Oilwellian (10,843 posts) http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026207125
Democrats Push Obama to Send More Arms to Ukraine's Military Which Includes Neo-Nazi Militias
oh, and democrats too.
Whether we want to admit it or not, we are on the verge of entering a proxy war with Russia, and Ukraine's volunteer neo-nazi militias called the Aidar Battalion have joined the Ukranian military in that fight.
A lot of Ukrainians fought for Hitler in WW2. One of the reasons there is so much trouble in the region is that during WW2 Nationalist Ukrainians sided with Hitler against Stalin.
Why, why, WHY are Democrats proposing we arm neo-nazis with weapons to be used on the Russian border, and civilians are caught in between? Why are DEMOCRATS supporting this Republican neocon wet dream of what could EASILY become a HOT WAR with Russia? Judging from history, when Nazi symbols appear on Russia's doorstep, there will be a brutal response. The only difference is, this time, America will be on the wrong side of history.
For the leftist (pro-communist pro-russia) America is always on the wrong side.
Skinner This message was self-deleted by its author.
Oilwellian (10,843 posts)
2. I'm sorry Skinner, but...When America arms the Ukrainian military, we are also arming an extreme right wing, neo-nazi batallion of men. I think I laid that fact out very clearly and it is a HUGE problem for Democrats.
sabrina 1 (49,742 posts)
4. I don't think the President wants to do this. Just as he doesn't want to increase sanctions on Iran. And we've seen now how the warmongers operate behind the scenes to undermine any efforts he makes to avoid more war. That told me a lot, the plot between Netanyahy, Dermer and Boehner to do an end run around the WH to do exactly what he fears could only escalate the situation.
We learned how much pressure there has been on him regarding Iran.
Same thing airc, regarding Syria in the beginning.
And now Ukraine.
The way to HELP the President is to oppose those who are pushing for war.
If the general public refuses to buy all the propaganda we get, and they must still fear the public or they wouldn't need to push so much propaganda in order to win them over, they would not succeed.
Arming neo-nazis, why are democrats supporting that, I wish I could answer that question. They are letting the President down.
Oilwellian (10,843 posts)
7. Sabrina, I've been thinking along the same line. I don't think Obama instigated this mess. I think McCain is the main instigator, joined by several of the neocons still embedded in the State Department and Pentagon. There also seems to be a pattern emerging that shows Republicans meddling in foreign policy without White House knowledge. I hope Obama doesn't buy into this very dangerous game they're playing. Apparently, more than a few Democrats have.
sabrina 1 (49,742 posts)
9. See my post below. The exposure of the Netanyahu/Boehner plot to over ride the President's policies on Iran, was a huge revelation into how far the warmongers are willing to go.
And the thought occurred to me that there might be a connection between the the attempt to avoid war in Iran and the sudden anti-Russian rhetoric we are hearing lately.
Russia is one of the five countries working with the President on Iran.
I remember that 'Iran is the Prize' for the neocons. Russia helping to prevent them, by siding with the President on Iran, has to be a real threat to the plans they have.
Yes. Iran and Russia are our friends...
iandhr (4,210 posts)
11. I am Jewish So I wonder why these guys in the Ukraine get all the attention (no doubt so focus should be put on them) But no one here seems to care about the Russian Neo-Nazis.
Ukrainian Nationalists and Germans murdered thousands of Ukrainian Jews in WW2
Between 1941 and 1945, approximately 3,000,000 Ukrainian and other non-Jewish victims were killed as part of Nazi extermination policies, along with between 850,000 - 900,000 Jews who lived in the territory of modern Ukraine.
" A number of Ukrainians had collaborated: According to German historian Dieter Pohl, around 100,000 joined police units that provided key assistance to the Nazis. Many others staffed the local bureaucracies or lent a helping hand during mass shootings of Jews. Ukrainians, such as the infamous Ivan the Terrible of Treblinka, were also among the guards who manned the Nazi death camps."
According to the The Simon Wiesenthal Center (in January 2011) "Ukraine has, to the best of our knowledge, never conducted a single investigation of a local Nazi war criminal, let alone prosecuted a Holocaust perpetrator."
According to the Israeli Holocaust historian Yitzhak Arad, "In January 1942 a company of Tatar volunteers was established in Simferopol under the command of Einsatzgruppe 11. This company participated in anti-Jewish manhunts and murder actions in the rural regions."
The most notorious massacre of Jews in Ukraine was at the Babi Yar ravine outside Kiev, where 33,771 Jews were killed in a single operation on September 29–30, 1941. (An amalgamation of 100,000 to 150,000 Ukrainian and other Soviet citizens were also killed in the following weeks). The mass killing of Jews in Kiev was decided on by the military governor Major-General Friedrich Eberhardt, the Police Commander for Army Group South (SS-Obergruppenführer Friedrich Jeckeln) and the Einsatzgruppe C Commander Otto Rasch. It was carried out by a mixture of SS, SD and Security Police, assisted by the Ukrainian Auxiliary Police. On the Monday, the Jews of Kiev gathered by the cemetery, expecting to be loaded onto trains. The crowd was large enough that most of the men, women, and children could not have known what was happening until it was too late: by the time they heard the machine-gun fire, there was no chance to escape. All were driven down a corridor of soldiers, in groups of ten, and then shot.
But that was nothing new to the region, the Soviets murdered plenty of Jews in the Ukraine.
During the 1917 Russian Revolution and the ensuing Russian Civil War, an estimated 31,071 Jews were killed during 1918–1920.[17] During the establishment of the Ukrainian People's Republic (1917–21), pogroms continued to be perpetrated on Ukrainian territory. In Ukraine, the number of civilian Jews killed during the period was between 35 and 50 thousand. Pogroms erupted in January 1919 in the northwest province of Volhynia and spread to many other regions of Ukraine. Massive pogroms continued until 1921. The actions of the Soviet government by 1927 led to a growing antisemitism in the area.
Ukraine had 840,000 Jews in 1959, a decrease of almost 70% from 1941 (within Ukraine's current borders). Ukraine's Jewish population declined significantly during the Cold War. In 1989, Ukraine's Jewish population was only slightly more than half of what it was thirty years earlier (in 1959). The overwhelming majority of the Jews who remained in Ukraine in 1989 left Ukraine and moved to other countries (mostly to Israel) in the 1990s during and after the collapse of Communism. Antisemitic graffiti and violence against Jews are still a problem in Ukraine.
I hate when DUmp monkies make stupid comments about history they know nothing about.
