Omaha's Ed Norton being anti-Wal-Mart

[franksolich]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002308114

Oh my.

Omaha Steve (31,289 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

UFCW Strongly Against Proposed Walmart Neighborhood Markets

http://pleasanton.patch.com/articles/ufcw-strongly-against-proposed-walmart-neighborhood-markets

Walmart wants to build grocery stores in Pleasanton and San Ramon but is facing resistance from the United Food and Commercial Workers (UFCW) Union.

http://o1.aolcdn.com/dims-shared/dims3/PATCH/resize/273x203/http://hss-prod.hss.aol.com/hss/storage/patch/63523d544a902d04f34cec5fd137b4fe

The United Food and Commercial Workers (UFCW) Union is strongly against Walmart Neighborhood Markets coming to Northern California, the union said in a press release Wednesday.

Walmart is looking to bring its grocery store chain to Bay Area cities, including Pleasanton and San Ramon. There are currently 167 Walmart Neighborhood Markets nationwide, selling everything one would find in a regular grocery store, according to the Walmart website.

What concerns the union is, unlike Safeway and Lucky's, workers at Walmart Neighborhood Markets aren't unionized.

"Walmart's new move into the traditional grocery store sector is a departure in tactics on their part and a direct threat to our members in the grocery industry," said Ron Lind, President of UFCW Local 5. "Thousands of good jobs and the livelihood of tens of thousands of our members are jeopardized by Walmart's plans. We intend on fighting this threat with every ounce of our strength."

FULL story at link.

Chief Big Weeper must not worry much about grocery prices.

leveymg (20,938 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

2. Antitrust laws were made for Walmart. Whatever happened to them?

View profile

There should be 20 separate unionized Walmarts, competing on price, quality, and service against each other. That would probably put another 250,000 Americans back to work, at decent wages, right there.

RKP5637 (17,724 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

4. This is a nation full of monopolies anymore IMO. They seem a cruel joke today.

Walmart being one prime example. AT&T, Comcast, Verizon plus the huge media companies and many others. Congressmen will do/ignore anything for a buck today, apparently, in our 10% approval rated congress.

Honeycombe8 (9,298 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

7. There's one near me. I don't think there's a way to stop Walmart. How?

RKP5637 (17,724 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

8. Walmart is like a cancer.

Honeycombe8 (9,298 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

12. I shop at Walmart. Most people do. If everyone you know tells you they don't, some of them are...

some of them are lying. At one time or another, the majority of people in America who live within several miles of a Walmart (or have access to internet shopping), shop at Walmart.

They have a great inventory, great prices, and good business model (shipping has been fast for my online buys). Where else am I going to buy from? Target? People on DU hate Target,too. Home Depot? People on DU hate Home Depot, too. Is Best Buy okay? That's where I bought my new TV, because they beat Walmart's price. I also bought my first mp3 player there, on sale.

I also belong to Sam's Club (Walmart).

For groceries, I frequent Albertson's nearby, but because it's pricey (it caters to the millionaire homes nearby), I shop for food at food sections of Target and Sam's, usually, sometimes venturing to walmart, but Walmart Foodmart is further away.

jsmirman (1,588 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

13. What do you think of the standard criticisms of Walmart?

I'm pretty well convinced that they treat their workforce terribly and treat women even worse.

Walmart v. Dukes may well have been correctly decided, but what came out of that case was enough to convince me that Walmart has systematically discriminated against women (the lawsuit just went for too much and in the wrong way).

I can honestly say I have never shopped at a Walmart, but geography probably did most of the work.

franksolich doesn't shop at Wal-Mart either, for geographical reasons.

The places are just too damned big for the five or six items I want to get.

It's ridiculous to have to trod over 640 acres just to buy $5.43 worth of goods; I'm happy to pay the extra six cents or whatever the price difference is, at a smaller place where one doesn't need to wear hiking boots.

But if others like Wal-Mart, hey, it's all good.  More power to them.

Honeycombe8 (9,298 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

17. I'm confused as to why so many DUers hate WalMart.

I haven't seen any info to convince me that WalMart has discriminated against women. As for the union thing, I don't know what to think about it, really. A lot of businesses are not union, which they have a right to be. I actually wasn't aware of the union issue until recently. I will read up on that.

I will say that WalMart tried to open a SuperMart near me (a big, sprawling place with both the dry goods AND the foomart in it). Right now what they have are two separate smaller stores about one block from ea. other, several miles north of me. The SuperMart was slated to be built several miles SOUTH of me. It had to be voted on either by voters directly, or via our City Council. I forget which. WalMart mailed out pretty, colorful spec drawings of the SuperMart, with parking outlined, and trees (to make it fit the area in appearance), etc. I joined with other local residents in objecting to it...either by petitioning our Councilman or voting against it. So the SuperMart failed, which I'm glad of. I mean, how many WalMarts do we NEED?

As for the women discrimination thing, the impression I got, and it was just an impression since I didn't have all the facts, led me to think that the women actually performed their jobs differently, and that's why they weren't promoted as often. I forget what the women did differently, though. I remember thinking that it didn't make sense that WalMart wouldn't promote a good, reliable hard worker because of gender, because all WalMart cares about, really, is profit. I didn't think WalMart would care one iota what color, what gender, or what ethnicity the worker was, as long as s/he showed up, worked long hours, did hard work, didn't complain, etc.

I'll read up on it more, though. It's hard to know all the facts in a big lawsuit...there are a lot of facts that go into a lawsuit like that (I work in litigation at a law firm, so I know how complicated it can be).

jsmirman (1,588 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

20. As to the lawsuit the thing I took away is that there really was a policy in place that not only led to discrimination against good female workers, who were still discriminated against because the "one of us" ethos at walmart meant men promoting men - but that central HQ was well-aware of the issue. Walmart wouldn't spell out the policy, but as much as they had difficulty aggregating that class (I don't know why they had to draw it that broadly, I actually found their statistics compelling, if a bit creative in approach. It seemed a safe takeaway was that women weren't getting promoted at the same rates as men, and that more qualified women were frequently passed over. The fight from there is was there an intentional policy in place and so on, and I think the case was pretty strong that Walmart HQ knew what was going on, and if "the walmart way" had this totally unacceptable result, well, it was far from unacceptable to them.

But that class was always going to get broken apart. I don't think many of us thought they had a real chance with the SC. The SC, for one, is getting better on this, but is not going to grab onto innovative statistical ways of representing a situation, but the problems with the class in the class action were going to be very hard to justify to the Court.

Honeycombe8 (9,298 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

18. Okay, I've read up on WalMart, Target, Kroger, Albertson's, & Costco

Yeah, WalMart sounds pretty bad. Very upsetting how they treat their workers. Target sounds even worse. That's where I do most of my shopping, household and food. Albertson's is not union in TX, but sounds like things are better there than WalMart or Target. Kroger is union.

I read up on Costco, and it sounds a lot better than Sam's Club, as far as pay and benefits for its workers. But the nearest Costco to me is miles away. They sell online, but I've looked, and they don't carry the daily sort of household things I buy, like sheets and things. It's a higher-brow store.

I'm afraid that WalMart has cornered teh market around here, in some ways. But I could food shop at Kroger w/o much inconvenience. And I could make the drive to Costco on occasion, decreasing my shopping at Sam's. But I'm stuck as far as frequent household shopping to either WalMart or Target, it looks like. Grocery stores are too expensive for pet treats, clothes detergent, & such.

jsmirman (1,588 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

19. One does what they can

I mean, like I said, crazy enough, I just have never been very close to a walmart. The cities I've lived in just haven't been the kind of cities walmart's going to force their way into, or at least not into the neighborhoods I've lived in. So I haven't even had the temptation. My family shopped a bit at Costco, back in the day, but it's been a while.

Another thing - for me - about Walmart is that they've got pretty terrible animal welfare practices when it comes to the food at Walmart (and Sam's Club, I believe).

And one thing I didn't mention is that the friend I mentioned at the beginning of this - is an animal person, specifically a horse-welfare advocate. It will come up at some point. My first means of reestablishing contact is through our facebook friendship, but I'm scared to click on her page because I get this one well-meaning but soul-destroying animal-related cause thing that I would truly kill myself if I contemplated too constantly.

I can say that when we were down in Florida for HS baseball spring training, I sure did love my Kroger, as we'd stock the crappy motel rooms with this and that.

One alternative is definitely buying online just from the general internet- have you checked the prices on all that? There are some really cheap ways to get pet stuff on line (same products, of course), and even like a drugstore.com has pretty good prices on detergent, etc.

One tries, that's always the best starting point.

Leopolds Ghost (11,492 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

15. Well, you only have 5 stores to choose from, that's like living in Soviet Russia.

But I don't imagine most Americans will understand this because they weren't alive when a "free market" existed in this country with lots of local stores to choose from. So they're like a frog in a pot, believing they have a choice because they have two stores to choose from -- in ten different locations.

When the free market in groceries existed, say circa 1960, the average household spent 33% of its income on groceries.

Now, circa 2010, it's less than 10%, something like 8%, and that includes eat-out too, an addition not used in computing the earlier average percentage.

Honeycombe8 (9,298 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

16. Unfortunately, I'm old enough to remember no WalMarts, no fast food places.

That's right, folks. There was a time when there weren't fast food places in smaller cities and towns. A Church's Chicken opened up in my small city, as well as a couple of burger joints, when I was in my teens.

I first saw a WalMart...not sure when...when I moved to Dallas in 1985, I think. A WalMart was finally built in my home city in the 90's, I think it was.

My choices for food are (listed in order of nearness to me): Albertson's (caters to millionaires), Target food section, Sam's Club, WalMart Foodmart, Kroger's, Tom Thumb (caters to millionaires and mega-millionaires). I used to shop at Kroger's, when there was one close to me, but it closed. I live in an area that is close to a couple of VERY ritzy areas, which is why 2 of the stores are pricey.

w8liftinglady (22,022 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

11. We are seeing this in my town,too.

They are building a wal Mart directly in front of our Brookshires.We are a "right-to-work" state,but Brookshires is employee owned,pays good wages and healthcare for it's staff.

This will ruin them.There has to be a limit set on where Walmart can build.

[NHSparky]

Wait a sec, coach--wasn't UFCW the ones who, several years ago in the hot summer sun of Las Vegas, paid "protestors" something like $6/hr to demonstrate the evils of WalMart?

Of course, said "protestors" weren't given water, shade, sunblock, or other protective clothing to spare them the harsh Nevada climate, while the folks they were protesting against were inside, making $8-9/hr minimum, with far better working conditions that those "concerned" union folks were getting.

And I still recall the grocery strike in CA about a decade ago (2003?) when UFCW went on strike because the cashiers and bologna slicers might be (gasp!) FORCED to pay $5 co-pays for their doctor visits.  After six months of intimidating and assaulting customers, they went back to work, the grocery chains having met NONE of the union demands.  But of course, the union leadership was still pulling down their $200K/year-plus salary the whole time, while the bologna slicers were stuck with $100/week strike pay.

[Karin]

The only time I hate Walmart is around the first of the month. 

[NHSparky]

The only time I hate Walmart is around the first of the month. 

Ah, but see, that's the most entertaining time to go.  Don't buy anything, just watch all the EBT ri-tards. 

[Rebel]

Oh, I get it, they're only pro-choice when it comes to killing babies. Giving people a choice between stores, well, **** them. You exist to provide me with a job, damnit!

F'n fascists.

[Rugnuts]

we need more walmarts

[Chris_]

we need more walmarts

or fewer liberals.

[Karin]

Ah, but see, that's the most entertaining time to go.  Don't buy anything, just watch all the EBT ri-tards. 

You know, Sparky, I've found it to be too depressing.  This is becoming the forefront issue in my thinking.  The free shit is out of control, the loafing and mooching is pervasive, any stigma or shame has been completely removed and we are headed toward Greece.  I'm sick of it, but I don't know what to do about it. 

 

[Ballygrl]

The overwhelming majority of people in NYC want a Walmart, the Unions don't, so screw the people:

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2011/07/28/poll-most-new-yorkers-would-shop-at-local-walmart/

A majority of New York City voters support Walmart opening stores in the Big Apple, according to a recent poll.

In a Quinnipiac University poll released Thursday, 69 percent of the respondents said they would shop at a Walmart in the city if it was convenient, while 63 percent said city officials should allow a local Walmart to open.

[Tucker]

http://www.google.com/search?q=people+of+walmart&hl=en&client=firefox&hs=7rP&rls=com.yahoo:en-US:official&prmd=imvns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=kGM-T7u0A4TtggfhobWJCA&ved=0CHoQsAQ&biw=1040&bih=595

People of Walmart.

[Skul]

The actual reason for the whining.

Omaha Steve (31,289 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore
>snip<
What concerns the union is, unlike Safeway and Lucky's, workers at Walmart Neighborhood Markets aren't unionized.

"Walmart's new move into the traditional grocery store sector is a departure in tactics on their part and a direct threat to our members in the grocery industry," said Ron Lind, President of UFCW Local 5. "Thousands of good jobs and the livelihood of tens of thousands of our members are jeopardizedBS flag by Walmart's plans. We intend on fighting this threat with every ounce of our strength."

Translation to the last...
We intend on fighting this threat to our cash cow, and ability to squeeze money from our members.

[TVDOC]

I think the best "cut off your nose to spite your face" Walmart story is Chicago.........several years ago Walmart wanted to build stores in Chicago, and petitioned the city for approval.  Even after offering to make millions in neighborhood improvements to the store areas, none costing the Chicago taxpayers a dime......the city held out....."no union....no Walmart.......".

So........Walmart found a run-down postwar incorporated suburban community just outside the Chicago city limits, built a huge Superstore, and a few years later the entire community is transformed.......with millions in sales tax income from this one Walmart store, they are rebuilding schools, parks, repaving long-neglected streets, and repairing sidewalks, as well as building a new public library, and a new city hall.......all because of Walmart......and Chicago doesn't get a dime, even though most of the shoppers that frequent the store come from Chicago.

Karma's a bitch.....

doc

[delilahmused]

Walmart's one of the few stores that will build in small towns (Cottage Grove is under 10,000). I have an option I wouldn't otherwise. I still shop at local mom & pop places because I get great service, want to support my local economy and in some cases the prices are lower.

Cindie

[GOBUCKS]

"Chicago" doesn't care. The mob gets its cut no matter where a business is in the metro area. Keeping WalMart out of the city proper is a sop to nitwits like the Weeper.

[TVDOC]

Walmart's one of the few stores that will build in small towns (Cottage Grove is under 10,000). I have an option I wouldn't otherwise. I still shop at local mom & pop places because I get great service, want to support my local economy and in some cases the prices are lower.

Cindie

That's really how they started out decades ago when Sam was still alive and calling the shots.  Their business model was to select small rural communities, with populations between 8 and 15,000 to build their stores.  As time went on, they started building in larger and larger communities.....the big cities are a recent addition.

doc

[TVDOC]

"Chicago" doesn't care. The mob gets its cut no matter where a business is in the metro area. Keeping WalMart out of the city proper is a sop to nitwits like the Weeper.

In this case the mob got screwed......the Uniondale (I think) store was built with non-union labor, Walmart secured contractors from all over the midwest to build it......even their trash hauling is contracted to a non-union company in Elgin.  And of course, they use their own (non-union) drivers and trucks to supply them.

Walmart offered to build the Chicago stores with union labor.......just non-union employees, but that wasn't good enough.

doc

[redwhit]

This is where I get confused:

Wal-mart is supposed to treat its workers horribly.  Wal-mart is non-union. 

Organizations that treat employees badly go union.  That's the way it works.  It's not like the unions are an exclusive club; private sector unions are screaming for more population.  Union reps are no doubt champing at the bit to charge in and start convincing Wal-mart employees that they need to be a part of the union label.

Yet that's not happening.  Wal-mart remains staunchly non-union.  The only conclusions that I can come to are:

1. Unions don't want Wal-mart or

2. Wal-mart workers are actually ok with the way they are treated and see no need to add unions to the mix.

[TVDOC]

2. Wal-mart workers are actually OK with the way they are treated and see no need to add unions to the mix.

I'm no expert, but I think the above-quoted portion of your post is the correct answer......it's my understanding that Walmart treats their employees quite well.  They pay fair wages (I doubt that any Walmart employee makes just minimum wage), provide a buffet of benefit plans, plus bonuses and profit-sharing based on unit performance.  

Walmart also gives preferences to hiring veterans, disabled persons, and those that are retired, and wishing to supplement their income.  Further, they always allow charities such as DAV and Salvation Army to use their facilities to solicit donations.

Little things, like allowing RV owners to use their unused parking facilities to stay overnight are appreciated and used by many travellers.

The Chicago store that I discussed above, when it opened, they advertised for (if I remember correctly) 500 new employees, and received over 8,000 applicants......they were up to their collective necks in folks wanting to go to work for them.  Not really the mark of an employer that abuses their staff......

The DUmmie thread above gets all bogged down in ONE lawsuit involving alledged female discrimination....however, when you are as large as Walmart, and (I think) is the largest single employer in the US.....you're bound to have at least one disgruntled employee occasionally.......it's inevitable.

doc

[AprilRazz]

One of the Neighborhood Markets opened up here a while back. And I have to admit I really like it. While I don't care for their meat because for some reason it always has an odd texture. Their prices on a lot of other things really good. They have even beaten the commissary on certain items. It's clean and it's not anywhere near as crowded as a normal Walmart so I can get out of there pretty fast. All the workers seem pretty happy and they get tons of job applications every day.I guess that whole nonunion thing is really a big deal around here.

[Chris_]

One of the Neighborhood Markets opened up here a while back. And I have to admit I really like it. While I don't care for their meat because for some reason it always has an odd texture.

The Neighborhood Market here changed their meat department.  Now they're selling the same quality of beef I usually get from Kroger or Publix.  No more of that funky brined stuff. 

I like Albertson's, but the one here is closing.

[redwhit]

I'm no expert, but I think the above-quoted portion of your post is the correct answer......it's my understanding that Walmart treats their employees quite well.  They pay fair wages (I doubt that any Walmart employee makes just minimum wage), provide a buffet of benefit plans, plus bonuses and profit-sharing based on unit performance. 

doc

Yeah, I'm no expert either but I know enough to be able to see that rarely does an organization get a union without richly deserving it (govt unions excepted here - I don't know the story behind that well enough).  It's just the basic contradiction that keeps confusing me.  

I'm probably making it too complicated.  It's another example of a self-appointed, self-righteous group insisting it know how to live your life better than you do.  

[TVDOC]

Yeah, I'm no expert either but I know enough to be able to see that rarely does an organization get a union without richly deserving it (govt unions excepted here - I don't know the story behind that well enough).  It's just the basic contradiction that keeps confusing me.  

I'm probably making it too complicated.  It's another example of a self-appointed, self-righteous group insisting it know how to live your life better than you do.  

Well.....perhaps to clarify it for you.......the DUmmies generally, and "progressives" specifically are all about control......it disturbs them greatly to see an enterprise (not just Walmart.....they're just the biggest target) that is successful without union involvement, or government subsidies and a great overburden of regulation.  To them, AMTRAK and USPS is an example of how a business should be run.  

An enterprise whose management is completely free to make any and all decisions on operations without consulting unions or the government is an anathema to them.  It's the shadow of the old Marxist/Leninist concept that the "workers" should be in charge, rearing its ugly head.

They perceive such successful enterprises as "evil" and "greedy"......they never consider that companies like Walmart are publically owned, and anyone (even a DUmmie) is perfectly free to call their broker and buy ownership in the company, thus sharing in their success......it simply doesn't compute in their small bigoted minds.

It's a mental disorder.......

doc

[miskie]

This is where I get confused:

Wal-mart is supposed to treat its workers horribly.  Wal-mart is non-union. 

Organizations that treat employees badly go union.  That's the way it works.  It's not like the unions are an exclusive club; private sector unions are screaming for more population.  Union reps are no doubt champing at the bit to charge in and start convincing Wal-mart employees that they need to be a part of the union label.

Yet that's not happening.  Wal-mart remains staunchly non-union.  The only conclusions that I can come to are:

1. Unions don't want Wal-mart or

2. Wal-mart workers are actually ok with the way they are treated and see no need to add unions to the mix.

This is where the union argument always falls apart.

If the non-union store is terrible to work at, it will be forced to (pick one)

A ) Unionize.
B ) Improve its employee/public relations - including pay, benefits, etc.
C ) Close.

Since (statistically speaking) none of these things happen, its safe to assume that Walmart employees receive competitive pay and benefits - else they would leave for the nearest union retail giant, or they would mobilize. It seems to me, the only people consistently losing out because of Walmart are the unions themselves.

[Airwolf]

So is this another one of OmahaSteves brilliant platforms to run on? Wal Mart in Bellevue is one of the biggest employers outside of Offutt AFB.  Makes one wonder way OmahaSteve is attacking them and posting about something that has nothing if little to do with his city.