Oscar Wilde a good German now

[franksolich]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x3096372

Oh my.

One wondered where Oscar Wilde went, and is happy to see him back.

Cyrano  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Wed Apr-02-08 06:45 PM
Original message

We’re all the “Good Germans” now
   
I had always wondered why the German people stood by and did nothing while the Nazis performed some of histories most unspeakable crimes. I’ve stopped wondering. Now I know.

From the day the Nazis came to power, the German people lost all say regarding anything their government did. And from the day our current criminals seized America’s reins of power, we lost all say in anything that was done in our name.

The average German could no more stop the Nazi’s crimes against humanity than we can stop the Cheney/Bush crimes against humanity. You might say that, “We don’t have any concentration camps,” to which my answer is, not yet. (Then again, what would you call Gitmo, Abu Gahrab and all the other torture chambers whose names we don't know?)

I’ve watched Bush give speeches at American Legion halls where many of the old men sitting there smiling were those who helped defeat the Nazis. They are totally oblivious to the fact that the majority of the world views the U.S. as the current day menace. We are despised throughout the world. And IMO the main reason the civilized countries of the world aren’t doing anything about it is because we have a nuclear arsenal and criminals with their fingers on the button who wouldn’t hesitate to use it.

I think it will be a long, long time for our country to regain the moral authority it once held, or to be looked upon as “the beacon of freedom.” We all know what has taken place over the past eight years in our name. But the truth is there isn’t one damn thing we could do about it. So we might as well get used to the fact that we will probably be universally hated on this planet for the foreseeable future.

Perhaps the one thing we can do to mitigate this is to hold Cheney/Bush and their minions responsible once they are out of power. We must either send them all to The Hague, or hold our own version of the Nuremberg trials.

Oh my.

Since genocide is a crime against humanity, how about sending those who support infanticide to the Hague, while one's at it?

I know, I know, that won't fly.  But it should.

Blue_In_AK  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Wed Apr-02-08 06:49 PM
Response to Original message

1. I agree, the one way we could restore our honor would be to very publicly prosecute these bastards. The world needs to know that most thinking citizens of this country never condoned the despicable acts that were carried out in our name.

TahitiNut  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Wed Apr-02-08 07:06 PM
Response to Reply #1

7. Yup. The one and only way.
   
We're a nation of cowards and outlaws - without honor and without integrity - unless and until the war criminals in the White House and Pentagon are prosecuted and imprisoned for their crimes against humanity in our name.

Don't forget the abortion profiteers, too.

Solly Mack  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Thu Apr-03-08 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #1

28. I agree.

People hanging their hopes on an election to restore even a modicum of honor, without holding the war criminals accountable, are clinging to delusions.

gateley  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Apr-02-08 06:53 PM
Response to Original message

2. Read Naomi Wolf.
   
She speaks of how the German people were unaware of what was taking place behind the scenes. They still had jobs, went out to dinner, to the theater, etc., and little by little their rights were taken away for the "good of the country". It got to the point where neighbors were afraid NOT to report on each other, because the Nazis had convinced them that They Knew Everything Everybody Said And Did. This worked even though the government didn't REALLY have access to all their communications, etc., but people believed they did. Now, our government DOES have access to it all.

We're not quite at the same point -- yet -- but we're heading there fast, I fear.

OhioBlues  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Wed Apr-02-08 06:56 PM
Response to Original message

3. in regard to..."it will be a long, long time for our country to regain the moral authority it once held, or to be looked upon as “the beacon of freedom.”

It will depend on who we choose as a president to address the rest of the world. Will we continue to pretend we know what's best for everyone on the planet while raping the natural resources as we scream "mine". Will we bully and torture others while screaming "national security", "homeland security, "danger" "danger," "danger". Are Americans smart enough and brave enough to embrace the changes necessary to right our pig headed direction?

If not I think our new national anthem will be "bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb, Iran" sung out of tune and loudly by our next president.

enid602  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Apr-02-08 07:00 PM
Response to Original message

4. too soon to tell
   
I agree with most of your post, but am not yet ready to say that we're heading into another 1000 year Reich. If Iran has been left unscathed on 1/21/09, I'd say the danger has passed; provided, however the incoming administration can put our institutions back together. Including the press. I don't think we realize what a herculean task that will be, and in a time of economic downturn to boot.

msongs  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Apr-02-08 07:04 PM
Response to Original message

6. the average german SUPPORTED the nazi attrocities

Uh huh.

Just like the average primitive supports infanticide, the late genocidal homocidal manic Saddam Hussein, the still-living Fidel, Yugo, Bob, the heirs of Mao tse-Tung, and that little guy up there in North Korea.

nichomachus  (91 posts) Wed Apr-02-08 07:18 PM
Response to Reply #6

9. Just as the average American
   
Just as the average American will support atrocities against Mexicans and other immigrants as soon as the economy really hits the skids.

We're already seeing the Mexicans being set up as "stealing" American's jobs. When the real unemployment rate hits about 25 percent and former white collar workers and former factory workers are vying for the jobs now done by Mexicans -- working in restaurant kitchens picking crops in the 110-degree sun -- they will be able to blame the Mexicans for "stealing their jobs."

The groundwork is being laid -- just as the Germans spent the '20s and the '30s convincing the German people that the Jews were responsible for all their economic problems.

I dunno.  I scent "mole" in the above.

Uh-oh.

A speed bump, and a big one.

MonkeyFunk  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Thu Apr-03-08 05:59 AM
Response to Original message

20. only drama queens and idiots
   
think we're just like Nazi Germany.

The lace-cuffed embroidered-handkerchiefed Oscar Wilde wants manners minded:

Cyrano  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Thu Apr-03-08 06:43 AM
Response to Reply #20

21. History never repeats itself in exactly the same way
   
But the similarities between the Germany of the mid-1930s and ourselves today is unmistakable.

Read post #5 above and wherever it says "German" replace it with American. I think you might find the similarities striking.

Oh, and by the way, name-calling is not an argument. If you disagree, please be courteous enough to state your views.

Ooops, another speed-bump, supporting the spunking monk primitive:

seawolf  (1000+ posts) Thu Apr-03-08 06:55 AM
Response to Reply #20

22. THANK YOU.
   
Honestly, I'm getting sick of this shit.

[Splashdown]

Am I reading this right? Did a DUmmie just compare Bush to Hitler? The U.S. to Nazi Germany?


Wow! Imagine that!


Those DUmmies sure do have a flair for the original. 

[Chris_]

You know, so far this morning I've read the obligatory "we're so wonderful because we aren't bogged down by pointless morality" (i.e. we're so progressive we'll screw anything that moves, teach our children...maybe even YOUR children to do the same, and judge those of you don't as uptight, sexually repressed, etc.). And this one, the US is Germany, Bush is Hitler, the camps are coming, everybody hates us and we're the only ones intellectually superior enough to see it. Its like they wake up in the morning and have to reassure themselves that their assumptions and prejudices haven't changed, that the rest of the hive still thinks the way they do. Must be depressing to wake up everyday and realize you don't have any core values of your own.

Cindie

[Bondai]

While the DUmmies are rounding up Bush and Cheney to have them tried for whatever they had better round up every congressman/woman who voted for the war...bring lots of trucks because there are a bunch of them.

[Rebel]

While the DUmmies are rounding up Bush and Cheney to have them tried for whatever they had better round up every congressman/woman who voted for the war...bring lots of trucks because there are a bunch of them.

The real question is, would these f'n tards be allowed to post their bullshit if what they're saying is true? DU, DW, DailyKook, and the rest of those steaming piles of dog squeeze would be shut down already.

[Chris_]

While the DUmmies are rounding up Bush and Cheney to have them tried for whatever they had better round up every congressman/woman who voted for the war...bring lots of trucks because there are a bunch of them.

The real question is, would these f'n tards be allowed to post their bullshit if what they're saying is true? DU, DW, DailyKook, and the rest of those steaming piles of dog squeeze would be shut down already.

Now come on...everyone knows they're brave keyboard warriors risking their very freedom to speak truth to power. They're fighting fascism (corporate or government...pick your paranoia of the moment) because the masses and Republicans are too stupid to know they're being oppressed.

Cindie

[Lord Undies]

While the DUmmies are rounding up Bush and Cheney to have them tried for whatever they had better round up every congressman/woman who voted for the war...bring lots of trucks because there are a bunch of them.

The real question is, would these f'n tards be allowed to post their bullshit if what they're saying is true? DU, DW, DailyKook, and the rest of those steaming piles of dog squeeze would be shut down already.

Now come on...everyone knows they're brave keyboard warriors risking their very freedom to speak truth to power. They're fighting fascism (corporate or government...pick your paranoia of the moment) because the masses and Republicans are too stupid to know they're being oppressed.

Cindie

What the DUmmies do is come to DU everyday and express their hopes and dreams masked as insincere warnings and overdramatized complaints.

[Chris_]

You know, so far this morning I've read the obligatory "we're so wonderful because we aren't bogged down by pointless morality" (i.e. we're so progressive we'll screw anything that moves, teach our children...maybe even YOUR children to do the same, and judge those of you don't as uptight, sexually repressed, etc.). And this one, the US is Germany, Bush is Hitler, the camps are coming, everybody hates us and we're the only ones intellectually superior enough to see it. Its like they wake up in the morning and have to reassure themselves that their assumptions and prejudices haven't changed, that the rest of the hive still thinks the way they do. Must be depressing to wake up everyday and realize you don't have any core values of your own.

Cindie

They probably wake up every morning, look into a mirror and do a Stuart Smalley.

[USA4ME]

Must be depressing to wake up everyday and realize you don't have any core values of your own.

Bingo!  And if a Dem become prez, the things they cry out against now will be the very things they support.  Low unemployment rate?  It won't be because people have quit trying to find work, it'll be because the wonderful Dems created jobs for them.  Warning about impending terrorists attacks?  No longer fear, fear, fear, but rather a group of caring Dems looking out for the people.  All of these things will happen overnight.  The list goes on and on.

.

[BlueStateSaint]

While the DUmmies are rounding up Bush and Cheney to have them tried for whatever they had better round up every congressman/woman who voted for the war...bring lots of trucks because there are a bunch of them.

The real question is, would these f'n tards be allowed to post their bullshit if what they're saying is true? DU, DW, DailyKook, and the rest of those steaming piles of dog squeeze would be shut down already.

Now come on...everyone knows they're brave keyboard warriors risking their very freedom to speak truth to power. They're fighting fascism (corporate or government...pick your paranoia of the moment) because the masses and Republicans are too stupid to know they're being oppressed.

Cindie

High five!  Spot on.