primitive can't get driver's license renewed

[franksolich]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=250x3712

Oh dear.

lunamagica (48 posts)     Fri Jul-24-09 04:46 PM
Original message
 
Being disabled and driving

I can't walk at all. in 2001 I received my driver's license. I then drove with a perfect record for all my driving history. Not even a parking ticket.

Then I had to renew.

Here's a letter I wrote about what happened then:

Two years ago I went to renew my driver's license. I have a completely, totally spotless driving record. When I got there, a DMV officer started asking me what medications I took, and asked me to explain my disability. She did it in an extremely rude manner, yelling at me from across the room. I was really taken aback, and started answering her about the disability, but she didn't understand, so she then told me to write it all down on a piece of paper, and demanded that I take my driving test again. I refused to write anything down, felt pretty shaken up and decided to leave.

I went to another office where they told me I had to take the driving test. I think the woman at the previous office wrote it down on the computer as I had renewed my license before with no problem. I didn't take the test as I felt it was wrong to force people with a spotless record to take the test again

The following day I emailed several people about what had happened. The supervisor of the office I went called me, and I thought she'd set things right, but soon in the call I could see she only wanted to protect the employee. She told me that asking me to write my disability down was a "kind gesture" from the clerk, as "she didn't want to embarrass me", and then she had the gall to ask me if I had ever taken the driving test, as if she didn't know the answer to that. I felt she just wanted to confuse me.

My life has really deteriorated since my license expired. So I bit the bullet and went again to try to renew.

Someone (a supervisor, I think) reviewed the whole matter and told me that the problem was that no one had made a note that I was in a wheelchair. She told me to take the test so they could write the note. I've used a wheelchair since I was ten yrs old.

Then I went for my vision test. I couldn't reach the machine, so they looked around and in a corner there was an old, different looking machine and they had me take the test there. With my glasses on, I could see the letters clearly, but they told me I was "getting too many of them wrong". I couldn't understand what happened, and how could I be getting them wrong when I could see them just fine. I failed the test, and they gave me a form for the Dr. to fill. I went, I have the form saying that my corrected vision is 20/20. The Dr. doesn't understand how I failed the test. One of the questions on the form is "On the basis of your clinical observation, visual or otherwise, do you recommend applicant be required to pass a driving test? The Dr's reply is "NO".

So I wonder why if THEY made a mistake no noting I was in a wheelchair, why am *I* being penalized? How can that be right? Why isn't my driving record enough evidence that I'm a safe driver, who passed the driving test and was issued a safe driver's license by the state? I know people who have tickets, collisions, who renew without being asked to take the test again.

On page ten of "The Official Florida Driver's handbook, it says that driver's who have a conviction -free record for the past three years, and no suspensions or revocations for the past seven years will be issued a "safe driver" license. I belong in that group. I don't think it's fair that I'm being singled out just by perception, when the reality, the facts, and the record are in my favor. That's just wrong. Please help.

---------------------------

I sent this email to a state representative. (I live in FL). An assistant to the representavive spoke to a "liason" (sorry, I don't really know what that means) of the DMV and she told him I HAD to take the test. Couldn't give her a reason why. Said it was all up the discretion of the examiner.

Now, you might say, just take the test. The truth is that I'm terrified to. After all this hassle I feel they want to take my license away. The truth is that the tought of having this person (the examiner) next to me has me shaking. Sometimes I just want to forget the whole thing, but my life without my license has deteriorated. Im now a shut-in, getting more depressed anyway.

I posted this to get your opinions. Opinions from people who live life with a POV similar to mine. I'm I wrong here?

What can I do?

First up, the mad & dumb primitive, who gives the expected answer:

MADem  (1000+ posts)      Fri Jul-24-09 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
 
1. Lawyer up and sue the ****ers. If you can afford it. If not, maybe you can get someone to pro-bono you. I think you've been discriminated against.

lunamagica (48 posts)     Fri Jul-24-09 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #1
 
3. I can't afford a lawyer. My mother thinks I should just go and take the test on Monday. But I tell her that it's completely up to them to fail me or pass me. My word against the examiner. ( and they must be hating me because they got a call from the government)

I really don't think that it's in my best interest to take the test.

But the mad & dumb primitive insists:

MADem  (1000+ posts)      Fri Jul-24-09 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #3
 
6. Call your bar association, see if you can get some pro bono (free) help.

I think you have an important case, myself.

lunamagica (48 posts)     Fri Jul-24-09 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #6
 
8. I think I have a strong case too. But I wanted some feed back.

MADem  (1000+ posts)      Fri Jul-24-09 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #8

11. I think the DMV crapped all over the ADA in their dealings with you.

And you've memorialized those interactions in your correspondence with lawmakers.

I think you can eat their lunch!

customerserviceguy  (1000+ posts)      Fri Jul-24-09 05:01 PM
Response to Original message
 
5. Part of the problem is where you live

I see a lot of older folks around me who probably shouldn't be driving, and let's face it, when they get even older, they move to Florida. Your DMV is geared to trying to get as many people de-licensed as possible for an inability to drive. It's in their DNA.

It's like when I had to call the Support Enforcement Office back in WA state. The vast majority of men they deal with are deadbeat dads, so when I called them up (as a title officer) to find out the amount of a debt on a child support lien, they would be very snotty, almost abusive, to me. I soon learned to have a female co-worker make the calls, and she was dealt with politely.

Take the test, hold your head up high, and pass it, knowing that you'll have less hassle from people who drive 15 MPH in a 50 MPH zone with the left turn signal on to deal with.

Coyote_Bandit  (1000+ posts)        Fri Jul-24-09 05:13 PM
Response to Original message
 
9. I am vision impaired when my driver's license comes up for renewal I am required to re-take the vision test - as is everyone in the state regardless of age or disability. I dread it. It has been over a decade since I have had either a violation of any kind or an accident of any kind (including not at fault accidents).

If your license expired a couple of years ago I suspect you no longer fall under the provisions of page ten which you cite. Also, it is unclear whether those safe drivers are automatically exempted from the possibility of being re-tested.

The way I see it you've got two choices. You can take the test and resolve the matter fairly quickly. Or you can contact a disability advocacy group and see if they are willing to undertake your representation and allege some discriminatory practice that has harmed you. They may be willing to fight for you against any discriminatory policies and practices - but they will want you to remain unable to secure that license until the litigation is resolved. Otherwise the facts that gave rise to the litigation are moot. You could expect this to drag on for awhile.

I know it is not what you want to hear but I'd recommend that you go and take that test so you can start to reclaim your life. I'd also recommend that you check around in advance with different DMV offices to see which one is most experienced and best equipped to test folks with your particular handicap (yes they shoud all be ADA compliant but apparently they are not).

There is always some bastard bully around trying to intimidate and dominate folks. You know from experience that you are a good driver. This is a perfect opportunity for you to go and prove your ability to overcome unfair circumstances. You'll feel better about yourself knowing you didn't let the bastards get you down. And it will immediately enable you to begin to reclaim your life.

lunamagica (48 posts)     Fri Jul-24-09 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #9
 
12. I'm sorry renewing is such a hassle for you.
 
They have never, not one mentioned the provision on page ten not applying anymore. In fact, when I showed it to the examiner, her reply was, "but you can't walk. You have to take the test again because you can't walk"

Sure I can go to take the test. But should I trust a bully to be fair? That's my biigest issue. They haven't been fair so far. Why would I trust them to be fair with the driving test when they haven't shown any fairness so far?

Odin2005  (1000+ posts)        Sun Jul-26-09 03:12 PM
Response to Original message
 
20. I passed the written test 100%, I just never passed behind-the-wheel because of my sensory... and motor issues and executive system dysfunction related to my Asperger's. Simply too much sensory information and things to do in a short amount of time, and I simply cannot multi-task.

Well, if the Odin primitive can't handle "too much sensory information" and can't "multi-task," the roads are safer without the Odin primitive driving around.

[NHSparky]

And these idiots think government run healthcare is the solution.

Oh, the sweet taste of irony.

[thundley4]

lunamagica:
I posted this to get your opinions. Opinions from people who live life with a POV similar to mine. I'm I wrong here?

What can I do?

Similar POV = Nucking Futs.

[tuolumnejim]

And these idiots think government run healthcare is the solution.

Oh, the sweet taste of irony.

Hi five to you for that one. 

[Ralph Wiggum]

MADem  (1000+ posts)      Fri Jul-24-09 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
 
1. Lawyer up and sue the ****ers.

And the DUmmies wonder why costs in this country skyrocket.

[NHSparky]

And the DUmmies wonder why costs in this country skyrocket.

More importantly, people in MA wonder why we in NH consider them shitty drivers.

[AllosaursRus]

I'll lay odds the examiner figured this asshat is a threat to community. All she/he/it has to do is take a frikkin' drive test. If it's making this kind of noise, I'll bet it can't pass it and the examiner is spot on!

It wanted a free pass! When the examiner figured it out, now it's time to sue!!!

[Karin]

I don't think it's fair that I'm being singled out...... That's just wrong. Please help.
I sent this email to a state representative.

All you need in a nutshell.  The dependence, the whining, the expectation that gov't will help.  Yet, they never learn.   

[Carl]

I suspect that there are many details being left out of the story.

[DumbAss Tanker]

Indeed, Carl.  It sounds like the DUmmy is admitting to a two-year lapse in there, which kind of shoots its whole 'Continuously-licensed' argument in the ass.  I'm not sure anyone that helpless (And I refer only to mentality, not physical disability) should be driving on the same roads with non-suicidal people anyway.

[GOBUCKS]

DMV people most definitely do not want to generate any extra work for themselves unless absolutely necessary.
When I relocated years ago, after decades of driving without a moving violation, the law required that I be retested.
The DMV folks definitely didn't have their hearts in it.
The lady pointed to the eye chart on the wall, and sort of mumbled, "Can you read the fourth line?"
I said, "Yes." With that one-word answer, I had passed both the vision test and the hearing test.
The driving test was equally perfunctory, mainly a discussion of college football.

If the the DMV folks, whose sloth is the stuff of legends, are forcing the DUmmy to do something extra, there's for
sure a red flag in there that we don't know about.l

[jukin]

My money says, clever mole demonstrating how obumlecare will work.

[PatriotGame]

lunamagica (48 posts)     Fri Jul-24-09 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #1
 
3. I can't afford a lawyer. My mother thinks I should just go and take the test on Monday. But I tell her that it's completely up to them to fail me or pass me. My word against the examiner. ( and they must be hating me because they got a call from the government)

I really don't think that it's in my best interest to take the test.

So....last week I was looking over the VRWC's balance sheet and I see several invoices for payments to an "entity" titled FLDMV. There was a code attached to the entries but I cannot reveal it here since most of those codes are for black-Ops.

This is just a reminder that paying your VRWC dues in a timely fasion will guarantee a steady stream of comedy such as we have from lunatic lunamagica.

[AprilRazz]

When DH let his CT license lapse (CT requires all persons to renew in person) due to military service in CA he went to the MVA in Maryland where we were stationed at the time. Even though it had only lapsed by a month he still had to take the written and road test again.

All the DUmmy had problems with (if said primitive is indeed telling the truth) is a rude counter person and a supervisor that may have been guilty of a HIPPA violation by asking the primitive to yell his diagnosis from across the room. And that is even doubtful.

[Chris]

When DH let his CT license lapse (CT requires all persons to renew in person) due to military service in CA he went to the MVA in Maryland where we were stationed at the time. Even though it had only lapsed by a month he still had to take the written and road test again.

Wow.  I let my TN license lapse after I moved to another state.  I moved back and only had to pay a $25 reinstatement fee.

You have to love life in the socialist utopia of the Northeast.  They make it so easy for each other.

[AprilRazz]

Wow.  I let my TN license lapse after I moved to another state.  I moved back and only had to pay a $25 reinstatement fee.

You have to love life in the socialist utopia of the Northeast.  They make it so easy for each other.

At least MD will work with you if your license expires and you can't get back to renew it due to orders. Mine did 2 years ago and they sent me one valid without photo till I could get back up to get a new photo free of charge. No such thing with CT.

[docstew]

That's the beauty of living in a courtesy state.  FL is one, they don't require renewal of DL's until your completely out of the military.  I got pulled over in GA (Tift County Sherriff) in 2003 driving north from FL with my FL license that expired in 2001.  I hand him my license and mil ID, he hands me the mil ID back, says "I don't need that", asks me why I didn't renew my DL while I was in FL.  I told him I didn't have to, and he proceeds to write me a ticket, saying "Well, it's expired, and you have just left the state of FL".

I found the appropriate statute online, emailed it to the county atty, he dismissed the ticket. 

Oh yeah, I paid the speeding ticket, I don't want my DL suspended twice for failure to pay GA speeding tickets.

[BadCat]

So let me get this straight...the DUmmies don't like DMV, but that is what they want for health care?

[kenth]

There has to be extenuating circumstances not being told. One, because this is a DUmmie. Two, because couldn't he/she have just renewed their license by mail, if in fact they did not have any traffic violations of any sort in the past?

[diesel driver]

In VA, if your license expires, you have to show your birth certificate and/or another form of ID, along with a couple of utility bills to prove residency.

AND, EVERYBODY takes the driver's test over if your license expires, otherwise, just the vision test.

This DUmbass just wants a "pitty party"....

[RobJohnson]

lunamagica (48 posts)     Fri Jul-24-09 04:46 PM
Original message
 
Being disabled and driving

I can't walk at all. in 2001 I received my driver's license. I then drove with a perfect record for all my driving history. Not even a parking ticket.

Then I had to renew.

Here's a letter I wrote about what happened then:

Two years ago I went to renew my driver's license. I have a completely, totally spotless driving record. When I got there, a DMV officer started asking me what medications I took, and asked me to explain my disability. She did it in an extremely rude manner, yelling at me from across the room. I was really taken aback, and started answering her about the disability, but she didn't understand, so she then told me to write it all down on a piece of paper, and demanded that I take my driving test again. I refused to write anything down, felt pretty shaken up and decided to leave.

I went to another office where they told me I had to take the driving test. I think the woman at the previous office wrote it down on the computer as I had renewed my license before with no problem. I didn't take the test as I felt it was wrong to force people with a spotless record to take the test again

Sounds like he refused to cooperate with the folks at the DMV that were just trying to help the guy. Very often DUmmies think someone is "out to get them" when in fact, they are just being DUmmies.

[Wineslob]

When I got there, a DMV officer started asking me what medications I took, and asked me to explain my disability. She did it in an extremely rude manner, yelling at me from across the room. I was really taken aback, and started answering her about the disability, but she didn't understand, so she then told me to write it all down on a piece of paper, and demanded that I take my driving test again

Complete and utter 


No bongs.

[vesta111]

Complete and utter 


No bongs.

Times have changed slowly but they do march on.

I kept meeting all these temp workers that were suppose to be documented that had those international drivers licences, they were much like state licenses , picture information as to appearance etc.  These licenses allowed drivers to drive in foreign country's.

This was a brilliant con carried out in the basements of Embassy's in NY. For a fee, birth certificates, drivers licences and even green cards were being printed and sold for big bucks.

All went well for YEARS until a town clerk in a Yankee  town of 5,000 had a person walk in to register their car.   The ID given was the international drivers licence.

The clerk gave some excuse to stop the transaction to go into another room to call the police,

This clerk had an international license and it in no way resembled what she was given,
For one thing her license was on paper not anything like state licenses.

This became a major heads up for all police all over the country that had no idea what a valid international looked like.

Result was thousands on the east coast headed for Richmond VA where there were friendlies in place that for $100 each would get anyone a license.  This was semi-shut down in the late 1990's.

 For those that bought their Va. license and transferred it to other states, they have now renewed their licenses with no problem.  still illegal in the country but legal to drive our roads, drive cars and 18 wheelers, big gas trucks, -----good grief some of them cannot speak English.