Another Civil War in the United States?

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

If this country was severely weakened in the minds of say China for example....they could very well make a strategic decision to intervene....as far as lift capability....they are spending and spending on such matters...their navy particuarly.

China would be lucky if it could make the trek to Australia and even then sustaining operations would be impossible.

Regarding crime in L.A. or N.Y.   my local national guard outfit could deal with that....it is just a matter of being willing to shoot to kill.....crime only flourishes in our big cities because the politicians dare not deal with it for fear of being accused of being a racist...our crime problem is 99 per cent due to politics...politicians ...mostly liberal and pc republicans with more concern over their personal political career than any concern over the best interests of America.

Sorry but the NG won't be subjgating the streets of the US with martial law. Maybe the odd riot but no sustained operation such as you describe.

BTW -- I mentioned the crime in major cities as an impediment to foreign occupation; not as a domestic issue.

[Eupher]

If this country was severely weakened in the minds of say China for example....they could very well make a strategic decision to intervene....as far as lift capability....they are spending and spending on such matters...their navy particuarly.  

You are completely full of shit if you think the Chinese navy could muster together a few cruisers and an odd oiler or two, to go along with their faux aircraft carrier. They might make it out of the brown water in 10 years but until then, fugeddaboudit.

You really might want to stop displaying your ignorance the way you do. It's gone beyond funny to just....sad.

Regarding crime in L.A. or N.Y.   my local national guard outfit could deal with that....it is just a matter of being willing to shoot to kill.....crime only flourishes in our big cities because the politicians dare not deal with it for fear of being accused of being a racist...our crime problem is 99 per cent due to politics...politicians ...mostly liberal and pc republicans with more concern over their personal political career than any concern over the best interests of America.  

      We got us real genius here. Fo'shizzle. 

[Conservative Libertarian]

You put diesel in the Peterbilt, didn't you.

No. But he did stay at a Holiday Inn Express.

[Crazy Horse]

If this country was severely weakened in the minds of say China for example....they could very well make a strategic decision to intervene....as far as lift capability....they are spending and spending on such matters...their navy particuarly.  

China....

They would be stretched on lift if invading Taiwan.  Their navy would be sitting on the bottom as soon as it gets underway.

[vesta111]

China....

They would be stretched on lift if invading Taiwan.  Their navy would be sitting on the bottom as soon as it gets underway.

Never know when a small spark will start a forest fire.  NEVER FORGET WHAT ROSA PARKS DID WHEN HER FEET ACHED ON A BUS.

Somehow I see this spark starting on the South West border by a group of land owners fed up with Latinos keeping them off the land they pay taxes on.

 The blacks fed up with loosing their jobs to illegals, their land to illegals, and the best and brightest of their children not able to go to college as all slots have been filled with non American kids.

I predict the American blacks will start the spark and the Whites will join them------We are not fighting a race of others, we will be defending America from a foreign Country and our Government that doesn't seem to give a rats Ass.

When the Latinos buy land next to the mosques and bring in the Dog and Pig racing fans, as one topic here is about, then we will have the American Muslims that Will fight for their rights as American citizens.

When more States legalize pot, the foreign country's will take a big hit.  As did the Boot Leggers when Prohibition ended.    The big problem will be that in the city's the Illegals and the blacks will riot against each other for what is left of the drug trade the jobs and security from each other.   Why am I thinking about West Side Story, was it the Jets against the Sharks ????

Just one tiny spark will come out of nowhere, Fancy had the shooter in Conn. been an illegal alien that the Government knew was in the country and did not deport for past behavior.

[Zathras]

Put me on ignore then.....ah duh!

Where do such ignoramouses come from?

You tell us DUmbass since it seems that's where you came from.

[Zathras]

Here that clicking noise?  Thats me being a coward.  heh heh

FIFY.

[Zathras]

Really? I think you are pushing this a bit too much, troll.
Tell me. Which side will you be on?

I can answer that Mr. Mann....the losing one.

[NHSparky]

If this country was severely weakened in the minds of say China for example....they could very well make a strategic decision to intervene....as far as lift capability....they are spending and spending on such matters...their navy particuarly.  

Lemme guess--never served or at least wasn't Navy, correct?

[dutch508]

Lemme guess--never served or at least wasn't Navy, correct?

Dude is a ****ing dumbass. Latest in several. My bet is on Taverner, or whatever his name is. Same level of ****ing stupid.
China doesn't need to invade physically. They already are economically. Once they own everything there (or at least the critical pieces) is no need to put troops on the ground.

[NHSparky]

Dude is a ****ing dumbass. Latest in several. My bet is on Taverner, or whatever his name is. Same level of ****ing stupid.
China doesn't need to invade physically. They already are economically. Once they own everything there (or at least the critical pieces) is no need to put troops on the ground.

But again, and I've said this before, and will say it again until people start understanding it:

China needs us more than we need them.  PERIOD.  Who is their biggest trading partner?  US.  Who would be hurt more if trade were cut off?  THEM.  Yeah, so Joe Six-Pack can't get cheap shit at WalMart anymore, and might have to pay a few bucks extra for that iPhone.  But the US market makes up a LARGE percentage of Chinese GDP, and if they want to avoid becoming a bunch of shit-pickers (and they're barely above that level now) they might not want to piss us off all that much.

Everyone bellyaches about how China is the second-largest economy, blah blah blah...but their GDP is still barely 1/4 of ours.  Couple that with population, and you're seeing the average Chinese income about 1/10 of ours.  Now consider that income disparity is even MORE pronounced in China than it is here.

So sure, they can TRY to put out a shitload of ships, etc., but the quality, capabilities, training of the crews, etc., aren't even close.  Not even the same ballpark.  Not even the same damned sport.

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

But again, and I've said this before, and will say it again until people start understanding it:

China needs us more than we need them.  PERIOD.  Who is their biggest trading partner?  US.  Who would be hurt more if trade were cut off?  THEM.  Yeah, so Joe Six-Pack can't get cheap shit at WalMart anymore, and might have to pay a few bucks extra for that iPhone.  But the US market makes up a LARGE percentage of Chinese GDP, and if they want to avoid becoming a bunch of shit-pickers (and they're barely above that level now) they might not want to piss us off all that much.

Everyone bellyaches about how China is the second-largest economy, blah blah blah...but their GDP is still barely 1/4 of ours.  Couple that with population, and you're seeing the average Chinese income about 1/10 of ours.  Now consider that income disparity is even MORE pronounced in China than it is here.

So sure, they can TRY to put out a shitload of ships, etc., but the quality, capabilities, training of the crews, etc., aren't even close.  Not even the same ballpark.  Not even the same damned sport.

[youtube=425,350]NKkRDMil0bw[/youtube]

[5412]

I think it will start out as minorities rioting in the big cities....then when they head up to the burbs you will a general insurrection....followed by a break down of law and order.  There could be intervention from overseas.

I think of all of this is much more probable or at least possible than most can possibly imagine.

Those of us who went through Katrina can relate to all this much better than most. 

Hi,

I not only see rioting, but see it encouraged by the libs and the Jesse Jackson's of this world.  Instead of trying to quell the riots, they will be enabling and encouraging them to do so.

regards,
5412

[Rufus2010]

If this country was severely weakened in the minds of say China for example....they could very well make a strategic decision to intervene....as far as lift capability....they are spending and spending on such matters...their navy particuarly.  

Regarding crime in L.A. or N.Y.   my local national guard outfit could deal with that....it is just a matter of being willing to shoot to kill.....crime only flourishes in our big cities because the politicians dare not deal with it for fear of being accused of being a racist...our crime problem is 99 per cent due to politics...politicians ...mostly liberal and pc republicans with more concern over their personal political career than any concern over the best interests of America.  

 

[Rufus2010]

And you are being put on ignore....deal wid it chump.  heh heh

Ooh... I is so scared!!!! 111111!!!!1111

 

[Dori]

You only have to look at recent disasters and riots to know how people would behave on a national level.

[delilahmused]

This whole thread is weird! What the hell possible reason could we have that's big enough (like slavery was) to split apart? Who's going to do the splitting? Every single state in the union has liberals and conservatives. I don't want to move out of Oregon just because it's being split into the United States of Progressive Communist America. And then there's the military. Hell, California is off the cliff liberal and there are several huge military bases there. Oh, and the military is NOT liberal. They also know the left works damn hard to suppress their vote. Very few, very, very few would want to be on the progressive side. As they take an oath to uphold and protect the Constitution, and progressives have little use for it, except for the parts that say "free Mumia", "we're scared to ****ing death of seeing any Christian symbol so bury them all or else we'll melt", or "yes, I can stab that unborn mash of tissues in the head with a fork and suck out of my body...multiple times...and you do have to pay for it", the military would obviously go with the document they swear an oath to protect.

As 200 years of history has shown, capitalism works. Freedom works. Small government works. One side would embrace it fully (finally) and the other side would be...Greece, whining for everyone to bail them out. Me, I'd tell them "you reap what you sow"...this is the world you wanted, wallow in it until it suffocates you and you die in your own selfishness. And then there's the whole issue of gun control. One side would have a few more laws about that than the other. So...one side has the majority of the military AND private gun ownership...I'd say even if the split happened, we'd be the United States of America again in short order. FEMA camps anyone?

Cindie

[5412]

This whole thread is weird! What the hell possible reason could we have that's big enough (like slavery was) to split apart? Who's going to do the splitting? Every single state in the union has liberals and conservatives. I don't want to move out of Oregon just because it's being split into the United States of Progressive Communist America. And then there's the military. Hell, California is off the cliff liberal and there are several huge military bases there. Oh, and the military is NOT liberal. They also know the left works damn hard to suppress their vote. Very few, very, very few would want to be on the progressive side. As they take an oath to uphold and protect the Constitution, and progressives have little use for it, except for the parts that say "free Mumia", "we're scared to ****ing death of seeing any Christian symbol so bury them all or else we'll melt", or "yes, I can stab that unborn mash of tissues in the head with a fork and suck out of my body...multiple times...and you do have to pay for it", the military would obviously go with the document they swear an oath to protect.

As 200 years of history has shown, capitalism works. Freedom works. Small government works. One side would embrace it fully (finally) and the other side would be...Greece, whining for everyone to bail them out. Me, I'd tell them "you reap what you sow"...this is the world you wanted, wallow in it until it suffocates you and you die in your own selfishness. And then there's the whole issue of gun control. One side would have a few more laws about that than the other. So...one side has the majority of the military AND private gun ownership...I'd say even if the split happened, we'd be the United States of America again in short order. FEMA camps anyone?

Cindie

Hi,

Slavery had little to do with the civil war; that is just how Lincoln sold it to the north.  Basically the war was fought about states rights versus the federal government.  The southern states were of the opinion that the part of the constitution that said, "All other rights belong to the states" was what it meant.

Our individual liberties, schools and most everything else that was handled well on a state level are now regulated by the federal government. 

regards,
5412

[Conservative Libertarian]

Hi,

Slavery had little to do with the civil war; that is just how Lincoln sold it to the north.  Basically the war was fought about states rights versus the federal government.  The southern states were of the opinion that the part of the constitution that said, "All other rights belong to the states" was what it meant.

Our individual liberties, schools and most everything else that was handled well on a state level are now regulated by the federal government. 

regards,
5412

I agree. Slavery was just a side issue to State's Rights. Wrt that, I agreed wi the South. However, slavery is not acceptable.

[Zeus]

Hi,

Slavery had little to do with the civil war; that is just how Lincoln sold it to the north.  Basically the war was fought about states rights versus the federal government.  The southern states were of the opinion that the part of the constitution that said, "All other rights belong to the states" was what it meant.

Our individual liberties, schools and most everything else that was handled well on a state level are now regulated by the federal government. 

regards,
5412

That's my take on the progenitor of wide ranging civil unrest. It may take a national disaster, perpetrated by man or nature, but folks will come to realize local control usually comprises the best results. As such there will be a groundswell demand of return of and adherence to the 10^th Amendment of the US Constitution.  Might even include threats of succession.

[Right and Proud]

This whole thread is weird! What the hell possible reason could we have that's big enough (like slavery was) to split apart? Who's going to do the splitting? Every single state in the union has liberals and conservatives. I don't want to move out of Oregon just because it's being split into the United States of Progressive Communist America. And then there's the military. Hell, California is off the cliff liberal and there are several huge military bases there. Oh, and the military is NOT liberal. They also know the left works damn hard to suppress their vote. Very few, very, very few would want to be on the progressive side. As they take an oath to uphold and protect the Constitution, and progressives have little use for it, except for the parts that say "free Mumia", "we're scared to ****ing death of seeing any Christian symbol so bury them all or else we'll melt", or "yes, I can stab that unborn mash of tissues in the head with a fork and suck out of my body...multiple times...and you do have to pay for it", the military would obviously go with the document they swear an oath to protect.

As 200 years of history has shown, capitalism works. Freedom works. Small government works. One side would embrace it fully (finally) and the other side would be...Greece, whining for everyone to bail them out. Me, I'd tell them "you reap what you sow"...this is the world you wanted, wallow in it until it suffocates you and you die in your own selfishness. And then there's the whole issue of gun control. One side would have a few more laws about that than the other. So...one side has the majority of the military AND private gun ownership...I'd say even if the split happened, we'd be the United States of America again in short order. FEMA camps anyone?

Cindie

I don't recall anyone so far offering the opinion that any new civil war would involve states leaving the union, or be region against region.  I think it would be an ideological divide and not a geographical divide, which could make it a LOT more deadly - like we're seeing in Syria.

Even in the bluest blue counties there are conservatives, like there are liberals in even the reddest of red counties, which makes it a lot more personal.

And even if they hold opposing ideological convictions, it's a lot easier to hate someone a few hundred miles away that we'll never lay eyes on than it is to hate the family at the next table in the restaurant; who could be former classmates, baseball teammates, fellow ELKS, whatever.

But just because it's hard doesn't mean it can't happen, as has been proven many, many times in the human experience.

My personal plan is to prepare for the worst (EDIT: as best I can), then hope to God it never happens.

 

[Moby]

Most know very little about the War Between The States....if it hapens again it will be completely davastating.  Some very intelligenct people have suggested the possibility...it is something that deserves serious thought for sure.

The first civil was fought with highly inaccurate firearms and a lot less people than are in the US today.
Today, firearms are very accurate, highly lethal, and widely disseminated across the nation.  Ammo and assault rifles are flying off the shelves.  High capacity magazines are unattainable, they've all been purchased.  Almost all high velocity rifle ammo has been purchased.

If this nation sees another war among ourselves, it will be a blood bath and a very terrible out come.
All we need is a serious depression.  That seems unavoidable.  And the food supply to diminish.  Hungry people are desperate people, and desperate people are dangerous.

Right now 40-50% of the nation is prepping to some point. I hope you are!  Walmart and large sporting goods stores are selling foods meant to last on the shelf for years.  I can imagine things could indeed get very ugly.
Until the lame stream media turns on Husain Obama and the people demand his impeachment, things are as unpredictable as they can possibly be.

[XYiftah]

I agree. Slavery was just a side issue to State's Rights. Wrt that, I agreed wi the South. However, slavery is not acceptable.

Most conservatives let liberals beat them up over the issue of Southern Slavery.  Most understand very little about that institution.  We should never attempt to judge another people that lived in different times by the same moral standards that are acceptable now.  Slavery was a legal institution and had been for thousands of years. 

I thank The Lord that my ancestors were brought to America.  We became civilized,educated and Christians.  If my ancestors had not been brought over here-I shudder to think what would have happened to them in Africa.
All kinds of people form judgements on this without knowing the least about it.  In fact without even giving it much thought.  They just accept what is programmed into their minds by the liberal media and Public Schools.

My great, great Grandfather was a slave and the family has passed down a lot of information about all that and it was not like it has been made out to be. 

For the most part it was very humane and the Plantation Owners helped my family and others tremendously even after Slavery was made illegal.

  Most do not understand that when Mr. Lincoln ended slavery he nor the Federal Government made any provisions for the former Slaves.  What did they think the newly freed slaves would do or where they would go?  Obviously they did not care.  Thanks to their former master my family members survived.

If anyone in the world is or has ever been a racist, Mr. Lincoln must definitely be included in that number.  He  wanted to send the slaves back to Africa  even before the commencement of the War.  He left many writings exposising his racist beliefs.  Yet no figure in American History is more lauded or had more streets and towns named after him and he continues to be a Hero to this day.

No Man is more responsible for that conflagration than Mr. Lincoln.

[delilahmused]

I don't recall anyone so far offering the opinion that any new civil war would involve states leaving the union, or be region against region.  I think it would be an ideological divide and not a geographical divide, which could make it a LOT more deadly - like we're seeing in Syria.

Even in the bluest blue counties there are conservatives, like there are liberals in even the reddest of red counties, which makes it a lot more personal.

And even if they hold opposing ideological convictions, it's a lot easier to hate someone a few hundred miles away that we'll never lay eyes on than it is to hate the family at the next table in the restaurant; who could be former classmates, baseball teammates, fellow ELKS, whatever.

But just because it's hard doesn't mean it can't happen, as has been proven many, many times in the human experience.

My personal plan is to prepare for the worst (EDIT: as best I can), then hope to God it never happens.

 

Listen, princess, here's YOUR post:

I suspect we can all agree that the United States hasn't been this politically divided since the late 1850s.  And we all know what that division led to.

So is another Civil War brewing in this country?

Is it inevitable?

Avoidable?

Just one possibility among many?

Can civil war be averted if some states secede, or will that just guarantee it?

My honest opinion is I don't know what can and can't happen - the actions and ideological positions of the left never make sense to me - but I don't feel very optimistic about remaining a united United States.

I could be wrong, and just worrying too much.  But I have four soldier-age sons, and I can't help worrying about it.

I'd really appreciate other views.

Note the bolded sentences. If the "civil war" YOU are talking about is different than the accepted definition most Americans have, based on a real war that happened and was called (surprise, surprise!) THE CIVIL WAR, then YOU have to explain what you mean. Anyone with a modicum of knowledge about the Civil War understands it was a ****ing war, not just a "difference of opinion" with OWS on one side of a park and the Tea Party on another.

Next is your question about whether it could be "averted if some states secede". Now, I took that sentence literally. Doesn't "some states secede" mean "some states secede" or do you have a different definition than those of us using a dictionary? As for WHICH states, I made the leap (perhaps it's too big of a jump for someone who obviously is such a mental tampon they can't even remember what their whole thread was about) of using the scenario most people think of when they talk about this. Usually, people refer to the red/blue state map (kinda like the one in your avatar, except states instead of counties). When one looks at that map, one notices both coasts are rather blue, whereas the middle of the country is red. Even when DUmmies talk about dividing the country they talk about it like this. Thus, if one is working out a way for "peaceful secession" (as if), it would be practical to keep the majority of left/right where they are, correct? It would certainly be damned ridiculous to secede by counties.

And then there's your third point about having 4 sons who are "soldier-age". Why the hell would you worry about that if you weren't talking about some kind of war they would be fighting in? Do you think one or other of the new nations would recruit "soldier-age" men & women to serve in the "moving van brigade" and are worried they would hurt their back or drop a piano on their foot?

Bitch slap for being so ****ing stupid you didn't even reread your OP before replying. Idiot!

Cindie

[XYiftah]

Listen, princess, here's YOUR post:

Note the bolded sentences. If the "civil war" YOU are talking about is different than the accepted definition most Americans have, based on a real war that happened and was called (surprise, surprise!) THE CIVIL WAR, then YOU have to explain what you mean. Anyone with a modicum of knowledge about the Civil War understands it was a ****ing war, not just a "difference of opinion" with OWS on one side of a park and the Tea Party on another.

Next is your question about whether it could be "averted if some states secede". Now, I took that sentence literally. Doesn't "some states secede" mean "some states secede" or do you have a different definition than those of us using a dictionary? As for WHICH states, I made the leap (perhaps it's too big of a jump for someone who obviously is such a mental tampon they can't even remember what their whole thread was about) of using the scenario most people think of when they talk about this. Usually, people refer to the red/blue state map (kinda like the one in your avatar, except states instead of counties). When one looks at that map, one notices both coasts are rather blue, whereas the middle of the country is red. Even when DUmmies talk about dividing the country they talk about it like this. Thus, if one is working out a way for "peaceful secession" (as if), it would be practical to keep the majority of left/right where they are, correct? It would certainly be damned ridiculous to secede by counties.

And then there's your third point about having 4 sons who are "soldier-age". Why the hell would you worry about that if you weren't talking about some kind of war they would be fighting in? Do you think one or other of the new nations would recruit "soldier-age" men & women to serve in the "moving van brigade" and are worried they would hurt their back or drop a piano on their foot?

Bitch slap for being so ****ing stupid you didn't even reread your OP before replying. Idiot!

Cindie

Far be it from me to jump in
the
middle of a catfight.  But it is late and I have had a couple of drinks...maybe that explains you treating that lady so badly. 

Or perhaps you have a history with her over something.  But I really do not understand why you are getting so hyped up about her post..though the way this window is jumping around, maybe you saw something I missed.

Anyhow I think any lady with 4 sons does not deserve a response like you have given her.  Just my opinion I could be wrong.

Are you bi-polar?