Public School funding is more important than educating children.

[thundley4]

cjbgreen   (49 posts)           Thu Feb-11-10 01:34 PM
Original message
Poll question: Do you think charter schools contribute to a more segregated society?   
   
Edited on Thu Feb-11-10 01:46 PM by cjbgreen
Charter School Report Finds Widespread Segregation, Including in Minnesota
by Beth Hawkins http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2010/02/11-7
Hawkins cites two recent reports on charter schools and notes:
Text
"In Minnesota, the report found, much of this segregation can be attributed to the fact that many urban charters are targeted at students of a single race or ethnicity. By contrast, in the western United States, where traditional schools are typically more diverse, charters "are havens for white re-segregation from public schools," researchers reported.
A second study released earlier this week found that charters operated by so-called education management organizations - private corporations - segregate by race, income, disability, and language.
"The student population is pushed out to the extremes," researchers at Western Michigan University and the University of Colorado at Boulder concluded. "Most charter schools were divided into either very segregated high-income schools or very segregated low-income schools."}Text

Poll result (21 votes)
Charter schools foster segregation intentionally and unintentionally.    (15 votes, 71%)   Vote
Charter schools do foster segregation in some situations .    (3 votes, 14%)   Vote
Charter schools do not foster segregation.    (3 votes, 14%)   Vote
Segregating students is harmful to children and society.    (0 votes, 0%)   Vote
Integrating students is not an important role of public education.    (0 votes, 0%)   Vote

  http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7693443

ixion   (1000+ posts)               Thu Feb-11-10 01:35 PM
Response to Original message
1. charter schools are what public schools ought to be
   
the difference in the quality and depth of education is considerable, from my experience. In that regard, charter schools contribute to a segregated society.

Not a big fan of the teacher unions, are you?

Vincardog   (1000+ posts)           Thu Feb-11-10 01:41 PM
Response to Original message
2. The purpose of charter schools is to de-fund public education. They should not be allowed.

They show that unions are detrimental to education, and that shouldn't be allowed.  FIFY

alstephenson   (1000+ posts)           Thu Feb-11-10 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. That's B.S.
   
And you know it. What information do you base this statement on?

tonysam   (1000+ posts)             Thu Feb-11-10 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. It has EVERYTHING to do with destroying public education
   
Why do you think billionaires are up to their eyeballs funding these things?

Like that evil conservative Rethuglican Bill Gates?

Vincardog   (1000+ posts)           Thu Feb-11-10 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. I base this on 30 years of watching rePIGlickers implement their anti-education agenda.

Yeah, Education funding goes up every year, union teachers make more money, kids get dumber. Sounds  good to me.

alstephenson   (1000+ posts)           Thu Feb-11-10 01:53 PM
Response to Original message
6. Many charter schools are run by mission-oriented non-profits.
   
They choose to serve low-income communities and students with a high percentage of "at risk" students. The fact that these communities and students are comprised primarily of minorities speaks more about our society than it does about charter schools. So charter schools MAY be segregated, but they DO NOT segregate.

That is what I see in the 2 charter schools that I pass by several times a week.  The students are bused from their neighborhoods to nicer schools. Almost every kid is a minority, here that means black. 

[The Village Idiot]

Thundley,
Charter schools are publicly funded.

DUmmies should love it.

[thundley4]

Thundley,
Charter schools are publicly funded.

DUmmies should love it.

But that money is taken from the schools that support unions.  [/DU mode]  I think charter schools are a good idea where the public schools are failing, and that is in most   cities.

[Texacon]

Vincardog   (1000+ posts)           Thu Feb-11-10 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. I base this on 30 years of watching rePIGlickers implement their anti-education agenda.

Can they be any more juvenile? 

Vincardog   how old are you ..... 10?

KC

[jukin]

The DUchebags do know that the hard left controls the education system and has for over thirty five years?

[kenth]

Two things they don't like about charter schools; non-unionized teachers and students not captive to leftist indoctrination.

[The Village Idiot]

Two things they don't like about charter schools; non-unionized teachers and students not captive to leftist indoctrination.

true.

[Tucker]

Two things they don't like about charter schools; non-unionized teachers and students not captive to leftist indoctrination.

Can you say tenure.

[delilahmused]

If charter schools are funded as part of public education wouldn't they use union teachers? One of the tricks some districts here use is to start an "online" or charter-like school for homeschoolers. The districts get funding for full time students without having students there more than part time. Eventually they try to put more and more rules and restrictions and testing requirements on families to the point that they might as well be in the school system. I know my views are pretty radical but I'd really like to see schools (at least the way they are today) abolished. Every child is autodidactic with an insatiable love of learning. Then they're put into an institution that plays to a single learning style and caters to the lowest common denominator.

Cindie

[miskie]

We send our oldest to the area charter (she is in 5th - the charter runs 5th through high school)

1- the racial makeup seems to be a reflection of the city, I see no bias in any direction.

2- enrollment is based on lottery (for the first entrant in your family, siblings get automatically accepted) and the names are pulled in public by random people.

3- enrollment is voluntary.

4- the school is funded via public funds, as well as from grants from non-profits. The extra grants definitely help the school remain on the bleeding edge curriculum-wise. Computers, technical and martial arts are taught on top of the usual courses (5th grade) and the students do several projects a year, and have numerous educational field trips as well.

5- the school is classed as a public school - it also has special education teachers, and has to meet or exceed all benchmarks for public schools (rest assured, it exceeds them all)

So -- to the Charter deniers..

Funds aren't "drained" from the other schools, they are supplemented by sources that the other public schools can't use.

Educators are outside of the teacher's unions, and choose to be there voluntarily. Regardless of their personal political affiliation, I am certain that these are teachers who feel they can succeed on their own merit, and not ride along on the tenure bus - meaning they have to be talented, or they will become unemployed. Just like the private sector.

Massachusetts is using the charter schools to pioneer new education techniques that will be spread to the regular public schools- so eventually all will benefit.

finally, to those that are interested, or those primitives who feel Im just blowing smoke http://glcps.org/  -- the website of the charter to which I refer.

[blitzkrieg_17]

Can they be any more juvenile? 

Vincardog   how old are you ..... 10?

KC

Probably. History is not taught in the publik skewlz.

[AllosaursRus]

If charter schools are funded as part of public education wouldn't they use union teachers? One of the tricks some districts here use is to start an "online" or charter-like school for homeschoolers. The districts get funding for full time students without having students there more than part time. Eventually they try to put more and more rules and restrictions and testing requirements on families to the point that they might as well be in the school system. I know my views are pretty radical but I'd really like to see schools (at least the way they are today) abolished. Every child is autodidactic with an insatiable love of learning. Then they're put into an institution that plays to a single learning style and caters to the lowest common denominator.

Cindie

These asshats are trying to meld private schools and charter schools!!!!!!!!!!! They aren't even close!

THIS, is what the left does! Their call of racist cannot be applied to "charters". Charters are by far, more diverse than even public schools. Parents try like hell to get their kids into them and away from the frikkin gang violence so prevelant in our inner city schools. They try, without it costing them a damn fortune, and their child's lives!!

Can you blame them?????

DUmmie liberals, would like you to think that they are the same as private schools that, will pick and choose! Much as I hate to dismiss these idiots, (heh), they actually think it's done for race..... believe it or not, privates actually look at ...........wait for it.........academic superiority. Whether or not you can still afford to pay the damn tuition will also make a diff whether or not you get in!

Charters, on the other hand, would recieve Gubmint subsidies on top of tuition from parents, in order to get their children to excell!. Of course this is before the Bummer shut it down! I don't know the number, but Bummer just "****ed" a whole bunch of kids in DC!

In order to get thier kids, out of the hell hole that is our inner city sewege, that has become the "Public School system", they were willing to go BROKE!! Ya think the "Bummer" would help them, wouldn't ya? After all he's half their color! He has stopped the funding for inner city kids. His first stop on this travesty was DC!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

For this, I will never forgive him! The reason these parents were enrolled in this program was to get them the hell out of the gang life! I guess Bummer would rather fund the Teachers and SEIU, before he would help his own out of the gutter!

Yeah, now you can call me RACIST! [/rant] Damn, this guy pisses me off!



ETA: 'cause of a few too many...........

[notaDUmmie]

What Obama and the Dems did to school children in DC is a crime, or at least it should be.  Children from poor families and failing schools were thriving in private schools paid for with vouchers.  And I can't speak for the non-Catholic schools, but the Catholic schools were accepting the vouchers and charging nothing above that amount.

For all the bitching and moaning the left does about private schools, the cold, hard fact is that the public schools would be overwhelmed if all the private school kids registered for the local public schools.  We pay the taxes for the public schools, but the private school kids don't use that money.  In Fairfax county, thousands of kids go to Catholic schools - the public schools would be overwhelmed if we all one day decided to register them at the local public schools.

[thundley4]

What Obama and the Dems did to school children in DC is a crime, or at least it should be.  Children from poor families and failing schools were thriving in private schools paid for with vouchers.  And I can't speak for the non-Catholic schools, but the Catholic schools were accepting the vouchers and charging nothing above that amount.

For all the bitching and moaning the left does about private schools, the cold, hard fact is that the public schools would be overwhelmed if all the private school kids registered for the local public schools.  We pay the taxes for the public schools, but the private school kids don't use that money.  In Fairfax county, thousands of kids go to Catholic schools - the public schools would be overwhelmed if we all one day decided to register them at the local public schools.

I don't know about other places, but the Catholic schools here offer help to lower income families that are members of the Catholic Church.

[Celtic Rose]

I don't know about other places, but the Catholic schools here offer help to lower income families that are members of the Catholic Church.

They do that here as well.  I've heard of people who start attending church regularly a few years before their child will start attending school so that they are part of the diocese and their child can get into/get financial aid for local Catholic Schools.

I went to a Catholic high school.  I didn't get in my freshman year because I'm not Catholic, and Catholics of course get priority, but they had space for my sophomore year.  Best decision ever. 

[BlueStateSaint]

They do that here as well.  I've heard of people who start attending church regularly a few years before their child will start attending school so that they are part of the diocese and their child can get into/get financial aid for local Catholic Schools.

I went to a Catholic high school.  I didn't get in my freshman year because I'm not Catholic, and Catholics of course get priority, but they had space for my sophomore year.  Best decision ever.  

My wife's sister, who is a sort-of moonbat, was thrilled to get her oldest daughter into a local Catholic kindergarten.  They apparently have a long waiting list, too.  I'd take a second job as a McDonald's fry cook, if that would be what it would take to pay for The Heiress (and any future children) to go to Catholic schools.  I went from kindergarten through the end of high school, as did my brother and two sisters.

[AllosaursRus]

My wife's sister, who is a sort-of moonbat, was thrilled to get her oldest daughter into a local Catholic kindergarten.  They apparently have a long waiting list, too.  I'd take a second job as a McDonald's fry cook, if that would be what it would take to pay for The Heiress (and any future children) to go to Catholic schools.  I went from kindergarten through the end of high school, as did my brother and two sisters.

My kids, and grandkids, are fortunate enough to have parents that have always lived in conservative areas of the country. We will not allow what happens in the Big City to influence our children's education. It's a sad fact that you have to enroll your children in private schools in order for them to get a decent education nowadays in the "blue" parts of the country.