Author Topic: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....  (Read 1109 times)

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Offline enslaved1

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Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building real estate empire

https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-letitia-james-fraud-lawsuit-1569245a9284427117b8d3ba5da74249

Quote
NEW YORK (AP) — A judge ruled Tuesday that Donald Trump committed fraud for years while building the real estate empire that catapulted him to fame and the White House, and he ordered some of the former president’s companies removed from his control and dissolved.

Judge Arthur Engoron, ruling in a civil lawsuit brought by New York Attorney General Letitia James, found that Trump and his company deceived banks, insurers and others by massively overvaluing his assets and exaggerating his net worth on paperwork used in making deals and securing loans.

Engoron ordered that some of Trump’s business licenses be rescinded as punishment, making it difficult or impossible for them to do business in New York, and said he would continue to have an independent monitor oversee Trump Organization operations.

Leftists celebrating, logical people waiting to see how the appeals go, and wondering who else in DC needs to be put under a microscope like this.  The lawfare continues. 

Love or hate Trump, he's being put through a wringer that all politicians SHOULD endure if they want to prove their intent is to serve the public.  But the fact that he is getting dog-piled on while so much other grift and crime is ignored shows the true colors of our one party system masquerading as a two party system. 
Romans 6:17-18 But thanks be to God, that you who were once slaves of sin have become obedient from the heart to the standard of teaching to which you were committed, and, having been set free from sin, have become slaves of righteousness.

Offline Old n Grumpy

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2023, 08:00:41 AM »
That’s the sad part they are persecuting him and it’s taking the light off of the really guilty people.
Life is tough and it’s even tougher when you’re stupid

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I will give up my guns when the liberals give up their illegal aliens

We need a Bull Shit tax to make the Democrats go broke!

Offline ADsOutburst

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2023, 05:15:02 PM »
Mar-a-Lago was valued by the judge at $18 million.

If he really believes that, I have a bridge to sell him in exchange for some empty gum wrappers.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2023, 06:34:31 PM by ADsOutburst »

Offline Eupher

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #3 on: September 27, 2023, 08:06:25 PM »
Mar-a-Lago was valued by the judge at $18 million.

If he really believes that, I have a bridge to sell him in exchange for some empty gum wrappers.

Yep, I read earlier today that several real estate brokers in the area value smaller properties nearby at $150 million, and they estimate Trump's digs at about $300 million. Includes the adjoining golf course, which the neighbors don't have.

The judge is leftist and he's saluting the leftist flag.  :whatever:
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Offline Drafe Hoblin

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2023, 09:20:44 PM »
The cherry-pickers are gonna get their cherries picked...

https://thefederalist.com/2023/09/27/n-y-judge-cherry-picks-lowball-mar-a-lago-appraisal-to-find-trump-guilty-of-inflating-property-values/

Despite an automatic win for Trump on-appeal, Engoron and James better hope their histories of private property-ownership have always been immaculately appraised, filed, and certificated. 

Offline Ralph Wiggum

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2023, 09:05:42 AM »
OK kids, I've opined on this issue of valuing commercial properties on prior occasions so feel compelled to add to this discussion.

Found this line intriguing:

Judge Arthur Engoron, ruling in a civil lawsuit brought by New York Attorney General Letitia James, found that Trump and his company deceived banks, insurers and others by massively overvaluing his assets and exaggerating his net worth on paperwork used in making deals and securing loans.

That should be on the bank, not the owner who secured the loans.

Worked for three years as a financial analyst for one of the largest commercial real estate companies in Chicagoland, and one of my major functions was to calculate the current and future market values of properties in order to further validate the loans that were already in place with various banking institutions. It is a complex process that took about 3 to 5 months of the year and involved building in assumptions on occupancy rates and a variety of economic factors.

Could type many more paragraphs, but I won't bore you to death (if I haven't already).

Bottom line: The Trump Organization's loans on their properties were secured by banks. Given the size of the operation, I'm certain their internal analysts did their due diligence and properly valued the properties. This is simply a case of Trump Derangement Syndrome, vengeance for beating Cankles like a rented mule in 2016.

As for a ballpark value of Mar-a-Lago, I don't know the dimensions of the property or exact holdings and prefer to defer comment.

In general, it pissed me off to no end when media and government types who have ZERO business knowledge make such blanket statements and assumptions based on their personal bias.

Carry on.
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Offline Eupher

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2023, 09:27:47 AM »
^^^Ralphie's got more info than I'll ever have.

I think, since the judge is a confirmed Democrat and he's opining on James' case (and she's a card-carrying leftist), that the entire effort is simply more lawfare, meant to tie up Trump and his legions of lawyers until the well runs dry.

I wish I had confidence in the legal system, that Trump will win these cases on appeal, but I don't.

The entire system sucks donkey balls.  :whatever:
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Offline Ralph Wiggum

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2023, 09:47:59 AM »
^^^Ralphie's got more info than I'll ever have.

I think, since the judge is a confirmed Democrat and he's opining on James' case (and she's a card-carrying leftist), that the entire effort is simply more lawfare, meant to tie up Trump and his legions of lawyers until the well runs dry.

I wish I had confidence in the legal system, that Trump will win these cases on appeal, but I don't.

The entire system sucks donkey balls.  :whatever:

I know how to stay in my lane, and this was veering into one of my areas of expertise.

Especially involving military and gun discussions (and music on your part), I prefer to remain silent because typing anything would show my ignorance.
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Offline SVPete

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2023, 09:59:18 AM »
The judge obviously pulled a random number from deep within his too-substantial ass, but it's part of the Dems' lawfare. Trump has to spend $$ and resources to get this absurd ruling overturned and to get a change of venue.
If, as anti-Covid-vaxxers claim, https://www.poynter.org/fact-checking/2021/robert-f-kennedy-jr-said-the-covid-19-vaccine-is-the-deadliest-vaccine-ever-made-thats-not-true/ , https://gospelnewsnetwork.org/2021/11/23/covid-shots-are-the-deadliest-vaccines-in-medical-history/ , The Vaccine is deadly, where in the US have Pfizer and Moderna hidden the millions of bodies of those who died of "vaccine injury"? Is reality a Big Pharma Shill?

Millions now living should have died. Anti-Covid-Vaxxer ghouls hardest hit.

Offline Old n Grumpy

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2023, 11:09:22 AM »
Quote
The judge obviously pulled a random number from deep within his too-substantial ass,

 :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
 :cheersmate: :cheersmate: :cheersmate:

Life is tough and it’s even tougher when you’re stupid

Basking in the glow of my white Privilege, while I water the Begonias with liberal tears!

I will give up my guns when the liberals give up their illegal aliens

We need a Bull Shit tax to make the Democrats go broke!

Offline Eupher

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2023, 12:05:31 PM »
I know how to stay in my lane, and this was veering into one of my areas of expertise.

Especially involving military and gun discussions (and music on your part), I prefer to remain silent because typing anything would show my ignorance.

Well, I'm glad you chimed in. I learned something. I took a Finance class to prepare for MBA studies, but I still can't tell you how to calculate the future value of money.  :stoner:

Speaking of guns, I picked up a CZ 75 P01 today. Suweeeet!
Adams E2 Euphonium, built in 2017
Boosey & Co. Imperial Euphonium, built in 1941
Edwards B454 bass trombone, built 2012
Bach Stradivarius 42OG tenor trombone, built 1992
Kanstul 33-T BBb tuba, built 2011
Fender Precision Bass Guitar, built ?
Mouthpiece data provided on request.

Offline SVPete

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2023, 12:11:36 PM »
...
In general, it pissed me off to no end when media and government types who have ZERO business knowledge make such blanket statements and assumptions based on their personal bias.

Carry on.

Unlike students, whose teachers can require them to, "Show your work," Judge Arthur Engoron had no such requirement in making his ruling.
If, as anti-Covid-vaxxers claim, https://www.poynter.org/fact-checking/2021/robert-f-kennedy-jr-said-the-covid-19-vaccine-is-the-deadliest-vaccine-ever-made-thats-not-true/ , https://gospelnewsnetwork.org/2021/11/23/covid-shots-are-the-deadliest-vaccines-in-medical-history/ , The Vaccine is deadly, where in the US have Pfizer and Moderna hidden the millions of bodies of those who died of "vaccine injury"? Is reality a Big Pharma Shill?

Millions now living should have died. Anti-Covid-Vaxxer ghouls hardest hit.

Offline Old n Grumpy

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2023, 03:30:47 PM »
Well, I'm glad you chimed in. I learned something. I took a Finance class to prepare for MBA studies, but I still can't tell you how to calculate the future value of money.  :stoner:

Speaking of guns, I picked up a CZ 75 P01 today. Suweeeet!

Cz is good stuff I have a cz82 that I carry some time. But I’m still partial to the big clunky 1911 if you don’t want to shoot them you can club them into submission  :-)
Life is tough and it’s even tougher when you’re stupid

Basking in the glow of my white Privilege, while I water the Begonias with liberal tears!

I will give up my guns when the liberals give up their illegal aliens

We need a Bull Shit tax to make the Democrats go broke!

Offline Eupher

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2023, 04:32:41 PM »
Cz is good stuff I have a cz82 that I carry some time. But I’m still partial to the big clunky 1911 if you don’t want to shoot them you can club them into submission  :-)

Yup on both counts. I don't wanna mention publicly how many 1911s I have - probably more than one. And it's/they're all in .45 ACP.  :whistling:
Adams E2 Euphonium, built in 2017
Boosey & Co. Imperial Euphonium, built in 1941
Edwards B454 bass trombone, built 2012
Bach Stradivarius 42OG tenor trombone, built 1992
Kanstul 33-T BBb tuba, built 2011
Fender Precision Bass Guitar, built ?
Mouthpiece data provided on request.

Offline Ralph Wiggum

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #14 on: September 28, 2023, 07:38:47 PM »
Unlike students, whose teachers can require them to, "Show your work," Judge Arthur Engoron had no such requirement in making his ruling.

If you only knew how many times I've had to scold underlings (and have been myself occasionally eviscerated) for not having an fully complete or improperly formatted spreadsheet showing my work.

It seems that this judge was governing on emotion, not facts. And there was no jury, it was simply his/her/its ruling.

As an aside, I heard this afternoon that similar properties to Mar-A-Lago are worth upwards of $200-$400 million. It would be absolutely silly to think the Trump property is only worth a measly $18 mil.
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Offline Ralph Wiggum

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #15 on: September 28, 2023, 07:40:43 PM »
Well, I'm glad you chimed in. I learned something. I took a Finance class to prepare for MBA studies, but I still can't tell you how to calculate the future value of money.  :stoner:

I don't even like making such calculations, Euph! There are so many unknowns and built-in assumptions when conducting such a process that I feel as ridiculous as climate change zealots relying on only garbage data that supports their viewpoint.
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Offline Old n Grumpy

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Re: Judge rules Donald Trump defrauded banks and insurers while building.....
« Reply #16 on: September 29, 2023, 10:15:14 AM »
Yup on both counts. I don't wanna mention publicly how many 1911s I have - probably more than one. And it's/they're all in .45 ACP.  :whistling:

Just for variety purposes in addition to. .45 I have a .22 and a 9mm :-)

Remember variety is the spice of life  :-)
Life is tough and it’s even tougher when you’re stupid

Basking in the glow of my white Privilege, while I water the Begonias with liberal tears!

I will give up my guns when the liberals give up their illegal aliens

We need a Bull Shit tax to make the Democrats go broke!