechanics that work on SAE equipment will have to purchase metric tools to comply with the ObamaFurhrer's demands. Didn't Congress pull this shit during Nixon? I remember there was some sort of government "suggestion" that we all switch over to the metric system.
jmho, but I prefer the metric system (mostly from working on Hondas). A 10mm is a hell of a lot easier to figure than a 3/4 versus a 5/16. :p
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Of course I still "think" in American units, but I'm fairly experienced with SI as well. One thing I have to say on behalf of the American units is that, while SI may be less error-prone during mental calculation, American units have at least the potential for greater ease of precision, this by simple virtue of the fact that 12 has more factors than 10 (I'm thinking linear measurement here).
2/3 is simpler for the layman to mentally grasp than 0.666666...
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It's the "broken window" economics theory. All the (currently emplyed) mechanics that work on SAE equipment will have to purchase metric tools to comply with the ObamaFurhrer's demands. Didn't Congress pull this shit during Nixon? I remember there was some sort of government "suggestion" that we all switch over to the metric system.
jmho, but I prefer the metric system (mostly from working on Hondas). A 10mm is a hell of a lot easier to figure than a 3/4 versus a 5/16. :p
Screw metric wrenches, I'll just use a Crescent Wrench. (I have seen a metric adjustable wrench not made by Crescent tools)
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It's the "broken window" economics theory. All the (currently emplyed) mechanics that work on SAE equipment will have to purchase metric tools to comply with the ObamaFurhrer's demands. Didn't Congress pull this shit during Nixon? I remember there was some sort of government "suggestion" that we all switch over to the metric system.
jmho, but I prefer the metric system (mostly from working on Hondas). A 10mm is a hell of a lot easier to figure than a 3/4 versus a 5/16. :p
I come from the world of ball bearing and hydraulic fitting measurements where everything is classified by 1/16 of an inch.
Therefore a NPS012RRC ball bearing will always be a narrow inner ring,spherical outer ring,3/4 bore,relubricatible insert bearing.
It becomes very easy once you grasp it.
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I used to design a lot of equipment that went to europe (pre CE) and would get a a good chuckle every time we sent one over all SAE and no tool kit.
Huh?
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I used to design a lot of equipment that went to europe (pre CE) and would get a a good chuckle every time we sent one over all SAE and no tool kit.
Turn about is fair play........... :rotf:
Metric systen gave me a lot of laughs back in the 70's...."Hey. Ya'll sell dem messy-can wrenches?"
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Turn about is fair play........... :rotf:
Metric systen gave me a lot of laughs back in the 70's...."Hey. Ya'll sell dem messy-can wrenches?"
Hell, about everything with threads in a US passenger vehicle now is metric anyway.
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It's the "broken window" economics theory. All the (currently emplyed) mechanics that work on SAE equipment will have to purchase metric tools to comply with the ObamaFurhrer's demands. Didn't Congress pull this shit during Nixon? I remember there was some sort of government "suggestion" that we all switch over to the metric system.
jmho, but I prefer the metric system (mostly from working on Hondas). A 10mm is a hell of a lot easier to figure than a 3/4 versus a 5/16. :p
Don't professional mechanics already have tools in both metric and SAE? I'm just a backyard mechanic, but I've had both for decades.
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I have both at home, but at work(I work on airplanes) I have SAE. I believe ALL aircraft manufacturers use SAE for ease of integration around the world. I would have to spend alot more money to redo my rollaway toolbox with metric. not to mention all the manufacturers would also....MD
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My god the nightmare it would be to go metric within the military..........................in just in dimensional hand tools, torque wrenches, pressure gages, thread plugs and rings :thatsright:
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I guess thery're inspired by how well this plan worked in the 70s. All that came out of it was dual numbers on speedometers and changes in measurements for drugs and beverages.
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Of course I still "think" in American units, but I'm fairly experienced with SI as well. One thing I have to say on behalf of the American units is that, while SI may be less error-prone during mental calculation, American units have at least the potential for greater ease of precision, this by simple virtue of the fact that 12 has more factors than 10 (I'm thinking linear measurement here).
2/3 is simpler for the layman to mentally grasp than 0.666666...
Isn't that the primary dispute between the two schools of thought. Ease of measurement vs, Precision of measurement. I ain't no rocket scientist but I would think precision would take a back seat to ease of measurement. What good does it do to have something easy to do if it doesn't work.
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Isn't that the primary dispute between the two schools of thought. Ease of measurement vs, Precision of measurement. I ain't no rocket scientist but I would think precision would take a back seat to ease of measurement. What good does it do to have something easy to do if it doesn't work.
If you were a rocket scientist, you'd be using a calculator, for which the only factors affecting ease of measurement are your skill with the calculator and the software packages on the calculator.
Ease of measurement is only a concern for those fields where mental calculations are frequently performed - and I'm pretty sure that those are also the fields where precision is less important. However, if you're an engineer designing a structure which will kill people when it fails, precision is much more important - and you aren't going to be doing many mental calculations.
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Precision trumps ease everyday in reality..................if things are precise what good does ease do
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Don't professional mechanics already have tools in both metric and SAE? I'm just a backyard mechanic, but I've had both for decades.
My POS Buick was all-SAE, but I didn't like it enough to buy tools to take care of it. All I have are metric tools. And I'm a cheapass, which doesn't help things.
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I can use metric and US measurements fairly interchangeably.
Of course I still "think" in American units, but I'm fairly experienced with SI as well. One thing I have to say on behalf of the American units is that, while SI may be less error-prone during mental calculation, American units have at least the potential for greater ease of precision, this by simple virtue of the fact that 12 has more factors than 10 (I'm thinking linear measurement here).
2/3 is simpler for the layman to mentally grasp than 0.666666...
The degree of precision is the same. The way we quantify it differs.
Most engineering measurements here are in mm and things are made to that scale ... ie if you have a metric fitting for a hose it will be for example 12mm , not 1/2" (circa 12.5mm). The hose itself is metric so if you were to express it's size in US terms it would come out as something like .4899...."
Is only when it comes to interoperability, where people have issues. Like having to own 2 sets of tools.
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12 mm is close to 7/16th, close enough to use and not round off the bolt head. 13 mm is 1/2". I have both types tools in my rollaway. The stupid thing is this was tried in the 70s (circa 73-75, pre-Carter) and it didn't work. It's just another stupid idea to get the US to conform with the rest of the world. And these libtards accuse us Conservatives of being "conformists"...... :whatever:
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The all important question, how to measure your drugs. :whatever:
Well, duh. A "happy" ounce is 32 grams. A skimpy ounce is 28. Enough for a couple bowls or a half-way decent penner. (http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff68/kayaktn/smileys/emot-stoner.gif)
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12 mm is close to 7/16th, close enough to use and not round off the bolt head. 13 mm is 1/2". I have both types tools in my rollaway. The stupid thing is this was tried in the 70s (circa 73-75, pre-Carter) and it didn't work. It's just another stupid idea to get the US to conform with the rest of the world. And these libtards accuse us Conservatives of being "conformists"...... :whatever:
Think of how much it'd cost to change over... Politicians would be rubbing their hands together with glee thinking of ways to get their cut.
I just own both sets of tools, as does pretty much everyone who has mechanical tools.
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Think of how much it'd cost to change over... Politicians would be rubbing their hands together with glee thinking of ways to get their cut.
You think that's why Obama is pushing it? :sarcasm:
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It's the "broken window" economics theory. All the (currently emplyed) mechanics that work on SAE equipment will have to purchase metric tools to comply with the ObamaFurhrer's demands. Didn't Congress pull this shit during Nixon? I remember there was some sort of government "suggestion" that we all switch over to the metric system.
jmho, but I prefer the metric system (mostly from working on Hondas). A 10mm is a hell of a lot easier to figure than a 3/4 versus a 5/16. :p
Every mechanic I know already has a metric as well as SAE tools in their kit. (I am talking about auto mechanics)
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I can use metric and US measurements fairly interchangeably.
The degree of precision is the same. The way we quantify it differs.
Most engineering measurements here are in mm and things are made to that scale ... ie if you have a metric fitting for a hose it will be for example 12mm , not 1/2" (circa 12.5mm). The hose itself is metric so if you were to express it's size in US terms it would come out as something like .4899...."
Is only when it comes to interoperability, where people have issues. Like having to own 2 sets of tools.
Right, but say you're dividing up a ten-meter length of something-or-other (maybe a wall?) into three equal pieces. Each of those pieces is going to be 3.33333... meters in length. Or three meters, 33 cm, 3.333333... mm. Point is, you're still dealing with a repeating decimal. Of course that isn't an unsurmountable obstacle by any means, but it can be inconvenient. Now, if the length were 10 yards, each section would be exactly ten feet. Dividing each of those sections would leave subsections of exactly three feet and four inches. It's only until you divide those subsections by three again that you run into the repeating decimal problem - which isn't as much a problem as the US system is designed to work with fractions as well as decimal expansions - I don't know if the same is true for the standard use of SI measurements, but it would seem silly to me if it weren't.
Dividing by three isn't an altogether uncommon occurrence, yet insisting upon a base-10 system for linear measure makes it a pain in the ass.
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Right, but say you're dividing up a ten-meter length of something-or-other (maybe a wall?) into three equal pieces. Each of those pieces is going to be 3.33333... meters in length. Or three meters, 33 cm, 3.333333... mm. Point is, you're still dealing with a repeating decimal. Of course that isn't an unsurmountable obstacle by any means, but it can be inconvenient. Now, if the length were 10 yards, each section would be exactly ten feet. Dividing each of those sections would leave subsections of exactly three feet and four inches. It's only until you divide those subsections by three again that you run into the repeating decimal problem - which isn't as much a problem as the US system is designed to work with fractions as well as decimal expansions - I don't know if the same is true for the standard use of SI measurements, but it would seem silly to me if it weren't.
Dividing by three isn't an altogether uncommon occurrence, yet insisting upon a base-10 system for linear measure makes it a pain in the ass.
While I can see your point, I might add that in the case stated, it would be setup at 333.3mm and the 0.03' mm isn't really important in that sort of application as the 0.00122..." is less than the thickness of the paint on the new wall.
Things that require more precision than that would have been built that way to begin with.
The smallest unit I use by hand is 0.1 mm and that's pretty much as fine as what one would wish to go in most common applications. Any more than that and you need a machine to correctly position the tool or the part to begin with . Of course I also own a micrometer , which is accurate down to 0.0005mm and when one gets down to that level of precision it's really splitting hairs as to what's better.
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Wouldn't changing to the metric system also necessitate changing nearly every zoning and construction code? Even our basic land measurements go back to being based on feet and yards. I can remember back in the 70's the push to go go metric. It sucked then and it still sucks.
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Wouldn't changing to the metric system also necessitate changing nearly every zoning and construction code? Even our basic land measurements go back to being based on feet and yards. I can remember back in the 70's the push to go go metric. It sucked then and it still sucks.
I dunno , my house is on land measured in links and chains and was built pre decimalization, I never have problems when I do renovations. I don't see that it needs to be modified even in our decimal system. One can still measure the distance accurately , just use a imperial measuring device (or a metric one if your land is on a newer surveyed plan).
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I was thinking about building codes that give specific measurements for load bearing walls vs non load bearing, roofing, etc. I know some of the local ones here specify inches and feet. i.e. 16 or 24 on center.