http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6327337Oh my.
The Idiot Briggs primitive, the greedly landlordess up there in Michigan:
IdaBriggs (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 12:51 PM
Original message
I don't want INSURANCE - I want HEALTH CARE.
If my kids are sick, I want to take them to the doctor without checking the family budget for co-pays, deductibles, and prescription coverage first.
When my baby cuts her finger, I don't want to agonize over whether or not she needs stitches - I want someone trained in emergency trauma situations to FIX IT NOW.
If my mother is having chest pains, I want her to get in the ambulance without worrying about whether or not it is "life threatening" as opposed to having her die in the car because she was afraid of the potential cost.
If I find a lump somewhere, I don't want to negotiate whether or not it is "immediately life threatening"; I want tests and any required surgery scheduled immediately, and then I don't want to worry about how much the follow-up meds are going to cost or how I can afford them.
Kindly note in each of the above examples, I am NOT discussing "insurance". I am talking HEALTH CARE.
And *THAT* is what I want the folks who are spending my money in Washington to do -- make sure my ACCESS TO HEALTH CARE isn't dependent on were we work, whether we are offered affordable benefits, or even if we have 'pre-existing conditions.'
I don't want INSURANCE. I want HEALTH CARE. And I want EVERYONE ELSE to have it, too.
Any questions?
Yeah, lots of questions, but whatever.
stray cat (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 12:52 PM
Response to Original message
1. and what have your demands gotten you thus far?
Laelth (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
2. Same here. Demand single payer now.
And franksolich demands that Pa Kettle in the White House fulfill his campaign promises--love and joy and peace and goodwill all over the world, free food, free housing, free medical care, for all.
Oregone (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 12:54 PM
Response to Original message
3. How about insurance that pays for your health care? That work?
LisaM (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. No, you're wrong and Ida is right.
While there are some things we can control about our health, we can't control them all. We can't control if we were born into poverty, raised in an environment with heavy smokers, or with a predisposition to diabetes. We can't control if we are female and need a mammogram once a year or not. These are not factors you "insure". You insure your choice to buy and drive a vehicle, or to own valuable property, and so on.
I don't think our health should be victim to the crap shoot that is the insurance industry.
The Maple Leaf primitive:
Oregone (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. No. Im right
I have insurance. It pays for my care. Its that simple.
Its also single-payer public insurance.
Don't throw out the baby with the bathwater. Socializing all healthcare may be a noble goal, but meeting in the middle for Medicare for All in the meantime isn't a bad pathway there.
Kansas Wyatt (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. Whatever it takes to kick Death Merchants to the curb.
Insurance Industry = Death Merchants
Death Merchants HARM & HINDER Health Care. Insurance Companies are only parasites sucking the life out of people, and nothing more. That is the point.
LisaM (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. So you support the model of a company refusing to cover someone if they have a preexisting condition that is outside of her or his own control? Like the woman Howard Dean references who was dropped by her carrier because she was diabetic?
That's what insurance does. It minimizes risk. The insurance companies make money off denying claims, not paying them.
They have not proved themselves the least bit worthy of our money. They don't choose to keep us healthy and solvent.
I haven't had a mammogram in 10 years. Why? The hurdles. I have to go to a doctor first (I don't have a regular doctor) and pay money for that appointment just to get scheduled for a mammogram. That's BS. It involves multiple appointments, multiple copays, and no quick results. I'll have to go to two or three different places. You like that model? Good for you but I think it sucks.
What? A mammogram's supposed to be as easy to get as an abortion?
The Maple Leaf primitive again:
Oregone (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 01:30 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. I support the model where insurance companies make no money at all
And preferably, there is but a single company in any region covering basic health needs.
In such a scenario, there is no motivation to deny claims. They are motivated to keep everyone healthy, as to lower overall long-term costs.
The wallpaper primitive, who got into trouble and lost his job because he posted subliminal Hate messages in films for clients:
walldude (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #6
18. Sorry, but It's not that simple. Your insurance company is in business for one thing only. Profit. The less they give you the more they pocket. Many people out there at this very moment are fighting for their lives to get their insurance company to pay for needed care which was denied to them for the purpose of filling the coffers of CEO's and stock holders. Until the profit is removed from the health care system we will continue in this quagmire.
The Maple Leaf primitive yet again:
Oregone (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 06:52 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. No, my insurance provider exists to take care of the entire community
Single Payer Insurance exists to benefit a society, no drain it.
IdaBriggs (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Do I have to spend more than two seconds dealing with it before/after any doctor visit? If the answer is "yes", then NO, it doesn't work.
When I or a loved is sick, I do NOT want to spend hours on the phone negotiating with anyone about how much of a bill is going to be covered, whether a procedure is going to be covered, whether someone I've never met/who has never met me thinks it is necessary, or any of half a dozen other ridiculous paper pushing piles of crap.
I should not have to have a medical degree so I can discuss the correct terminology of a test, whether it was "coded" correctly, or whether I exercised good judgment by taking my son to the emergency room because I thought he had swallowed something / was "wheezing" when he breathed, only to find out his throat was swollen because of a previously unnoticed virus -- that will be $300 for the emergency room visit, $115 for the x-ray, $475 for the emergency room physician -- all billed by different departments/companies even though all of the treatment took place in the same hospital. At no point in time does anyone say, "if I talk to you, that will be $XXX" and even if they did, I wouldn't care -- if the doctor says its necessary, I believe him/her.
The Maple Leaf primitive yaps on:
Oregone (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. I don't
Ive never dealt with my insurance at all. Ive never been on the phone with them, aside from paying my premium. Everything is pre-approved.
Single-payer insurance is wonderful. Its something to strive for. Don't hate all insurance.
Finally, the Idiot Briggs primitive gets it:
IdaBriggs (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. I keep forgetting you are Canadian!
loudsue (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 01:58 PM
Response to Original message
15. We need that on every bumper sticker in the country.
I DON'T NEED INSURANCE!!! I NEED HEALTH CARE!!!!
I NEED DRUGS! PHARMACEUTICALS! CONTROLLED SUBSTANCES! I NEED DRUGS!
Scout (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
16. thank you
we don't need health INSURANCE, we need health CARE.
cut out the middleman insurance industry, and pay the hospitals and doctors directly.
IdaBriggs (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #16
21. It seems pretty simple to me, but apparently killing people by denying access is more profitable.
Up goes the white flag:
sinkingfeeling (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 02:20 PM
Response to Original message
17. After 40 years and now this, it ain't gonna happen in this country. This was our last best shot at taking a step in the right direction. Without a public option, it'll be business as usual.
Man, that white flag looks purty, flippin' and flappin' in the wind like that.
IdaBriggs (1000+ posts) Mon Aug-17-09 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. Your name says how I feel about this "reform" situation -- it gives me a TERRIBLE sinking feeling -- as if we are all so completely screwed, it isn't even funny.
pampango (1000+ posts) Tue Aug-18-09 11:57 AM
Response to Original message
23. Most of us would be happy with the Canadian single-payer insurance system.
Canadian doctors don't work for the government and their hospitals are, like in the US, a mixture of nonprofit and for-profit.
I think the British system of government actually running the health care system is better than the Canadian system, but not by much.
intheflow (1000+ posts) Tue Aug-18-09 12:23 PM
Response to Original message
24. Thank you!
That's exactly how I feel on the subject. **** insurance. We need healthcare that's not dependent on being able to pay premiums so that we can be denied coverage when we need treatment.
Or denied when the primitives want drugs for recreational purposes.
