DUmmies attempt to discuss profits and Democrat Socialists

[Ralph Wiggum]

https://democraticunderground.com/100210839282

3 hrs ago
MichMary
What does "abolish profit" mean?
Serious question. I've read that the Democratic Socialists platform includes abolishing profit. Why would anyone be in business if they can't make a profit?

Adrahil
29. So how does a business make money if there is not profit?
If I want to open a mom and pop shop in my local downtown, how do I do that, if I can make a profit?

How do do I build a operational cash fund to guard against economic down times? How do I invest in expansions, or deal with unexpected maintenance costs?

lark
2. DAMN!!
Seriously, that is part of their platform? That is truly un-American. If you make no profit, how do you pay the workers or even yourself, how do you stay in business? This is C>R>A>Z>Y and a non-starter for most. My husband buys cars, fixes them up and sells them at a net profit but still at a lower cost that you could find anywhere else - so that's now wrong? WTF? You don't beat crazy and wrong by being crazy and wrong yourself.

If people knew this, Bernie and his ilk would be completely finished. Hope they rethink this substantially and realize how stupid and wrong it is.

Loki Liesmith
16. It's a stupid unsellable slogan
A great way to alienate the electorate tho.

MineralMan
35. It's a simplistic slogan.
No doubt they mean "excessive profit." But, they don't say that.

For W-2 employees, it doesn't matter. If they work, they get paid. For me, who has not been a W-2 employee since 1974, profits are my income. I produce a product that I sell. That product is text content. That's what I've been doing since 1974. I work hard. If I don't get paid, which is the profit on the product I produce, I don't eat.

I don't make "excessive profits" though. In face, I barely manage to stay in the middle class income range, but profits are all I have.

Long and interesting thread.  Lots of DUmmies are against Democrat Socialism and fine with profits.

[SVPete]

MM shows he doesn't get Marxist Socialism. Not only did Marx hate profits, he also wanted to kill business owners. Lenin and Stalin were murderous monsters, but they did it in conformity to Marxist thinking.

[Karin]

Response to MichMary (Reply #8)
Sat Jul 7, 2018, 10:48 AM
leftstreet (31,446 posts)
11. If you have Google, you can look up their platform

According to the DSA’s current mission statement, the government should ensure that all citizens receive adequate food, housing, health care, child care, and education.


The only way for things like that to happen is when no one is profiting

 

Response to lark (Reply #15)
Sat Jul 7, 2018, 11:27 AM
scarytomcat (158 posts)
33. we have lots of non-profits doing really great things

Response to MichMary (Original post)
Sat Jul 7, 2018, 11:20 AM
Yupster (14,210 posts)
24. Maybe no one will be in business

Maybe the means of production will be run by the state for the benefit of the people.

[Delmar]

Response to MichMary (Reply #5)Sat Jul 7, 2018, 12:14 PM
Oneironaut (2,987 posts)
57. Sounds reasonable!

Let’s abolish the police too, and fire departments.

My (sarcastic) conspiracy theory is that these people are really right wingers out to make Democrats look stupid

[BlueStateSaint]

No, they're Democraticks, alright.  We on the other side just highlight what you're doing.

[SVPete]

Yupster (14,210 posts)
24. Maybe no one will be in business

Maybe the means of production will be run by the state for the benefit of the people.

That worked great under Mao! His collectivization took Russia from being one of the largest exporters of wheat to mass starvation in what had been Russia's breadbasket.

That worked great under Stalin! His hunger for modern arms for China's military resulted in mass amounts of food being sent to the USSR and mass starvation in China.

Ethiopia ... Cambodia ... Venezuela .......

[Texacon]

It appears the DUmmies have a completely different take on what profit is than what I do.

Profit in my world is after all bills have been paid and that includes everyone’s salary up to and including the owner. That profit is what is used for slow times or business expansion, possible repairs to equipment or facilities, etc.

Was I taught incorrectly?

KC

[Ausonius]

Rasmussen has nearly 75% of Americans (i.e. likely voters) in favor free-market capitalism, with only 13% saying socialism is okay, another 13% undecided.

On the other hand, their polls show that a "majority of Democrats" view Socialism favorably. 

Does that mean the "majority of Democrats" likely to vote is 13% of the electorate?!  No, probably not, but that would be a nice reality! 

My wife interpreted the results as people wanting "free stuff," but refusing to call it socialism, and at the same time being in favor of successful capitalism...for other people, who will be providing them with "free stuff."    

See:

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/general_politics/july_2018/voters_overwhelmingly_prefer_free_market_to_socialism

[GOP Congress]

My new mole/troll, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, is working BRILLIANTLY! Best invention since BantheGOP. 

[sunsettommy]

Surprising to see some conflicting viewpoints over there.....

Anyone who still think (13%) Nationalized Socialism will work has never been a good history student since there are plenty of evidence they don't work well and eventually fails.

[Old n Grumpy]

The problem is that it sounds cool & hip, like being a Buddhist or some thing. Not many if any actually understand what it is. 

They think the world can operate on rainbows and unicorn farts.

[FlaGator]

I wish they would explain this to me. If no matter how hard I work or how good I am at what I do what is my incentive to excel when no matter what  I do I'm going to get the same reward as the person next to me who may be doing just enough to get by?

[Ausonius]

The problem is that it sounds cool & hip, like being a Buddhist or some thing. Not many if any actually understand what it is. 

They think the world can operate on rainbows and unicorn farts.

I wish they would explain this to me. If no matter how hard I work or how good I am at what I do what is my incentive to excel when no matter what  I do I'm going to get the same reward as the person next to me who may be doing just enough to get by?

In school I use a classic explanation of Communism/Socialism: I tell the students that points will be taken away from "A" and "B" students and given to the "D" and "F" students, so that everybody will have a "C" and nobody will be better or worse than anybody else!  They will all be equal!

You should hear the outcry!   

[DumbAss Tanker]

It appears the DUmmies have a completely different take on what profit is than what I do.

Profit in my world is after all bills have been paid and that includes everyone’s salary up to and including the owner. That profit is what is used for slow times or business expansion, possible repairs to equipment or facilities, etc.

Was I taught incorrectly?

KC

Comrade Texacon, you simply fail to understand that the government will ensure that you, too, have adequately rationed food, lodging, and other necessities, and you will therefore have no need of profit (Should you actually be retained as the appointed manager).  As far as matters such as 'Capital' (Cough) improvements, that will not be your problem anymore, but a matter for the local Master Resource Allocation Committee of the Permanent Good-of-the-Children Socialist Democratic government.

[USA4ME]

Who are the primitives trying to fool? They've been promoting these socialist (Marxist) policies for years, and now because they are a bunch of hillbots who hate the bernouts they believe we don't remember what they've posted since 2001 and believed a lot longer?

It's as if they believe you can feed the boiler on the liberal crazy train until it's burning red hot, but when things start spinning out of control they can suddenly shut the whole thing off. Doesn't work that way, primitives. You're the ones who encouraged these "democratic socialist" tax and spend gov't should control everyone's lives gimme gimme gimme whackos. And now you ask "What do they mean.....?" The question is what do you mean by pretending to not know what they (and you by extension) wanted all along?

.

[67 Rover]

I wish they would explain this to me. If no matter how hard I work or how good I am at what I do what is my incentive to excel when no matter what  I do I'm going to get the same reward as the person next to me who may be doing just enough to get by?

Sort of like unions. 

[SVPete]

In school I use a classic explanation of Communism/Socialism: I tell the students that points will be taken away from "A" and "B" students and given to the "D" and "F" students, so that everybody will have a "C" and nobody will be better or worse than anybody else!  They will all be equal!

You should hear the outcry!   

The obvious limitation/flaw to this is that in real Communism/Socialism some "students" get Ds, some get Fs (prison camps and death), and the "teachers" get raises.

[Carl]

I waded through the DUmp thread and outside 3 or 4 of them one would learn more about economics from listening to a hyena attack on a dead animal.

[Texacon]

Comrade Texacon, you simply fail to understand that the government will ensure that you, too, have adequately rationed food, lodging, and other necessities, and you will therefore have no need of profit (Should you actually be retained as the appointed manager).  As far as matters such as 'Capital' (Cough) improvements, that will not be your problem anymore, but a matter for the local Master Resource Allocation Committee of the Permanent Good-of-the-Children Socialist Democratic government.

Boy that ain’t no kidding. They live in an alternate universe. What’s even more terrifying is that some of them claim to own or run businesses.

KC

[Old n Grumpy]

Profit is what you use to buy booze, lottery tickets and hookers.

[67 Rover]

Profit is what you use to buy booze, lottery tickets and hookers.

And waste the rest on frivolous stuff. 

[Ausonius]

The obvious limitation/flaw to this is that in real Communism/Socialism some "students" get Ds, some get Fs (prison camps and death), and the "teachers" get raises.

You remind me of a story about a Chinese high school during Mao's days: one of his generals had a son who was in a poetry class.   Everyone was supposed to write a poem.  The general's son wrote an obscenity and turned it in.

The class was scolded for not showing great creativity...like the general's son had done!         

[SVPete]

You remind me of a story about a Chinese high school during Mao's days: one of his generals had a son who was in a poetry class.   Everyone was supposed to write a poem.  The general's son wrote an obscenity and turned it in.

The class was scolded for not showing great creativity...like the general's son had done!         

"Some animals are more equal than others," was written by a socialist disillusioned by Stalinist reality (Orwell). Khrushchev, Brezhnev, et al may have been slightly less brutal, but the Soviet ruling class didn't become any less "more equal".

[Old n Grumpy]

Sort of like unions. 

Or working for the government. 

H5 67Rover 

[Ausonius]

"Some animals are more equal than others," was written by a socialist disillusioned by Stalinist reality (Orwell). Khrushchev, Brezhnev, et al may have been slightly less brutal, but the Soviet ruling class didn't become any less "more equal".

This will be hard to believe - or not! - but my wife and I were visiting London in the last weeks, and came across the "George Orwell House" on Portobello Road in Notting Hill, London.

I am not making this up: two cameras were fastened onto the facade and pointing toward the entrance!