Ukraine: Pirates seize ship carrying tanks
KIEV, Ukraine (AP) -- The Foreign Ministry says pirates have seized a Ukrainian-operated ship off Somalia.
The ministry says the Faina was sailing with 21 people on board under the Belize flag, though it is operated by Ukrainian managing company Tomax Team Inc.
The ministry says in a statement that the ship's captain reported being surrounded by three boats of armed men Thursday afternoon.
The ship's passengers include 17 Ukrainian citizens including the captain, as well as three Russians and one Latvian citizen.
The ministry had no information on the ship's cargo. But the Interfax news agency cited an unnamed source as saying the ship was loaded with about 30 T-72 tanks and spare parts for them.
Too short to truncate
LINK (http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/09/25/ukraine.ship.seized.ap/index.html)
QuoteUkraine: Pirates seize ship carrying tanks
KIEV, Ukraine (AP) -- The Foreign Ministry says pirates have seized a Ukrainian-operated ship off Somalia.
The ministry says the Faina was sailing with 21 people on board under the Belize flag, though it is operated by Ukrainian managing company Tomax Team Inc.
The ministry says in a statement that the ship's captain reported being surrounded by three boats of armed men Thursday afternoon.
The ship's passengers include 17 Ukrainian citizens including the captain, as well as three Russians and one Latvian citizen.
The ministry had no information on the ship's cargo. But the Interfax news agency cited an unnamed source as saying the ship was loaded with about 30 T-72 tanks and spare parts for them.
Too short to truncate
LINK (http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/09/25/ukraine.ship.seized.ap/index.html)
Great; the terrorists now have (another?) battalion of tanks.
QuoteUkraine: Pirates seize ship carrying tanks
KIEV, Ukraine (AP) -- The Foreign Ministry says pirates have seized a Ukrainian-operated ship off Somalia.
The ministry says the Faina was sailing with 21 people on board under the Belize flag, though it is operated by Ukrainian managing company Tomax Team Inc.
The ministry says in a statement that the ship's captain reported being surrounded by three boats of armed men Thursday afternoon.
The ship's passengers include 17 Ukrainian citizens including the captain, as well as three Russians and one Latvian citizen.
The ministry had no information on the ship's cargo. But the Interfax news agency cited an unnamed source as saying the ship was loaded with about 30 T-72 tanks and spare parts for them.
Too short to truncate
LINK (http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/09/25/ukraine.ship.seized.ap/index.html)
Great; the terrorists now have (another?) battalion of tanks.
Methinks that the Russian military won't take too "kindly" to this.
QuoteUkraine: Pirates seize ship carrying tanks
KIEV, Ukraine (AP) -- The Foreign Ministry says pirates have seized a Ukrainian-operated ship off Somalia.
The ministry says the Faina was sailing with 21 people on board under the Belize flag, though it is operated by Ukrainian managing company Tomax Team Inc.
The ministry says in a statement that the ship's captain reported being surrounded by three boats of armed men Thursday afternoon.
The ship's passengers include 17 Ukrainian citizens including the captain, as well as three Russians and one Latvian citizen.
The ministry had no information on the ship's cargo. But the Interfax news agency cited an unnamed source as saying the ship was loaded with about 30 T-72 tanks and spare parts for them.
Too short to truncate
LINK (http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/09/25/ukraine.ship.seized.ap/index.html)
Great; the terrorists now have (another?) battalion of tanks.
Methinks that the Russian military won't take too "kindly" to this.
I have no evidence to back me up on this, but I'm not so sure - after their Treaty with the Iranians - that this isn't the Russians version of Lend/Lease.
The Ukraine doesn't FART without Moscow's direct okay to do so in triplicate, especially after they saw what happened when Georgia got uppity with regards to the holy mind and will of the Kremlin.
The Ukraine doesn't FART without Moscow's direct okay to do so in triplicate, especially after they saw what happened when Georgia got uppity with regards to the holy mind and will of the Kremlin.
yes, they do. If not, then yushenko woudn't talk about joining nato. They also woudn't restrict (or attempt to restrict) russian ships from leaving sevastopol. Ukrainian equipment has fought against russian equipment in wars in africa.
The Ukraine doesn't FART without Moscow's direct okay to do so in triplicate, especially after they saw what happened when Georgia got uppity with regards to the holy mind and will of the Kremlin.
yes, they do. If not, then yushenko woudn't talk about joining nato. They also woudn't restrict (or attempt to restrict) russian ships from leaving sevastopol. Ukrainian equipment has fought against russian equipment in wars in africa.
Not only that, the Ukraine has a fair number of Soviet nukes. The Russians know this. The Ukranians could make Russia burn if they were threatened by Russia (at the loss of a significant portion of their people), and Russia won't do what they did to Georgia. Georgia didn't have anything to be able to stop the Russian Army, though their air-defense units did pretty well against the Russian Air Force.
Because of Russia's assault on Georgia, Ukraine has tripled its defense budget and is on full-court press to join NATO.
Ukraine's defense buget = $6 billion
Russia = $37 billion
United States = $700 billion
Who do you think the US would be "sympathetic" with if Russia started a pissing match with Ukraine? Poland, Baltic states, Germany -- none would be too thrilled if Russia picked on the Ukraine next.
Who do you think is going to blink first?
Next.
Because of Russia's assault on Georgia, Ukraine has tripled its defense budget and is on full-court press to join NATO.
Ukraine's defense buget = $6 billion
Russia = $37 billion
United States = $700 billion
Who do you think the US would be "sympathetic" with if Russia started a pissing match with Ukraine? Poland, Baltic states, Germany -- none would be too thrilled if Russia picked on the Ukraine next.
Who do you think is going to blink first?
Next.
the pro nato government is about to lose power, since yushchenko has called for early elections..
why do you think the pro nato coalition in power collapsed?Because of Russia's assault on Georgia, Ukraine has tripled its defense budget and is on full-court press to join NATO.
Ukraine's defense buget = $6 billion
Russia = $37 billion
United States = $700 billion
Who do you think the US would be "sympathetic" with if Russia started a pissing match with Ukraine? Poland, Baltic states, Germany -- none would be too thrilled if Russia picked on the Ukraine next.
Who do you think is going to blink first?
Next.
the pro nato government is about to lose power, since yushchenko has called for early elections..
When you can't find a source of information outside of Russian media, AP, Reuters to ascertain what the sentiments are you really cannot make assumptions on how the election will turn out.
Georgia has the Ukrainian people on edge, so I highly doubt that a Russian apologist is actually going to win.
QuoteUkraine: Pirates seize ship carrying tanks
KIEV, Ukraine (AP) -- The Foreign Ministry says pirates have seized a Ukrainian-operated ship off Somalia.
The ministry says the Faina was sailing with 21 people on board under the Belize flag, though it is operated by Ukrainian managing company Tomax Team Inc.
The ministry says in a statement that the ship's captain reported being surrounded by three boats of armed men Thursday afternoon.
The ship's passengers include 17 Ukrainian citizens including the captain, as well as three Russians and one Latvian citizen.
The ministry had no information on the ship's cargo. But the Interfax news agency cited an unnamed source as saying the ship was loaded with about 30 T-72 tanks and spare parts for them.
Too short to truncate
LINK (http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/09/25/ukraine.ship.seized.ap/index.html)
Great; the terrorists now have (another?) battalion of tanks.
Methinks that the Russian military won't take too "kindly" to this.
why do you think the pro nato coalition in power collapsed?Because of Russia's assault on Georgia, Ukraine has tripled its defense budget and is on full-court press to join NATO.
Ukraine's defense buget = $6 billion
Russia = $37 billion
United States = $700 billion
Who do you think the US would be "sympathetic" with if Russia started a pissing match with Ukraine? Poland, Baltic states, Germany -- none would be too thrilled if Russia picked on the Ukraine next.
Who do you think is going to blink first?
Next.
the pro nato government is about to lose power, since yushchenko has called for early elections..
When you can't find a source of information outside of Russian media, AP, Reuters to ascertain what the sentiments are you really cannot make assumptions on how the election will turn out.
Georgia has the Ukrainian people on edge, so I highly doubt that a Russian apologist is actually going to win.
why do you think the pro nato coalition in power collapsed?Because of Russia's assault on Georgia, Ukraine has tripled its defense budget and is on full-court press to join NATO.
Ukraine's defense buget = $6 billion
Russia = $37 billion
United States = $700 billion
Who do you think the US would be "sympathetic" with if Russia started a pissing match with Ukraine? Poland, Baltic states, Germany -- none would be too thrilled if Russia picked on the Ukraine next.
Who do you think is going to blink first?
Next.
the pro nato government is about to lose power, since yushchenko has called for early elections..
When you can't find a source of information outside of Russian media, AP, Reuters to ascertain what the sentiments are you really cannot make assumptions on how the election will turn out.
Georgia has the Ukrainian people on edge, so I highly doubt that a Russian apologist is actually going to win.
In power? nah. The parliament has a communist-kremlin-loving majority. With its ring-leader the Bill Clinton of Ukraine in that she talks the talk of what the people of Ukraine want to hear, while making nice with Putin so Russia ensures her win in December.
That is certainly not the will of the people. It is corrupt politics 101. The people want to forge a relationship with the EU, join NATO and kick start their economy.
It ain't over by a long shot.
In power? nah. The parliament has a communist-kremlin-loving majority. With its ring-leader the Bill Clinton of Ukraine in that she talks the talk of what the people of Ukraine want to hear, while making nice with Putin so Russia ensures her win in December.
That is certainly not the will of the people. It is corrupt politics 101. The people want to forge a relationship with the EU, join NATO and kick start their economy.
It ain't over by a long shot.
In power? nah. The parliament has a communist-kremlin-loving majority. With its ring-leader the Bill Clinton of Ukraine in that she talks the talk of what the people of Ukraine want to hear, while making nice with Putin so Russia ensures her win in December.
That is certainly not the will of the people. It is corrupt politics 101. The people want to forge a relationship with the EU, join NATO and kick start their economy.
It ain't over by a long shot.
Have fun with him on this one FL. John Matrix is our defender of all things USSR.
And in his own mind he's ALWAYS right.
Yushchenko's party, which wants to forge closer ties with the European Union and the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, quit the coalition on Sept. 3, after Timoshenko's bloc teamed up with the pro-Russian opposition to strip the president of some powers. The parties had 10 days to re-unite.
``A pro-Kremlin parliamentary majority has been de facto formed by Timoshenko's alliance and the Party of Regions'' led by former Prime Minister Viktor Yanukovych, said Vyacheslav Kyrylenko, a member of Yushchenko's Our Ukraine party. ``Our Ukraine has no other choice but to officially announce it is now in opposition.''
Ukrainian officials warned Russia on Thursday not to encourage separatist groups in Ukraine and insisted that Russian military ships will have to leave the Black Sea base of Sevastopol when Russia's lease expires.
The comments revealed the deep tensions between Ukraine and its neighbor to the north following Russia's war with Georgia in August.
Ukraine fears that Moscow may try to encourage a separatist movement on the Black Sea peninsula of Crimea, which hosts Russia's Black Sea fleet.
Russian and Ukrainian diplomats met in Kiev for the latest round of talks on the future of the Russian Black Sea fleet, stationed at Sevastopol on a lease agreement until 2017.
Moscow has insisted it does not want to leave the strategic port and has offered to pay more to continue using it. But Defense Minister Yury Yekhanurov remained firm, saying the deal will not be extended after 2017.
"Come that year and Ukraine will be left without foreign bases on its territory," he told reporters Thursday.
Meanwhile, Marina Ostapenko, a spokeswoman for Ukraine's Security Service, said the government will resist attempts by Russian extremists to recruit Ukrainians to their separatist cause.
Russia's recognition of the Georgian rebel regions of South Ossetia and Abkhazia as independent states following a war last month has only stoked those fears. Crimea long belonged to the Russian empire and the majority of Crimeans are ethnic Russians, many of whom feel close to Moscow.
Ostapenko accused Russian special services of backing extremist groups in Georgia's breakaway regions and Moldova's separatist province of Trans-Dniester and vowed that Ukraine would not allow such activities.
"We will not allow for our citizens to be dragged into such things and their expansion in Ukraine," Ukraine's Security Service chief Valentyn Nalyvaychenko said at a news conference.
Russia has asked Ukrainian authorities to refrain from discussing the expiration date of the deployment of Russia's Black Sea Fleet in Ukraine in 2017.
"Today, we cannot find a solution that will suit both parties. We ask the Ukrainian side to postpone [negotiations] on the matter. It is early to discuss this issue for certain reasons," the Russian Foreign Ministry's Ambassador at Large Vladimir Dorokhin said during a television link-up on Friday
QuoteYushchenko's party, which wants to forge closer ties with the European Union and the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, quit the coalition on Sept. 3, after Timoshenko's bloc teamed up with the pro-Russian opposition to strip the president of some powers. The parties had 10 days to re-unite.
``A pro-Kremlin parliamentary majority has been de facto formed by Timoshenko's alliance and the Party of Regions'' led by former Prime Minister Viktor Yanukovych, said Vyacheslav Kyrylenko, a member of Yushchenko's Our Ukraine party. ``Our Ukraine has no other choice but to officially announce it is now in opposition.''
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601085&sid=arxd209BuhWY&refer=europe
I wonder why Timoshenko would make such a statement on the use of their ports... oh, my bad:QuoteUkrainian officials warned Russia on Thursday not to encourage separatist groups in Ukraine and insisted that Russian military ships will have to leave the Black Sea base of Sevastopol when Russia's lease expires.
The comments revealed the deep tensions between Ukraine and its neighbor to the north following Russia's war with Georgia in August.
Ukraine fears that Moscow may try to encourage a separatist movement on the Black Sea peninsula of Crimea, which hosts Russia's Black Sea fleet.
Russian and Ukrainian diplomats met in Kiev for the latest round of talks on the future of the Russian Black Sea fleet, stationed at Sevastopol on a lease agreement until 2017.
Moscow has insisted it does not want to leave the strategic port and has offered to pay more to continue using it. But Defense Minister Yury Yekhanurov remained firm, saying the deal will not be extended after 2017.
"Come that year and Ukraine will be left without foreign bases on its territory," he told reporters Thursday.
Meanwhile, Marina Ostapenko, a spokeswoman for Ukraine's Security Service, said the government will resist attempts by Russian extremists to recruit Ukrainians to their separatist cause.
Russia's recognition of the Georgian rebel regions of South Ossetia and Abkhazia as independent states following a war last month has only stoked those fears. Crimea long belonged to the Russian empire and the majority of Crimeans are ethnic Russians, many of whom feel close to Moscow.
Ostapenko accused Russian special services of backing extremist groups in Georgia's breakaway regions and Moldova's separatist province of Trans-Dniester and vowed that Ukraine would not allow such activities.
"We will not allow for our citizens to be dragged into such things and their expansion in Ukraine," Ukraine's Security Service chief Valentyn Nalyvaychenko said at a news conference.
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5iuG-1AWCQ_aPSNfCAlDvtxx54j7gD93DQRO80
Of course, 2017 is not exactly tomorrow is it? actually it isn't December, or anytime next year which will be when the new elections will be held:QuoteRussia has asked Ukrainian authorities to refrain from discussing the expiration date of the deployment of Russia's Black Sea Fleet in Ukraine in 2017.
"Today, we cannot find a solution that will suit both parties. We ask the Ukrainian side to postpone [negotiations] on the matter. It is early to discuss this issue for certain reasons," the Russian Foreign Ministry's Ambassador at Large Vladimir Dorokhin said during a television link-up on Friday
http://www.istockanalyst.com/article/viewiStockNews+articleid_2655850.html
Nothing to see here people. No worries -- we have plenty of time to fix this election so things go our way. :-)
Under these circumstances, we must assume that Ukraine's president has got the maximum he possibly could amid these dark prospects. But this result is very disappointing," says Alexei Kolomiets, president of the independent Center for European and Transatlantic Studies in Kiev. "I have no doubt that Ukraine's political crisis is being organized from outside, and the team that's directing this turmoil is sitting in the Kremlin," he added.
Ukraine's location between Russia and Poland and its 45-million-strong population, 1 in 6 of whom are Russian, gives it terrific value to Moscow. Yet after Georgia, the EU is opting for an exchange with Ukraine and Georgia through economic aid and outreach. For example, a Polish-Swedish initiative to create an eastern European neighborhood policy has been revitalized, with an underlying assumption that the best way to confront Moscow is by helping Ukraine develop. Similar efforts are being worked on assiduously in Poland, the Baltics, and Sweden with the support of France and Britain.
Russia's venture into Georgia has solidified the European view that Moscow no longer wishes to be a "transitional" power aiming to integrate with Western systems and norms. But Ukraine does see itself as a transitional power, says Anne de Tinguy, a Russian-Ukrainian expert at Sciences Po in Paris.
On 24 July, Interfax Ukraine cited the results of the most recent survey conducted by the Yaremenko Ukrainian Institute of Social Research and the “Social Monitoring†Center between 10 and 18 July. It is based on 2,014 respondents over the age of 18, residing in 132 cities and villages in all regions of Ukraine, and has a margin of error of 1.34-2.24%.
...you want them to poll every person in the country?QuoteUnder these circumstances, we must assume that Ukraine's president has got the maximum he possibly could amid these dark prospects. But this result is very disappointing," says Alexei Kolomiets, president of the independent Center for European and Transatlantic Studies in Kiev. "I have no doubt that Ukraine's political crisis is being organized from outside, and the team that's directing this turmoil is sitting in the Kremlin," he added.
Ukraine's location between Russia and Poland and its 45-million-strong population, 1 in 6 of whom are Russian, gives it terrific value to Moscow. Yet after Georgia, the EU is opting for an exchange with Ukraine and Georgia through economic aid and outreach. For example, a Polish-Swedish initiative to create an eastern European neighborhood policy has been revitalized, with an underlying assumption that the best way to confront Moscow is by helping Ukraine develop. Similar efforts are being worked on assiduously in Poland, the Baltics, and Sweden with the support of France and Britain.
Russia's venture into Georgia has solidified the European view that Moscow no longer wishes to be a "transitional" power aiming to integrate with Western systems and norms. But Ukraine does see itself as a transitional power, says Anne de Tinguy, a Russian-Ukrainian expert at Sciences Po in Paris.
http://ukraineanalysis.wordpress.com/2007/07/25/ukrainians-shun-nato-support-ties-with-russia/
Well for starters, by joining NATO they could stand independent from Russia and would be safe from invasion. It would also certainly solidify their move toward joining the EU as it would bring a political stability they just don't have at this time.
Joining the EU would crack their economy wide open -- as would kicking the Russians out of their ports within the decade.
As for your poll figures:QuoteOn 24 July, Interfax Ukraine cited the results of the most recent survey conducted by the Yaremenko Ukrainian Institute of Social Research and the “Social Monitoring†Center between 10 and 18 July. It is based on 2,014 respondents over the age of 18, residing in 132 cities and villages in all regions of Ukraine, and has a margin of error of 1.34-2.24%.
In a country of 45 million, they pick 15 people from 132 villages and that is supposed to be accurate? Every article written on this topic points to this particular survey, which makes no sense given the age of it.
Russia goes after Georgia, the Ukranians are fearful they will be next, yet we are supposed to believe they support the Kremlin's position on their joining NATO?
Save for a few Russian loyalists, are you kidding me right now?
Results are based on face-to-face interviews conducted in April-July 2007, with 1,066 adults, aged 15 and older, in Ukraine. For results based on the total sample of national adults, one can say with 95% confidence that the maximum margin of sampling error is ±3 percentage points. In addition to sampling error, question wording and practical difficulties in conducting surveys can introduce error or bias into the findings of public opinion polls."Is this poll also wrong, simply because "only" 1,066 people were polled? The Gallup polls used to say who's ahead in the Presidential race use 1-3 thousand people. Are those polls wrong because not enough people are being polled?
Ultimately, a president needs to reflect the sentiments of the public. Yushchenko’s avowed pro-Georgian, pro-NATO, and increasingly anti-Russian policies do not have overwhelming support in Ukraine. In fact they serve to highlight the regional divisions. On Georgia especially a consensus is plainly lacking.Here is another poll regarding nato from the same piece:
Thus an August poll conducted by the Razumkov Center asked a sampling of respondents in the different regions of Ukraine which country they perceived as the aggressor in the Russian-Georgian conflict (a question that would have received a unanimous verdict in neighboring Poland). In western Ukraine, 55.2% saw Russia in this role, 15.1% both countries, and 7% Georgia. The center was evenly divided. However, Eastern Ukraine perceived Georgia as the main aggressor (37.2% to 13.8%), and in southern Ukraine almost 57% maintained the same, with only 13.8% citing Russia.
Though the same Center’s webpage does not offer a recent poll on NATO membership, a June 2008 survey indicated that 60% of respondents opposed it, with 20.9% in favor. Incidentally in June 2002, according to this same source, 32% supported accession to NATO.
Joining the alliance has featured on Ukraine's political agenda since 2002, when then-President Leonid Kuchma and Prime Minister Victor Yanukovych provided initial momentum. In 2004, the Yanukovych government adopted an official strategy aimed at joining in 2008. But the issue quickly bogged down in domestic tussles over whether to hold a national referendum on NATO membership. Such a vote has been championed by the current opposition coalition, led by none other than Yanukovych. His Party of the Regions, the dominant partner in the opposition coalition-it actually received the most votes of any individual party in the most recent parliamentary elections in September 2007-blocked all work in the parliament for several weeks in early 2008 until the government agreed to the referendum idea.
This fractious situation became more strained after 12 February 2008, when Russian President Vladimir Putin threatened to aim nuclear warheads at Ukraine if it ever should deploy NATO missiles on its territory. This provoked a fiercely critical response from U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, who called the threat "reprehensible" and "unacceptable." Given the high political stakes, Ukrainian Prime Minister Yulia Tymoshenko is choosing to move cautiously.
Joining the alliance has featured on Ukraine's political agenda since 2002, when then-President Leonid Kuchma and Prime Minister Victor Yanukovych provided initial momentum. In 2004, the Yanukovych government adopted an official strategy aimed at joining in 2008. But the issue quickly bogged down in domestic tussles over whether to hold a national referendum on NATO membership. Such a vote has been championed by the current opposition coalition, led by none other than Yanukovych. His Party of the Regions, the dominant partner in the opposition coalition-it actually received the most votes of any individual party in the most recent parliamentary elections in September 2007-blocked all work in the parliament for several weeks in early 2008 until the government agreed to the referendum idea.
Save for a few Russian loyalists, are you kidding me right now?
QuoteJoining the alliance has featured on Ukraine's political agenda since 2002, when then-President Leonid Kuchma and Prime Minister Victor Yanukovych provided initial momentum. In 2004, the Yanukovych government adopted an official strategy aimed at joining in 2008. But the issue quickly bogged down in domestic tussles over whether to hold a national referendum on NATO membership. Such a vote has been championed by the current opposition coalition, led by none other than Yanukovych. His Party of the Regions, the dominant partner in the opposition coalition-it actually received the most votes of any individual party in the most recent parliamentary elections in September 2007-blocked all work in the parliament for several weeks in early 2008 until the government agreed to the referendum idea.
This fractious situation became more strained after 12 February 2008, when Russian President Vladimir Putin threatened to aim nuclear warheads at Ukraine if it ever should deploy NATO missiles on its territory. This provoked a fiercely critical response from U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, who called the threat "reprehensible" and "unacceptable." Given the high political stakes, Ukrainian Prime Minister Yulia Tymoshenko is choosing to move cautiously.
The date of your Gallop (nonsense) poll is when exactly? Given the makeup of Ukraine, a legitimate poll would indeed have to entail questioning a quite a large segment of the population which would expand over the entire country.QuoteJoining the alliance has featured on Ukraine's political agenda since 2002, when then-President Leonid Kuchma and Prime Minister Victor Yanukovych provided initial momentum. In 2004, the Yanukovych government adopted an official strategy aimed at joining in 2008. But the issue quickly bogged down in domestic tussles over whether to hold a national referendum on NATO membership. Such a vote has been championed by the current opposition coalition, led by none other than Yanukovych. His Party of the Regions, the dominant partner in the opposition coalition-it actually received the most votes of any individual party in the most recent parliamentary elections in September 2007-blocked all work in the parliament for several weeks in early 2008 until the government agreed to the referendum idea.
http://www.audiencescapes.org/component,8/action,show_content/id,40/
How can that be if the overwhelming majority of Ukranians are against joining NATO?
The dates of your polls, the wording of the findings "disagree somewhat or strongly", the amount of population sampled -- all should cause you to take pause and question their worth. It doesn't however and you are the only one who can explain that.
QuoteSave for a few Russian loyalists, are you kidding me right now?
Sadly...no he's not.
QuoteJoining the alliance has featured on Ukraine's political agenda since 2002, when then-President Leonid Kuchma and Prime Minister Victor Yanukovych provided initial momentum. In 2004, the Yanukovych government adopted an official strategy aimed at joining in 2008. But the issue quickly bogged down in domestic tussles over whether to hold a national referendum on NATO membership. Such a vote has been championed by the current opposition coalition, led by none other than Yanukovych. His Party of the Regions, the dominant partner in the opposition coalition-it actually received the most votes of any individual party in the most recent parliamentary elections in September 2007-blocked all work in the parliament for several weeks in early 2008 until the government agreed to the referendum idea.
This fractious situation became more strained after 12 February 2008, when Russian President Vladimir Putin threatened to aim nuclear warheads at Ukraine if it ever should deploy NATO missiles on its territory. This provoked a fiercely critical response from U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, who called the threat "reprehensible" and "unacceptable." Given the high political stakes, Ukrainian Prime Minister Yulia Tymoshenko is choosing to move cautiously.
The date of your Gallop (nonsense) poll is when exactly? Given the makeup of Ukraine, a legitimate poll would indeed have to entail questioning a quite a large segment of the population which would expand over the entire country.QuoteJoining the alliance has featured on Ukraine's political agenda since 2002, when then-President Leonid Kuchma and Prime Minister Victor Yanukovych provided initial momentum. In 2004, the Yanukovych government adopted an official strategy aimed at joining in 2008. But the issue quickly bogged down in domestic tussles over whether to hold a national referendum on NATO membership. Such a vote has been championed by the current opposition coalition, led by none other than Yanukovych. His Party of the Regions, the dominant partner in the opposition coalition-it actually received the most votes of any individual party in the most recent parliamentary elections in September 2007-blocked all work in the parliament for several weeks in early 2008 until the government agreed to the referendum idea.
http://www.audiencescapes.org/component,8/action,show_content/id,40/
How can that be if the overwhelming majority of Ukranians are against joining NATO?
The dates of your polls, the wording of the findings "disagree somewhat or strongly", the amount of population sampled -- all should cause you to take pause and question their worth. It doesn't however and you are the only one who can explain that.
The Gallup poll was simply an example that demonstrated that polls never really sample the amount of people you seem to want them to sample. It seems as though you want a poll of a huge percentage of the population, and if that it not done, then the poll isn't reliable. Of course, I stated that in my previous post.
Yanukovych got that many votes for one simple reason. The people of Ukraine really don't like Yushchenko much anymore. It wasn't a vote on who wants or doesn't want NATO, since Yushchenko also wants to join it.
You also seemed to ignore the other polls i posted...
QuoteJoining the alliance has featured on Ukraine's political agenda since 2002, when then-President Leonid Kuchma and Prime Minister Victor Yanukovych provided initial momentum. In 2004, the Yanukovych government adopted an official strategy aimed at joining in 2008. But the issue quickly bogged down in domestic tussles over whether to hold a national referendum on NATO membership. Such a vote has been championed by the current opposition coalition, led by none other than Yanukovych. His Party of the Regions, the dominant partner in the opposition coalition-it actually received the most votes of any individual party in the most recent parliamentary elections in September 2007-blocked all work in the parliament for several weeks in early 2008 until the government agreed to the referendum idea.
This fractious situation became more strained after 12 February 2008, when Russian President Vladimir Putin threatened to aim nuclear warheads at Ukraine if it ever should deploy NATO missiles on its territory. This provoked a fiercely critical response from U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, who called the threat "reprehensible" and "unacceptable." Given the high political stakes, Ukrainian Prime Minister Yulia Tymoshenko is choosing to move cautiously.
The date of your Gallop (nonsense) poll is when exactly? Given the makeup of Ukraine, a legitimate poll would indeed have to entail questioning a quite a large segment of the population which would expand over the entire country.QuoteJoining the alliance has featured on Ukraine's political agenda since 2002, when then-President Leonid Kuchma and Prime Minister Victor Yanukovych provided initial momentum. In 2004, the Yanukovych government adopted an official strategy aimed at joining in 2008. But the issue quickly bogged down in domestic tussles over whether to hold a national referendum on NATO membership. Such a vote has been championed by the current opposition coalition, led by none other than Yanukovych. His Party of the Regions, the dominant partner in the opposition coalition-it actually received the most votes of any individual party in the most recent parliamentary elections in September 2007-blocked all work in the parliament for several weeks in early 2008 until the government agreed to the referendum idea.
http://www.audiencescapes.org/component,8/action,show_content/id,40/
How can that be if the overwhelming majority of Ukranians are against joining NATO?
The dates of your polls, the wording of the findings "disagree somewhat or strongly", the amount of population sampled -- all should cause you to take pause and question their worth. It doesn't however and you are the only one who can explain that.
The Gallup poll was simply an example that demonstrated that polls never really sample the amount of people you seem to want them to sample. It seems as though you want a poll of a huge percentage of the population, and if that it not done, then the poll isn't reliable. Of course, I stated that in my previous post.
Yanukovych got that many votes for one simple reason. The people of Ukraine really don't like Yushchenko much anymore. It wasn't a vote on who wants or doesn't want NATO, since Yushchenko also wants to join it.
You also seemed to ignore the other polls i posted...
You posted two polls, both with samplings that could very well be skewed given the makeup of Ukraine -- we have no idea which areas were tapped for polling. You also have no idea how a person who was formerly under Soviet control would respond when Putin threatens to aim nukes at you.
The timing of the polls is certainly questionable, as is the polling sample and the results as reported -- disagree somewhat means what exactly?
I place no importance or meaning whatsoever on polls, and feel when you have to use them as the sole criteria to support your argument then you have no credible argument.
If the people of Ukraine are overwhelming against joining NATO, then common sense would dictate that Putin wouldn't be exerting so much energy to see that it never happens would he? What does he care if Ukraine joins NATO?
On NATO? no you didn't.
You have not addressed the concerns I have on the polls, which is rather telling especially given your last post -- which is tantamount to a temper tantrum.
Ukraine is in a rather fragile political state presently with regard to the Kremlin's interference. I am not optimistic at all that the elections will be free from corruption. The national referendum you point to will hopefully represent a true reflection of the will of the Ukranian people.
(CNN) -- Pirates who seized a Ukrainian vessel loaded with tanks and weapons off the African coast have lowered their ransom demand to $5 million.
The pirates initially demanded $35 million and no military action, said Andrew Mwangura of the Kenya Seafarers Association. They decreased their demands for several reasons, Mwangura said.
Those reasons include that the crew is from eastern Europe and not the United States, the weapons the ship carries are secondhand, and there is no way to unload the tanks without coming onto land, he said.
The vessel Faina, flying a Belize flag, was headed to the Kenyan port of Mombasa after departing Nikolayev, Ukraine, according to Lt. Col. Konstantin Sadilov, spokesman for the Ukrainian defense ministry. He said it was seized by pirates Thursday not far from its destination.
According to the defense ministry, the ship was carrying 33 Soviet-made T-72 tanks, tank artillery shells, grenade launchers and small arms.
The weapons were sold to Kenya by the Ukraine, said Ukraine Defense Minister Yuri Yekhanurov, according to the Interfax-Ukraine news agency. He said that the entire shipment was contracted and carried out by Ukrspetzexport, Ukraine's state arms exports monopoly, and that it would know better exactly what was on board.
On NATO? no you didn't.
You have not addressed the concerns I have on the polls, which is rather telling especially given your last post -- which is tantamount to a temper tantrum.
Ukraine is in a rather fragile political state presently with regard to the Kremlin's interference. I am not optimistic at all that the elections will be free from corruption. The national referendum you point to will hopefully represent a true reflection of the will of the Ukranian people.
lol, temper tantrum? I just find it odd that you find polls to be meaningless. What other way is there to gauge what the people feel on a certain subject that is actually cost effective? You can't have a referendum for every issue all the time.
The "somewhat disagree" is just a standard answer for a survey. I'm sure you've filled one out sometime gave you the option of saying "Strongly Agree, agree, neither agree nor disagree, disagree, or strongly disagree"
Here's a thought...something that would send a clear message to the pirates.
Blow the damn boat right out from under them.
That much ammo and other combustibles on board...we could see the glow from here.
The pirates would think twice about snatching another ship any time soon.
Here's a thought...something that would send a clear message to the pirates.
Blow the damn boat right out from under them.
That much ammo and other combustibles on board...we could see the glow from here.
The pirates would think twice about snatching another ship any time soon.
right, blow it up. Who cares about the crew being held hostage on it?
Here's a thought...something that would send a clear message to the pirates.
Blow the damn boat right out from under them.
That much ammo and other combustibles on board...we could see the glow from here.
The pirates would think twice about snatching another ship any time soon.
right, blow it up. Who cares about the crew being held hostage on it?
Screw the crew what about all the tanks??
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7642978.stm
Another of the ships was from Russia but the nationality of the third was not clear.
The Russian guided missile frigate Neustrashimy, or Intrepid, is not expected to reach the Somali coast for several days. However, the state-owned Russian news agency RIA-Novosti, quoting a high-level Navy official, says the frigate is carrying marines and special forces commandoes.
Navy told by Somali govt to get somehttp://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7642978.stm
Another of the ships was from Russia but the nationality of the third was not clear.
Seems the Ruskies haven't gotten there yetQuoteThe Russian guided missile frigate Neustrashimy, or Intrepid, is not expected to reach the Somali coast for several days. However, the state-owned Russian news agency RIA-Novosti, quoting a high-level Navy official, says the frigate is carrying marines and special forces commandoes.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,431198,00.html
Navy told by Somali govt to get somehttp://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7642978.stm
Another of the ships was from Russia but the nationality of the third was not clear.
Seems the Ruskies haven't gotten there yetQuoteThe Russian guided missile frigate Neustrashimy, or Intrepid, is not expected to reach the Somali coast for several days. However, the state-owned Russian news agency RIA-Novosti, quoting a high-level Navy official, says the frigate is carrying marines and special forces commandoes.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,431198,00.html
it might take a while, it's coming from the baltic.
I don't know, it could be another ship.Navy told by Somali govt to get somehttp://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7642978.stm
Another of the ships was from Russia but the nationality of the third was not clear.
Seems the Ruskies haven't gotten there yetQuoteThe Russian guided missile frigate Neustrashimy, or Intrepid, is not expected to reach the Somali coast for several days. However, the state-owned Russian news agency RIA-Novosti, quoting a high-level Navy official, says the frigate is carrying marines and special forces commandoes.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,431198,00.html
it might take a while, it's coming from the baltic.
So in other words there's not a Russian ship on scene yet as the exerpt from the article you posted claims.