DUmmies mourn the loss of complete socialist control over Venezuela

[BattleHymn]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10141282323

The Venezuelan people are finally unshackling their chains after 16 years of socialist dictatorial rule.  The tone in the thread is a somber one at the DUmp:

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 03:23 AM
FrodosPet (3,649 posts)

Venezuela election: Maduro's Socialists trounced

Source: BBC

The opposition in Venezuela has won a majority of seats in the National Assembly, overturning nearly two decades of dominance by the Socialists of President Nicolas Maduro.

Five hours after polling ended, the National Electoral Council announced the opposition had won 99 seats.

President Maduro has admitted defeat, recognising "these adverse results".

It is the worst-ever defeat by the leftist movement founded by former leader Hugo Chavez in 1999.

~ snip ~

Read more: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-35019111


Good luck to the Venezuelan people. Alas, it will undoubtedly take many years to fix their economy and find income sources besides petroleum.

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 04:26 AM
joshcryer (53,551 posts)
1. Such a wasted opportunity.

Venezuela could have proved the process. The boligarchs got in the way. Chavez was right about them.

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 04:31 AM
ericson00 (1,243 posts)
2. one of the reasons I don't always base my stances for foreign political parties

on my views in the US is because with Venezuela as an example, Hugo Chavez and his comrades were leading their country down a very dark, anti-freedom, anti-American path.

It would be different if we tried it!!

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 05:57 AM
nyabingi (585 posts)
3. Well, the American interventionists are getting their way again

and the poor (made up overwhelmingly of indigenous and Afro-Venezuelans) who've benefited from Chavez's changes will suffer as a result. Not surprisingly, both major American political parties have supported dismantling what Venezuela's socialists had accomplished (even supporting right-wing violence and two attempted coups to overturn democratic elections) and the American goal of returning right-wing business interests to power has been a long-term project which is finally bearing fruit..

It will be interesting to see the American media establishment hail the elections results as "free and fair" since they got the results they desired. It will be telling if Obama's declaration that Venezuela is a threat to the national security of the US (a statement that should make any thinking person scratch their heads in confusion and disbelief) will be lifted since the conservatives have gained a bit of political power once again.

The Democratic Party represents liberal views domestically, but it has always been united with Republicans when it comes to supporting right-wing/conservative forces abroad and intervening in the democratic processes of foreign countries (i.e., regime change). I guess concern for the non-rich and marginalized communities ends at this nation's borders.

https://www.jacobinmag.com/2015/12/venezuela-elections-fraud-free-chavez-maduro-haiti-latin-america/

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 10:15 AM
snooper2 (25,726 posts)
9. you believe all of that LOL...Maduro's buddies and buddies of buddies who all got government jobs

May have to prove their worth now, to start-

Maduro can go back to driving buses

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 12:10 PM
sus453 (22 posts)
20. Yes.

Yes to nyabingi

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 04:35 PM
GGJohn (8,163 posts)
24. No.

No to nyabing.

Ok, this primitive is starting to be what one person here described as "someone they could sit down and have a cup of coffee with".  I'm surprised after his defense of the 2nd Amendment and now this that he is still at the DUmp.

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 03:42 PM
Blue_Tires (42,954 posts)
23. Please...Marduro was a world-class ****up

Even a cursory glance at his record will tell you he did far more to hurt the case for socialism than help it...

It's Maduro, not Marduro, DUmbass. 

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 05:12 PM
nyabingi (585 posts)
25. He and Chavez both failed to curb

the backdoor machinations and schemings of the right-wing corporate elite and their US benefactors, and mistakes were definitely made. But you can't deny that the US has pretty much had a hit out on the Venezuelan government since Chavez took power. If you accept that as being normal then I think you need to reassess your idea of democracy and freedom of choice.

Well, there you have it.  Socialism failed in Venezuela because of right-wing corporate interests.  You read it here first at the DUmp.

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 05:18 PM
GGJohn (8,163 posts)
26. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's always the fault of the US/CIA right?

It's never the fault of the corrupt and incompetent Maduro govt.
Well, apparently the people of Ven., including the people who usually vote with the Chavista's, disagree with your premise that the US is responsible for the sad state of affairs in Ven., they laid it directly at the feet of Maduro, where it rightly belongs.

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 07:00 AM
newfie11 (7,779 posts)
4. God help them if it returns to pre Chavez days nt

Yeah.  Toilet paper is overrated.

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 07:16 AM
fasttense (16,671 posts)
5. So they are going backwards to the rule of money through capitalism

I don't think the peoople realize what is in store for them.

Let's hope the uber rich who are about to take control back are beigne dictators.

I bet the people do know what's in store-  Toilet paper, for starters, on store shelves. 

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 07:37 AM
hack89 (32,510 posts)
7. It can't get any worse. nt

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 12:31 PM
Star Member Adrahil (5,490 posts)
21. Well, what the Chavistas were doing sure wasn't working.

At some point, reality has to trump ideology.

Is that a subtle Trump endorsement? 

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 08:47 AM
hrmjustin (64,024 posts)
8. Well the people spoke and that must be respected.

After 17 years one has to expect to lose an election once and awhile.

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 12:36 PM
Bradical79 (1,235 posts)
22. Needed more democratic socialism and less cronyism

and some basic knowledge of economics.

These people never learn. 

[BattleHymn]

From a thread back in September dealing with Maduro entitled "Has Venezuelan President Maduro Gone Insane?":

Sun Sep 27, 2015, 12:16 PM
GGJohn (8,163 posts)
4. Yep,

they're so ideologically invested that they can't admit to themselves that they were wrong and have to defend this corrupt govt to the end, and even when Maduro does fall, they'll blame the US/CIA for his fall because they just can't believe that their favorite dictator is hated by the people.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/110843998

Heh.  Not bad, for a primitive.

[Skul]

The DUmpmonkey least like a DUmpmonkey.

I wonder what beer he drinks.

[Carl]

Ah yes,the self professed "reality based community". 

[98ZJUSMC]

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 04:26 AM
joshcryer (53,551 posts)
1. Such a wasted opportunity.

Didn't work, ................... again.  Did it?

Venezuela could have proved the process. The boligarchs got in the way. Chavez was right about them.

Always somebody elses' fault.

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 12:36 PM
Bradical79 (1,235 posts)
22. Needed more democratic socialism and less cronyism

and some basic knowledge of economics.

 

Well, (D)Upe,  Number 1 always begets Number 2 and Number 3 has nothing to do with either.

[98ZJUSMC]

 

nyabingi (585 posts)
3. Well, the American interventionists are getting their way again

and the poor (made up overwhelmingly of indigenous and Afro-Venezuelans) who've benefited from Chavez's changes will suffer as a result. Not surprisingly, both major American political parties have supported dismantling what Venezuela's socialists had accomplished (even supporting right-wing violence and two attempted coups to overturn democratic elections) and the American goal of returning right-wing business interests to power has been a long-term project which is finally bearing fruit..

It will be interesting to see the American media establishment hail the elections results as "free and fair" since they got the results they desired. It will be telling if Obama's declaration that Venezuela is a threat to the national security of the US (a statement that should make any thinking person scratch their heads in confusion and disbelief) will be lifted since the conservatives have gained a bit of political power once again.

The Democratic Party represents liberal views domestically, but it has always been united with Republicans when it comes to supporting right-wing/conservative forces abroad and intervening in the democratic processes of foreign countries (i.e., regime change). I guess concern for the non-rich and marginalized communities ends at this nation's borders.

 

Afro-Venezuelans?!?!?! 

 

At some point, reality has to trump ideology.

5,4xx posts and you still don't know where you are?   

hrmjustin (64,024 posts)
8. Well the people spoke and that must be respected.

After 17 years one has to expect to lose an election once and awhile.

Throd (6,577 posts)
11. That's where they ****ed up. They should have followed the Cuban model.

   You lunatics never disappoint. 

http://www.hulu.com/watch/440814

[Ptarmigan]

A very sad day at DU. 

[98ZJUSMC]

A very sad day at DU. 

This is teh funneh....   

Star Member betterdemsonly (1,760 posts)
27. The wealthy in Venezula are the oil oligarchy   Oil industry nationalized?

They surely are not going to move Venezuela off dependence on oil, furthermore the Saudis aren't going to end the old glut anytime soon. Their true goal was to harm Putin, who is more popular than ever, and to harm alternative energy giants like Elon Musk, not to mention stop the tar sands. This is a temporary set back, which will be reversed once the austerity kicks in and the oilygarchs entrench the oil economy more than ever.

 

Tell me, (D)Upe,  How much more austere does it get from no toilet paper?

[thundley4]

Their true goal was to harm Putin, who is more popular than ever, and to harm alternative energy giants like Elon Musk, not to mention stop the tar sands.

Obama is doing his part to kill the tar sands and keep his Muslim buddies happy.

[BattleHymn]

Small appropriate article is appropriate:

APRIL 5, 2015
Venezuela Reaches the Final Stage of Socialism: No Toilet Paper

By DAVID BOAZ SHARE

In 1990 I went to a Cato Institute conference in what was then still the Soviet Union. We were told to bring our own toilet paper, which was in fact useful advice. Now, after only 16 years of Chavista rule, Venezuela has demonstrated that “Socialism of the 21st Century” is pretty much like socialism in the 20th century.

Shortages, queues, black markets, and official theft. And blaming the CIA. Yes, Venezuela has truly achieved socialism.

A bit more at the jump, for lurking DUmmies: http://www.cato.org/blog/venezuela-reaches-final-stage-socialism-no-toilet-paper

[freedumb2003b]

and the poor (made up overwhelmingly of indigenous and Afro-Venezuelans) who've benefited from Chavez's changes will suffer as a result.

Examples of the poor benefiting chavez' changes:

[I_B_Perky]

OK dummies. Lets make a deal. We will swap some venezuelians for you dummies.  You can go down there and implement the mostest bestest successful socialist country in the world and the venezuelians can come up here and be able to wipe their ass.

Deal?

[ChuckJ]

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 07:16 AM
fasttense (16,671 posts)
5. So they are going backwards to the rule of money through capitalism

I don't think the peoople realize what is in store for them.

Let's hope the uber rich who are about to take control back are beigne dictators.

Ah. A paraphrase of the old "voting against their self-interest" talking point. From the people who support taxing out of business the businesses that employ the individuals who pay the taxes that fund the DUmmie gubmit checks.

[txradioguy]

Mon Dec 7, 2015, 05:12 PM
nyabingi (585 posts)
25. He and Chavez both failed to curb

the backdoor machinations and schemings of the right-wing corporate elite and their US benefactors, and mistakes were definitely made. But you can't deny that the US has pretty much had a hit out on the Venezuelan government since Chavez took power. If you accept that as being normal then I think you need to reassess your idea of democracy and freedom of choice.

Umm...just a wild ass guess here...but I think it had less to do with the U.S. interfering with their country and more about this:

The richest person in Venezuela isn’t a billionaire industrialist, but the daughter of dead socialist President Hugo Chavez, according to Venezuelan media reports.

María Gabriela, Chavez’s favourite daughter, is reported to be worth a staggering $4.2 billion. Gabriela’s father was a notorious opponent of capitalism and Venezuela’s entrepreneurial class. When he was alive he went so far to say “capitalism leads us straight to hell.”

Chavez was also a vicious opponent of the Unites States over the course of his life, declaring that the “North American empire is the biggest menace to our planet.”

If the reports turn out to be true, Gabriela would be significantly richer than Venezuela’s richest businessman Gustavo Cisneros, whose estimated wealth amounts to $3.6 billion. According to the Criminal Justice International Associates, the Chavez family amassed a vast fortune at the height of Venezuela’s oil boom.

http://dailycaller.com/2015/08/10/iron-fisted-socialism-benefited-hugo-chavezs-daughter-to-the-tune-of-billions-reports-say/#ixzz3tjOQDmEy

Or maybe this:

Two members of Venezuelan President Nicolas Maduro's family have been indicted in the United States on drug trafficking conspiracy charges, prosecutors said Thursday.

Efrain Antonio Campo Flores, 29, and Franqui Francisco Flores de Freitas, 30, were arrested Tuesday night in the Haitian capital of Port-au-Prince as they were preparing to finalize a deal that would have allowed them to transport 800 kilograms of drugs to the United States, according to a Drug Enforcement Administration source who participated in the arrest.

One of the men was raised by Venezuelan first lady Cilia Flores; the other is her nephew.

An indictment unsealed Thursday accuses the men of conspiring to import, manufacture and distribute 5 or more kilograms of cocaine into the United States. In October, the indictment says, Campo and Flores de Freitas "participated in meetings in Venezuela, regarding a shipment of cocaine that was to be sent to the United States, via Honduras."

But I'm sure the tin foil brigade at the DUmp will find a way to blame the U.S. for Hugo's daughter being a billionaire 1%'er and Maduro's relatives running drugs.

[SVPete]

It's going to take decades to rebuild Venezuela once Maduro is removed. After Chavez' and Maduro's nationalization antics I don't think businesses are going to be falling all over each other to restart in Venezuela.

[98ZJUSMC]

It's going to take decades to rebuild Venezuela once Maduro is removed. After Chavez' and Maduro's nationalization antics I don't think businesses are going to be falling all over each other to restart in Venezuela.

Of course, the existence of vast oil reserves is a powerful inducement, but if I am a retailer or a manufacturer?

  Venezuela.

Yeah, it'll take a couple of decades of stability and consistency to bring it back.

[SVPete]

Of course, the existence of vast oil reserves is a powerful inducement, but if I am a retailer or a manufacturer?

  Venezuela.

Yeah, it'll take a couple of decades of stability and consistency to bring it back.

It's going to take a while for oil companies to be willing to risk much $$ in a country with a track record of nationalizing industries and stealing their assets. And IIRC, Venezuela's oil is not of the most desirable grade. So, if Venezuela manages to be stable and reasonable, various industries will come. But in the near term Chavez and Maduro have poisoned Venezuela's well.

[txradioguy]

Tell me, (D)Upe,  How much more austere does it get from no toilet paper?

That's not austerity to the DUmmies...that's suffering for "the cause".

The austerity the primitives are talking about has to do with possible tax cuts to get the economy restarted and reductions in the massive social welfare programs the country has suffered under the last two decades.

See in DUmmie-land...no TP = minor inconvenience...Reduction in spending on welfare = AUSTERITY!!  DESTUCTION OF SOCIETY ON A MASSIVE SCALE!!!!!   

[franksolich]

Afro-Venezuelans?!?!?! 

I went and checked.

According to wikipedia, Venezuela's 2.9% people of African derivation.

For purposes of comparison, Methuselah's state is 1% people of African derivation, and franksolich's state is 4.5% people of African derivation.

As surprising as it may seem, Nebraska's blacker than Venezuela.

[VelvetElvis]

I went and checked.

According to wikipedia, Venezuela's 2.9% people of African derivation.

For purposes of comparison, Methuselah's state is 1% people of African derivation, and franksolich's state is 4.5% people of African derivation.

As surprising as it may seem, Nebraska's blacker than Venezuela.

Frank, as a person of pallor® you can't possibly understand the problems of the Afro-Venezuelan community, your white-privileged statistics be damned. 

[BattleHymn]

Frank, as a person of pallor® you can't possibly understand the problems of the Afro-Venezuelan community, your white-privileged statistics be damned. 

During the compilation of his previous post, no doubt frank was identifying as being black. 

Anyone who says different is a transraceophobe.

[njpines]

Beatcha! NJ is 13.7%. I'll have to look up the migrant percentage but it'll be low-balled as most of them are illegal blueberry pickers.....


18%!   Jeez my while privilege is dying here!!   

[Karin]

About that toilet paper and empty shelves:

nyabingi (600 posts)
35. Nothing to do with price controls or anything

related to government activity or policy.

Federal agents discovered warehouses stocked full of goods that should have been in stores available for people to buy, but the right-wing business owners wanted to create long lines and dissatisfaction among the people. These are the country's rich and powerful deliberately working to bring misery to the masses of people because they didn't like the government the people elected.

 

He keeps doubling and tripling down.  I don't know how this GGJohn character stands it over there.

[SVPete]

nyabingi (600 posts)
35. Nothing to do with price controls or anything

related to government activity or policy.

Federal agents discovered warehouses stocked full of goods that should have been in stores available for people to buy, but the right-wing business owners wanted to create long lines and dissatisfaction among the people. These are the country's rich and powerful deliberately working to bring misery to the masses of people because they didn't like the government the people elected.

Ri-ight! And why, after this mythic discovery, weren't stores flooded with TP and all those other consumer goods? Stupid stories might be convincing to US people living hundreds of miles away, but the average Venezuelan on the street can fact-check such stupid claims by looking at the shelves of their neighborhood stores.