The Conservative Cave
Interests => Religious Discussions => Topic started by: The Night Owl on April 13, 2008, 07:31:03 AM
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I'm interested in reading opinions on the practice of speaking in tongues. Is the practice of speaking in tongues actual evidence of humans communing with God or is it just mumbo jumbo?
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I'm interested in reading opinions on the practice of speaking in tongues. Is the practice of speaking in tongues actual evidence of humans communing with God or is it just mumbo jumbo?
Speaking in tongues if considered a gift from God and must be verified by another person. It is not mumbo jumbo, like all gifts given to man by God it is real.
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Speaking in tongues if considered a gift from God and must be verified by another person. It is not mumbo jumbo, like all gifts given to man by God it is real.
Excuse my ignorance, but... how does one go about verifying the act of speaking in tongues?
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Speaking in tongues if considered a gift from God and must be verified by another person. It is not mumbo jumbo, like all gifts given to man by God it is real.
Excuse my ignorance, but... how does one go about verifying the act of speaking in tongues?
Peer review?
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What purpose would it serve?....The disciples were given the gift upon the great commission..in order to speak the language of the people they were sent to by God.....frankly I reject this as a "spiritual gift"...unless that person in actually speaking a language [unknown to them] that is being used by the people that are are witnessing to.
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Color me cynical but I can't help but view this thread suspiciously as yet another attempt demonstrate a wedge between religion--with particular emphasis on Christianity--and *ahem* science.
Yet the Christian role in science is more firmly established than global warming or whether or not eggs are good for you.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_thinkers_in_science
As concerns "speaking in tongues"?
bleh
Benny Hinn gives me the runs.
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I'm interested in reading opinions on the practice of speaking in tongues. Is the practice of speaking in tongues actual evidence of humans communing with God or is it just mumbo jumbo?
I, personally, don't go for the speaking in tongues. I've heard it happen once. And it sounded like this. "nanananananana".
So let's question your religion. Why is it latest studies show that the ocean water is not getting warmer?
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=88520025
I chose a liberal, pro Global Warming point of view. They try to spin it, but really can't. Maybe it's 20% Global Warming and the other 80% is staying the same. Maybe there haven't been enough carbon credits (offerings) purchased to appease hot spaghetti monster. Care to explain?
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I'll go with mumbo jumbo.
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I'll go with mumbo jumbo.
I think that some of it is......however, before proceeding, one must consider WHO initiated this thread, and as this sorry excuse for an individual would like nothing better than to start a discussion that in some manner trivialized Christianity, or organized religion in general, one should couch ones comments with this in mind.
That said, and with the caveat that I'm no biblical scholar, I believe that the Catholic church has a long history of documenting cases where individuals, seemingly possessed by the Holy Spirit, or something more ominous, have been witnessed speaking in languages that it has been thoroughly documented that the person has never been exposed to in any manner......"dead" languages such as Aramaic, Latin, and ancient Greek.
Certainly "food for thought"....
doc
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I'll go with mumbo jumbo.
I think that some of it is......however, before proceeding, one must consider WHO initiated this thread, and as this sorry excuse for an individual would like nothing better than to start a discussion that in some manner trivialized Christianity, or organized religion in general, one should couch ones comments with this in mind.
That said, and with the caveat that I'm no biblical scholar, I believe that the Catholic church has a long history of documenting cases where individuals, seemingly possessed by the Holy Spirit, or something more ominous, have been witnessed speaking in languages that it has been thoroughly documented that the person has never been exposed to in any manner......"dead" languages such as Aramaic, Latin, and ancient Greek.
Certainly "food for thought"....
doc
The Holy Spirit can give you the ability to do anything it sees fit. I just don't go for the guy standing next to me going nananananana, then asking for your checkbook.
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^When I was but a wee lad, I once dated a girl that was a member of a "Holiness" church, and one Sunday, she invited me to attend with her. My parents had mentioned from time to time these churches, and referred to them as "Holy Rollers", and until that Sunday, I had no idea what that expression referred to. Needless to say, I learned.....and during that service there was some "speaking in tongues" allegedly going on....however, since I was intentionally seated in the back of the congregation, I can't confirm or deny what was happening......no one, however, asked for my checkbook....
doc
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Color me cynical but I can't help but view this thread suspiciously as yet another attempt demonstrate a wedge between religion--with particular emphasis on Christianity--and *ahem* science.
Yet the Christian role in science is more firmly established than global warming or whether or not eggs are good for you.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_thinkers_in_science
I'm not the type of person who considers science and faith to be in conflict. Nor am I the type of person who considers believers to be less informed or less intelligent than nonbelievers. That some scientists rely on faith to explain that which science cannot explain does not bother me in the least.
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That some scientists rely on faith to explain that which science cannot explain does not bother me in the least.
This is manifestly evident in your posting history........
doc
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^When I was but a wee lad, I once dated a girl that was a member of a "Holiness" church, and one Sunday, she invited me to attend with her. My parents had mentioned from time to time these churches, and referred to them as "Holy Rollers", and until that Sunday, I had no idea what that expression referred to. Needless to say, I learned.....and during that service there was some "speaking in tongues" allegedly going on....however, since I was intentionally seated in the back of the congregation, I can't confirm or deny what was happening......no one, however, asked for my checkbook....
doc
A company I used to work with was owned by 2, I consider, scammers who did financial advising by command of the Lord. If you aren't wealthy, it's because of your lack of faith. Jesus was a wealthy busines man, and everything is about money. One of the owner's brother was the pastor of a "non-denominational" church that splintered off from a Church of God. You had to attend that church to be part of the clique. I never stepped foot in that church, because I'm a Freewill Baptist. Every other church's pator was leading his congregation to hell. This church was a silent partner in the business and have a televised service every Sunday down here. You'll see the patsor preach a few minutes, then an infomercial on how to invest your money. That was my experiance with tongue talkers. I know they are the exception, but that is what comes to mind when I hear of people talking in tongues.
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I, personally, don't go for the speaking in tongues. I've heard it happen once. And it sounded like this. "nanananananana".
When I was a person of faith (Catholic), I once attended a revival and got to hear people speaking in tongues during it. The vocalization sounded like jibberish to me and I felt that I could probably mimic it if I practiced it for a while. Then things got interesting. Once I decided that what was going on around me was absurd, I came to the realization that the kind of loud and public worship I was witnessing at the revival was not intrinsically different from the quiet kind of worship I had grown up with and engaged in on Sundays. To this day I consider that revival to have been the first time I realized that I was on a journey away from religion and toward agnosticism.
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A company I used to work with was owned by 2, I consider, scammers who did financial advising by command of the Lord. If you aren't wealthy, it's because of your lack of faith. Jesus was a wealthy busines man, and everything is about money. One of the owner's brother was the pastor of a "non-denominational" church that splintered off from a Church of God. You had to attend that church to be part of the clique. I never stepped foot in that church, because I'm a Freewill Baptist. Every other church's pator was leading his congregation to hell. This church was a silent partner in the business and have a televised service every Sunday down here. You'll see the patsor preach a few minutes, then an infomercial on how to invest your money. That was my experiance with tongue talkers. I know they are the exception, but that is what comes to mind when I hear of people talking in tongues.
I vaguely remember television preachers in the 1980s talking about how Jesus Christ had a big house and wore designer clothes.
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I've seen the real thing.
But I've also seen the opposite.
The former is rare.
*Red*
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I've seen the real thing.
But I've also seen the opposite.
The former is rare.
*Red*
So, how does one tell the difference between real speaking in tongues and fake speaking in tongues?
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I've seen the real thing.
But I've also seen the opposite.
The former is rare.
*Red*
So, how does one tell the difference between real speaking in tongues and fake speaking in tongues?
One is real and one is fake.
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Speaking In Tongues is considered to be the lowest of God's gifts.
Anyone know what is the highest?
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One is real and one is fake.
Nonanswer answers don't cut it here. Try again.
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I, personally, don't go for the speaking in tongues. I've heard it happen once. And it sounded like this. "nanananananana".
When I was a person of faith (Catholic), I once attended a revival and got to hear people speaking in tongues during it. The vocalization sounded like jibberish to me and I felt that I could probably mimic it if I practiced it for a while. Then things got interesting. Once I decided that what was going on around me was absurd, I came to the realization that the kind of loud and public worship I was witnessing at the revival was not intrinsically different from the quiet kind of worship I had grown up with and engaged in on Sundays. To this day I consider that revival to have been the first time I realized that I was on a journey away from religion and toward agnosticism.
so, if you had had a cold or something that day, you would still be a christian?
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so, if you had had a cold or something that day, you would still be a christian?
No. What I wrote is that the revival made me aware that I was on a journey away from religion, not that it put me on that journey.
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so, if you had had a cold or something that day, you would still be a christian?
No. What I wrote is that the revival made me aware that I was on a journey away from religion, not that it put me on that journey.
you miss the point, as you do frequently. :whatever:
if you had never started the journey, it would have never happened, right?
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you miss the point, as you do frequently. :whatever:
if you had never started the journey, it would have never happened, right?
Right. And?
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you miss the point, as you do frequently. :whatever:
if you had never started the journey, it would have never happened, right?
Right. And?
the point is that if you had missed that one night, you would still be a christian.
let's talk about what else happened on that one night.
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the point is that if you had missed that one night, you would still be a christian.
let's talk about what else happened on that one night.
No. You missed the point. I'm not saying that the revival was what sent me on a journey away from religion. What I'm saying is that the revival was the first thing which made me aware that I was on a journey away from religion. In a way, it was a milestone... just a marker. The journey started when I was a kid and without me really knowing it had started.
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One is real and one is fake.
Nonanswer answers don't cut it here. Try again.
You are so cute. I think it is great your mommy and daddy let you play on the internets. Liberal homes are really a great source of funny stuff on the internets.
Please tell your mommy and daddy we appreciate the funny things you say.
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One is real and one is fake.
Nonanswer answers don't cut it here. Try again.
Pot meet kettle.
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Let's see what the Bible has to say about this...
1 Corinthians 12:30 "Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues? Do all interpret?"
1 Corinthians 14:2-25 2For anyone who speaks in a tongue[a] does not speak to men but to God. Indeed, no one understands him; he utters mysteries with his spirit. 3But everyone who prophesies speaks to men for their strengthening, encouragement and comfort. 4He who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but he who prophesies edifies the church. 5I would like every one of you to speak in tongues,[c] but I would rather have you prophesy. He who prophesies is greater than one who speaks in tongues,[d] unless he interprets, so that the church may be edified.
6Now, brothers, if I come to you and speak in tongues, what good will I be to you, unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or word of instruction? 7Even in the case of lifeless things that make sounds, such as the flute or harp, how will anyone know what tune is being played unless there is a distinction in the notes? 8Again, if the trumpet does not sound a clear call, who will get ready for battle? 9So it is with you. Unless you speak intelligible words with your tongue, how will anyone know what you are saying? You will just be speaking into the air. 10Undoubtedly there are all sorts of languages in the world, yet none of them is without meaning. 11If then I do not grasp the meaning of what someone is saying, I am a foreigner to the speaker, and he is a foreigner to me. 12So it is with you. Since you are eager to have spiritual gifts, try to excel in gifts that build up the church.
13For this reason anyone who speaks in a tongue should pray that he may interpret what he says. 14For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful. 15So what shall I do? I will pray with my spirit, but I will also pray with my mind; I will sing with my spirit, but I will also sing with my mind. 16If you are praising God with your spirit, how can one who finds himself among those who do not understand[e] say "Amen" to your thanksgiving, since he does not know what you are saying? 17You may be giving thanks well enough, but the other man is not edified.
18I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you. 19But in the church I would rather speak five intelligible words to instruct others than ten thousand words in a tongue.
20Brothers, stop thinking like children. In regard to evil be infants, but in your thinking be adults. 21In the Law it is written:
"Through men of strange tongues
and through the lips of foreigners
I will speak to this people,
but even then they will not listen to me,"[f] says the Lord.
22Tongues, then, are a sign, not for believers but for unbelievers; prophecy, however, is for believers, not for unbelievers. 23So if the whole church comes together and everyone speaks in tongues, and some who do not understand[g] or some unbelievers come in, will they not say that you are out of your mind? 24But if an unbeliever or someone who does not understand[h]comes in while everybody is prophesying, he will be convinced by all that he is a sinner and will be judged by all, 25and the secrets of his heart will be laid bare. So he will fall down and worship God, exclaiming, "God is really among you!"
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unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or word of instruction?
Yes, my friend. To TEACH is one of the greatest of God's gifts. My mother was a natural teacher and, in RL (as opposed to the rather over the top style I use here from time to time), I too do pretty well in that area (which, IMHO is a gift that God gave my Mom which He gave to me through her).
But the gift of teaching is not the same as the craft of teaching. There are teachers and there are TEACHERS.
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The Holy Spirit gives gifts for a reason........standing up in the middle of your congregation and babbling is not a reason.
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I'm interested in reading opinions on the practice of speaking in tongues. Is the practice of speaking in tongues actual evidence of humans communing with God or is it just mumbo jumbo?
If you had to ask, you'd never understand.
Why ask at all? Are Pentacostals storming your door? Or do you just have to inject your "opinion".....of which no one really gives a ****?
I was raised a Pentacostal. You don't like what they do, don't go to a Pentacostal church, prick.
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The Holy Spirit gives gifts for a reason........standing up in the middle of your congregation and babbling is not a reason.
Paul tells us that speaking in tongues should only be done in public when their is someone who is able to interpret the tongue near by.
1 Corinthians 14:27-28 If anyone speaks in a tongue, two or at the most three - should speak, one at a time, and someone must interpret. If there is no interpreter, the speaker should keep quiet in church and speak to himself and God.
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unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or word of instruction?
Yes, my friend. To TEACH is one of the greatest of God's gifts. My mother was a natural teacher and, in RL (as opposed to the rather over the top style I use here from time to time), I too do pretty well in that area (which, IMHO is a gift that God gave my Mom which He gave to me through her).
But the gift of teaching is not the same as the craft of teaching. There are teachers and there are TEACHERS.
Good never gives a gift that he doesn't intend for us to use.