The Conservative Cave
Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: dutch508 on October 04, 2015, 08:56:12 PM
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Yeah... it ain't us.
big_dog (3,508 posts) http://www.democraticunderground.com/10141224276
Putin Reportedly Sending 150,000 Troops to Syria to Wipe Out ISIS
COLGATE4 (7,382 posts)
10. There's no question Putin is attempting to shore up Assad and the only realistic way to do it now is to do away with ISIS and a host of often reconfiguring other rebel groups who are creating the chaos that is today's Syria. Russia has been Syria's protector and ally for years now, so from Putin's perspective this action is reasonable. He restores Russia's military prestige, cements his position with Assad and gains mightily in the eyes of the rest of the Middle East.
While Barry tells everyone Russia is acting out of weakness... and the world laughs at Barry.
starroute (12,506 posts)
34. That's not at all obvious
It would be for the US if we tried to put books on the ground. But that's because we turn everything we touch into a cluster**** -- and we would be pinning our hopes on "moderate rebels" who don't actually exist.
If Putin can shore up Assad's government while insisting on some form of power sharing with the legitimate opposition, wipe out ISIS and the various al Qaeda clones, and get Iran and the Kurds to act as stabilizing forces, he has every possibility of succeeding.
Putin is a cold-eyed realist. Not a nice man by any standards, but he's not stupid or self-deluding. US strategists in contrast tend to be both.
AND why does all our 'adventures' turn to shit? Hmmm... could it be everytime the Democrats take power they **** every thing up?
Yeah... yeah, they do.
MJJP21 (308 posts)
50. Not stupid? When Putin was in the KGB his superiors made sure to put him where he couldn't cause any trouble. Putin often acts without thinking things through and is impulsive. These character faults are likely to do him in.
Yes... Putin is an idiot and Barry is a genius. Which one does the world look to for strong leadership? It aint Barry.
tabasco (20,439 posts)
55. The Russian (Soviet) invasion of Afghanistan is the definition of cluster****
The US invasion of Afghanistan, especially since AWOL Bush got out of the picture, has been a stellar success in comparison.
The Iraq invasion was completely unjustified and unnecessary, and decisions primarily by the corrupt AWOL Bush regime (especially Paul Bremer) have resulted in an unmitigated cluster****.
I don't believe Russia is sending 150,000 troops to Syria, but if it does, it will be a giant cluster**** too.
There is so much wrong in that post I don't have the time to even start on it.
leveymg (32,884 posts)
17. Russia has had bases in Syria since 1971. Longer than they were in Poland. We're not going to do anything about it at this point.
Regime change failed in bloodiest, awfullest way - created a regional war, just like some of us warned.
Another stellar win for Barry's foreign affairs team.
brentspeak (17,708 posts)
24. So the Iraq War might possibly sow the seeds for WWIII
Thanks, Bush/Cheney and all your enablers.
BUSH's FAULT!!!!
book_worm (11,172 posts)
28. The Republicans will love Putin even more than they do now.
I hate to say it... but yeah...
woundedkarma (143 posts)
45. 150,000 kids to the slaughter?
So he's sending a bunch of untrained soldiers into that mess? I'd guess most will flee or die.
We've discussed this in comparative gov't and we kept going on the assumption he wants to succeed in Syria.. but I'm starting to wonder what does he gain if he fails?
As for those people who think he's going to enter a "quagmire" ... it's only a quagmire if you feel you have to stay and clean up the mess you created like we (the u.s.) did. What happens when Putin says oops things aren't going my way... and then pulls all his forces out ?
Heck, does the Middle East care about Russia? all the jihadists want to destroy the u.s. How is this not another form of empowering them if he fails to destroy them with his untrained soldiers?
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Response to big_dog (Original post)Sun Oct 4, 2015, 03:18 PM
Star Member COLGATE4 (7,382 posts)
2. I for one wouldn't lose any sleep if
the Russians took a large piece out of ISIS.
That will free up Barry so that he can focus on what's important:
http://twitchy.com/2015/10/04/local-man-who-calls-global-warming-a-national-security-threat-uses-helicopter-to-get-to-golf-course-on-time/
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woundedkarma (143 posts)
45. 150,000 kids to the slaughter?
So he's sending a bunch of untrained soldiers into that mess? I'd guess most will flee or die.
We've discussed this in comparative gov't and we kept going on the assumption he wants to succeed in Syria.. but I'm starting to wonder what does he gain if he fails?
As for those people who think he's going to enter a "quagmire" ... it's only a quagmire if you feel you have to stay and clean up the mess you created like we (the u.s.) did. What happens when Putin says oops things aren't going my way... and then pulls all his forces out ?
Heck, does the Middle East care about Russia? all the jihadists want to destroy the u.s. How is this not another form of empowering them if he fails to destroy them with his untrained soldiers?
Look dummie. Putin will tell his military to kill them all and let God sort them out. The world will wail and gnash their teeth, along with obozo, about civilian deaths and he will tell them to piss off. During WW2, the ruskies had one order... not one step back. That is their mindset.
Putin don't care about obozo. The Chinese don't care about obozo. The world is in flames, the US has no leader with balls, and we are running headlong into WW3 and there is one person responsible. Your side elected him. This is all obozos fault. Every last damn bit of it. When Bush left office, the middle east was stable and so was the world, more or less. Now the middle east is ground zero for what will be WW3. History will judge obozo the same way they judge Neville Chamberlain and it will not be kind.
I hope when it comes NYC, San Fran, LA, Philly and all of the rest of the liberal bastions get turned into a smoking hole in the ground courtesy of the Iranians. Serve you dumbass libs right. I hope you libs suffer greatly before you die. Serve you right.
THIS IS ALL YOUR FAULT!!!! Every last damn bit of it.
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The world is in flames, the US has no leader with balls, and we are running headlong into WW3 and there is one person responsible. Your side elected him. This is all obozos fault. Every last damn bit of it. When Bush left office, the middle east was stable and so was the world, more or less. Now the middle east is ground zero for what will be WW3. History will judge obozo the same way they judge Neville Chamberlain and it will not be kind.
I hope when it comes NYC, San Fran, LA, Philly and all of the rest of the liberal bastions get turned into a smoking hole in the ground courtesy of the Iranians. Serve you dumbass libs right. I hope you libs suffer greatly before you die. Serve you right.
THIS IS ALL YOUR FAULT!!!! Every last damn bit of it.
Hear, hear.
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
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Look dummie. Putin will tell his military to kill them all and let God sort them out. The world will wail and gnash their teeth, along with obozo, about civilian deaths and he will tell them to piss off. During WW2, the ruskies had one order... not one step back. That is their mindset.
Putin don't care about obozo. The Chinese don't care about obozo. The world is in flames, the US has no leader with balls, and we are running headlong into WW3 and there is one person responsible. Your side elected him. This is all obozos fault. Every last damn bit of it. When Bush left office, the middle east was stable and so was the world, more or less. Now the middle east is ground zero for what will be WW3. History will judge obozo the same way they judge Neville Chamberlain and it will not be kind.
I hope when it comes NYC, San Fran, LA, Philly and all of the rest of the liberal bastions get turned into a smoking hole in the ground courtesy of the Iranians. Serve you dumbass libs right. I hope you libs suffer greatly before you die. Serve you right.
THIS IS ALL YOUR FAULT!!!! Every last damn bit of it.
I really wish you'd learn how to express yourself so we know, you know, where you stand...:)
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Putin is a cold-eyed realist. Not a nice man by any standards, but he's not stupid or self-deluding. US strategists in contrast tend to be both.
That's because our "strategists" have to put happy faces on their reports...otherwise the NCA ignores the reality of what they are being told.
We're seeing that with what happened at CENTCOM.
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Look dummie. Putin will tell his military to kill them all and let God sort them out. The world will wail and gnash their teeth, along with obozo, about civilian deaths and he will tell them to piss off. During WW2, the ruskies had one order... not one step back. That is their mindset.
Putin don't care about obozo. The Chinese don't care about obozo. The world is in flames, the US has no leader with balls, and we are running headlong into WW3 and there is one person responsible. Your side elected him. This is all obozos fault. Every last damn bit of it. When Bush left office, the middle east was stable and so was the world, more or less. Now the middle east is ground zero for what will be WW3. History will judge obozo the same way they judge Neville Chamberlain and it will not be kind.
I hope when it comes NYC, San Fran, LA, Philly and all of the rest of the liberal bastions get turned into a smoking hole in the ground courtesy of the Iranians. Serve you dumbass libs right. I hope you libs suffer greatly before you die. Serve you right.
THIS IS ALL YOUR FAULT!!!! Every last damn bit of it.
Said like a true Mountaineer! H5 to you. :clap:
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The world is in flames, the US has no leader with balls, and we are running headlong into WW3 and there is one person responsible. Your side elected him. This is all obozos fault. Every last damn bit of it. When Bush left office, the middle east was stable and so was the world, more or less. Now the middle east is ground zero for what will be WW3. History will judge obozo the same way they judge Neville Chamberlain and it will not be kind.
I hope when it comes NYC, San Fran, LA, Philly and all of the rest of the liberal bastions get turned into a smoking hole in the ground courtesy of the Iranians. Serve you dumbass libs right. I hope you libs suffer greatly before you die. Serve you right.
THIS IS ALL YOUR FAULT!!!! Every last damn bit of it.
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
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starroute
Putin is a cold-eyed realist. Not a nice man by any standards, but he's not stupid or self-deluding. US strategists in contrast tend to be both.
So close! Just needed to say:
"Putin is a cold-eyed realist. Not a nice man by any standards, but he's not stupid or self-deluding like Obama."
... but I realize that saying that on Skin's island gets the primitives all worked up because it goes against their version of the truth. Saying "US strategists in contrast tend to be both" was as close as the primitive could get.
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The Russians have a huge logistical advantage in Syria, it is in their border zone and they can essentially drive anything they want there. For us it's at the ass end of an around-the-globe supply chain and no way to get directly into it without getting the whole thing signed off by several other countries whose territory, national waters, or airspace we have to transit to put anything there.
Sad fact is that it is actually in Russia's natural sphere of influence and only the expenditure of vast amounts of money and effort enable us to play there at all, an exercise for which the US electorate has demonstrated a rather limited patience or even attention span which has already pretty well been exhausted. Without that national political will, no amount of military capability is going to tip the balance in our favor, and even our military capability seems to have peaked and be drifting down.
The US military and political leadership has been in love with special operations forces for twenty years, for divergent reasons, but in addition to the sexy factor, the politicians regard them as a way to fight far-flung wars on the cheap. Within certain parameters and conditions of uncertainly fighting third-world regimes, that works, at least for a time, but special operators are essentially raiders and trainers and can't provide the long-term tangible ground presence that it takes to exercise national influence. Any strategy that forbids commitment of a substantial regular ground force is ultimately doomed to fail. It DEFINITELY doesn't work against large ground forces committed by other second- and first-world forces, who have real intelligence capabilities, do not leave the airspace uncontested, and have special operations forces of their own to counter any attempts to piss into that particular wind.
Also, what Perky said about Russian 'Rules of engagement' is right on the money. That BS isn't going to hold them back.
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Putin can send a bunch of muzzie savages to their reward in hell then great but am not sure the long term result is terrifically better in some respects.
A Russian/Syrian/Iranian etc alliance in the Middle East puts US interests just as much in Jeopardy.
In short,Putin is willing to do all the things the left accused Bush of wanting to.
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Hate to say it but Putin will conduct the war against ISIS in the way it should be done. He'll use the proper tool , a sledgehammer, as opposed to what we've been using, a scalpel. The only way you can beat ISIS is with overwhelming force on the ground. Airpower is great but it can't take and hold ground, which is what is needed in this conflict.