The Conservative Cave

Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: fatboy on January 24, 2017, 06:08:13 PM

Title: SHRED senses something
Post by: fatboy on January 24, 2017, 06:08:13 PM
Newly minted President Trump, in concert with his media minions, is going to wipe out (with a cloth or something) our very way of life!

Quote
Tue Jan 24, 2017, 06:36 PM

Star Member SHRED (15,552 posts)

Republican plan is working
   
 
tRump is distracting the media and creating the headlines with his lies while the GOP dismantles our government.

That's what I sense.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10028531117

 
I sense that Ted is having an arguement with himself. On one shoulder he is hearing voices telling him that Trump is dumb. The other ear is hearing that  Trump is an evil genius.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: Karin on January 24, 2017, 06:14:10 PM
Freezing/removing all those do nothing fed jobs in which everyone is watching porn, or yakking on the internet all day for $90K isn't "dismantling the government."  I think most of us have been on the receiving end of restructuring and "right-sizing."  They should experience it too. 

They had to justify their existence, so they'd just create a regulation every day.  It seemed even that they were trolling us.  "What can we do today, before we take a break with jugs.com?"
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: Patriot Guard Rider on January 24, 2017, 06:18:48 PM
Freezing/removing all those do nothing fed jobs in which everyone is watching porn, or yakking on the internet all day for $90K isn't "dismantling the government."  I think most of us have been on the receiving end of restructuring and "right-sizing."  They should experience it too. 

They had to justify their existence, so they'd just create a regulation every day.  It seemed even that they were trolling us.  "What can we do today, before we take a break with jugs.com?"

I have worked for four companies that were on the receiving end of a buyout. Every. Single. Time. the company being bought out faced massive, massive layoffs since the buyer had people capable of doing the job.

I had to go home, face the family and tell them I got laid off. Humbling. I had to declare bankruptcy 20 years ago because of it. But I survived.

The fed people are now facing what millions of us have faced. It isn't fun, but they'll survive.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: SSG Snuggle Bunny on January 24, 2017, 06:32:58 PM
"I felt a great disturbance in the Force...

(http://www.destinationhollywood.com/movies/starwars/images/moviequotes/starwars4_clip11.jpg)

"As if millions of spoiled retards just realized no one
wants to listen to their shit."
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: Karin on January 24, 2017, 06:48:25 PM
Five for me, PGR. It's awful and I'm exhausted from it.  These fed guys have no idea, since they're so-called "un-fireable."  Private sector is entirely at-will, and this oconomy has just decimated businesses.  When you can't make payroll, you just can't, so you fire a big bunch of people.  Going home is the worst.   

No one wants to listen to spoiled retards and their shit.  ^^ SSB
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: jukin on January 24, 2017, 07:37:26 PM
Quote
Republican plan is working
   
 
tRump is distracting the media and creating the headlines with his lies while the GOP dismantles our government.

Yes that is the plan. Trump said that wss the plan and Trump is living up to his campaign promises. Once the federal government is whittled down to those that are considered "essential" when WDC gets a couple of inches of snow, America Will Be Great Again.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: Crazy Horse on January 24, 2017, 08:25:24 PM
Freezing/removing all those do nothing fed jobs in which everyone is watching porn, or yakking on the internet all day for $90K isn't "dismantling the government."  I think most of us have been on the receiving end of restructuring and "right-sizing."  They should experience it too. 

They had to justify their existence, so they'd just create a regulation every day.  It seemed even that they were trolling us.  "What can we do today, before we take a break with jugs.com?"

I really wish  I made that much. As a current federal employee that works for the department of the Navy I don't see how this will help us.  We in the department of defense have seen these cuts for many years now due to sequestration.  That's OK we'll l just turn everything over from ships and aircraft to the military for maintenance .
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: FunkyZero on January 24, 2017, 10:25:57 PM
I have worked for four companies that were on the receiving end of a buyout. Every. Single. Time. the company being bought out faced massive, massive layoffs since the buyer had people capable of doing the job.

I had to go home, face the family and tell them I got laid off. Humbling. I had to declare bankruptcy 20 years ago because of it. But I survived.

The fed people are now facing what millions of us have faced. It isn't fun, but they'll survive.

it sucks ASS.
Same thing happened to me.. TWICE.
I was starting to get a complex.
Fortunately God always eventually shines that light in the right direction and I've managed to escape total financial ruin.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: Adam Wood on January 25, 2017, 02:30:29 AM
I really wish  I made that much. As a current federal employee that works for the department of the Navy I don't see how this will help us.  We in the department of defense have seen these cuts for many years now due to sequestration.  That's OK we'll l just turn everything over from ships and aircraft to the military for maintenance .
What this does is it ultimately frees up more money that in the end should be coming your way, since his plan is to add a bunch of ships.

What Trump is doing here is stopping the bleeding on paper.  This revolves around the idiotic DC budgetary process, which says that jobs that aren't filled today, and may well have been vacant for years, still sit on future budgets, sucking up money in the budget that may well never get spent because those positions may never get filled at all, but they still have to include that salary, benefits, etc. for that "employee" for years in advance.

Another way to look at it: you run the Crazy Horse Widget Company.  At one point early on in the company, you think that you need another guy to operate one of your widget presses.  So, you put it in your budget for next year to hire and pay employee X $50K per year, plus $10K in benefits.  Next year comes around, and you find that you don't actually need that employee because the one you already have can run the press just fine.  So you're not actually going to spend that sixty grand per year going forward. Now, out here in Normal Land, outside of the Beltway, you would just take that potential employee out of the budget going forward.  Not so inside the Beltway: they keep that employee who was never actually hired in the budget for years and years going forward.  Multiply that by the thousands of federal jobs that sit vacant today and over ten years going forward, and you're talking about huge sums of money that is sucking up space in the budget for employees who often are never actually going to be hired.  That $60K employee turns into $600K because of a ten-year budget, and then if there are 10,000 of those positions, you're talking about a $6,000,000,000 hit to the budget.

By declaring a hiring freeze, Trump is able to go into the budget and say "OK, we're not hiring these people on paper, so there's all these billions of dollars that are freed up in the budget and we can now re-allocate that money from the Department of Thumb Up Your Ass to something actually useful, like building ships or roads or bridges."  Without the hiring freeze, though, he can't do that with the budget.

It sounds crazy and stupid, and that's mostly because it actually IS crazy and stupid, but this is the stupid way shit gets done inside the Twilight Zone of Accounting Beltway.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: SVPete on January 25, 2017, 07:57:10 AM
Five for me, PGR. It's awful and I'm exhausted from it.  These fed guys have no idea, since they're so-called "un-fireable."  Private sector is entirely at-will, and this oconomy has just decimated businesses.  When you can't make payroll, you just can't, so you fire a big bunch of people.  Going home is the worst.   

No one wants to listen to spoiled retards and their shit.  ^^ SSB

Same number of "T-shirts" here, all when we were a single-income household, 4 when we had one or more dependent kids. On that level, I feel sorry for anyone laid off. OTOH, the civil service system that was supposed to keep professional people in non-appointed jobs (instead of incompetent cronies) has morphed into a system where incompetents and sloughers are all but unfirable and "encourage" good coworkers.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: SVPete on January 25, 2017, 07:58:11 AM
BTW, SHRED should not associate himself with the word, "sense".
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: FiddyBeowulf on January 25, 2017, 08:48:17 AM
Freezing/removing all those do nothing fed jobs in which everyone is watching porn, or yakking on the internet all day for $90K isn't "dismantling the government."  I think most of us have been on the receiving end of restructuring and "right-sizing."  They should experience it too. 

They had to justify their existence, so they'd just create a regulation every day.  It seemed even that they were trolling us.  "What can we do today, before we take a break with jugs.com?"

One thing is for sure, we will be able to test the theory that public employees could make more money in the private sector.
http://www.epi.org/publication/public_sector_workers_earn_less/
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: franksolich on January 25, 2017, 09:07:03 AM
One thing is for sure, we will be able to test the theory that public employees could make more money in the private sector.
http://www.epi.org/publication/public_sector_workers_earn_less/

How the Hell do they figure that, that governmental employees are paid less than people in similar positions in private enterprise?

That used to be true, way back when, but not since the dawning of the Age of Aquarius circa forty years ago.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: FlaGator on January 25, 2017, 09:13:25 AM
"I felt a great disturbance in the Force...

(http://www.destinationhollywood.com/movies/starwars/images/moviequotes/starwars4_clip11.jpg)

"As if millions of spoiled retards just realized no one
wants to listen to their shit."


^5 for the bunny and the clever star wars reference.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: franksolich on January 25, 2017, 09:21:18 AM
Oh God, when oh when are the ****ing lies going to stop?

Quote
CNN Quietly Releases Updated Pic Showing Trump’s Inaugural Crowd Size Greater than Obama’s 2009 Inaugural Crowd

.....However, the pictures in the article show the crowd size for Obama when he was speaking during his 2009 inauguration with the crowd from Trump’s inauguration approximately 3 hours before Trump spoke.....

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/01/crowd-size-matters-trump-is-right-it-was-huge/

Please God, smite the mouths of liars.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: DumbAss Tanker on January 25, 2017, 09:36:15 AM
How the Hell do they figure that, that governmental employees are paid less than people in similar positions in private enterprise?

That used to be true, way back when, but not since the dawning of the Age of Aquarius circa forty years ago.

It depends on the particular profession involved.  From my own experience in DoD, some pay much better, especially at the lower end; for the mid- and upper-level white collar jobs, the opposite is true.  And of course the unions and employee advocates base their comparisons on union scale, not the actual going rate in the free market for the blue collar jobs.  It's very difficult to tell from the naked job qualifications, because while the official requirements for, say, an administrative law attorney will only be a law degree and two years of relevant experience, in reality the most competitive applicants and the one the agency actually needs for the job are mid-career attorneys who are subject-matter experts, many with an advanced degree such as an LLM.  The private sector billing rate for such a target employee would be about eight times their official rate of pay they can actually offer, which is on a salary-only basis plus the odd bonus in years when they are available, but which are pretty much chickenfeed.  To balance that, of course, the executive lawyer, engineer, or medical professional doesn't have to pay the overhead on an office, pay for malpractice insurance, or work 10 hours a day and then spend every night at social gatherings trying to drum up business.  However, that also means if you don't get what you need to do done in 40 hours (For a pending hearing or such critical tasks in the case of an attorney), you're going to be working for free until it put to bed, because overtime is not only very rarely authorized for white collar work, Federal pay laws at that mid-level executive point make is so the worker can actually get less than straight time for those hours even when the planets line up and overtime is actually authorized.  For such a worker, in many ways the system combines the worst features of both wage and salary systems.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: thundley4 on January 25, 2017, 03:20:04 PM


I read an article somewhere that the DOD could save money, by replacing certain jobs currently done by active duty personnel with civilians. This seems counter-intuitive to me give the low pay of the military.

Didn't we find that out when Jimmy Carter hired civilians to work at the Navy Exchanges and Army base stores?  Also, wasn't he the one that did away with Seabeas doing construction on bases and farmed it out private contractors?
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: DumbAss Tanker on January 25, 2017, 04:03:25 PM

I read an article somewhere that the DOD could save money, by replacing certain jobs currently done by active duty personnel with civilians. This seems counter-intuitive to me give the low pay of the military.

Didn't we find that out when Jimmy Carter hired civilians to work at the Navy Exchanges and Army base stores?  Also, wasn't he the one that did away with Seabeas doing construction on bases and farmed it out private contractors?

There are several big problems with trying to use military personnel for anything in lieu of either NAF or appropriated fund civilians, or contractors.  First, the pay for anything but unskilled labor (E1s and E2s) isn't as low as it once was and the benefits price out waaaay differently.  Second, their availability sucks, they get as much annual leave as a 15-year civil service employee and unlimited sick time, and then they are always pulled for other BS like safety stand-downs, on-duty education, details, schools, soldier training like range fire, PT, MOS training unrelated to the task at hand, TDY, transfers, levies, you name it - we used to joke about that 'We do more by 9:00 than most people do all day' commercial by adding '-And then we stop!' to the end of it.  Three, military force size is set by law, not budget, based on the combat power needs    and Congress gets kind of pissy about using them for non-military tasks, while civilian work size is unlimited (Most years, excluding BRAC times) except by budget, which is decided at the installation level based on all the competing needs on the installation budget.  Fourth, Congress also gets pissy about taking food out of the mouth of contractors who end up performing any work there aren't enough government personnel (Mil or civ) to do or funds to pay actual additional employees to do, or which a bunch of constraints prevent being done by government personnel within the force size limits for both kinds...because those contractors represent jobs in the District and the businessmen involved also contribute to re-election campaigns, there's a DoD directive that makes things like using Seabees for construction within CONUS a thing you can only do if you make a case for the training value of the activity, because senior DoD military leadership loves to keep Congress happy even more than the political appointees do, because their chances of making general, or a higher grade of general, all depend on not pissing off any Congressmen and especially Senators.

As far as PXs go, I've never seen anyone but NAF employees working in them except in really extreme and hazardous environments, that did not start with Carter. 
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: thundley4 on January 25, 2017, 04:18:43 PM
.

Good points. I hadn't considered the extra benefits that military receive in vacation, sick days and health care let alone the other things you mentioned.

I was under the impression that civilians and contractors working for the DOD were funded out of the defense budget.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: Crazy Horse on January 25, 2017, 04:51:00 PM
Good points. I hadn't considered the extra benefits that military receive in vacation, sick days and health care let alone the other things you mentioned.

I was under the impression that civilians and contractors working for the DOD were funded out of the defense budget.

Not all of them are.  I actually work at a working capital funding site which is not appropriated money.  More later.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: DumbAss Tanker on January 25, 2017, 06:46:07 PM
Good points. I hadn't considered the extra benefits that military receive in vacation, sick days and health care let alone the other things you mentioned.

I was under the impression that civilians and contractors working for the DOD were funded out of the defense budget.

It's the defense budget, but an entirely different appropriation.  Active military plus a few oddball things are funded with the MILPAY appropriation, civil service working for the Army (For instance) are funded from the OM(A) (Operations and Maintenance - Army) appropriation, the same account that has to be used to buy noncontingency needs like fuel, chow, minor construction, traffic lights, paint for the parking lot slots, and every other damn' thing that doesn't go back to a specific appropriation.  You can't take money from one appropriation for something that doesn't fit it without going back to the evil overlord level, generally meaning Congress.
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: 98ZJUSMC on January 25, 2017, 06:53:20 PM
"I felt a great disturbance in the Force...

(http://www.destinationhollywood.com/movies/starwars/images/moviequotes/starwars4_clip11.jpg)

"As if millions of spoiled retards just realized no one
wants to listen to their shit."

:-)
Title: Re: SHRED senses something
Post by: thundley4 on January 25, 2017, 07:28:35 PM
It's the defense budget, but an entirely different appropriation.  Active military plus a few oddball things are funded with the MILPAY appropriation, civil service working for the Army (For instance) are funded from the OM(A) (Operations and Maintenance - Army) appropriation, the same account that has to be used to buy noncontingency needs like fuel, chow, minor construction, traffic lights, paint for the parking lot slots, and every other damn' thing that doesn't go back to a specific appropriation.  You can't take money from one appropriation for something that doesn't fit it without going back to the evil overlord level, generally meaning Congress.

But, when the left is talking about how much Defense spending is, are they including all that other stuff in their inflated numbers?