What exactly is wrong with having Socialized Medicine?

[Carl]

The obsession continues.

link

Hepburn  (1000+ posts)       Mon Jan-28-08 02:36 PM
Original message
What exactly is wrong with having Socialized Medicine?
   Why are people opposed to this? Is it brain washing by the insurance corporations, a fear of the word "socialized", or both?

From what I have seen ~~ particularly referencing MM's movie SICKO ~~ I think this is a great idea. In fact, I have always favored getting rid of the private medical insurers and having government provided health care that just took care of whatever needed to be taken care of. This would include dental problems, psychological counseling, etc.

I truthfully believe that a healthy society can only benefit our nation. So why in the hell would anyone be against this. The only answer I can find is there has been total brainwashing by the bastard insurance companies.

Here is a great example of this foolish kind of thinking: I have a friend who many, many years ago was in the US Navy and for many, many years thereafter carried private medical insurance until I showed him the benefits he was entitled to through the VA. Now, for about 8 years, he has used the VA facilities in West Los Angeles. He has received GREAT treatment and I should note he has had some major medical problems, including a leg that was broken in an accident in four places, required an open reduction and the use of a titanium rod. Never has had a problem with this. When I noted to this Reagan Republican pal of mine that the VA was basically "socialized medicine," he came un-****ing glued and literally screamed at me that he had "earned" the right to use the VA facilities by serving his country. But, no "freeloader" should have access to things they had not earned. Sheesh!

So why isn't it just because of a right as a human being and the humanity with which others should be treated doesn't everyone have a right to health care? Isn't this "earned" and "paid for" by being a living breathing person? Why do some feel that there is a need to "earn" or "pay for" this and it is OK if someone is unable to pay the necessary $$$, to allow him or her to suffer or die?

What's the difference with public schools, freeways, etc? Why to the neocons is is OK to provide those things with equal access to all...but health insurance is so ****ing different? The disabled, the poor, etc., can use a public school or freeway without someone noting that it is some form of "socialization" for which they are NOT paying....but the right to be free of pain and healthy is a lesser priority?

I just do not get it. <sigh>

Nothing really surprising,of course as always no mention of malpractice litigation or how that affects the costs of healthcare.

One post that was pretty good.

Sadie4629 (655 posts)        Mon Jan-28-08 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #64
77. They are out there
   I used to post on the MSNBC Boards. The people there represented a pretty good cross-section. The discussions got heated at times, but were overall pretty good. Haven't found a place since that has that kind of representation of political opinions.

I do talk to a lot of people, and I know what their arguments are. (And for what it's worth, I think there are valid considerations that will have to be dealt with before universal healthcare is implemented here.)

1. Cost. People are very concerned that their taxes will increase phenomenally. Social Security has ended up taking a lot larger chunk of our paychecks than people in the '30's and '40's anticipated. Government programs do tend to do that. Whatever they tell you it will cost, bet it will cost more eventually.

2. Long waits for necessary medical procedures. Lots of people from Canada come here for procedures, if they can afford to. There is a reason. (And wasn't there a set of Canadian quadruplets that was born in this country, specifically because Canada didn't have the facilities? I'm a bit fuzzy on the details.)

3. Healthcare rationing. There was an article posted on here within the last day or so saying that in Great Britain they are recommending that the elderly and ailing be allowed to die.

4. Government inefficiency/fraud. Not saying that doesn't happen in our present system, but Medicare fraud is a HUGE problem. Expect it to increase when everyone is covered.

Personally, I don't know enough about the subject to counter these arguments; I just know that the Republican/conservatives I know are very concerned about these issues, and unless we can assure them that we will be prepared to deal with them, you're not going to get a lot of converts.

As far as "freaking out," I think both sides are guilty of that. How many posts appear on DU on a daily basis saying "All Republicans are NAZIS!!!!!!!!!!!" "I HATE Repugnicons!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" "I have cut myself off from my right-wing lunatic Repuke family!"

Unfortunately, civility (on both sides) went the way of the dinosaur about the time Clinton was impeached.

Surprise,that one is being completely ignored.

Then this one really takes the cake.

pitohui  (1000+ posts)        Mon Jan-28-08 07:29 PM
Response to Original message
82. a black man might get good medical care (yes, sorry to say people really think like this)
   i've thought about it a long time, and i have to conclude that, at the end of the day, the reason america is so opposed to things like fair wages, medical care, these days even funding for the public schools is because the average person is so damn racist

look at all the fools who voted reagan/bush and picked their own pockets, they'd rather be bankrupt than see a black man have an equal chance

i'm not kidding, the reagan voters and the david duke voters were the same people in louisiana anyway

get somebody one on one, and do you ever hear that person say that health care should NOT be socialized and the insurance industries taken out of the business of interfering with health care? not too damn often, but get the fools all in a room together and they start egging on each other's stupidity

50% of the people have IQs of 100 or less, this is a basic problem we have to contend with, not just in getting fair health care but on all the progressive issues, being progressive usually requires more brains than average and being able to think things thru at least semi-independently (because the media by definition is going to be for the status quo not the progressive) but the majority of people have fewer brains than average or are just average and are not capable of much in the way of independent thought

no clue what to do about this except education, which takes too long to work, people are sick, hurting, and dying right now

 

[Chris_]

1. Cost. People are very concerned that their taxes will increase phenomenally. Social Security has ended up taking a lot larger chunk of our paychecks than people in the '30's and '40's anticipated. Government programs do tend to do that. Whatever they tell you it will cost, bet it will cost more eventually.

2. Long waits for necessary medical procedures. Lots of people from Canada come here for procedures, if they can afford to. There is a reason. (And wasn't there a set of Canadian quadruplets that was born in this country, specifically because Canada didn't have the facilities? I'm a bit fuzzy on the details.)

3. Healthcare rationing. There was an article posted on here within the last day or so saying that in Great Britain they are recommending that the elderly and ailing be allowed to die.

Common sense!  NOOOOOO!!!!

Why do you think gas costs $8-9 a gallon in the UK?  It's all taxes. 

Time for a little bouncy.  If you haven't noticed, bad eyes run in my family.  My grandmother has lived in the same small northeast English town her entire life and developed cataracts a few years ago.  After being placed on a 12-month waiting list, she was allowed to have surgery to have ONE of them removed.  After that surgery was done, she was placed on another waiting list for 9 months to have the other one removed. 

In comparison, my problems were treated and (I hope) resolved within three months.

[Mary Ann]

1. Cost. People are very concerned that their taxes will increase phenomenally. Social Security has ended up taking a lot larger chunk of our paychecks than people in the '30's and '40's anticipated. Government programs do tend to do that. Whatever they tell you it will cost, bet it will cost more eventually.

2. Long waits for necessary medical procedures. Lots of people from Canada come here for procedures, if they can afford to. There is a reason. (And wasn't there a set of Canadian quadruplets that was born in this country, specifically because Canada didn't have the facilities? I'm a bit fuzzy on the details.)

3. Healthcare rationing. There was an article posted on here within the last day or so saying that in Great Britain they are recommending that the elderly and ailing be allowed to die.

Common sense!  NOOOOOO!!!!

Why do you think gas costs $8-9 a gallon in the UK?  It's all taxes. 

Time for a little bouncy.  If you haven't noticed, bad eyes run in my family.  My grandmother has lived in the same small northeast English town her entire life and developed cataracts a few years ago.  After being placed on a 12-month waiting list, she was allowed to have surgery to have ONE of them removed.  After that surgery was done, she was placed on another waiting list for 9 months to have the other one removed. 

In comparison, my problems were treated and (I hope) resolved within three months.

'Nother Bouncy: Guy who lived in France was having some back problems. Verrrrrrry painful. He was scheduled for an MRI MONTHS down the road. He had friends in the US who persuaded him to come here. Within a matter of days after arriving, he had not only had the diagnostic tests but also the surgery to fix his problem. And when the hospital found out he was paying cash for the procedure they gave him a huge discount.