Author Topic: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?  (Read 1623 times)

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Offline BannedFromDU

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Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« on: June 01, 2009, 01:37:43 AM »
Quote
leftstreet  Donating Member  (1000+ posts)       Sun May-31-09 10:02 PM

Original message

Why do so few Doctors do abortions?
   
I don't get this.

I'm old enough to remember when abortion was illegal, however it was well known that many family doctors did "something" for women "in trouble," or whatever, called (I think) a D&C. Even as a guy, I knew this from female relatives, friends, etc.

But since abortion became legal, the number of doctors providing the service seems to be very, very low.

This is ****ed up.

It's a legal procedure. It's between a woman and her healthcare provider. There's NO REASON that ANYONE should know which doctors do or don't do abortions.


Are they overlooking a simple reason on purpose?



Um, DUmmy? Maybe doctors don't want to have any part of abortion. Had that ever occurred to ANY of you? Can you show me where in the Hippocratic Oath it says that doctors HAVE to kill babies?

Assholes.
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Offline RobJohnson

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2009, 02:28:48 AM »
Just when you think you have seen it all at the DUmp........

What's next, a drive up window for abortions?
« Last Edit: June 01, 2009, 02:31:46 AM by RobJohnson »

Offline RobJohnson

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2009, 02:38:15 AM »
Quote
AllentownJake  (1000+ posts)        Mon Jun-01-09 01:23 AM

13. Seeing what just left office in January
 its not that hard to imagine. The man might have stolen an election or two, but the election was close enough to steal.
 


Stupid follows stupid, as always, at the DUmp.

Quote
aquart  (1000+ posts)      Mon Jun-01-09 01:48 AM

18. The terrorists have been ALLOWED to win.
 How many of Randall Terry's group have spent time in Gitmo or any prison? Are their phones tapped? Are they followed? Are they infiltrated? ARE THEY ON THE NO FLY LIST?


 :mental: :mental: :mental:

Quote
AllentownJake  (1000+ posts)        Mon Jun-01-09 01:57 AM

24. We all know this is what this debate is really all about
 If anyone doesn't think that the rich and upper middle class fundamentalist leaders, would have no qualms about having their children have abortions to prevent family embarrassment, you only have to look at history.

The fact is Row made the practice available to the lower classes. This is what pissed off the fundies so much.
 


Quote
BrklynLiberal  (1000+ posts)        Mon Jun-01-09 01:56 AM

22. Excellent post. I was also shocked to find that there are doctors who are

never even taught in medical school how to do abortions.
 






Offline BlueStateSaint

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2009, 04:40:40 AM »
What an idiot.

Quote
BrklynLiberal  (1000+ posts)        Mon Jun-01-09 01:56 AM

22. Excellent post. I was also shocked to find that there are doctors who are

never even taught in medical school how to do abortions.

What if the OB/GYN doesn't choose to learn how to do abortions?  They can have "choice," too . . .
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Offline jtyangel

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2009, 05:27:51 AM »
Well, this is where DUmmies and their ilk may have shot themselves in the foot. I'm guessing if something goes wrong, even if there really is nobody to blame, it is likely a DUmmie who is most litigious and screaming for regulations of all kind on whatever professionals they believe wronged them in some way since we all know one professional who is a quack must shape the entire profession. When doctors are sued to death over making life and death choices on a moment's notice, many will refuse to make those decisions without all the proper i's dotted and t's crossed. So, DUmmies, had you been less of a burden to your average doctor, you might actually find your abortion paradise in a casual office visit a reality for the doctor's(and here's a big one) WILLING
 to perform the gruesome deed.

BTW, the 'special' things a lot of those doctors did were very often to correct the botching either the woman did to herself or someone else did to her. I think you'd find mnay of those doctors still did not condone abortion and would have preferred someone had helped the young woman before she chose to mangle or poison herself to rid herself of a pregnancy. Of course, morals being different then too, doctors probably often saw this situation as a failing of a young woman's family to either not raise her properly or to put her out on her own far before she was ready and without the protection her family should have given her from men who would take advantage of her in that way. Either way, if a doctor approved they probably had a view of the woman as trash and was fine with practicing a sort of eugenics to keep the riff raff from multiplying or a doctor who saw the failings of the particular brand of society the woman belonged to and would have preferred the issues or crime that lead to unwed pregnancy be dealt with.

I'm tired of the DUmmies comparing women who would have really had their lives changed totally 50 or 60 years ago and would have tried any act of desperation to avoid that to a woman today who could have a litter and be applauded and supported for it. A woman who found herself pregnant in the 1950's and 60's is not the same as a woman who finds herself pregnant today. Not only are their options BEFORE pregnancy very different, but their outlook and morals and the outcome and effect on the rest of their lives is very very different. They are hardly the same thing and relying on the old worn out stereotypes of the past is a very unliberal thing to do anyway if we are to believe their sophisticated ways with wordly things :whatever:

Offline BlueStateSaint

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2009, 05:45:00 AM »
Well, this is where DUmmies and their ilk may have shot themselves in the foot. I'm guessing if something goes wrong, even if there really is nobody to blame, it is likely a DUmmie who is most litigious and screaming for regulations of all kind on whatever professionals they believe wronged them in some way since we all know one professional who is a quack must shape the entire profession. When doctors are sued to death over making life and death choices on a moment's notice, many will refuse to make those decisions without all the proper i's dotted and t's crossed. So, DUmmies, had you been less of a burden to your average doctor, you might actually find your abortion paradise in a casual office visit a reality for the doctor's(and here's a big one) WILLING
 to perform the gruesome deed.

BTW, the 'special' things a lot of those doctors did were very often to correct the botching either the woman did to herself or someone else did to her. I think you'd find mnay of those doctors still did not condone abortion and would have preferred someone had helped the young woman before she chose to mangle or poison herself to rid herself of a pregnancy. Of course, morals being different then too, doctors probably often saw this situation as a failing of a young woman's family to either not raise her properly or to put her out on her own far before she was ready and without the protection her family should have given her from men who would take advantage of her in that way. Either way, if a doctor approved they probably had a view of the woman as trash and was fine with practicing a sort of eugenics to keep the riff raff from multiplying or a doctor who saw the failings of the particular brand of society the woman belonged to and would have preferred the issues or crime that lead to unwed pregnancy be dealt with.

I'm tired of the DUmmies comparing women who would have really had their lives changed totally 50 or 60 years ago and would have tried any act of desperation to avoid that to a woman today who could have a litter and be applauded and supported for it. A woman who found herself pregnant in the 1950's and 60's is not the same as a woman who finds herself pregnant today. Not only are their options BEFORE pregnancy very different, but their outlook and morals and the outcome and effect on the rest of their lives is very very different. They are hardly the same thing and relying on the old worn out stereotypes of the past is a very unliberal thing to do anyway if we are to believe their sophisticated ways with wordly things :whatever:

It's the whole "free sex and love" thing--without responsibility.  They have never grown up, and don't ever want to.
"Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of Liberty." - Thomas Jefferson

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Offline jtyangel

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2009, 05:52:06 AM »
It's the whole "free sex and love" thing--without responsibility.  They have never grown up, and don't ever want to.

I don't know that's the only motivation. I think those my age(39) and younger can be willfully ignorant not being able to relate to the values or situations of that time. When really compassionate people are forced to think on this issue with truth on their side, it's really very hard to deny a pro-life position, particularly after the early weeks of pregnancy. I was talking to a friend recently and had speculated how much this and any other issue out there is shaped by the very weak constitution of some of the younger generations. We've created a bunch of people that want to be 'liked' and to fit in and who have been discouraged from thinking critically and have had a certain pov demonized during their raising. I've seen adults carry this fitting thing in well into their 30's, more then I remember it in the past(I never remember my grandfather giving a damn about what other people thought for example). Not a bad thing if fitting in meant a good work ethic, some semblence of moral behavior, etc., but fitting in anymore means being liberal if one wants to get along with the general public in many areas. WEAK people cave under that kind of pressure. Sigh

Offline Toastedturningtidelegs

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2009, 05:58:08 AM »
Quote
Why do so few Doctors do abortions?
They know "how" to do them moron! Ever occur to you sick mother****ers that some doctors find it morally repugnant? Oh and btw! "BURN IN HELL Tiller THE KILLER" :evillaugh:
Call me "Asshole" One more time!

Offline Carl

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2009, 06:05:20 AM »
It's the whole "free sex and love" thing--without responsibility.  They have never grown up, and don't ever want to.

It is to a degree the exploitation of women by men who want to have multiple partners and not even have to be bothered to use a condom.
Funny how so many women think they are being feminists by supporting abortion when in reality they are making it easier for predatory men to use them.

Offline franksolich

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2009, 07:42:30 AM »
What's next, a drive up window for abortions?

Yeah, sure.

I've been waiting for eight years for the primitives to suggest this.
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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #10 on: June 01, 2009, 07:49:32 AM »
Just when you think you have seen it all at the DUmp........

What's next, a drive up window for abortions?

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Offline Lord Undies

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #11 on: June 01, 2009, 08:00:03 AM »
If making abortion illegal can save but one doctor's life, then I think we have no choice.

Offline AprilRazz

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #12 on: June 01, 2009, 08:16:50 AM »
Well, this is where DUmmies and their ilk may have shot themselves in the foot. I'm guessing if something goes wrong, even if there really is nobody to blame, it is likely a DUmmie who is most litigious and screaming for regulations of all kind on whatever professionals they believe wronged them in some way since we all know one professional who is a quack must shape the entire profession. When doctors are sued to death over making life and death choices on a moment's notice, many will refuse to make those decisions without all the proper i's dotted and t's crossed. So, DUmmies, had you been less of a burden to your average doctor, you might actually find your abortion paradise in a casual office visit a reality for the doctor's(and here's a big one) WILLING
 to perform the gruesome deed.

BTW, the 'special' things a lot of those doctors did were very often to correct the botching either the woman did to herself or someone else did to her. I think you'd find mnay of those doctors still did not condone abortion and would have preferred someone had helped the young woman before she chose to mangle or poison herself to rid herself of a pregnancy. Of course, morals being different then too, doctors probably often saw this situation as a failing of a young woman's family to either not raise her properly or to put her out on her own far before she was ready and without the protection her family should have given her from men who would take advantage of her in that way. Either way, if a doctor approved they probably had a view of the woman as trash and was fine with practicing a sort of eugenics to keep the riff raff from multiplying or a doctor who saw the failings of the particular brand of society the woman belonged to and would have preferred the issues or crime that lead to unwed pregnancy be dealt with.

I'm tired of the DUmmies comparing women who would have really had their lives changed totally 50 or 60 years ago and would have tried any act of desperation to avoid that to a woman today who could have a litter and be applauded and supported for it. A woman who found herself pregnant in the 1950's and 60's is not the same as a woman who finds herself pregnant today. Not only are their options BEFORE pregnancy very different, but their outlook and morals and the outcome and effect on the rest of their lives is very very different. They are hardly the same thing and relying on the old worn out stereotypes of the past is a very unliberal thing to do anyway if we are to believe their sophisticated ways with wordly things :whatever:
H5!
The regulations and fear of litigation placed on doctors is staggering. The DUmmies want to complain about the lack of abortion providers but fail to mention the thousands of OB/GYNs that leave practice every year due to outrageous insurance premiums. They only have people like the silky pony himself (John Edwards) to blame.
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Offline RobJohnson

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #13 on: June 01, 2009, 09:26:07 AM »
What an idiot.

What if the OB/GYN doesn't choose to learn how to do abortions?  They can have "choice," too . . .

On top of the fact, that not all doctors are OB/GYNs.  I have never seen an OB/GYN on staff at an urgent care, they are usually GP's or FP's with training in emergency care.


Offline GOBUCKS

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #14 on: June 01, 2009, 10:55:59 AM »
Quote
AllentownJake  (1000+ posts)        Mon Jun-01-09 01:57 AM

24. We all know this is what this debate is really all about
 If anyone doesn't think that the rich and upper middle class fundamentalist leaders, would have no qualms about having their children have abortions to prevent family embarrassment, you only have to look at history.

The fact is Row made the practice available to the lower classes. This is what pissed off the fundies so much.



This one puzzles me. The DUmmies constantly reassure one another that we are murderous brutes who would do anything to be rid of them, up to and including their physical annihilation. I don't deny that's sort of appealing, but if so, then DUmmies should wonder why we would oppose a medical procedure that could help reduce their teeming, swarming, squirming masses, under cover of the law?

We defend the unborn because they are blameless innocents, even though the overwhelming majority of these aborted underclass fetuses would have grown up to be worthless leaching democrats. It's a funny thing about a moral code. Sometimes if you have one, you must accept some undesireable side effects. DUmmies are always confused by moral people; they would say we're not voting our best interests. DUmmies always think only of their own selfish interest of the day.

Offline VivisMom

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #15 on: June 01, 2009, 11:14:10 AM »
Quote
BrklynLiberal  (1000+ posts)        Mon Jun-01-09 01:56 AM

22. Excellent post. I was also shocked to find that there are doctors who are

never even taught in medical school how to do abortions.

Just because a doctor specializes in obstetrics/gynecology does not mean that they will choose to learn how to perform abortions.

A story from the Washington Post Magazine about how difficult it is to learn to do abortions in medical school.

The reason that there are so few doctors who do them is because there are so few doctors that WANT to do them. OB/GYNs have the most expensive malpractice insurance. I'm sure that for doctors who do perform abortions, that the cost is even higher. Performing abortions is just not fiscally responsible.


Offline BannedFromDU

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #16 on: June 01, 2009, 01:51:16 PM »
Just because a doctor specializes in obstetrics/gynecology does not mean that they will choose to learn how to perform abortions.

A story from the Washington Post Magazine about how difficult it is to learn to do abortions in medical school.

The reason that there are so few doctors who do them is because there are so few doctors that WANT to do them. OB/GYNs have the most expensive malpractice insurance. I'm sure that for doctors who do perform abortions, that the cost is even higher. Performing abortions is just not fiscally responsible.





     And I'll just hazard a guess that med schools would rather spend a week teaching life-saving techniques rather than life-taking ones. People sue when doctors don't know how to stop someone from dying; they get sued rather less often for failing to cause someone to die.
NJCher (31,658 posts)

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Offline Lord Undies

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #17 on: June 01, 2009, 02:28:25 PM »

Offline MrsSmith

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #18 on: June 01, 2009, 08:34:54 PM »
If making abortion illegal can save but one doctor's life, then I think we have no choice.
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:


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Offline MrsSmith

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #19 on: June 01, 2009, 08:39:26 PM »

Are they overlooking a simple reason on purpose?



Um, DUmmy? Maybe doctors don't want to have any part of abortion. Had that ever occurred to ANY of you? Can you show me where in the Hippocratic Oath it says that doctors HAVE to kill babies?

Assholes.
Very few hospital allow abortions because so many are run by Christians.  Those fundies you hate so much don't murder the unborn.  They also don't make a profit from their hospitals.  They also give away billions of dollars worth of care every year.  They spend any extra money on more nursing staff or better equipment to save more lives.  They won't kill YOU, or your CHILD, or even Tiller. 
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Offline The Village Idiot

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #20 on: June 01, 2009, 10:25:25 PM »
What an idiot.

What if the OB/GYN doesn't choose to learn how to do abortions?  They can have "choice," too . . .

oh, not for long. You wait until the gov requires all medical students to learn them

Offline Sam Adams

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #21 on: June 02, 2009, 06:12:18 AM »
Performing abortions is just not fiscally responsible.



I dunno. There's big money in it. The income from doing it is worth the cost.

The reason to NOT do abortions is that abortion is murder.

Offline VivisMom

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #22 on: June 02, 2009, 10:28:23 AM »
I googled local abortion costs in my area, and what I found, while by no means cheap, was a lot less than delivering a baby:

Prices

If I remember correctly, my entire pregnancy was something akin to 8 or 9K, and I'm pretty sure the delivery alone was well over 6K (I had a C-section.) My doctor got roughly 3.5K from it. So if we say that a doctor makes 2000 for a regular delivery and 3500 for a C-section, and delivers 2 babies a day, that still more than an abortionist. And I'd bet that the abortionist has a higher malpractice fee than your regular OB/GYN who does not perform abortions. (I'd also bet that a doctor in a high-population area delivers more than two babies a day.)

I don't know that I'd call it a money-making career. Then again, my state is also losing OB/GYNs because of the prohibitive cost of malpractice.

Offline Sam Adams

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #23 on: June 03, 2009, 12:53:37 AM »
I'd bet that the abortionist has a higher malpractice fee than your regular OB/GYN who does not perform abortions.




You would lose that bet. OB/GYN doctors get sued when something goes wrong with the baby, even if it's not the doctor's fault. That is the reason their malpractice insurance rates are so high--higher even then most medical specialties.

On the other hand, most abortions are pretty simple procedures. And nobody notices if there's something wrong with the baby. So, for abortions, malpractice insurance rates are pretty low.

Regarding the profit margins: Abortions are not only simpler, but take place during regular office hours, whereas a delivery can take place anytime of the day or night, and is much more complicated. Furthermore, abortions usually take place during the first or second trimester, whereas deliveries take place in the third trimester, and that makes deliveries more difficult than abortions. So, the costs to the doctors for an abortion is less than the cost to the doctors for the delivery of a live baby. Just because the price of an abortion is less than a delivery does not mean the profit is less.

Offline MrsSmith

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Re: Why can't you get an abortion at urgent care?
« Reply #24 on: June 03, 2009, 06:41:23 PM »
I googled local abortion costs in my area, and what I found, while by no means cheap, was a lot less than delivering a baby:

Prices

If I remember correctly, my entire pregnancy was something akin to 8 or 9K, and I'm pretty sure the delivery alone was well over 6K (I had a C-section.) My doctor got roughly 3.5K from it. So if we say that a doctor makes 2000 for a regular delivery and 3500 for a C-section, and delivers 2 babies a day, that still more than an abortionist. And I'd bet that the abortionist has a higher malpractice fee than your regular OB/GYN who does not perform abortions. (I'd also bet that a doctor in a high-population area delivers more than two babies a day.)

I don't know that I'd call it a money-making career. Then again, my state is also losing OB/GYNs because of the prohibitive cost of malpractice.


Quote
Tiller indicated that the average cost of a post-viability abortion is $6,000. He pockets 38 cents on every dollar generated. Using that average, post-viability abortions conservatively generated over $2.9 million in 2003, with Tiller's take being close to $1.2 million.
http://www.christiannewswire.com/news/190469981.html

This is one doctor, and only counts his post-viability abortions .  By the time you count all the many, many, quicker early-term abortions, Tiller raked in millions in profits every year.  By all reports, he not only lived a lavish life, but donated quite a lot to politicians - who, in turn, kept his business safe.

Quote
That means that each year in the U.S., the abortion industry brings in approximately $831 million through their abortion services alone
http://www.abort73.com/index.php?/abortion/abortion_for_profit

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