soleil, I have some political questions for you

[Doc]

So you think Americans would be more accepting of freeing people in Iraq as a reason because they could understand that more then the real reason? if so I can agree with that too, Americans at time can be so short-sighted that they can't see the over-all picture of what could happen down the road if Saddam was left unchecked.

The short answer is .....yes......I also believe that freeing 25 million intelligent, and reasonably well educated people was part of the motive, but the entire decision was far more complex........

I further believe that fifty years from now, the decision will be looked upon far more favorably than it is now, when Iraq is stable and free, and a participating member of the world's economies.  GWB was a visionary......he saw things as they "need to be"......unlike the present administration, which has no vision at all.

doc

[rich_t]

You know that actually isn't true. I consider it all. I am southern ('bout as southern as you can get), and I know many dems here would be considered republicans in a national election.  I vote on the issues that mean a lot to me.

Whoa...

Did you or did you not post

Although I would never vote republican,

?????

[rich_t]

Are the southern Democrats though beholden to their constituents? or the progressives of the Democratic party?  Seems like some of them are afraid to go against the party higher ups. At 1 time yes, but it doesn't seem like it lately.

I was speaking of the voters, not those running for office.  I should have clarified that in my initial post.

[Carl]

So you think Americans would be more accepting of freeing people in Iraq as a reason because they could understand that more then the real reason? if so I can agree with that too, Americans at time can be so short-sighted that they can't see the over-all picture of what could happen down the road if Saddam was left unchecked.

Not addressed to me but the answer in a nutshell is yes,most people don`t grasp how far reaching the impact of oil production is to not just ours but the global way of life.
A tire is more oil then rubber for example and since we have shut down virtually all means of energy production here outside of oil it is in our national as well as a global interest.

This is the big regional threat of islam but not the only one.
The islamists fascist desires of religious rule are a threat which is embodied by wanton killing of innocents simply because they don`t believe.
The WOT has many faces but despite 9/11 a certain segment of the population here refuses to acknowledge what they are very open about.
The reason for that always seems to boil down to the same...they think that the resources used to fight oppression should instead be spent giving them what they think is a happier life for today.

Sorry to Soleil if it isn`t pleasant to hear but there is no greater greed and selfishness in the world then that held by the far left.

[Ballygrl]

Sort of like what happened in Iraq?

Do you recall the purple fingers, and the pride of those that had one after Saddam was disposed of?

Yes, I admit that was exciting to see.

[Lord Undies]

I still confused about this homosexuals not having equal rights thingy.  I am to understand that if a homosexual male attempts to apply for a marriage license with his female friend, someone in government will deny the license?  

For gawd's sake, don't tell Liza Minnelli!    

[rich_t]

Heritage maybe? Not sure since I was born and raised in this country, but if I were to go elsewhere, I'd always want to be referred to as an American in some way. My grandma always liked to call herself Irish-American even though it was her parents who came here and not her. She was born here. I have no answer to that question really. Maybe it is human nature to feel something about where you came from.

You do understand that to immigrate to another country means that you are intentionally leaving your old country behind you right?

[Ballygrl]

The short answer is .....yes......I also believe that freeing 25 million intelligent, and reasonably well educated people was part of the motive, but the entire decision was far more complex........

I further believe that fifty years from now, the decision will be looked upon far more favorably than it is now, when Iraq is stable and free, and a participating member of the world's economies.  GWB was a visionary......he saw things as they "need to be"......unlike the present administration, which has no vision at all.

doc

I also think history will treat Bush kindly. I think Bush's major problem throughout his Presidency was the lefts
constant Bush was selected not elected mantra that didn't end even when he was re-elected in 2004.

[Ballygrl]

Not addressed to me but the answer in a nutshell is yes,most people don`t grasp how far reaching the impact of oil production is to not just ours but the global way of life.
A tire is more oil then rubber for example and since we have shut down virtually all means of energy production here outside of oil it is in our national as well as a global interest.

This is the big regional threat of islam but not the only one.
The islamists fascist desires of religious rule are a threat which is embodied by wanton killing of innocents simply because they don`t believe.
The WOT has many faces but despite 9/11 a certain segment of the population here refuses to acknowledge what they are very open about.
The reason for that always seems to boil down to the same...they think that the resources used to fight oppression should instead be spent giving them what they think is a happier life for today.

Sorry to Soleil if it isn`t pleasant to hear but there is no greater greed and selfishness in the world then that held by the far left.

I agree with your post too.

[soleil]

Whoa...

Did you or did you not post
?????

And I meant that. I happen to have always agreed with the dem side, and so unless things the parties stand for change, I will always vote dem. I obviously can't see the future, but I don't ever see myself voting Republican.

[soleil]

You do understand that to immigrate to another country means that you are intentionally leaving your old country behind you right?

Intentionally for various reasons. Doesn't mean you can't take the parts you did like with you. I am sure there is something about the culture you were raised in that could make you nostalgic for parts of the country.

[rich_t]

And I meant that. I happen to have always agreed with the dem side, and so unless things the parties stand for change, I will always vote dem. I obiously can't see the future, but I don't ever see myself voting Republican.

Thanks for proving my point.

You are more about voting for the party than a person.

[soleil]

Thanks for proving my point.

You are more about voting for the party than a person.

How is that? I just told you I voted on the issues that meant something to me. It has always happened to be the dem side.

[rich_t]

Intentionally for various reasons. Doesn't mean you can't take the parts you did like with you.
[/quote

Such as?

[Lord Undies]

Intentionally for various reasons. Doesn't mean you can't take the parts you did like with you.

That makes me feel all warm and fuzzy about what some radical homosexual's-head-cutting-off muslim guy may bring with him. Maybe we can applaud when some assimilating radical muslim brings the parts he liked about his old country to the City By The Bay.  Can you imagine all those heads floating around in the water under the Golden Gate Bridge?    

[soleil]

Intentionally for various reasons. Doesn't mean you can't take the parts you did like with you.
[/quote

Such as?

The neighborhood you grew up in. The family get togethers you had in this area. The food you ate. The different ways of culture. A lot of stuff. Not everyone remembers the political things. America's culture is different than that of other countries. So the country means one thing on a political level and another on a cultural level.

[Ballygrl]

Thanks for proving my point.

You are more about voting for the party than a person.

I think for offices such as the Presidency, Senate and Congress I can never see myself voting Democrat at all, I'm in NJ, I'm stuck with Menendez and Lautenberg, I can't envision a Democrat ever coming along that I agree with on issues even a small percentage of the time.

[soleil]

That makes me feel all warm and fuzzy about what some radical homosexual's-head-cutting-off muslim guy may bring with him. Maybe we can applaud when some assimilating radical muslim brings the parts he liked about his old country to the City By The Bay.  Can you imagine all those heads floating around in the water under the Golden Gate Bridge?    

Whoah, you totally took this into crazy land. Please tell me how that equates to anything I said.

[rich_t]

How is that? I just told you I voted on the issues that meant something to me. It has always happened to be the dem side.

No...  What you posted was:

unless things the parties stand for change, I will always vote dem.

Note your use of the word "parties".

I assume that to mean you mean politcal party, and that goes dircetly back to your comment that you would always vote dem.

After all these are your own words.

[Lord Undies]

Whoah, you totally took this into crazy land. Please tell me how that equates to anything I said.

How does it not, lady?  Religion is cultural, not political - or so we have to pretend.  Muslims kill homosexuals.  That's part of their culture.  I can produce photos if you need them.

How do you pick and choose what can be brought to corrupt America's unique culture.  Are you the arbitrator?

You are Crazyland.  Leftism is a mental disorder.  Even those like you who appear rational are not immune.

Do you hate muslims for hating homosexuals? 

[soleil]

No...  What you posted was:

Note your use of the word "parties".

I assume that to mean you mean politcal party, and that goes dircetly back to your comment that you would always vote dem.

After all these are your own words.

Yes, those are my words. I vote on the issues. I don't know how many other ways to say that. There are certain issues dems are for/against and certain ones repubs are for/against. That is kinda what makes them separate parties. I usually agree with the dems side, therefore, I vote that way.

[BEG]

Yes, those are my words. I vote on the issues. I don't know how many other ways to say that. There are certain issues dems are for/against and certain ones repubs are for/against. That is kinda what makes them separate parties. I usually agree with the dems side, therefore, I vote that way.

Just for curiosity sake, would you list a few items you disagree with Republican's on (besides the gay marriage and abortion issue, we know where you stand on those).

[Ballygrl]

Do you hate muslims for hating homosexuals? 

Are you asking why progressives are selective in who they condemn?

[BEG]

Are you asking why progressives are selective in who they condemn?

Their hypocrisy comes naturally.

[Lord Undies]

Are you asking why progressives are selective in who they condemn?

I'm just trying to get one of them, even a plebe like that one, to face the obvious hypocrisy of his/her purposefully obtuse worldview.  

I am quite aware their mental illness gets in the way of clarity -- but it was worth a shot.