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Author Topic: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki  (Read 2229 times)

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Offline jinxmchue

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Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« on: August 18, 2008, 07:28:02 PM »
Check out this hilarious page of theirs:

http://rationalwiki.com/wiki/Chickenhawk/NHG/Where%27s_Clinton%3F

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Where's Clinton?

Bill Clinton is not a chickenhawk. He is A) famous but B) does NOT support the current wars and C) never served in the military. Yes, Bill Clinton sent troops into dangerous missions. PEACE-keeping missions: hideous muddles started by other people. U.S. intervention in Somalia was a failure. Intervention in Haiti and Bosnia were successes. Not intervening in Rwanda is also a failure.

Furthermore, Clinton isn't a member of the CURRENT administration running the CURRENT wars. This is modern politics, not ancient history. If we did include past presidents, the first chickenhawk on the list would probably be FDR, who presided over WWII without any personal military background (he had polio) but not Harry Truman, who served in the Army in WWI.

If we did delve into ancient history, prominent chickenhawks would include John Wayne - who loved wars but never served - and Ronald Reagan - who also loved wars but also made movies during WWII (uniform notwithstanding). Ditto Sylvester Stallone and Bruce Willis.

Richard Nixon would not be a chickenhawk, because he served in the Navy in WWII, as did JFK. Jimmy Carter served in Navy submarines. General Eisenhower earned his war chops. Lyndon Johnson barely squeezed into WWII. Abraham Lincoln plunged into America's bloodiest war, but (we recently were corrected) served in the Illinois Militia during the Blackhawk War, so is not a chickenhawk.


Famous Chickenhawks and Non-Chickenhawks

Returning to the present with more examples:

George W. Bush is a chickenhawk. He is A) famous and B) supports the war efforts but C) did not really serve in the military. He was shoehorned into the Texas Air National Guard to dodge the draft. He served only three years of a six-year committment, then went AWOL, essentially deserting. Now he's sent thousands of troops overseas to die for Big Oil, which is likely the greatest sin this country has ever produced.

George Bush Sr. is NOT a chickenhawk. He is A) famous and B) supports the war efforts but C) served admirably as a Navy flyer in WWII. George Sr. can advocate for wars, because he fought in one.

Colin Powell is NOT a chickenhawk. He's A) famous and B) supports the current wars but C) fought in Vietnam.

John Kerry is NOT a chickenhawk. Yes, he's A) famous and B) voted for the current wars but C) served his country in Vietnam.

 :rotf:
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Offline rich_t

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2008, 07:31:04 PM »
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John Kerry is NOT a chickenhawk. Yes, he's A) famous and B) voted for the current wars but C) lied about serving his country in Vietnam.

Fixed.
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Offline jinxmchue

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2008, 08:26:08 PM »
Quote from: rich_t on August 18, 2008, 07:31:04 PM
Quote
John Kerry is NOT a chickenhawk. Yes, he's A) famous and B) voted for the current wars but C) lied about serving his country in Vietnam.

Fixed.

Hi5.
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Offline Duke Nukum

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2008, 09:28:25 PM »
So, serving in the Air National Guard doesn't count as serving in the military?  Anyway, even someone who never served in the military automatically becomes Commander In Chief upon becoming elected to the Presidency of the United States, even a military loather like Bill Clinton so, um...the whole chickenhawk thing just seems like typical liberal mean-spritedness.  And it seems clear, to me at least, that real service in the Air National Guard trumps whatever the heck qualified Clinton or qualifies Obama (although I guess he could have had some paramilitary training in the Weather Underground or someplace which would still trump Bill Clinton but I don't think he did).
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Offline rich_t

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2008, 09:33:08 PM »
Quote from: Duke Nukum on August 18, 2008, 09:28:25 PM
So, serving in the Air National Guard doesn't count as serving in the military?  Anyway, even someone who never served in the military automatically becomes Commander In Chief upon becoming elected to the Presidency of the United States, even a military loather like Bill Clinton so, um...the whole chickenhawk thing just seems like typical liberal mean-spritedness.  And it seems clear, to me at least, that real service in the Air National Guard trumps whatever the heck qualified Clinton or qualifies Obama (although I guess he could have had some paramilitary training in the Weather Underground or someplace which would still trump Bill Clinton but I don't think he did).

Haven't you heard?  GW Bush went AWOL.

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Offline Duke Nukum

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2008, 09:58:33 PM »
Quote from: rich_t on August 18, 2008, 09:33:08 PM
Quote from: Duke Nukum on August 18, 2008, 09:28:25 PM
So, serving in the Air National Guard doesn't count as serving in the military?  Anyway, even someone who never served in the military automatically becomes Commander In Chief upon becoming elected to the Presidency of the United States, even a military loather like Bill Clinton so, um...the whole chickenhawk thing just seems like typical liberal mean-spritedness.  And it seems clear, to me at least, that real service in the Air National Guard trumps whatever the heck qualified Clinton or qualifies Obama (although I guess he could have had some paramilitary training in the Weather Underground or someplace which would still trump Bill Clinton but I don't think he did).

Haven't you heard?  GW Bush went AWOL.


I think what happens is the moonbats' brains have all gone AWOL and so anything that rolls into those empty spaces gets mistaken for facts.  They probably mix up George W. Bush with Bugs Bunny cartoons Noam Chomsky and G.L.O.W. matches and weave it into some bizare mental fabric that gets buttered with THC because it's just amazing what these people think.  The first rule of conspiracy theory is never believe a word of it. Violate this rule and that is where DUmmies come from.
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Offline SSG Snuggle Bunny

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2008, 09:59:41 PM »
I've never understood this argurment of: if you didn't serve you can't support a war.

If we accept the premise:

* how would a lifelong civilian know when a war was legit to fight?

* the entire American notion of the military being subordinated to the civilian population is turned on its head as only the military and its former members could fully and properly assert US power.

* civilians could just as easily be criticized for condemning a war--including an unjust war--because they lack the requisite experience.

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Offline rich_t

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2008, 10:11:17 PM »
Quote from: Mr Snuggle Bunny on August 18, 2008, 09:59:41 PM
I've never understood this argurment of: if you didn't serve you can't support a war.

If we accept the premise:

* how would a lifelong civilian know when a war was legit to fight?

* the entire American notion of the military being subordinated to the civilian population is turned on its head as only the military and its former members could fully and properly assert US power.

* civilians could just as easily be criticized for condemning a war--including an unjust war--because they lack the requisite experience.



Who do you think is promoting such a premise?  Or are you just speaking in general terms?
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Offline SSG Snuggle Bunny

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2008, 10:13:45 PM »
Quote from: rich_t on August 18, 2008, 10:11:17 PM
Who do you think is promoting such a premise?  Or are you just speaking in general terms?
I believe Michael Moore--among many others--made a big deal about Bush 2.0 lacking combat experience. That cephalically-challenged finger-sniffer is too fat to make his way through the front door of a MEP station.
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Offline rich_t

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2008, 10:21:40 PM »
Quote from: Mr Snuggle Bunny on August 18, 2008, 10:13:45 PM
Quote from: rich_t on August 18, 2008, 10:11:17 PM
Who do you think is promoting such a premise?  Or are you just speaking in general terms?
I believe Michael Moore--among many others--made a big deal about Bush 2.0 lacking combat experience. That cephalically-challenged finger-sniffer is too fat to make his way through the front door of a MEP station.

Point taken.

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Offline rich_t

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2008, 10:29:30 PM »
Robert Heinlein nailed this one decades ago in his book titled "Friday":

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What are the marks of a sick culture? It is a bad sign when the people of a country stop identifying themselves with the country and start identifying with a group. A racial group. Or a religion. Or a language. Anything, as long as it isn't the whole population.


We see a lot of this sort of thing these days.
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Offline Thor

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #11 on: August 19, 2008, 06:33:37 AM »
Quote from: rich_t on August 18, 2008, 10:29:30 PM
Robert Heinlein nailed this one decades ago in his book titled "Friday":

Quote
What are the marks of a sick culture? It is a bad sign when the people of a country stop identifying themselves with the country and start identifying with a group. A racial group. Or a religion. Or a language. Anything, as long as it isn't the whole population.


We see a lot of this sort of thing these days.

In a sad sense, what Heinlein wrote is true.
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Offline DumbAss Tanker

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2008, 08:39:28 AM »
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Jimmy Carter served in Navy submarines.


Not at war, though, therefore a chickenhawk according to this, based on Desert 1 and other disasters he oversaw.  Unless you count the "Cold War," in which case Reagan's WW2 Special Services duty still tops him.  Rather glosses over the ignominious true story of LBJ at war, too.
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Offline MrsSmith

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #13 on: August 19, 2008, 05:53:21 PM »
Quote from: Mr Snuggle Bunny on August 18, 2008, 09:59:41 PM
I've never understood this argurment of: if you didn't serve you can't support a war.

If we accept the premise:

* how would a lifelong civilian know when a war was legit to fight?

* the entire American notion of the military being subordinated to the civilian population is turned on its head as only the military and its former members could fully and properly assert US power.

* civilians could just as easily be criticized for condemning a war--including an unjust war--because they lack the requisite experience.



Exactly.  Anyone who spouts this nonsense had better have a long service record before making any pro or con statement on any war. 

Idiots.   :censored:
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Offline Crazy Horse

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #14 on: August 19, 2008, 06:13:18 PM »
War sucks.............

I wish we never had to fight another or current wars.............







































I will say, that since we are in a war on terror.......................we need to kick the ever loving shit out of those we are fighting. Also, as of last news the Soviets stole some of our military equipment....................We need to kick there ass also.

Military fights our wars so we as normal citizens don't have too. They are the ones that have given up their constitutional tights to an extent............and I appreciate every day they are there protecting everything I say.............and also what those traitor primitives..............sadly they are the ones that have no idea what it means to sacrifice........................

I spent 5 years of sea duty and 34 months of that spent at sea or on deployment.................................................I know sacrifice
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Offline Thor

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #15 on: August 22, 2008, 11:31:50 AM »
Quote from: Crazy Horse on August 19, 2008, 06:13:18 PM
War sucks.............

I wish we never had to fight another or current wars.............


Wimp........
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Offline WinOne4TheGipper

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #16 on: August 22, 2008, 01:39:00 PM »
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Ohmigod, what kind of retarded crap is this?

I wonder who did this, hmmm?  **Innocent look on my face**
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Offline jinxmchue

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #17 on: August 24, 2008, 09:04:50 PM »
They're obsessed with me over there.
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Offline Rebel

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Re: Major stupidity from "Rational"wiki
« Reply #18 on: August 24, 2008, 09:15:34 PM »
What a load of horseshit.  :whatever:
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