How broken is our democracy? Is it beyond repair?

[dutch508]

kentuck (103,668 posts)
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100216121446

How broken is our democracy?

Is it beyond repair?

It is difficult to imagine so much damage could be done to democracy and our institutions in just 4 years.

But, there was little to nothing that was not damaged during the Trump reign.

We recall the damage that was done to our State Department, as Trump bad-mouthed our allies and praised our enemies. We remember the attrition and the turnover in the Department, beginning with the hiring and firing of Rex Tillerson. It was chaotic.

Also, we recall the choice of Generals that went thru the Defense Department and how they tried to please and appease Trump, as our country was being threatened from inside. And how we ended up with an "acting" Secretary that was willing to do whatever Trump wanted.

There were few corners of the government that were not corrupted in the last four years.

The Justice Department was savagely destroyed, by Trump and his flunkie, Bill Barr. It is still broken, although Merrick Garland is attempting to put it back together.

The Homeland Security and the National Security apparatus, along with the CIA, were nothing but tools for the wanna-be dictator in the White House.

So, the demands for action from these different Departments may be a bit premature. The severe damage that was done may not be so easy to repair.

We may be better off to start from scratch and rebuild these institutions?

 

Star Member uponit7771 (79,892 posts)

1. J6 was *WORSE* than 911, the seriousness of the response from 911 attack didn't leave people

... guessing wtf the federal government was going to do nearly a year later.

The GQP even used 911 in the next election to to label democrats as sympathetic to the people who attacked us and ***KEPT*** congress in the year they were supposed to lose it seeing they won the presidency.

The J6 attack is still happening in the form of vote denial and nullification, I would like the federal response to indicated some serious shit is going down.

I don't see it, that's how ****ed up the democracy is now

Star Member gab13by13 (5,745 posts)

10. I have been hard on DOJ,

My point is that it seems to me that DOJ waits for referrals from the select committee which plays into the hands of the traitors, delay, delay.

This latest whistleblower gave his 16 page report to the select committee, why couldn't he give a copy to the FBI, why not cut out the middle man?

As far as the anti-democratic voter/elections laws being passed in the states, IMO, that's on Chuck Schumer. The fascist SC gutted the voting rights act so DOJ had to wait for laws to be passed before it acted, Chuck Schumer did not have to wait. If I were Schumer I would have carved up S1 into a dozen smaller bills and brought every one up for a vote one after the other rapid fire, and when the GQP voted down every sensible bill I would have gone to Joe Manchin and told him I was voting on a carve out for the filibuster to save our democracy. I would have told Manchin, you are either voting for democracy or for a generation of autocracy. Maybe that tactic would have failed but I see no other option.

kentuck (103,668 posts)

13. Is it possible that a big part of the FBI was supportive of the insurrectionists?

And the leadership was willing to turn the other way as the attempted coup developed under their noses?

How do we know the FBI is not part of the problem?

Star Member gab13by13 (5,745 posts)

26. I don't think so,

Some Capitol police and other law enforcement officials may have been complicit. This latest whistleblower who called out 2 generals for lying to Congress about why the guard was not deployed sooner should bea big deal. DOJ needs to get involved, pushing everything on the select committee is bs, DOJ shouldn't have to have referrals to act on its own. Getting to the bottom of why the Guard was not deployed for 3 hours can possibly go right up the ladder to the CIC, his actions were incriminating.

Star Member uponit7771 (79,892 posts)

20. +1, "IMO, that's on Chuck Schumer." Pelosi keeps the house mostly together and getting shit done

... but for some reason we're still ***** footing around with Manchin !!

Why hasn't Schumer asked him WTF he wants related to Biden's agenda and just went and voted on things, even peace meal as you describe, to progress something further before elections?

This is some scary shit, if the GQP take over both congressional chambers there's no way they're going to give up power again.

They'll make it impossible for people to vote like they've done in Texas

Star Member Johnny2X2X (12,152 posts)

3. We're going to lose our Democracy

I no longer think it can be saved. And it's been in the works for decades.

Republicans can no longer win fair elections, so they decided to do away with fair elections. Trump will be installed in 2024.

Bucky (50,722 posts)

4. For years Republicans have pushed the rhetoric that Dems are unamerican

90% of that was posing, building resistance to Democratic ideas. But they shouldn't be surprised when significant factions within their party start taking the hyperbole seriously and start taking violent action

In sociology we study how in a deviant subculture leadership within the deviant group usually goes to whoever expresses the most extreme form of deviance. This is why fanatics take over religions and why PETA types take over animal rights groups and why the most violent drug dealers take over the gangs and why Trump tool over the Republican party.

The Republicans started deviating from American small-d democratic norms two generations ago. Trumpism is a natural result of that deviation

Star Member Chin music (14,002 posts)

5. We can't give up bc it looks bleak. These people are a minority.

We are the greatest country in the world. One flunke can't bring us down. We need to toughen up. Big time. DEMAND faster action. No more of this "we need a perfect case' against these folks. Few things in life are perfect.
Biden needs to use his bully pulpit EVERYDAY to remind people about the folks who havent been confirmed yet and other things.
We are in the trenches. War is hell. We are at war. We didn't ask for it, but, we owe it to our forefathers and our next generation to do the best we can to right the ship after trmp.
We can do it.
We just need faster action and hard decisions to be made.
I for one am not leaving. Canada doesn't want a bunch of Americans. Neither does the Netherlnds or other places I've seen bandied about here. That's pipe dreams imho.
Further, we aren't going to chop up the country bc the internet has scared a bunch of folks and a crazy minority of a minority is raising hell.
Get tough. Make a plan. FIGHT BACK.

kentuck (103,668 posts)

12. Do the Democrats have the wrong strategy at this time?

Instead of focusing on "Build Back Better" and economic conditions of the country, should they be more focused on saving the democracy and protecting the right to vote? Do they have their priorities reversed?

Are they out of touch?

Star Member Celerity (24,078 posts)

6. this will likely only be possible post kinetic civil war:

We may be better off to start from scratch and rebuild these institutions


or IF the Blue states secede and are allowed to do so peacefully


I predicate all this, of course, on the fate of our democracy being perma flushed via the Rethugs winning control in 2022 and 2024 (including POTUS and both chambers)


IF that happens, then the answer to your first question

How broken is our democracy?

Is it beyond repair?


is broken beyond repair

Omnipresent (4,395 posts)

8. We need more Republicans like Liz Cheney, that believes in upholding our constitution.

There’s too many on the right, that are willing to to convert our democracy to a dictatorship.
The spreading of conspiracy theories, lies and changing voting laws, smacks of what the nazi’s did in reconciling their need to rule with absolute power.

kentuck (103,668 posts)

23. In 2020, Joe Biden was chosen because he was thought to have best chance against Trump.

That was proven correct.

But his election was not about some other great vision or a revolution for Democratic ideas.

It was a desperate act to prevent a dictator from continuing his destruction of our democracy.

Star Member gab13by13 (5,745 posts)

17. Sheldon Whitehouse nailed it,

America has a handful of oligarchs who fund groups like the Federalist Society and dozens more who worked to make our SC fascist. These oligarchs own politicians who do their bidding, gutting regulations. These oligarchs own and manage the MSM which is used to radicalize millions of Americans. These oligarchs do a better job than Osama Bin laden could have ever imagined. We don't have satisfactory laws to counter domestic terrorism which is what we are facing right now.

If Donald Trump runs in 2024 it really doesn't matter if he truly wins or loses, either way our democracy will be left in tatters. The Electoral college should have been repealed 100 years ago, there are too many loopholes in it. What other country doesn't elect its leader by popular vote, democratic country?

Too bad we couldn't indict a few of the American oligarchs who financed the coup to bring down our democracy. President Obama said in his SOTU that Citizens United would result in a handful of oligarchs being able to put unlimited amounts of money to tear apart our democracy, to buy an autocratic government, he was right, fascist Justice Alito was wrong when he mouthed, "not true," back at president Obama.

If our only strategy going into the next elections is GOTV, we are in a heap of trouble.

 

[ADsOutburst]

There is hope for our country.

States possibly "de-fortifying" elections.

The Supreme Court looks poised to strike down unconstitutional gun restrictions.

Kyle Rittenhouse was rightfully acquitted.

Vaccine mandates are getting struck down.

[zeitgeist]

 
 

This thread should have contained a  WARNING: SEVERE STUPIDITY AHEAD  Reading this thread may cause severe outbreaks of rage at the failure of public education.  This must be a by-product of the flotsam jetsam of Democratics, Shirley, the entire party cannot be made up of such loons.    Can there actually be 81 million morans in the country??

[SVPete]

                                                                                      

[FiddyBeowulf]

Star Member uponit7771 (79,892 posts)

1. J6 was *WORSE* than 911, the seriousness of the response from 911 attack didn't leave people

... guessing wtf the federal government was going to do nearly a year later.

Worse? WTF?
9-11...3000+ dead, caused by terrorists.
J9 (  ) ...1 dead, killed by an employee of the her own government.

[SVPete]

Worse? WTF?
9-11...3000+ dead, caused by terrorists.
J9 (  ) ...1 dead, killed by an employee of the her own government.

  and QFT.

[DLR Pyro]

It is difficult to imagine so much damage could be done to democracy and our institutions in just 4 years.

it's painful to see how much damage the sharter in chief has done to this Country in less than 11 months

[enslaved1]

kentuck (103,668 posts)
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100216121446



We may be better off to start from scratch and rebuild these institutions?

Not from scratch, just get back to the Constitution that properly limits and balances the powers in the Federal government and properly empowers the states.

Maybe throw a reading comprehension test or Constitutional basics test requirement for voting and running for office to keep moonbats out of office.  Other than that, the original plan works pretty well.

[DefiantSix]

kentuck (103,668 posts)
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100216121446

How broken is our democracy?

Is it beyond repair...

I'm sure it would be a lot more battered and broken IF SUCH A THING ACTUALLY EXISTED, DUmb****.

Since you keep forgetting, repeat after me, Little DUmbass Children, (well, except for you Malaise: you can go back to killing your few remaining brain cells) "I live in a CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC, not a DEMOCRACY".

[USA4ME]

I knew this thread was from the bluegrass primitive just from the title.

I have a recurring question that is basically the same one, it's just that the subject matter expands over time. I wasn't long ago the questions were "Since when did Dems/libs/progs support the FBI?", "Since when did Dems/libs/progs support the CIA?", and "Since when did Dems/libs/progs support the military?"

Now it's become "Since when did Dems/libs/progs support democracy?" The primitives have made it quite clear over the last 20 years that they want one party, one ideological rule and for their enemies to be vanquished. That's hardly democratic.

.

[FiddyBeowulf]

Worse? WTF?
9-11...3000+ dead, caused by terrorists.
J9 (  ) ...1 dead, killed by an employee of her own government.

[jukin]

It is getting there and fast. The last ten months have seen the great traitor attack on the USA. I really do not think we can take another 38 months of Traitor Joe Biden and his evil totalitarian junta without breaking apart or violence, probably both.