@Lleu: Hate Crimes Legislation

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

Considering the vast majority of wagging-tongued talking heads have nothing to offer as a rebuttal to those who oppose Obama's agenda and direction beyond "RACISM!!!1!!!" does it seem possible/probable that hate crime legislation could be abused as an excuse to stifle genuine political discourse?

If so should that legislation be abandoned where it exists and dropped from consideration where it does not yet exist?

[VelvetElvis]

Perish the thought!! 
The MSM, Obama, and the Dems have nothing but the purest of intentions in promoting Hate Crime laws.

Why, you must be a RAAAAACCCCCIIIIISSSSTTTTTTT or something to even consider such a thing isn't wonderful, hopey, and changey!!!

[Thor]

I don't see the troll responding, but I will. I think that hate crimes legislation is an abuse of the legal system. We already have laws on the books that protect EVERYBODY against crimes (when/if they catch the criminal). Does it being a hate crime make it any more heinous?? I think not. All that any form of racism, "homophobia", etc. does, be it from ANY side, is give the criminal an extra motivation, reason or excuse (moral justification) to commit that crime. What I'm seeing in today's world is that these hate crimes laws are a one way street. After all, if one isn't WHITE, these laws won't be applied equally. So much for "equal justice under the law"..........

[rich_t]

I don't see the troll responding, but I will. I think that hate crimes legislation is an abuse of the legal system. We already have laws on the books that protect EVERYBODY against crimes (when/if they catch the criminal). Does it being a hate crime make it any more heinous?? I think not. All that any form of racism, "homophobia", etc. does, be it from ANY side, is give the criminal an extra motivation, reason or excuse (moral justification) to commit that crime. What I'm seeing in today's world is that these hate crimes laws are a one way street. After all, if one isn't WHITE, these laws won't be applied equally. So much for "equal justice under the law"..........

Well put.

[miskie]

Perish the thought!! 
The MSM, Obama, and the Dems have nothing but the purest of intentions in promoting Hate Crime laws.

Why, you must be a RAAAAACCCCCIIIIISSSSTTTTTTT or something to even consider such a thing isn't wonderful, hopey, and changey!!!

LMAO - you inspired me -

Obama and the Seven Czars -

Dopey (Gil Kerlikowske),
Hopey (Joshua DuBois ),
Changey (Todd Stern),
Spendy (Paul Volcker),
Sicky (Nancy-Ann DeParle),
Hippy (Carol Browner),
... and Doc (John Holdren ).

( This has got to be my favorite +1 post of 2009 )   

[Chris_]

"hate crimes" laws are just "thought" control legislation.  A perp commits crime "A" and gets penalty "B".  A perp commits crime "A" while thinking bad thoughts, and gets penalty "B" plus penalty "C".  Just moral relativity and PC bullsh*t.

[NHSparky]

LMAO - you inspired me -

Obama and the Seven Czars -

Dopey (Gil Kerlikowske),
Hopey (Joshua DuBois ),
Changey (Todd Stern),
Spendy (Paul Volcker),
Sicky (Nancy-Ann DeParle),
Hippy (Carol Browner),
... and Doc (John Holdren ).

( This has got to be my favorite +1 post of 2009 )   

If only he had stopped at seven.

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

Well put.

yes...but nothing to do with what I asked.

I asked: since Obama's defenders have nothing better than scurrilous charges of racism to alibi his failing administration would/could/should hate crime laws be abused by these sad-sacks to silence legitmate dissent?

[rich_t]

yes...but nothing to do with what I asked.

I asked: since Obama's defenders have nothing better than scurrilous charges of racism to alibi his failing administration would/could/should hate crime laws be abused by these sad-sacks to silence legitmate dissent?

To answer the question.

would/could/should

maybe/possibly/no.

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

Leave it to Maxine Waters to prove my point:

The media should investigate the racial views of conservative activists like the ones who descended on Washington last weekend, one liberal congresswoman said Wednesday.

Rep. Maxine Waters (D-Calif.) said that it's not enough for African-Americans to levy allegations of racism against the right-leaning protesters, and that the media must look into their views.

"I want those people talked to; I want them interviewed," Waters told the liberal Bill Press Radio show in a podcast. "I want journalists to be all over those rallies and the marches with the birthers and the teabaggers."

"What I'm looking for is the very people who carry the signs who are referring to the policies in very, very strange ways like 'Obamacare' and 'Barry Obamacare with Kennedy,'" she said. "What I've been interested in is hearing from those people that everybody's referring to -- everybody on the Mall, in the rally."

Tens of thousands of conservative activists took to the National Mall last weekend to protest the Obama administration, specifically its stance on healthcare reform. Examples of incendiary rhetoric touching on racial overtones from some protesters have emerged on blogs in the days since the rally.

"I think it's not enough for African-Americans to say what they think, what they suspect," Waters said. "I think that if you put the microphones in front of them, if you do the interviews, they'll tell you what they believe, what they think."

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/59015-waters-media-must-investigate-right-wing-protesters-for-racism

In other words: she's looking for a pretext to use the police powers of the state to harrass and suppress dissent.

[LC EFA]

Leave it to Maxine Waters to prove my point:
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/59015-waters-media-must-investigate-right-wing-protesters-for-racism

The media should investigate the racial views of conservative activists like the ones who descended on Washington last weekend, one liberal congresswoman said Wednesday.

Rep. Maxine Waters (D-Calif.) said that it's not enough for African-Americans to levy allegations of racism against the right-leaning protesters, and that the media must look into their views.

"I want those people talked to; I want them interviewed," Waters told the liberal Bill Press Radio show in a podcast. "I want journalists to be all over those rallies and the marches with the birthers and the teabaggers."

In other words: she's looking for a pretext to use the police powers of the state to harrass and suppress dissent.

It is a standard leftist tactic. Question your enemy's motivations , Lie and obfuscate. Do everything in power to get people to ignore the actual content.

Scream "racist" .

Do anything in your power to prevent the enemy's message from reaching the ears of the people. Especially so  when that message is correct and damaging to their cause by revealing that their sacred cow is nothing more than a bloated corpse.

[lastparker]

She's a piece of work, isn't she?  And in another story of race-based disparity.....

The House ethics committee announced Wednesday that it is extending probes into two lawmakers -- Democrat Maxine Waters of California and Republican Sam Graves of Missouri -- in unrelated cases while it deferred investigation into a case involving Rep. Jesse Jackson Jr.

The Committee on Standards of Official Conduct did not say why it was extending the probes, but that they related to an unannounced question surrounding the conduct of Waters and an unspecified matter regarding Graves.

In a news release the panel said the committee extended the probe into Graves for 45 days even though the Office of Congressional Ethics did not find a "substantial reason to believe" that the lawmaker was guilty of any misconduct and had found information "that may contain exculpatory evidence" which was never provided to Graves.

In his own release, Graves indicated that the investigation related to testimony he requested while ranking member of the Small Business Committee. That testimony on renewable fuels last March was delivered by Graves' friend Brooks Hurst. Graves' wife and Hurst are investors together in renewable fuels plants in Missouri, Roll Call newspaper reported Wednesday. 

"I look forward to a quick review of the facts and answering any questions that the committee may have. I believe that a speedy review will show that all the rules of the House concerning testimony in front of the Small Business Committee were followed," Graves said.

Like Graves, the probe into Waters was extended for 45 days. A statement by the panel on Waters gave no indication what the probe was covering, but it is possible that Waters is under investigation for her role in the decision to provide $12 million in federal bailout funds to OneUnited Bank, where her husband, Sidney Williams, had served on the board and owned a minimum of $500,000 in stock in 2007.
The investigation into whether Jackson, D-Ill., offered to raise money for disgraced former Gov. Rod Blagojevich in exchange to succeed President Obama in the Senate has been deferred at the request of the JusticeDepartment.

The committee said it "will continue to monitor the situation and will consider pursuing avenues of inquiry that it concludes do not interfere with the activities of the Department of Justice."

FOX News' Chad Pergram contributed to this report.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/09/16/ethics-committee-starts-probes-lawmakers-defers/

[Crazy Horse]

I notice lib he/she/it hasn't responded

[BadCat]

I notice lib he/she/it hasn't responded

I think that maybe, during his brief stay, he got to "know" us.
That is what he wanted.

[Crazy Horse]

I think that maybe, during his brief stay, he got to "know" us.
That is what he wanted.

As usual.........they really miss that echo chamber

[Chris_]

I notice lib he/she/it hasn't responded

Any honest form of debate or "learning" was not ever likely.  Liberal views don't last long when subjected to logic.

[Lleu]

I moved on Tuesday and had problems getting the net up at my new apartment.

To answer the original OP I think it's likely that we're going to see a rise in the cry of "Hate Crime!!!"

BUT to me the idea of "hate crimes" is retarded to begin with.  If someone beats someone with in an inch of their life it shouldn't matter if the motive was racial or if the person being beaten just looked at the beater the wrong way.  I thought the punishment was supposed to fit the crime, not the motive.  /shrug.

[TheSarge]

I moved on Tuesday and had problems getting the net up at my new apartment.

To answer the original OP I think it's likely that we're going to see a rise in the cry of "Hate Crime!!!"

BUT to me the idea of "hate crimes" is retarded to begin with.  If someone beats someone with in an inch of their life it shouldn't matter if the motive was racial or if the person being beaten just looked at the beater the wrong way.  I thought the punishment was supposed to fit the crime, not the motive.  /shrug.

"When you murder somebody, it’s hate. I’m not exactly sure how you enhance the penalty any more than the death penalty." - -George W. Bush Oct. 2000

The ultimate hate crime law in the U.S. is already on the books in IIRC 38 states.

Like with gun laws we should enforce what's already on the books and not create more new feel good stuff just for the sake of doing it.

The problem with all this "hate crime" law BS (other than the death penalty) is that it's administered one way and one way only.

And it's 99.9% of the time levelled at white defendants doing harm to a one of a Liberals pet special interest groups.

A person of color or a gay murders a person pf pallor or that is hetero...the excuses start flying about how the defendant had no other choice.

Let a white person just spit in a "minority" person's way and it's a racist hate crime.