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Offline Mike220

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Building a Desktop
« on: June 28, 2010, 08:22:03 PM »
Seems like there are a few people here who have done it and thought I'd ask for some advice. I've had a Compaq Presario that I used to tinker with and upgrade, but I've never built one from the ground up.

So does anyone have any good pointers on what to look for or avoid? My basic minimum guidelines are

AMD processor, dual core or better
4+ GB RAM
250+ GB Hard Drive

I don't do a whole lot of gaming, so I don't need anything crazy. It'll be hooked up to a 27" HDTV as a monitor and mainly used for watching videos and photo editing as well as surfing.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #1 on: June 28, 2010, 08:24:44 PM »
If you want a basic computer, go with a kit from Tiger Direct.  I spent $200 for a dual-core 2.3Ghz Athlon with a 250GB SATA drive and a Gb of RAM.  Poke around their site and you'll find just about anything you would want.  Also, free shipping.

The only thing the kits are missing is the heatsink/cooling fan, so you'll need to find one.  You'll have it up and running an hour after it shows up at your door.
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Offline Thor

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #2 on: June 28, 2010, 11:45:08 PM »
Building is more fun for me. I like to do it from the ground up. The first thing one needs to consider is the time frame and budget. I've been buying bits and pieces for my next build because I have a limited budget. It seems like you have the basic parameters selected, but which AMD?? An X2, a Phenon X3, X4, X6?? How much do you want to spend on the motherboard?? What features do you want on the motherboard (all onboard lan, audio, video?) How do you want the motherboard to be able to grow?? How many peripherals do you want to connect?? Do you want RAID?? Then, there's the case. Do you want basic, medium features or are you looking for style?? Then there's the power supply. It depends on which processor & motherboard as to which power supply you need. I was hoping for cheap (like $20, I spent $37)

Here's what I have so far:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128435


A Thermaltake Soprano RS 101 case:



A 700 watt Viotak Power supply with the 8 pin 12 vdc connector:

http://3btech.net/ewv2vi7020pi.html

A DVD +RW from Newegg ($19 + free shipping)

I already have an SATA HDD @ 750 GB that I will use for now

all I have left to buy is the processor which will be an AMD Phenom II X6 and I want about 4 GB RAM .

I prefer Newegg or 3bTech for internet vendors. 3bTech's prices are typically competitive with Newegg and 3bTech has shipping already factored in. Newegg sometimes has free shipping, sometimes not.

Could I find something already mostly built?? Sure. Pricewatch.com has plenty of stuff listed through their vendors. I still prefer to create a custom desktop from the ground up. Gainesville isn't too far from me, so if you want to get together, send me a PM. You could help me (watch) with this build and maybe learn some stuff.
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Offline Eupher

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2010, 11:53:38 AM »
that Soprano case is a great lookin' case, Thor.   :evillaugh:     :uhsure:         
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Offline Thor

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2010, 12:17:20 PM »
Quote from: Eupher on June 29, 2010, 11:53:38 AM
that Soprano case is a great lookin' case, Thor.   :evillaugh:     :uhsure:        

What can I say, I have good taste in cases. :-) Besides, I believe that I mentioned the fact that I liked it so well that I was going to get one for myself. The one I ordered for me is the one I wanted for Mrs. Eupher. Mine has a solid side vs a see through window. Bastards screwed me in a sense. It turns out that my case was used and it was advertised as "new". I almost returned it, but it would have cost at least half the value to ship it back. I did give them a pretty negative review on http://www.resellerratings.com/profile.pl?user=594131
« Last Edit: June 29, 2010, 12:21:24 PM by Thor »
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Offline Mike220

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2010, 02:57:17 PM »
Quote from: Thor on June 28, 2010, 11:45:08 PM
Building is more fun for me. I like to do it from the ground up. The first thing one needs to consider is the time frame and budget. I've been buying bits and pieces for my next build because I have a limited budget. It seems like you have the basic parameters selected, but which AMD?? An X2, a Phenon X3, X4, X6?? How much do you want to spend on the motherboard?? What features do you want on the motherboard (all onboard lan, audio, video?) How do you want the motherboard to be able to grow?? How many peripherals do you want to connect?? Do you want RAID?? Then, there's the case. Do you want basic, medium features or are you looking for style?? Then there's the power supply. It depends on which processor & motherboard as to which power supply you need. I was hoping for cheap (like $20, I spent $37)

Here's what I have so far:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128435


A Thermaltake Soprano RS 101 case:



A 700 watt Viotak Power supply with the 8 pin 12 vdc connector:

http://3btech.net/ewv2vi7020pi.html

A DVD +RW from Newegg ($19 + free shipping)

I already have an SATA HDD @ 750 GB that I will use for now

all I have left to buy is the processor which will be an AMD Phenom II X6 and I want about 4 GB RAM .

I prefer Newegg or 3bTech for internet vendors. 3bTech's prices are typically competitive with Newegg and 3bTech has shipping already factored in. Newegg sometimes has free shipping, sometimes not.

Could I find something already mostly built?? Sure. Pricewatch.com has plenty of stuff listed through their vendors. I still prefer to create a custom desktop from the ground up. Gainesville isn't too far from me, so if you want to get together, send me a PM. You could help me (watch) with this build and maybe learn some stuff.

I'm thinking an Athalon X4 would be a good fit for what I need. I like the Phenom X4, but it's a little pricey for me. I can get the Athalon for about $100. Want to spend about the same on the mobo. Maybe something like this. One of the big things I'm looking for is upgradability. I want to be able to upgrade as new things become available. Peripherals that'll be attached are printer and tablet (eventually) (both USB) and of course the occasional portable HD/thumb drive, though I am a bit of a techno-geek and there will be some other gadget that'll come out that I'll want. So I'll probably need a few ports. I liked my old desktop setup that had 2 ports in back and 2 in the front. I do want a bit of a flashy case. Like this one. I guess a lot of stuff will depend on what I'm ultimately able to afford. Starting this would be a few months away, and I'm looking to get out around $500 if possible.

I'll see if I can get a chance to get up that way. I'm in Gainesville for work Thursday through Sunday until mid afternoon and I could come by afterward. We'll have to see what happens.
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2010, 03:15:08 PM »
Been building from the ground up since around '98. I think ya pretty much got it covered. The only thing I can add is perhaps look into a water cool system with the Athlon or at least make sure it's copper.

As far as motherboards, Ultra has always been a good performer for me, them and Azus. Don't know if you're into tweakin' 'em to speed 'em up, but Ultra makes it a lot easier. The only one I would steer clear of is DFI. I bought one of there LanParty Gamers a few years ago as it was supposed to be a real screamer and it didn't last a year.

Oh. and Ram coolers are always worth the money, along with puttin' as many fans as the case will hold into it to keep the thing cool. The cooler the board is the faster it is and the least amount of problems down the road.
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Offline Mike220

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #7 on: June 29, 2010, 04:13:54 PM »
Quote from: AllosaursRus on June 29, 2010, 03:15:08 PM
Been building from the ground up since around '98. I think ya pretty much got it covered. The only thing I can add is perhaps look into a water cool system with the Athlon or at least make sure it's copper.

As far as motherboards, Ultra has always been a good performer for me, them and Azus. Don't know if you're into tweakin' 'em to speed 'em up, but Ultra makes it a lot easier. The only one I would steer clear of is DFI. I bought one of there LanParty Gamers a few years ago as it was supposed to be a real screamer and it didn't last a year.

Oh. and Ram coolers are always worth the money, along with puttin' as many fans as the case will hold into it to keep the thing cool. The cooler the board is the faster it is and the least amount of problems down the road.

My old Presario had an AMD processor and I finally had to replace the stock fan with a bigger one. It never ran dangerously hot, but always kept my eye on it. Thought about water cooling, but don't know anything about it. Hard to set up and maintain?
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #8 on: June 29, 2010, 04:21:22 PM »
Quote from: Mike220 on June 29, 2010, 04:13:54 PM
My old Presario had an AMD processor and I finally had to replace the stock fan with a bigger one. It never ran dangerously hot, but always kept my eye on it. Thought about water cooling, but don't know anything about it. Hard to set up and maintain?

Naw it's a self contained system, just like your auto radiator.
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Offline PatriotGame

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #9 on: June 29, 2010, 04:25:37 PM »
Quote from: Mike220 on June 28, 2010, 08:22:03 PM
Seems like there are a few people here who have done it and thought I'd ask for some advice. I've had a Compaq Presario that I used to tinker with and upgrade, but I've never built one from the ground up.

So does anyone have any good pointers on what to look for or avoid? My basic minimum guidelines are

AMD processor, dual core or better
4+ GB RAM
250+ GB Hard Drive

I don't do a whole lot of gaming, so I don't need anything crazy. It'll be hooked up to a 27" HDTV as a monitor and mainly used for watching videos and photo editing as well as surfing.
What is your budget like? I have a fairly newer, upper-end motherboard with a 4-core Intel processor, 4 gigs 1600 RAM, nvidia video card, and 5,6,7, hundred gig hard drives for sale - CHEAP!! With the current crap going on in my life, I just want to get rid of the stuff as easy as possible. Last year I purchased a Thecus 4-drive NAS, populated it with 4, 1.5 terabyte WD Green Drives configured as a RAID 5 volume. I effectively have 4.3 TERABYTES of network storage and thus was able to pull eight multi-hundred gig hard drives out of two computers as a result. My main PC and the home automation server now each have an Intel 80GB SSD (Solid State Drive) as their only hard drives. These are partitioned as 30GB for the OS and 50GB for applications. My main squeeze PC boots to Desktop with Outlook opened in about 45 seconds and most of that is the POST. Applications open lightening fast and I was able to replace two 1000 watt power supplies with 450 watt models and actually shaved 10 bucks off my power bill.
Are you into home automation? I have TRUCKLOADS of computer and network gear, and X-10 lighting control switches coming up for sale!

Seriously, this is my home automation closet and other pics. I am re-wiring and removing preparing for the move so it is a mess:



No, I will never sell my Alienware laptop (center):


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Offline Thor

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #10 on: June 29, 2010, 04:45:52 PM »
Alienware users are similar to Apple users..... brainwashed into spending megabucks on an OK system..... :stirpot:

Mike, seriously, spend the extra $25 and go with the same motherboard as I have. It has better features than the ASUS and a better chipset. I'm pretty sure it will still run the AMD X4. Cooling IS essential with AMDs. Stock coolers will get you by, but an aftermarket cooler will give better cooling/ performance. That's one of the things I plan on upgrading after the initial build.
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2010, 04:52:35 PM »
Quote from: Thor on June 29, 2010, 04:45:52 PM
Alienware users are similar to Apple users..... brainwashed into spending megabucks on an OK system..... :stirpot:

Mike, seriously, spend the extra $25 and go with the same motherboard as I have. It has better features than the ASUS and a better chipset. I'm pretty sure it will still run the AMD X4. Cooling IS essential with AMDs. Stock coolers will get you by, but an aftermarket cooler will give better cooling/ performance. That's one of the things I plan on upgrading after the initial build.

Yep, if ya don't keep AMD cool, it will come back and bite yo ass! Don't know if Pentium has the same prob as I haven't had one since the top 5 engineers migrated to AMD back in early '90's.

ETA:

Quote
Alienware users are similar to Apple users..... brainwashed into spending megabucks on an OK system.....

Boy are you askin' for it! Nuttin' worse than a die hard Apple sheepster! Nothing you can say will convince them they don't have the best system on the planet even if it's 10 years old. There are some FReepers who will cut your jewels off for using Apple's name in vain! I know, I've tried to show them the error of their ways!
« Last Edit: June 29, 2010, 04:59:03 PM by AllosaursRus »
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Offline PatriotGame

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2010, 05:40:49 PM »
Quote from: Thor on June 29, 2010, 04:45:52 PM
Alienware users are similar to Apple users..... brainwashed into spending megabucks on an OK system..... :stirpot:

I only bought it because I liked the alien head.
Since Dell bought Alienware, they went to crap!
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Offline Mike220

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2010, 06:12:10 PM »
Quote from: AllosaursRus on June 29, 2010, 04:21:22 PM
Naw it's a self contained system, just like your auto radiator.

Very nice. I'll have to check it out.
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Offline Mike220

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #14 on: June 29, 2010, 06:14:20 PM »
Quote from: Thor on June 29, 2010, 04:45:52 PM
Alienware users are similar to Apple users..... brainwashed into spending megabucks on an OK system..... :stirpot:

Mike, seriously, spend the extra $25 and go with the same motherboard as I have. It has better features than the ASUS and a better chipset. I'm pretty sure it will still run the AMD X4. Cooling IS essential with AMDs. Stock coolers will get you by, but an aftermarket cooler will give better cooling/ performance. That's one of the things I plan on upgrading after the initial build.

I'm sure I can swing another $25. It should run the X4. They're both AM3 sockets.
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Offline docstew

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #15 on: June 29, 2010, 06:14:58 PM »
Quote from: Thor on June 29, 2010, 04:45:52 PM
Alienware users are similar to Apple users..... brainwashed into spending megabucks on an OK system..... :stirpot:


Anyone know what a Windows user can do that a Mac user can't do?


















Shut the **** up about their computer.
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #16 on: June 29, 2010, 06:23:56 PM »
Quote from: docstew on June 29, 2010, 06:14:58 PM
Anyone know what a Windows user can do that a Mac user can't do?


















Shut the **** up about their computer.

Uh, how 'bout 10x the amount of software!? Apple doesn't even come close to the apps you have a choice of! You perhaps have the same catagory, but you sure as hell don't have the the amount of applications in the same gender, so get lost!

For instance, cad/cam! Get a clue!

ETA:

And, is there a reason you left all the air space from top to bottom? Is that comprable to the space between your ears?

Can you even build a Mac from the ground up without your hero's consent nowadays?

Typical Mac sheeper! There are a multitude of designers working windows apps throughout the frikkin world! Most Mac's are in the US! you're not coming close to harvesting the intellect that's out there.

You can blame Jobs for that, for bein' the hippie he was instead of a capitalist. He's sure changed his spots since he started enjoying the profits though, hasn't he!

Ya know, I can't think of a single thing a Linux user can't do that a Mac user can do either, only 100x cheaper, mostly for frikkin' free! Which if you listen to Steve Jobs was his intention. So tell me, why do they now cost double what an IBM clone does?
« Last Edit: June 29, 2010, 06:35:44 PM by AllosaursRus »
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Offline thundley4

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #17 on: June 29, 2010, 06:43:38 PM »
Quote from: AllosaursRus on June 29, 2010, 06:23:56 PM
Uh, how 'bout 10x the amount of software!? Apple doesn't even come close to the apps you have a choice of! You perhaps have the same catagory, but you sure as hell don't have the the amount of applications in the same gender, so get lost!

For instance, cad/cam! Get a clue!

ETA:

And, is there a reason you left all the air space from top to bottom? Is that comprable to the space between your ears?

Can you even build a Mac from the ground up without your hero's consent nowadays?

Typical Mac sheeper! There are a multitude of designers working windows apps throughout the frikkin world! Most Mac's are in the US! you're not coming close to harvesting the intellect that's out there.

You can blame Jobs for that, for bein' the hippie he was instead of a capitalist. He's sure changed his spots since he started enjoying the profits though, hasn't he!

Ya know, I can't think of a single thing a Linux user can't do that a Mac user can do either, only 100x cheaper, mostly for frikkin' free! Which if you listen to Steve Jobs was his intention. So tell me, why do they now cost double what an IBM clone does?

I thought docstew was slamming Mac users for not being able to shut up about how great Macs are.
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #18 on: June 29, 2010, 06:52:10 PM »
Quote from: thundley4 on June 29, 2010, 06:43:38 PM
I thought docstew was slamming Mac users for not being able to shut up about how great Macs are.

I've been thru this so many times! I started out on an Apple IIE! I loved the things, they were easy to hack! Once they started their ProDos crap, I decided to see what the other side was doin'. Hands down, the speed and software was incredible compared to Apple! Never looked back!

Even an Apple IIE mother was twice what IBM clones were goin for! That was in the days of 286!

ETA:

Right after I had the 6 screws gunned into my back, Workmans Comp sent me to "Graphics" school cause I had to sit down in order to work. I walked in there and all they had was Macs, cause the graphic designers were all Steve Jobs hippies!. I told them as far as I was concerned they had a whole room full of boat anchors! I did all my work from home as IBM Photoshop had stuff not avalable in Mac!

It wasn't the program because Adobe made the software for both, it was the apps!

Oh, and I smoked 'em BTW. Even converted some hippies to go IBM!
« Last Edit: June 29, 2010, 07:06:17 PM by AllosaursRus »
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #19 on: June 30, 2010, 06:36:54 PM »
Hey bubba, just in case you haven't got this new sale from Tiger:

24 hour Clearance from TigerDirect!
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Offline Thor

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #20 on: June 30, 2010, 10:26:27 PM »
Quote from: AllosaursRus on June 30, 2010, 06:36:54 PM
Hey bubba, just in case you haven't got this new sale from Tiger:

24 hour Clearance from TigerDirect!

I don't really see any great prices on there except for maybe the case and the wireless keyboard & mouse combo.
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Offline ConservativeMobster

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #21 on: July 03, 2010, 08:08:59 PM »
I just drifted over here and all I can say is WOW!

See now why you do your own stuff Thor, amazing work there.

You must really think I'm a dummy now with my little shader deal  :thatsright:
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Offline Thor

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #22 on: July 03, 2010, 08:25:53 PM »
Quote from: ConservativeMobster on July 03, 2010, 08:08:59 PM
I just drifted over here and all I can say is WOW!

See now why you do your own stuff Thor, amazing work there.

You must really think I'm a dummy now with my little shader deal  :thatsright:

No, not really. End users are just that, end users. I wouldn't expect them to know the internals of a computer, a TV  or anything else.

Quote from: AllosaursRus on June 29, 2010, 04:52:35 PM
Yep, if ya don't keep AMD cool, it will come back and bite yo ass! Don't know if Pentium has the same prob as I haven't had one since the top 5 engineers migrated to AMD back in early '90's.


From what I understand, Pentiums will shut themselves down when they get too hot. Things may have changed over the last few years, but that's one GOOD feature of the Pentium. Of course, Intel processors are WAY overpriced.
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"The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of the children, the people will happily endure almost any curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation."- IBID

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Offline Chris_

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #23 on: July 03, 2010, 08:28:53 PM »
It's called melting. :-)

Most BIOSes have a temperature shutdown on them that will automatically cut power if the processor overheats.  In ten years, I've only seen that problem once.
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: Building a Desktop
« Reply #24 on: July 03, 2010, 09:18:54 PM »
Quote from: chris_ on July 03, 2010, 08:28:53 PM
It's called melting. :-)

Most BIOSes have a temperature shutdown on them that will automatically cut power if the processor overheats.  In ten years, I've only seen that problem once.

Only time I have seen it is when one of these super quiet fans stops because the user never cleaned the crud outa her box!

I know, I know, thats what she said!
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