Author Topic: Are Climategaters Still Lying?  (Read 15252 times)

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Offline Chris_

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #25 on: December 11, 2009, 12:03:22 PM »

If I were in any scientific field I would be red hot about this.  These arrogant fools have cast doubt on honest, hard work everywhere by the way they perverted the scientific method.

Trust me, legitimate science professionals from all over the world are incensed about this......and are making their voices heard in professional journals and symposiums almost daily......this is not going to end well for the discipline of "Climate Science", unfortunately they are a small voice compared to the "politicians" that perpetrated this fraud, and the media that enables them.

doc
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Offline Chris_

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #26 on: December 11, 2009, 12:07:23 PM »
Nobody with a shred of scientific integrity could say conclusions are valid when the data used to get to them is compromised or lost.  The essence of scientific proof is that results can be and have been replicated from the basic raw data by other scientist acting completely independently, not that you can pick it up after smoothing, outlier-discarding, and (In this case) upward-biasing algorithms have been applied to it.  The whole 'Fake but honest' circling of the wagons being done in the grant-sucking so-called "climate" science community is a complete travesty and prostitution of their foundational principles.

Minor correction above........there are many "legitimate" scientific fields of endeavor that wouldn't even consider applying the methodology these charlatans have demonstrated, grant money or not........

doc
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Offline SSG Snuggle Bunny

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #27 on: December 11, 2009, 12:09:22 PM »
Trust me, legitimate science professionals from all over the world are incensed about this......and are making their voices heard in professional journals and symposiums almost daily......this is not going to end well for the discipline of "Climate Science", unfortunately they are a small voice compared to the "politicians" that perpetrated this fraud, and the media that enables them.

doc
We should proceed apace!

Just in case.

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Offline Doc

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #28 on: December 11, 2009, 12:23:43 PM »
To put this entire Carbon Dioxide argument in perspective, particularly since the messiah is threatening the citizenry with the  wrath of the EPA, Carbon Dioxide comprises .03% (three hundredths of one percent) of the tropospheric gas mix, and 96% of that amount is naturally occurring, leaving, arguably, only 4% of the Carbon Dioxide that "might" be caused by all of the humans, mammals, power plants, industrial facilities, and motor vehicles on the planet today.  They are therefore arguing about 0.0001% of the atmosphere in total..........at any particular point in time there is a thousand times more "dust" in the atmosphere than the CO2 that "might" be generated by human activities.

This is the reason that when this matter is discussed by either the media, or politicians, they will nearly always referr to the level in terms of "parts per million", as it allows them to use larger, and therefore more dramatic numbers in order to scare the uninitiated.........

doc
« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 12:31:00 PM by TVDOC »

Offline SSG Snuggle Bunny

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #29 on: December 11, 2009, 12:27:49 PM »
To put this entire Carbon Dioxide argument in perspective, particularly since the messiah is threatening the citizenry with the  wrath of the EPA, Carbon Dioxide comprises .03% (three hundredths of one percent) of the tropospheric gas mix, and 96% of that amount is naturally occurring, leaving, arguably, only 4% of the Carbon Dioxide that "might" be caused by all of the humans, mammals, power plants, industrial facilities, and motor vehicles on the planet today.

This is the reason that when this matter is discussed by either the media, or politicians, they will nearly always referr to the level in terms of "parts per million", as it allows them to use larger, and therefore more dramatic numbers in order to scare the uninitiated.........

doc
Why do you hate polar bears?
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Offline bkg

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #30 on: December 11, 2009, 12:28:13 PM »
To put this entire Carbon Dioxide argument in perspective, particularly since the messiah is threatening the citizenry with the  wrath of the EPA, Carbon Dioxide comprises .03% (three hundredths of one percent) of the tropospheric gas mix, and 96% of that amount is naturally occurring, leaving, arguably, only 4% of the Carbon Dioxide that "might" be caused by all of the humans, mammals, power plants, industrial facilities, and motor vehicles on the planet today.

This is the reason that when this matter is discussed by either the media, or politicians, they will nearly always referr to the level in terms of "parts per million", as it allows them to use larger, and therefore more dramatic numbers in order to scare the uninitiated.........

doc

Doc - facts don't belong in this discussion.

Offline DumbAss Tanker

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #31 on: December 11, 2009, 12:29:11 PM »
Minor correction above........there are many "legitimate" scientific fields of endeavor that wouldn't even consider applying the methodology these charlatans have demonstrated, grant money or not........

doc

Actually doc, I said it that way for a reason.  Every limelight/grant-seeking science 'Professional' from the noted attention-whore Michio Kaku on down the food chain to the totally unknown seems to want to think their belief in global warming should shut everyone up even though their educational and professional credentials have not one damned thing to do with climatology, from nuclear physicists to software engineers.  They know less of the climatological science than I do, and apparently have a lot less devotion to its methods when their own grants or even stupid opinions are at stake.
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That here, obedient to their law, we lie.

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Offline Doc

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #32 on: December 11, 2009, 12:34:31 PM »
Why do you hate polar bears?

They are a threat to "progress", unless eliminated, how could we possibly build safe, affordable, low-income housing for poor "brown" people in the arctic........

doc
« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 12:49:54 PM by TVDOC »

Offline Chris_

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #33 on: December 11, 2009, 12:44:10 PM »
Actually doc, I said it that way for a reason.  Every limelight/grant-seeking science 'Professional' from the noted attention-whore Michio Kaku on down the food chain to the totally unknown seems to want to think their belief in global warming should shut everyone up even though their educational and professional credentials have not one damned thing to do with climatology, from nuclear physicists to software engineers.  They know less of the climatological science than I do, and apparently have a lot less devotion to its methods when their own grants or even stupid opinions are at stake.

While I would agree that a number in the science community have jumped on the AGW bandwagon, a large majority have not, and are still quietly confining their studies to their particular disciplines.......I would be hesitant to paint the science community with too broad a brush.........many have privately thought this entire AGW concept was BS from the beginning, however, they  have had to basically keep their mouths shut to avoid the wrath of their institutions/employers, who actually pay for the work that they do in their (non climate related) fields.

doc
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Offline bkg

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #34 on: December 11, 2009, 12:47:40 PM »
if this was at all about science, the entire community would be up in arms over the CRU falsification of numbers.


Offline DumbAss Tanker

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #35 on: December 11, 2009, 02:01:23 PM »
if this was at all about science, the entire community would be up in arms over the CRU falsification of numbers.



Exactly.  MSM science writers are all taking the 'Fake but accurate' ball and running with it.
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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #36 on: December 11, 2009, 02:32:31 PM »
Exactly.  MSM science writers are all taking the 'Fake but accurate' ball and running with it.


It almost worked for Dan Rather.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #37 on: December 11, 2009, 02:35:33 PM »
Exactly.  MSM science writers are all taking the 'Fake but accurate' ball and running with it.

An oxymoron at worst.......

doc
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Offline SSG Snuggle Bunny

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #38 on: December 11, 2009, 03:17:04 PM »
Oppressive taxes...curtailment of civil liberties...lying to the public

You could almost call them agents of a dictatorship if they were doing anything such as--say--suppression of the free media.

Oh...wait:

Quote
UN Security Stops Journalist’s Questions About ClimateGateby Mike Flynn
A Stanford Professor has used United Nation security officers to silence a journalist asking him “inconvenient questions”  during a press briefing at the climate change conference in Copenhagen.

Professor Stephen Schneider’s assistant requested armed UN security officers who held film maker Phelim McAleer, ordered him to stop filming and prevented further questioning after the press conference where the Stanford academic was launching a book.



McAleer, a veteran journalist and film maker, has recently made a documentary “Not Evil Just Wrong’ which takes a sceptical look at the science and politics behind Global Warming concerns.


He asked Professor Schneider about his opinions on Climategate – where leaked emails have revealed that a senior British professor deleted data and encouraged colleagues to do likewise if it contradicted their belief in Global Warming.

Professor Phil Jones, the head of Britain’s Climate Research Unit, has temporarily stood down pending an investigation into the scandal.

Professor Schneider, who is a senior member of the UN’s Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), said he would not comment on emails that may have been incomplete or edited.

During some testy exchanges with McAleer, UN officials and Professor Schneider’s assistants twice tried to cut short McAleer’s question.

However as the press conference drew to a close Professor Schneider’s assistant called armed UN security guards to the room. They held McAleer and aggressively ordered cameraman Ian Foster to stop filming. The guard threatened to take away the camera and expel the film crew from the conference if they did not obey his instructions to stop filming Professor Schneider.

The guard demanded to look at the film crews press credentials and refused to allow them to film until Professor Schneider left the room.
McAleer said he was disappointed by Professor Schneider’s behaviour.

“It was a press conference. Climategate is a major story – it goes to the heart of the Global Warming debate by calling into question the scientific data and the integrity of many scientists involved.”

“These questions should be answered. The attempts by UN officials and Professor Schneider’s assistant to remove my microphone were hamfisted  but events took a more sinister turn when they called an armed UN security officer to silence a journalist.”

Two officers corralled the film crew and one officer can be seen on tape threatening the cameraman. The Guard can also be heard warning that if the crew did not stop filming their would seize the equipment and the journalists expelled from the conference.

McAleer says he has made an official complaint about the incident.

“I have met Mr Christopher Ankerson the UN’s head of security for the conference and he has confirmed it was Professor Schneider’s staff who asked the security guards to come corral us at the press conference. Mr Ankerson could not say what grounds the security guard had for ordering us to stop filming.”

“This is a blatant attempt to stop journalists doing journalism and asking hard questions. It is not the job of armed UN security officers to stop legitimate journalists asking legitimate questions of senior members of the UN’s IPCC.”

Professor Schneider was interviewed for McAleer’s “Not Evil Just Wrong” documentary but lawyers later wrote to McAleer saying he was withdrawing permission for the interview to be used.

McAleer, who is from Ireland, has gained quite a reputation for asking difficult questions of those who have been promoting the idea of man-made Global Warming.

His microphone was cut off after he asked former vice-president Al Gore about the British court case which found that An Inconvenient Truth had a nine significant errors and exaggerations. Almost 500,000 people have watched the incident on youtube.

http://biggovernment.com/2009/12/11/un-security-stops-journalists-questions-about-climategate/#more-44722
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Offline Patriot Lady

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #39 on: December 11, 2009, 06:20:26 PM »
Exactly.  MSM science writers are all taking the 'Fake but accurate' ball and running with it.
Love your "oxymoron" ;)
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Offline Chris_

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #40 on: December 12, 2009, 11:25:42 AM »
Love your "oxymoron" ;)
The real planetary polluters are the money lovers.

Here we go again......I love money (not to the detrement of all else however) how does that make me a "polluter"........I might mistakenly jump to the conclusion from your statement that you are anti-capitalist.........would that be a correct or incorrect assumption?

The argument that consumption of resources (that we earn money to actually pay for) makes us somehow "bad" or "polluters", kinda runs counter to the economic basis of our society........is that your premise?  Or am I misinterpreting?

doc

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Offline bkg

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #41 on: December 12, 2009, 01:34:15 PM »
Here we go again......I love money (not to the detrement of all else however) how does that make me a "polluter"........I might mistakenly jump to the conclusion from your statement that you are anti-capitalist.........would that be a correct or incorrect assumption?

The argument that consumption of resources (that we earn money to actually pay for) makes us somehow "bad" or "polluters", kinda runs counter to the economic basis of our society........is that your premise?  Or am I misinterpreting?

doc



Was going to post the same...

Offline Chris_

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #42 on: December 12, 2009, 02:08:51 PM »
Was going to post the same...

Yeah, I sorta asked her the same question over in a thread on the "Herbal Remedies" subforum......and didn't get an answer there either......

doc
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Offline bkg

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #43 on: December 12, 2009, 02:15:59 PM »
Yeah, I sorta asked her the same question over in a thread on the "Herbal Remedies" subforum......and didn't get an answer there either......

doc

I have yet to get an answer from TNO or that other A-what'shisname... nor do I expect to.

Offline Doc

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #44 on: December 12, 2009, 02:28:37 PM »
I have yet to get an answer from TNO or that other A-what'shisname... nor do I expect to.

"Patriot Lady" is different than those two......she isn't a liberal troll (at least I don't think so), in the other thread that I engaged her in, I got several impressions, none of them political per se, I don't think English is her first language, she is perhaps Chinese (my DIL is Chinese, and the writing style is similar), and she is a practitioner of oriental medicine.  This is the thread......bottom of page 2

http://www.conservativecave.com/index.php/topic,17915.15.html

If she did immigrate from China......she may have brought some of the politics with her...........just a guess.......

To those people who spent a sizable portion of their lives in a "one-party" political system, ours must seem somewhat incomprehensible......

doc
« Last Edit: December 12, 2009, 02:36:17 PM by TVDOC »

Offline Patriot Lady

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #45 on: December 12, 2009, 07:08:29 PM »
Here we go again......I love money (not to the detriment of all else however) how does that make me a "polluter"........I might mistakenly jump to the conclusion from your statement that you are anti-capitalist.........would that be a correct or incorrect assumption?

The argument that consumption of resources (that we earn money to actually pay for) makes us somehow "bad" or "polluters", kinda runs counter to the economic basis of our society........is that your premise?  Or am I misinterpreting?

doc


Yup- we're on again :)
As I stated in the post re: Rockefeller- I am not against Capitalism at all. I do think it is pretty apparent that capitalism is the best social system in existence-HOWVER, it should entail good moral values! The global warming scenario is literally being forced down our throats and there is no room for debate! I should say that they do not allow debate! I am sure that you are aware that in the 70's, they were screaming that we had global cooling and that according to their estimates, half of us should not be here now.
Sorry- in our present society- most are in it for the money. There is big money to be made from this well oiled, global warming machine and they will not stop to listen to anyone that may oppose them.
I am sure that you are an honest and upright individual but most are not. The new $$$$ trend of Capitalism is why we are on the brink of financial ruin in this country. I do think that Marx may be right on this one! Capitalist's will exploit the poor if they do not have a moral compass.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #46 on: December 15, 2009, 12:27:21 PM »
Yup- we're on again :)
As I stated in the post re: Rockefeller- I am not against Capitalism at all. I do think it is pretty apparent that capitalism is the best social system in existence-HOWVER, it should entail good moral values! The global warming scenario is literally being forced down our throats and there is no room for debate! I should say that they do not allow debate! I am sure that you are aware that in the 70's, they were screaming that we had global cooling and that according to their estimates, half of us should not be here now.
Sorry- in our present society- most are in it for the money. There is big money to be made from this well oiled, global warming machine and they will not stop to listen to anyone that may oppose them.
I am sure that you are an honest and upright individual but most are not. The new $$$$ trend of Capitalism is why we are on the brink of financial ruin in this country. I do think that Marx may be right on this one! Capitalist's will exploit the poor if they do not have a moral compass.
The bubble had to burst at some point!


I don't really disagree with anything that you have stated, other than your (implied) comment that capitalism must have a "moral" component......Capitalism is an economic system, whose primary goal is the production of profit revenues.........as a system, it does not care whether the participants in the process are rich or poor.......

Where capitalism and "politics" become immeshed, is where governments attempt to distort capitalism in order to either exploit the rich or poor, or protect the rich or poor.........the economic engine of capitalism doesn't care about the participants......only the results......

I would be remiss if I did not add that under our particular brand of capitalism, the only manner in which the "poor" are exploited is if they allow themselves to be exploited.......no one is forcing them to buy goods with their meager resources at gun point, and no one is forcing them to work in a "sweatshop".......if they choose to do either it is the result of their own ignorance or sloth.......and capitalism, as a system, can be blamed for neither......

doc
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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #47 on: December 15, 2009, 01:39:01 PM »
Thanks! Good one! I do understand "sloth" but what about the ones in the middle. We work really hard and are still beholding to the Capitalists and what they deem appropriate???
It is as if we are fighting out of a paper bag-- or in "rock and hard place" scenario. They are steering the ship in the direction that they deem fit and many do not have that moral compass. SIGH
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Offline Chris_

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #48 on: December 15, 2009, 02:01:43 PM »
Thanks! Good one! I do understand "sloth" but what about the ones in the middle. We work really hard and are still beholding to the Capitalists and what they deem appropriate???
It is as if we are fighting out of a paper bag-- or in "rock and hard place" scenario. They are steering the ship in the direction that they deem fit and many do not have that moral compass. SIGH

As with every economic system whether capitalist or "communist (collective)" the ones with the money (or power), get to tell the rest what to do.......been that way since man walked upright.......what's the problem?

doc
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Offline bkg

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Re: Are Climategaters Still Lying?
« Reply #49 on: December 15, 2009, 02:16:02 PM »
Thanks! Good one! I do understand "sloth" but what about the ones in the middle. We work really hard and are still beholding to the Capitalists and what they deem appropriate???
It is as if we are fighting out of a paper bag-- or in "rock and hard place" scenario. They are steering the ship in the direction that they deem fit and many do not have that moral compass. SIGH

I'm beholden to no one but myself. If you chose to be, that's your decision. But don't knock the system that made this country great. No offense, but it's NOT "the other person's fault." I may be overstating a response here, but there is no paper back, no rock and hard spot, no beholden to "capitalists." There's just freedom or tyranny.