Author Topic: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas  (Read 251 times)

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Offline Ptarmigan

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Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« on: October 12, 2022, 08:17:03 PM »
Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
https://justthenews.com/nation/states/center-square/energy-analyst-says-ev-charging-more-expensive-gas

Quote
As Illinois transitions into a more electric vehicle-friendly state, an energy analyst says the cost to charge vehicles may slow the process.

Gov. J.B. Pritzker wants 1 million electric vehicles on Illinois roadways by the end of the decade. According to the U.S. Department of Energy, at the end of last year, there were just over 36,000 EV’s registered in Illinois.

Energy analyst Bill Cinnamon said the adoption of EVs will hit a brick wall when people realize how expensive it is to charge EVs at work or at public charging stations. And charging costs will continue to escalate as the price of grid electricity skyrockets.

“If we trade gas stations for utility-based EV charging during the day, our costs to drive the car and fuel up those cars is going to cost even more than gas at $3.50 a gallon,” Cinnamon said.

Charging an electric vehicle costs more than filling it up with gasoline.
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Offline Eupher

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Re: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« Reply #1 on: October 13, 2022, 04:11:47 AM »
And the stupid part is, people actually believe that EVs are the be-all, end-all.

The technology ain't there yet, folks. Lithium batteries may not be right after all, but the idiots who buy the hype will learn that that 2,000 lb. battery sitting in their trunk is their albatross. And then they'll be crying to the gubmint for a bailout.  :banghead:
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Offline SVPete

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Re: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« Reply #2 on: October 13, 2022, 08:40:08 AM »
What percentage of IL homes would not need substantial wiring upgrades to handle the current draw of an in-home charger?

What percentage of IL neighborhoods have pole transformers adequate for the load of multiple chargers?

What percentage of IL neighborhoods and cities have service to pole transformers adequate for neighborhoods and cities full of EV chargers?

And now substitute your state's postal abbreviation for "IL".

Close to my home, parts of my neighborhood were built up in the 1940s, 1960s, 1970s, 1980s, and 1990s. So some homes and pole transformers might handle the load. Some older homes have already been upgraded (or torn down and replaced), but their pole transformers and wires from the transformer have not, e.g. moi (our AWG #4 wires from the transformer were deemed just adequate when we upgraded). Some older homes have not been upgraded, or the upgrade was too long ago and not sufficient for the added load of a charger (my parents' rural home had been built in 1949, and when it was sold 50 years later still had its original pane with fuses). That's probably pretty typical of many cities.
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Offline Eupher

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Re: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« Reply #3 on: October 13, 2022, 12:54:53 PM »
^^^I was curious about the voltage levels needed to charge an EV car, so according to this link, the standard 120V line would work -- but it would take an eternity to fully charge your EV car.

They're saying Level 1, 120V; Level 2, 208-240V, and Level 3, 480V or "fast chargers".

For most homeowners, they've already got 120V. SOME homes, mine included, have 240V in either the garage or in a separate shed/shop.

As this link recommends the 240V option to charge your EV, Pete is correct in pointing out that putting in that capability in your home is an expense that most EV car owners wouldn't automatically think of. And the impact to the overall grid if 20% of homeowners suddenly "upgrade" to 240V somewhere in their home and they begin to use it steadily is also not factored in.

I come back to my main point -- we're not ready for EV anything. Gotta build the infrastructure FIRST -- not backasswards -- to make it work. And that takes time, capital investment, and the will to make it happen.

And we ain't there yet, if ever. Exploding lithium batteries, the lack of mineable lithium access, and other financial and political issues put all of that as a great big NFW until those elements are either resolved or a different technology comes about.

https://climatebiz.com/voltage-to-charge-an-electric-car/
Adams E2 Euphonium, built in 2017
Boosey & Co. Imperial Euphonium, built in 1941
Edwards B454 bass trombone, built 2012
Bach Stradivarius 42OG tenor trombone, built 1992
Kanstul 33-T BBb tuba, built 2011
Fender Precision Bass Guitar, built ?
Mouthpiece data provided on request.

Offline SVPete

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Re: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« Reply #4 on: October 13, 2022, 01:33:32 PM »
In my limited experience, most homes have 4-wire power: 2 Phases (of three possible), Neutral, and Earth Ground; Phase-Neutral is 120 VAC; Phase-Phase is 208 VAC. 208 VAC power is mainly used for appliances such as electric stoves and dryers and for electric heaters and AC. Because Phase-Neutral 120 VAC devices reasonably balanced between the two phases, there is not a huge surplus 208 VAC capacity, unless a home owner has upgraded well above present usage to allow for future consumption growth.

Consequently, many/most homes would need upgrade if a Level 2 charger is installed (and some might need upgrade to accommodate a Level 1 charger). A person looking to buy a Tesla or Volt or Bolt or Leaf or etc. would learn this, of course, but in Enviro-pols' and MSM EV-blather, this is seldom or never mentioned.

However, capacity problems pervade from the utility entry into homes all the way back to power generation sources. There is massive capacity and transmission inadequacy throughout the whole electrical grid.
Anti-Covid-Vaxxer pig crap claim/prediction, Doctor: Heart Failure from mRNA Jabs "Will Kill Most People" | Principia Scientific Intl. ; Dr. Geert Vanden Bossche Warns COVID-19 Jab Injuries and Deaths Will Soon "Collapse Our Health System" (VIDEO) ; Fully Vaxxed May 2021; Since that time I've done 10 5Ks, 1 8K, 8 10Ks, and 4 half marathons

Offline Eupher

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Re: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« Reply #5 on: October 13, 2022, 05:18:28 PM »
^^^I neglected to mention the 220V (or whatever the tech term is) for most electric and dual ranges. I had to have 220V installed when we yanked out the old gas range (gas oven too) and we put in a dual range (electric oven, gas range).

Putting that 220V line in was not easy. So I doubled down and had them run 220V out to my shed/shop.

But yeah, overall, the grid ain't ready for Mr. Bolt or Tesla or the rest of the EVs.
Adams E2 Euphonium, built in 2017
Boosey & Co. Imperial Euphonium, built in 1941
Edwards B454 bass trombone, built 2012
Bach Stradivarius 42OG tenor trombone, built 1992
Kanstul 33-T BBb tuba, built 2011
Fender Precision Bass Guitar, built ?
Mouthpiece data provided on request.

Offline SVPete

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Re: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2022, 06:22:44 PM »
This article details a couple of EV owners' IRL experiences attempting longish road trips, https://cowboystatedaily.com/2022/10/13/wyoming-ev-road-trip-15-hours-from-cheyenne-to-casper/ .
Anti-Covid-Vaxxer pig crap claim/prediction, Doctor: Heart Failure from mRNA Jabs "Will Kill Most People" | Principia Scientific Intl. ; Dr. Geert Vanden Bossche Warns COVID-19 Jab Injuries and Deaths Will Soon "Collapse Our Health System" (VIDEO) ; Fully Vaxxed May 2021; Since that time I've done 10 5Ks, 1 8K, 8 10Ks, and 4 half marathons

Offline Eupher

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Re: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2022, 08:44:03 PM »
This article details a couple of EV owners' IRL experiences attempting longish road trips, https://cowboystatedaily.com/2022/10/13/wyoming-ev-road-trip-15-hours-from-cheyenne-to-casper/ .

I'm not surprised at any of that. EVs are not happening. Not now, and maybe not ever.

Poor bastard. 15 hours to drive 178 miles. It's criminal.  :censored:
Adams E2 Euphonium, built in 2017
Boosey & Co. Imperial Euphonium, built in 1941
Edwards B454 bass trombone, built 2012
Bach Stradivarius 42OG tenor trombone, built 1992
Kanstul 33-T BBb tuba, built 2011
Fender Precision Bass Guitar, built ?
Mouthpiece data provided on request.

Offline Drafe Hoblin

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Re: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2022, 09:14:44 PM »
I'm not surprised at any of that. EVs are not happening. Not now, and maybe not ever.

Poor bastard. 15 hours to drive 178 miles. It's criminal.  :censored:


Zero sympathy for the moron.

Watch more television.

Offline DefiantSix

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Re: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2022, 10:05:24 PM »


Zero sympathy for the moron.

Any more than I might sympathize with the moron who camped outside the crApple store for THEIR overpriced toys...
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Offline SVPete

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Re: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« Reply #10 on: October 19, 2022, 09:51:50 AM »
EVs are adequate as commutermobiles (though they don't like very hot and very cold weather, and the battery will have to be replaced - = 1000s of $$ - in around 10 years). 10 years ago the Nissan Leaf did not have a range adequate for my daily commute of that time (46-47 miles round trip). But who has the $$ to have a PC commutermobile and another car suited for trips longer than 100-150 miles each way?
Anti-Covid-Vaxxer pig crap claim/prediction, Doctor: Heart Failure from mRNA Jabs "Will Kill Most People" | Principia Scientific Intl. ; Dr. Geert Vanden Bossche Warns COVID-19 Jab Injuries and Deaths Will Soon "Collapse Our Health System" (VIDEO) ; Fully Vaxxed May 2021; Since that time I've done 10 5Ks, 1 8K, 8 10Ks, and 4 half marathons

Offline Drafe Hoblin

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Re: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2022, 02:18:24 PM »
I'm sensing a smattering of motels and other locations that won't allow EV's to park next to the building because of the potential of batteries catching-fire.

That's what sent that ship full of luxury-cars to the bottom off the Azores last year.  One the lithium-batteries caught fire.

Here in Florida there was a weak sort-of park it in the driveway campaign after the hurricane, when several incidents of 'flood-salvaged' EV-batteries were spontaneously consumed in smoke.  -Takes an entire crew of guys to snuff it out.

Yeah, we have no business jamming the American Public with this turkey right now.
Watch more television.

Offline Drafe Hoblin

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Re: Energy analyst says EV charging more expensive than gas
« Reply #12 on: October 19, 2022, 02:23:06 PM »
Any more than I might sympathize with the moron who camped outside the crApple store for THEIR overpriced toys...


Reminds me of a quote from Jim Rome...  " Dude.  Get a girlfriend. "
Watch more television.