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Offline franksolich

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sparkling husband primitive loses control
« on: August 11, 2009, 03:10:24 PM »
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6276622

Oh my.

The sparkling husband primitive who, like all men, nightly pitches his tent one day's march closer to the mausoleum:

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Stinky The Clown  (1000+ posts)        Tue Aug-11-09 03:14 PM
Original message
 
Have Democrats lost control of the message/agenda?

This question is not specifically about Obama, but he's a part of it.

Has control of the message been lost? Forget the truth for a moment. It pretty much doesn't matter. The Internets are clogged with anti-anything-left e-mails being mailed, remailed, edited, recast, reedited and resent and then rinsed and repeated.

The town halls have been pretty effectively hijacked by the crazies.

Just today ..... Specter and McCaskill have had their metaphorical lunches handed to them. They're by no means the first or last. Just last night, in supposedly blue Maryland, Senator Ben Cardin was met with similar mindless vitriol.

All of this is out there and the fact is THERE IS NO BILL BEFORE CONGRESS. Yet people are pissed off at what they've been told - by media hate mongers and (VERY WELL) paid operatives of the corporatists - is in "Obama's healthcare plan". Some on the left are pissed for the flip side of the very same reason: Obama has NO healthcare plan.

In the background are people with guns at these town hall meetings. There is hyperalert among the Secret Service's presidential detail. local cops are on alert when these circuses are played out.

And through all of this ...... where's the message? Not one heard by you or me, who pay attention. But by average people?

Do we hear the word "socialism" a lot?

Or do we hear "improved health care for the country" far more?

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kelly1mm (97 posts)      Tue Aug-11-09 03:18 PM
Response to Original message
 
1. In general yes - but the President's TH was a start in moving the debate forward constructively.

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Ninga  (1000+ posts)      Tue Aug-11-09 03:19 PM
Response to Original message

2. As long as elected Dem's being interviewed on TeeVee don't push back hard, then I say Yes!!

It's "the sound bites, stupid"..... folks too busy to watch during the workday get the gist of the Town Halls by watching cable talking heads.

So as far as I am concerned, the "protesters" are begetting other "protesters" and we will have the snow ball effect in August.

I am not a dooms day kind of person, but even little 'ole me can see the "protesters" are gaining ground planting doubt.

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OwnedByFerrets  (1000+ posts)      Tue Aug-11-09 03:20 PM
Response to Original message
 
3. They never had control of it.

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Lex  (1000+ posts)        Tue Aug-11-09 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #3
 
4. Agreed.

It's been BADLY mishandled by the Dems.

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phantom power  (1000+ posts)        Tue Aug-11-09 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #3
 
8. +1. The Dems never get out in front of Republican FUD campaigns.

The GOP cheerfully starts throwing a storm of shit at the public, to muddy the waters and see what sticks. The Dems are never, ever prepared for it.

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Zenlitened  (1000+ posts)        Tue Aug-11-09 03:41 PM
Response to Reply #3
 
11. Yep. Dems never seem to start out FIGHTING for what they believe in.

Never set the tone from the start, that these are crucial, profoundly important issues, worthy of the attention and support of every single American.

While repukes, on the other hand, turn even the most trivial nonsense into OhMyGawdItsTheEndOfTheWorld!!!

Which gets tiring, no doubt about it. But I'd like to see Dems get that fired up about genuine TEOTW issues, instead of approaching everything like a debating club rehearsal.

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AlinPA (1000+ posts)      Tue Aug-11-09 03:24 PM
Response to Original message
 
5. The media decides the message and has total control of it.

Apparently; the other day franksolich was in a physician's office, and happened to notice a recent edition of Time magazine was dedicated to glorifying Ma Kettle in the White House, the most worthless First Lady since, well, I dunno, maybe ever.

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Corgigal  (1000+ posts)      Tue Aug-11-09 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #5
 
6. and thats the truth

the media keeps showing the theater and not showing intelligent people with good questions. However it does appear like our mental health care system is failing way too many people.

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kevinbgoode  (1000+ posts)      Tue Aug-11-09 03:28 PM
Response to Original message
 
7. I blame that on the Blue Dogs and their posturing

it pretty much pissed off a lot of people and we have no agreement or idea of what "reform" is going to be. . .so that limited our ability to respond.

And I also blame ourselves for not doing more to organize support - but then we don't know what to support yet.

Uh huh.

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quiet.american  (1000+ posts)      Tue Aug-11-09 03:34 PM
Response to Original message
 
9. No - control of the message has definitely not been lost and has gained momentum.

The GOP right now has more to worry about regarding a "message," than we do. Their image, through their Astroturf/Stoopid Mob efforts, has cemented into one that brands them as the Party of Violence, the Party of Lies, the Party of Hate, the Party of Racists, the Party of Thugs, the Party of Fear, the Party of Desperation.

If ever a party needed to get control of its message, it's the GOP.

I'm proud of our Democratic representatives (yes, surprisingly, even Arlen Specter) who refused to back down from the Beck/Limbaugh/Palin incitements and held our message firm. It worked, and with Pres. Obama's home-run today, this train is definitely still on track.

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reflection  (1000+ posts)      Tue Aug-11-09 03:40 PM
Response to Original message
 
10. Yes. You are absolutely correct.

The people I interact with daily, the people who are not as plugged in and politically aware as the average DUer, are mad because of "Obama's health care plan" and are terrified of "socialism". It's maddening. I keep saying "there's no bill yet" and asking these people to define socialism, but to no avail. All they know is they are scared and angry and it must be Obama's fault. Sprinkle in a dash of racism and you have a recipe for uncertainty and chaos.

Spot on, Stinky.

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Zenlitened  (1000+ posts)        Tue Aug-11-09 03:50 PM
Response to Original message

12. Pres. Obama should have written a Health Care Bill and submitted it to Congress.

That way, he would have framed the debate in absolutely concrete terms from the start.

Everything that followed would have been measured (and reported) in terms of how it adheres to or deviates from The Obama Health Care Bill.

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BlooInBloo  (1000+ posts)        Tue Aug-11-09 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #12
 
14. That's what Hilary did. It didn't work.

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Zenlitened  (1000+ posts)        Tue Aug-11-09 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #14
 
15. So, therefor...?

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BlooInBloo  (1000+ posts)        Tue Aug-11-09 03:59 PM
Response to Reply #15
 
16. So Obama decided to try something else. But under *no* scenario will it be easy.

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BlooInBloo  (1000+ posts)        Tue Aug-11-09 03:52 PM
Response to Original message

13. (shrug) Newsflash - they punch back...

Our response was slow - for various reasons I'm sure - but it's coming on a bit now.
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Offline The Village Idiot

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #1 on: August 11, 2009, 03:12:23 PM »
That cuts it. I am going to launch a Citizen United Action Corps CUAC! Where me and a few others can get together and rant and rave about the left and pretend we are actually doing something important.
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Offline The Village Idiot

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #2 on: August 11, 2009, 03:16:45 PM »
http://unitedcitizen.proboards.com/index.cgi?/

There! Not that I need it with FR and CC though
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Offline Ralph Wiggum

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2009, 03:36:33 PM »
Quote
reflection  (1000+ posts)      Tue Aug-11-09 03:40 PM
Response to Original message
 
10. Yes. You are absolutely correct.

The people I interact with daily, the people who are not as plugged in and politically aware as the average DUer

 :lmao: :lmao:
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Offline Carl

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2009, 03:37:11 PM »
Quote
Zenlitened  (1000+ posts)        Tue Aug-11-09 03:50 PM
Response to Original message

12. Pres. Obama should have written a Health Care Bill and submitted it to Congress.

That way, he would have framed the debate in absolutely concrete terms from the start.

Everything that followed would have been measured (and reported) in terms of how it adheres to or deviates from The Obama Health Care Bill.
You mistake him for a person that will allow something to happen that he doesn`t have an escape clause in it.
He will only take a stand after someone else puts their career on the line and he can give them a push under the bus if/when needed.
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Offline Ralph Wiggum

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2009, 03:37:57 PM »
Quote
Zenlitened  (1000+ posts)        Tue Aug-11-09 03:50 PM
Response to Original message

12. Pres. Obama should have written a Health Care Bill and submitted it to Congress.

That way, he would have framed the debate in absolutely concrete terms from the start
.

Because so many Presidents actually write their own legislation. :whatever:
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Offline The Village Idiot

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2009, 03:40:04 PM »
http://unitedcitizen.proboards.com/index.cgi?/

They will love the idea behind the new board. How to pick up and rebuild after the civil war destroys this country.
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Offline Karin

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2009, 03:52:27 PM »
I am sure that Obama felt he hit a homerun today.  They only let adoring Obamabots in.  There, they bathed him in wild cheering and pelted him with puffball questions.   He loooooves that sort of thing and his narcissism and hubris will be his downfall.  You can read about it in any old Greek book.  Not to mention all the bodies under the bus that may have a beef and turn coat. 

quiet.american up there is very deluded and stupid.  Let him stay that way. 
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Offline Wineslob

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2009, 03:57:10 PM »
Hey, DUmmies, alot of those "mindless crazies" are...................DEMOCRATS.   :evillaugh:




Damn you people are teh stoopid.
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Offline Celtic Rose

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #9 on: August 11, 2009, 04:04:23 PM »
Typical lefties, don't attack the content of people's complaints, attack the messengers.  People are directly quoting passages of the health care bill, and explaining exactly what concerns them about it.  In response, the DUmmies say that the objectors are evil, violent, paid propagandists. 
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Offline jukin

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #10 on: August 11, 2009, 04:06:32 PM »
I'll put this up the flagpole here.  Now we all made fun of the DUmmy not one damn dime day etc.  However, since kalifornia just told us they were going to raise the with holding tax 'to borrow interest free' our money and that you can change your withholding to keep it steady, I had an idea.  Why not just up all of our deductions and pay on 4/15 while using your own money with interest.  I would up my dependents when interest rates were at 18% and sched A would knock thousands off.

This would be a real protest that would be felt.  Many taxpayers look at federal withholding as a savings account (w/o interest) and the feds depend on it.  I think the elites just might take notice if the tax receipts dropped an additional 15% over projected loss.  Yeah money talks and middle America could actually do it.  Be interesting to see what the reaction would be.

« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 04:08:48 PM by jukin »
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Offline The Village Idiot

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #11 on: August 11, 2009, 04:23:08 PM »
Quote from: Karin on August 11, 2009, 03:52:27 PM
I am sure that Obama felt he hit a homerun today.  They only let adoring Obamabots in.  There, they bathed him in wild cheering and pelted him with puffball questions.   He loooooves that sort of thing and his narcissism and hubris will be his downfall.  You can read about it in any old Greek book.  Not to mention all the bodies under the bus that may have a beef and turn coat. 

quiet.american up there is very deluded and stupid.  Let him stay that way. 

Obama said FedEx and UPS are doing fine while the PO is struggling.... isn't that a great argument against ObamaCare?
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Offline DumbAss Tanker

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #12 on: August 11, 2009, 04:48:01 PM »
Quote
Zenlitened  (1000+ posts)        Tue Aug-11-09 03:50 PM
Response to Original message

12. Pres. Obama should have written a Health Care Bill and submitted it to Congress.

That way, he would have framed the debate in absolutely concrete terms from the start

Well, Ayers was probably busy, and besides, how could it be porked-up in Congress if he did that?
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #13 on: August 11, 2009, 04:53:28 PM »
Stinky, you're an idiot! You have no idea of healthcare in America as it exists today!

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With all of this dissinfo coming from the DUmp on how we are lying about what is in this healthcare bill, I would like to share one of my personal experiences of healthcare in this country that I have experienced first hand.

Back in '98 when I had my the first of my back surgeries, of which I have now had three, I was housed in a semiprivate room. There were two of us. Myself, I was in under a workmans comp claim so my financial's were takin' care of. The young man in my room with me had the unfortunate experience of having done a little too much partying with his friends the night before. After everyone had partaken in sufficient alcohol, they decided to play "All Star Wrestling" on the front porch of a cabin up here in the Daniel Boonies. Inebriated  idiots, unfortunately, have a habit of coming up with ideas contrary to one's personal health.

Unfortunately, one of his "buddies", and I have to use the term loosely, pitched him off the porch and he landed basically on his neck! After x-rays and an MRI, they discovered he had a spiral fracture in one of the vertebrae in his neck.

I really felt sorry for the guy as he was going to have to be fitted with a "halo". For those of you who don't know what this is, it is a stainless steel rind with four bolts that are "screwed" into your skull in order to keep your spine above your shoulders in a fixed position. Very painful, very uncomfortable to say the least.

The poor soul had absolutely no insurance as he was unemployed at the time. The hospital sent a social worker from the local human services department, a state and federal program by the way, in to inform him he had nothing to worry about, as they would make sure he would get the best care possible!

The cold hard facts of this story are that the DUmmies are full of shit when they say we need a public option in our healthcare system. It already exists! Anyone, and I mean, anyone can get healthcare in this country whenever they need it!

This kid was basically useless as far as being a contributing member of our society, and yet, he was still able to get, I'm sure, several tens of thousands of dollars of FREE healthcare! Think the same will happen with ObamaCare?

So, SUCK IT DUmmies! Your arguments have no merit! What you know about our current healthcare system couldn't fill a thimble!

edited 'cause my typing sucks!
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 04:56:24 PM by AllosaursRus »
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Offline USA4ME

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Re: sparkling husband primitive loses control
« Reply #14 on: August 11, 2009, 08:38:01 PM »
Quote from:
Stinky The Clown

Forget the truth for a moment.

Primitives can't forget what they never knew.

.
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