Idiot primitive learns true value of useless liberal arts degrees...

[asdf2231]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=105x8161677

Project Grudge  (80 posts)      Mon Oct-13-08 04:50 PM
Original message
After graduating college and being unemployed for 3 months...
I finally got a job. It's not a good job and I don't like it. It pays $10.00 an hour and I can't live off of it, but it's something. In this economy and stuff, I just feel lucky to be employed! I start in a week doing 3rd shift cubicle work. (I still think something is wrong when a graduate with two BAs, a 3.6 GPA, and all of this from a Big Ten school can't get a decent job.)


Here's to me!

Here's to you.  You're a loser.

[rich_t]

Degrees in underwater basket weaving just ain't worth what they used to be.

 

[NHSparky]

It's true after all--only in America can an idiot go to a four-year college for six years and pay $30,000 a year for a degree which qualifies him/her for a $20,000 a year job.

OR...

You could have busted your ass, worked while you went to school, graduated with ONE engineering degree and be making nearly $40/hour, plus overtime.

This guy probably thinks the Messiah's "tax cuts" are a good thing too.  Wait until his employer can no longer afford to keep him around because he has to pay either his employees or his taxes, but can't pay both.

[NHSparky]

Degrees in underwater basket weaving just ain't worth what they used to be.

 

The only people I've ever known to get a decent job with a BA degree are those who immediately go on to grad school/law school/etc.

BA is short for Bullshit Applied.  What, none of these kids bothered to do any internships to get experience?  Work summers?  Take a few lighter semesters so they can get some full-time grunt work under their belts, or did they just think they were automatically going to walk in the door at $100K a year?  Shit, not even MS-degreed engineers make that!  I BARELY pull that, and that's after 12 years in the Navy and another decade in the utility field.

Whiny assed punks.

[Chris_]

The only people I've ever known to get a decent job with a BA degree are those who immediately go on to grad school/law school/etc.

BA is short for Bullshit Applied.  What, none of these kids bothered to do any internships to get experience?  Work summers?  Take a few lighter semesters so they can get some full-time grunt work under their belts, or did they just think they were automatically going to walk in the door at $100K a year?  Shit, not even MS-degreed engineers make that!  I BARELY pull that, and that's after 12 years in the Navy and another decade in the utility field.

Whiny assed punks.

My degree is a BS in Business Administration (which has helped me in my IT career much more than a degree in IT would have).

I am doing pretty well with just that, but I have been doing it for 30 years.  And, yes, I do make a healthy wage in the 6 figures.

[GOBUCKS]

You know what makes people feel important? Helping someone get a job. Tell EVERYONE about your job hunt, especially people older than you -uncles, aunts, cousins - everybody. That nice librarian you always talk to? She might be married to a guy who owns a company and is hiring. That guy on your softball team? His girlfriend is looking for a part-timer (who might have the opportunity to go full time). I know it's old, but it's so true - it's all about networking. Not using people - not pretending to be friends in order to get something - just letting folks know your situation. At parties, at church, at the soltice celebration - EVERYWHERE. If you're not volunteering for Obama, you're missing a big opportunity right there. Get involved with your local Democratic party - it's free, and you'll meet people in your community.

Nearly all of whom will be losers just like you.

[NHSparky]

Free--my point is, few of these kids are willing to WORK.  By which I mean few, if any, of these kids are willing to take the shit jobs that are a part of moving up.  It's the entitlement mentality.  Whatddya mean I have to suck it up for $30K a year--by God, I want $50-60K, and I want it now!  We saw this during the dot-com boom--people whose only skill was MS Front Page demanding (and for a time, getting) $70K salaries, but when the boom went bust, they sat on their asses and expected the next job to just fall in their laps.  No beating the bushes, no upgrading their skills, no working at lower paying jobs to hone their work ethic.  

Did you work exclusively in Biz Admin?  My cousin also has a Business degree, but while he was getting it (he's now 26) he took a lot of what some would consider menial jobs in order to fill out his resume so that he could go into an interview with some experience.  He's still struggling, and probably won't have his dream job for another 5-10 years, if that.  But he's trying.  He's not too proud to suck it up and do the things that need done, even if there's no real money or glory in them.

So while I'm not belittling your experience, keep in mind your situation (and my cousin's) is significantly different than what I'm hearing from these people and others on the Web.  We all had to bust our asses and do things we didn't want to do for less money than we thought we were worth.  Hell, I STILL feel that way sometimes, but until my company (or another) comes along with a significantly better offer which justifies the expense of moving, etc., I'll do my best at my job here.  Period.  As does anyone else who wants to be successful

BTW--UNH has nearly 2/3 of their degrees in Liberal Arts, and they wonder why they can't find jobs.  Nah, Sociology is really in demand--really.

[Chris_]

Free--my point is, few of these kids are willing to WORK.  By which I mean few, if any, of these kids are willing to take the shit jobs that are a part of moving up.  It's the entitlement mentality.  Whatddya mean I have to suck it up for $30K a year--by God, I want $50-60K, and I want it now!  We saw this during the dot-com boom--people whose only skill was MS Front Page demanding (and for a time, getting) $70K salaries, but when the boom went bust, they sat on their asses and expected the next job to just fall in their laps.  No beating the bushes, no upgrading their skills, no working at lower paying jobs to hone their work ethic.  

Did you work exclusively in Biz Admin?  My cousin also has a Business degree, but while he was getting it (he's now 26) he took a lot of what some would consider menial jobs in order to fill out his resume so that he could go into an interview with some experience.  He's still struggling, and probably won't have his dream job for another 5-10 years, if that.  But he's trying.  He's not too proud to suck it up and do the things that need done, even if there's no real money or glory in them.

So while I'm not belittling your experience, keep in mind your situation (and my cousin's) is significantly different than what I'm hearing from these people and others on the Web.  We all had to bust our asses and do things we didn't want to do for less money than we thought we were worth.  Hell, I STILL feel that way sometimes, but until my company (or another) comes along with a significantly better offer which justifies the expense of moving, etc., I'll do my best at my job here.  Period.  As does anyone else who wants to be successful

BTW--UNH has nearly 2/3 of their degrees in Liberal Arts, and they wonder why they can't find jobs.  Nah, Sociology is really in demand--really.

I agree, that is why I noted my 30 years' experience.  I started working at 14 and got my first Programming job when I was a Junior in college. I have been busting my hump ever since.  I worked in the business community but I have been IT the whole time -- application programming, systems administration, computer center director, applications manager, telcom manager -- you name it, I have done it.

Sacrifice and hard work is pretty well unknown to kids these days. And I was BADLY underpaid for years until I became a consultant.  When I found out they replaced me with 3 people when I left my prior job, I chuckled mightily.

[formerlurker]

My degree is a BS in Business Administration (which has helped me in my IT career much more than a degree in IT would have).

I am doing pretty well with just that, but I have been doing it for 30 years.  And, yes, I do make a healthy wage in the 6 figures.

It's your 30 years experience that nets you that salary.   My sister is the same -- 20 years experience in municipal government finances on a philosophy degree.  She works as a PM making well over 6 figures.

Grads now will not make that, but experience will get them there.  It's called "entry level position" and every field has one.

Nursing is one degree that will yield a very good salary on graduation as an RN.

[formerlurker]

Free--my point is, few of these kids are willing to WORK.  By which I mean few, if any, of these kids are willing to take the shit jobs that are a part of moving up.  It's the entitlement mentality.  Whatddya mean I have to suck it up for $30K a year--by God, I want $50-60K, and I want it now!  We saw this during the dot-com boom--people whose only skill was MS Front Page demanding (and for a time, getting) $70K salaries, but when the boom went bust, they sat on their asses and expected the next job to just fall in their laps.  No beating the bushes, no upgrading their skills, no working at lower paying jobs to hone their work ethic.  

Did you work exclusively in Biz Admin?  My cousin also has a Business degree, but while he was getting it (he's now 26) he took a lot of what some would consider menial jobs in order to fill out his resume so that he could go into an interview with some experience.  He's still struggling, and probably won't have his dream job for another 5-10 years, if that.  But he's trying.  He's not too proud to suck it up and do the things that need done, even if there's no real money or glory in them.

So while I'm not belittling your experience, keep in mind your situation (and my cousin's) is significantly different than what I'm hearing from these people and others on the Web.  We all had to bust our asses and do things we didn't want to do for less money than we thought we were worth.  Hell, I STILL feel that way sometimes, but until my company (or another) comes along with a significantly better offer which justifies the expense of moving, etc., I'll do my best at my job here.  Period.  As does anyone else who wants to be successful

BTW--UNH has nearly 2/3 of their degrees in Liberal Arts, and they wonder why they can't find jobs.  Nah, Sociology is really in demand--really.

Good friends of mine just paid 4 years of Fordham (40K/year) for the undergad, and now just started paying for a masters at BU for their daughter's sociology degree.     

Social Workers average what?  30K/year?   

Crazy.

[Chris_]

It's your 30 years experience that nets you that salary.   My sister is the same -- 20 years experience in municipal government finances on a philosophy degree.  She works as a PM making well over 6 figures.

Grads now will not make that, but experience will get them there.  It's called "entry level position" and every field has one.

Nursing is one degree that will yield a very good salary on graduation as an RN.

Nursing is the next HUGE career opportunity.  The boomers are gettin' old and they are not aging like those folks in the "Just for men" commercials.

[Tantal]

Nursing is one degree that will yield a very good salary on graduation as an RN.

Yup. Mrs. Tantal has a BS in Nursing and I have a BA in Criminal Justice. We're not wealthy, but we're not hurting either.

[jukin]

It's true after all--only in America can an idiot go to a four-year college for six years and pay $30,000 a year for a degree which qualifies him/her for a $20,000 a year job.

OR...

You could have busted your ass, worked while you went to school, graduated with ONE engineering degree and be making nearly $40/hour, plus overtime.

This guy probably thinks the Messiah's "tax cuts" are a good thing too.  Wait until his employer can no longer afford to keep him around because he has to pay either his employees or his taxes, but can't pay both.

If the kid only got 3.6 in a BA, a BS in engineering will be real hard for him to keep up anything over 2.0.... and if he worked 20 hours a week it will be around 1.2.

[GOBUCKS]

If the kid only got 3.6 in a BA, a BS in engineering will be real hard for him to keep up anything over 2.0.... and if he worked 20 hours a week it will be around 1.2.

Word.

And that's an optimistic forecast.

Most BA curricula require almost no mathematical aptitude, which makes them a match for most public high school graduates.

Exams in liberal arts subjects use lots of essay-type questions, proving that BS can win a B.A.

Courses where every answer is either right or wrong, black or white, with mathematical certainty, are a nightmare for these kids.

[DumbAss Tanker]

Not so fast, Sparky, a BA isn't necessarily worthless, it all depends on the subject and how the individual applies it.  I started with a BA in Crim Justice (double major with Soc, a true fluff subject to go with the nitty-gritty cop stuff, but the credits added up so that it was a "Might as well" situation).  Despite killer GREs, I decided wotthehell and joined the Army for a four-year hitch and never went the normal grad school route, but applied to law school while I was on the last year of my enlistment (JD cum laude in 82 from a Big Ten school) then over the years added a MS in Systems Management in night school, and an LLM courtesy of Uncle.  It all worked out pretty OK despite the BA.

  

[djones520]

Huh...  I've only got an Associates, and I've got a job with full benefits, a steady pay check, and almost absolute job security.

Guess DUmmie wasn't looking that hard.

[Vagabond]

Not so fast, Sparky, a BA isn't necessarily worthless, it all depends on the subject and how the individual applies it.  I started with a BA in Crim Justice (double major with Soc, a true fluff subject to go with the nitty-gritty cop stuff, but the credits added up so that it was a "Might as well" situation).  Despite killer GREs, I decided wotthehell and joined the Army for a four-year hitch and never went the normal grad school route, but applied to law school while I was on the last year of my enlistment (JD cum laude in 82 from a Big Ten school) then over the years added a MS in Systems Management in night school, and an LLM courtesy of Uncle.  It all worked out pretty OK despite the BA.

  

I started college, got bored with it.  Looked around and realized that I had never been anywhere but my hometown and wanted something else, "Change, you might say.  I was getting good grades, but I was just kind of loafing through life at best.  I decided to join the Army. 

Now, the only lie my recruiter told was about being able to go to college while in the Army, but it wasn't really his lie.  My first unit was in and out of the field once a month and would not flex for those of us who wanted to work in classes.  I barely had time to sleep in Kuwait (I was pretty much the only competent SATCOM guy in the platoon, by which I mean I could keep ALL of the SATCOM related equipment operational, the section seargeant gave me an order that prevented me from teaching anyone else).  My last unit was so understaffed that I only got leave when I fell into the use it or lose it category. 

Since, I have gotten out I have been working on the engineering degree.  I'll eventually get there, even though I have already worked my way into management.

[NHSparky]

All that discussion and I still get a bitchslap?  WTF?

I think we're seeing a trend here, so I'll stand corrected.  It's not necessarily the degree, although it has a lot to do with it.  It's the EFFORT and WORK put into the job of getting the degree and experience to work oneself up the ladder.

When I was recruiting in both high schools and colleges, the amount of bullshit that got shoved into these kids' heads by teachers and guidance counselors was astounding.  Granted, the more deluded of these kids never made it far in college.  Half of all incoming freshman NEVER get a Bachelor's, and half of those drop out before the end of freshman year.  But don't tell that to mommy and daddy, particularly when Mr. Navy Recruiter comes a-callin.

I saw kids with 900 SAT's convinced that they'd get into USC on full-ride scholarship because they were a minority.  I talked to another with a 2.8 GPA (in this era of grade inflation) and barely a 1000 SAT who was going to Princeton or not going to college at all.  A lot of the RTO (refusal to obligate--thanks, Pat Schroeder!) kids I had to deal with in the Nuke program were going to schools they clearly could not afford because someone, somewhere, convinced them that they could just take out a loan for $30K a year. 

Our kids can't read and write, but they sure have loads of self-esteem and lofty goals!  I can't count the number of times I wanted to take those kids aside and show them that not everyone gets to be a rocket scientist, and even then it takes years of effort.  Personally, whoever started the whole concept that EVERYONE MUST go to college needs to be dug up, shot, and repeat the process several times.  Not everyone is cut out for college, so why waste your time and money on a degree which is 1--next worthless, 2--expensive, 3--going to put you in debt for several years, 4--only useful when accompanied by a good ATTITUDE and good EXPERIENCE?

[USA4ME]

....or did they just think they were automatically going to walk in the door at $100K a year?  It's the entitlement mentality.  Whatddya mean I have to suck it up for $30K a year--by God, I want $50-60K, and I want it now!

With the above I completely agree.  Surprising how many college kids think their degree is going to land them at the corporate headquarters with a corner office making $100K+.  With some it could be the entitlement mentality, but the majority I recall in college who had that outlook were simply naive.

.

[NHSparky]

With the above I completely agree.  Surprising how many college kids think their degree is going to land them at the corporate headquarters with a corner office making $100K+.  With some it could be the entitlement mentality, but the majority I recall in college who had that outlook were simply naive.

.

And a lot of them were told to expect this--usually by people who had never themselves worked a day in the corporate world.

[USA4ME]

And a lot of them were told to expect this--usually by people who had never themselves worked a day in the corporate world.

Could be.  Seems most of the one's I knew like that had a father (and sometime mother) who worked 1st, 2nd, or 3rd shift down at the manufacturing plant and had for years and years.  Admirable parents in that they saved and sent their kid to college, but no doubt they told Jr. that the people at the plant who had the good jobs all went to college, and that's why they scrimped and saved in order to send them to college and give them a better life.  I think a lot of these kids saw how hard Dad had to work, didn't want to have to do that, and somehow the lines of immediate expectations and hearing what they wanted to hear were blurred.  After they got out and realized things weren't like they thought they would be, most of them had a good work ethic instilled by their parents, realized that college degree had given them opportunities for advancement that those who went would possibly never get, but they still had to work their way up, and they buckeled down and went to it.

Then there's the DUmmie Project Grudge's of the world.

.

[ScubaGuy]

Free--my point is, few of these kids are willing to WORK.  By which I mean few, if any, of these kids are willing to take the shit jobs that are a part of moving up.  It's the entitlement mentality.  Whatddya mean I have to suck it up for $30K a year--by God, I want $50-60K, and I want it now!  We saw this during the dot-com boom--people whose only skill was MS Front Page demanding (and for a time, getting) $70K salaries, but when the boom went bust, they sat on their asses and expected the next job to just fall in their laps.  No beating the bushes, no upgrading their skills, no working at lower paying jobs to hone their work ethic.  

Ain't that the truth.  I saw a ton of that here where some of those clowns were getting $80-$150 per hour and they only knew Front Page, Access and VB.

So while I'm not belittling your experience, keep in mind your situation (and my cousin's) is significantly different than what I'm hearing from these people and others on the Web.  We all had to bust our asses and do things we didn't want to do for less money than we thought we were worth.  Hell, I STILL feel that way sometimes, but until my company (or another) comes along with a significantly better offer which justifies the expense of moving, etc., I'll do my best at my job here.  Period.  As does anyone else who wants to be successful

As soon as I knew what I wanted to do when I grew up,  I took any job I could get related to the field just for the resume.

During my senior year I was working for Public TV to pay part of my tuition and I stayed on for a year after that.  The pay was crap but I got more experience that first year than many of my classmates did in their first three to five years.  That move payed off big-time when I left and got my first private sector job.

Since then I spend a lot of my own time keeping up with changes in technology so that I don't become some unemployed dinosaur.

BTW--UNH has nearly 2/3 of their degrees in Liberal Arts, and they wonder why they can't find jobs.  Nah, Sociology is really in demand--really.

If you get the chance to ask a Liberal Arts graduate of school what can you do with a Liberal Arts degree they will tell you how it applies to just about everything in life.  I guess it applies to everything except earning a good income.

[jtyangel]

Big 10 assumes the midwest. In my slight foray back into the work world, I was able to find 'cubicle work' for 12-13 bucks an hour with less then 2 years college, but he/she can only get 10 bucks an hour with 2 degrees? I think someone can make more working for Fed Ex or something for the holidays. What's wrong with this person?

[NHSparky]

Big 10 assumes the midwest. In my slight foray back into the work world, I was able to find 'cubicle work' for 12-13 bucks an hour with less then 2 years college, but he/she can only get 10 bucks an hour with 2 degrees? I think someone can make more working for Fed Ex or something for the holidays. What's wrong with this person?

It's not where/what I want to do.  I hear that a LOT.

[jtyangel]

It's not where/what I want to do.  I hear that a LOT.

Yeah, well that's what I suspected it probably is about. I would hate to have a family with someone like this when push comes to shove. You work in ditches or overnight somewhere if you have to make ends meet. There is no shame in work and taking care of yourself and your own. A title is only a title.