The Conservative Cave
Interests => The Science Club => Topic started by: CG6468 on April 23, 2012, 08:02:07 AM
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Sun may soon have four poles, say researchers
April 20, 2012
By SEIJI TANAKA/ Staff Writer
The sun may be entering a period of reduced activity that could result in lower temperatures on Earth, according to Japanese researchers.
Officials of the National Astronomical Observatory of Japan and the Riken research foundation said on April 19 that the activity of sunspots appeared to resemble a 70-year period in the 17th century in which London’s Thames froze over and cherry blossoms bloomed later than usual in Kyoto.
In that era, known as the Maunder Minimum, temperatures are estimated to have been about 2.5 degrees lower than in the second half of the 20th century.
Is it snuggling time in the valley? (http://ajw.asahi.com/article/behind_news/social_affairs/AJ201204200075)
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THOU SHALT NOT DEFY THE GOREACLE!
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ManBearPig AlGore needs to fly right over to the sun, and fix those sunspots, and get this global warming bandwagon's wheels back on.
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4 poles?
I don't even know what that means?!?
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4 poles?
I don't even know what that means?!?
As opposed to 6 Italians, I guess.
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As opposed to 6 Italians, I guess.
Exactly how many it takes to water a donkey.
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Exactly how many it takes to water a donkey.
Are you ASSuming something?
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Are you ASSuming something?
No, because I live in a NY burro.
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No, because I live in a NY burro.
uh....don't you mean NY barrio? :-)
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uh....don't you mean NY barrio? :-)
No, he lives IN a burro, where it's nice and warm year-round.
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No, he lives IN a burro, where it's nice and warm year-round.
Yeah, he lives there until he's evicted by those burro farts. They're really nasty at this time of year.
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Yeah, he lives there until he's evicted by those burro farts. They're really nasty at this time of year.
There was a cart accident in NYC. At first they said it was the driver's fault, but then they found out that it was the asphalt.
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There was a cart accident in NYC. At first they said it was the driver's fault, but then they found out that it was the asphalt.
Next thing I know, you'll be telling me there's an earthquake on Manhattan and it's the fault's fault.
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Next thing I know, you'll be telling me there's an earthquake on Manhattan and it's the fault's fault.
You trying to crack me up?
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Sun may soon have four poles, say researchers
Maybe so, but can it dance?
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Maybe so, but can it dance?
No, but it can vault, 4 times as high.
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You trying to crack me up?
With earth-splitting humor, you bet!
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With earth-splitting humor, you bet!
You wear your humor "mantle" loosely
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You wear your humor "mantle" loosely
Yeah, but you're keeping your crusty commentary coming along nicely. So much so that the tremors in the ground are detectable - prolly around a 1.6 on the Richter Scale.
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Yeah, but you're keeping your crusty commentary coming along nicely. So much so that the tremors in the ground are detectable - prolly around a 1.6 on the Richter Scale.
I'm sure you are humorous at your "core".
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I'm sure you are humorous at your "core".
An iron core that is, surrounded by animal magnetism.
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An iron core that is, surrounded by animal magnetism.
Are you sure it isn't "Magma" tism ?
Dr. Evil (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0fPyydxumk)
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Are you sure it isn't "Magma" tism ?
Dr. Evil (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0fPyydxumk)
After that aural rape, I ain't sure of anything except that my anti-rap device is busted.
Congratulations. I'm naked to the world. Utterly defenseless. Woe is me.
My life is in ashes.
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After that aural rape, I ain't sure of anything except that my anti-rap device is busted.
Congratulations. I'm naked to the world. Utterly defenseless. Woe is me.
My life is in ashes.
No Problemo, just wash it off with some pumice. That's a little hispanic lingo there.
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I need to steel myself against this ironic chatter.
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Stop laughing for just a minute.
Last night, PBS had a program about the sun. One thing they mentioned was a solar flare in 1859 that was real bad. If we had a similar one now, it could shut down the national electric grid. It could burn out transformer and cause us to be in the dark for months, possibly years. Oh, and the sun's magnetic poles flip every 7 years.
Now back to your regularly scheduled laughing.
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Stop laughing for just a minute.
Last night, PBS had a program about the sun. One thing they mentioned was a solar flare in 1859 that was real bad. If we had a similar one now, it could shut down the national electric grid. It could burn out transformer and cause us to be in the dark for months, possibly years. Oh, and the sun's magnetic poles flip every 7 years.
Now back to your regularly scheduled laughing.
Didn't see the program, but a big solar flare, or one that came directly at the earth, could be devastating, knocking out all satellite operations (including the Internet, GPS, TV programming, and even short wave communications.) I'm really uncomfortable that the world has become so dependent on satellite communications.
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Stop laughing for just a minute.
Last night, PBS had a program about the sun. One thing they mentioned was a solar flare in 1859 that was real bad. If we had a similar one now, it could shut down the national electric grid. It could burn out transformer and cause us to be in the dark for months, possibly years. Oh, and the sun's magnetic poles flip every 7 years.
Now back to your regularly scheduled laughing.
1859
* Nine years after California became the 31st state.
* The year Oregon becomes the 33rd state.
* Two years before the American Civil War
* Eleven years before Edison built the DC generator
* Seventeen years before Alexander Graham Bell invents the telephone.
We had had the telegraph for about 15 years. But man, we were stylin' with that telegraph!
In early September 1859, telegraph wires suddenly shorted out in the United States and Europe, igniting widespread fires. Colorful aurora, normally visible only in polar regions, were seen as far south as Rome and Hawaii.
In 1859, what caused the solar storm to be so strong was a number of factors. The Coronal Mass Ejection (CME) traveled at exceptionally high speeds. It took only 17 hours and 40 minutes to go from the Sun to Earth." Solar storms typically take two to four days to traverse the 93 million miles. The magnetic polarization was exceptionally intense and, even more importantly, the magnetic field was oriented opposite to that of earth's fields. In 1859 the earth's natural magnetic defenses were overwhelmed.
During the 1859 solar flare-up, solar observers logged almost an entire minute during which the amount of sunlight doubled at the region of the flare. "Such a strong white-light flare has never been seen since," says Paal Brekke, SOHO deputy project scientist. "So if this type of flare happened, yes we would know right away."[1 (http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/mystery_monday_031027.html)].
This solar storm in 1859 was 3 times the size of anything we've seen in modern memory:
- — In 1989, the sun unleashed a tempest that knocked out power to all of Quebec, Canada.
- — A remarkable (http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/xtreme_flare_031105.html) 2003 rampage included 10 major solar flares over a two-week period, knocking out two Earth-orbiting satellites and crippling an instrument aboard a Mars orbiter.
The Scale of the 1859 Storm:
- To get an idea of the strength of the 1859 storm, you have to wade into nT's for a moment.
A space storm's impact is measured in nano-Teslas (nT), Brekke explained. The lower the figure, the more powerful the storm. A moderate storm can be around -100 nT; extreme and damaging storms have been logged at around -300 nT.
The 1989 coronal mass ejection that knocked out power to all of Quebec, Canada measured -589 nT, Brekke said. The 1859 perfect storm was estimated to have been -1,760 nT. Brekke used three exclamation points in his e-mail delivering that number.
People on the ground are generally safe even in the worst space weather. But technology could be in trouble when the next super storm hits. [2 (http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/mystery_monday_031027.html)]
2012
The next peak in solar activity is expected to come sometime around 2012 (http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/081107-new-sunspots.html).
In January 2009 a study from the National Academy of Sciences outlines grim possibilities on Earth for a worst-case scenario solar storm. [3 (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,478024,00.html)]
The U.S. power grid could be shut down for months.
Damage to power grids and other communications systems could be catastrophic, the scientists conclude, with effects leading to a potential loss of governmental control of the situation.
Anyone noticed conspicuous activity of the U.S. government regarding martial law lately?
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Jesus, that tinfoil on your head is cutting off circulation to your ****ing brain, Trip.
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Jesus, that tinfoil on your head is cutting off circulation to your ****ing brain, Trip.
So I cite nothing but referenced facts, no speculation whatsoever, and you find some way insert tin foil and conspiranoia?
Maybe you missed our Fascist-in-Chief's recent Presidential Directive regarding martial law ... even in time of peace, and the fact that what the U.S. government has been doing lately is considerably beyond SOP.
The speculation here is that you've a brain of your own; it does have a valid use beyond being a place-holder. I wish you the best O'luck with that.
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So I cite nothing but referenced facts, no speculation whatsoever, and you find some way insert tin foil and conspiranoia?
Maybe you missed our Fascist-in-Chief's recent Presidential Directive regarding martial law ... even in time of peace, and the fact that what the U.S. government has been doing lately is considerably beyond SOP.
The speculation here is that you've a brain of your own; it does have a valid use beyond being a place-holder. I wish you the best O'luck with that.
Actually Trip, you would be better off to leave a comment like this out
Anyone noticed conspicuous activity of the U.S. government regarding martial law lately?
The above from you is nothing but speculation, just stick to the facts and nobody will mention conspiracy or tin foil.
Also please inform me of the exact SOP the goverment uses.
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WOW! MARTIAL LAW!!
I'm anxious to see documented proof of this! And not some shit from a lib site, either.
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Actually Trip, you would be better off to leave a comment like this out
The above from you is nothing but speculation, just stick to the facts and nobody will mention conspiracy or tin foil.
Also please inform me of the exact SOP the goverment uses.
You must have missed the executive order on March 13th, The National Defense Resources Preparedness Executive Order, that gave the President the unilateral ability to declare martial law in time of peace, only for the assertion of a national security interest, and capability to take possession of any private property, and to nationalize any industry deemed appropriate. Naaa, no problems here at all.
Then there's the NDAA, and the more recent push for Internet security that even has the lefties over at ACLU in an uproar.
And this may be of news, but the operative SOP for the U.S. Government is generally referred to as the "U.S. Constitution".
It's not at all 'speculation', though it does require a minimal degree of awareness as to what is going on.
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You must have missed the executive order on March 13th, The National Defense Resources Preparedness Executive Order, that gave the President the unilateral ability to declare martial law in time of peace, only for the assertion of a national security interest, and capability to take possession of any private property, and to nationalize any industry deemed appropriate.
Then there's the NDAA, and the more recent push for Internet security that even has the lefties over at CLU in an uproar.
And this may be of news, but the operative SOP for the U.S. Government is generally referred to as the "U.S. Constitution".
I guess you were preoccupied with American Idol and fishing for navel lint...
Okay this is your only warning on this.
Stick to the facts and the op. The op has nothing to do with martial law or executive orders. This is the end of that subject matter in this forum. If you can't stick to the facts, then don't post. You want to post things about executive orders that have been around a lot longer than Obama and specualtion on them knowing that a massive solar flare is coming and are making plans.........post it in the correct forum.
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Okay this is your only warning on this.
Stick to the facts and the op. The op has nothing to do with martial law or executive orders. This is the end of that subject matter in this forum. If you can't stick to the facts, then don't post. You want to post things about executive orders that have been around a lot longer than Obama and specualtion on them knowing that a massive solar flare is coming and are making plans.........post it in the correct forum.
Crazy Horse, it seems that some have misunderstood the intent of my vague reference in one sentence to "martial law". For that I apologize.
I have no intention whatsoever to discuss "martial law" in this thread, nor its progressive enablement over a series of administrations going back as far as the 1950's. Also when I indicated "....activity ... regarding martial law", I was not in any way referencing its current implementation. I guess I can see how the phrase might be misinterpreted to involve some sort of current enactment, however such an interpretation really does not fit in with anything I had said previously, nor the discussion of a possible future impact of a strong solar storm, making that interpretation extremely out of context.
I simply was recognizing "the fact" of the ability to enact of Martial law, in the event of social collapse. Believing anything more than this is only the reader projecting an interpretation that I did not intend to indicate, and nowhere even implied.
Crazy Horse, given your own recognition that the ability enact martial law has existed across numerous Presidential administrations, I would submit that you also recognize the potential to institute martial law as "a fact", and not merely some fanciful fabrication.
My vague, one sentence, reference to martial law, was only the logical extension from the cited reference immediately prior to my comment, of a 2009 study commissioned by NASA, undertaken by the National Academy of Sciences, and reported by FOX News, entitled "Powerful Solar Storm Could Shut Down U.S. for Months" (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,478024,00.html#ixzz1teiUQIuI):
- Heading: 'Command and control might be lost'
Such widespread power outages, though expected to be a rare possibility, would affect other vital systems.
"Impacts would be felt on interdependent infrastructures with, for example, potable water distribution affected within several hours; perishable foods and medications lost in 12-24 hours; immediate or eventual loss of heating/air conditioning, sewage disposal, phone service, transportation, fuel resupply and so on," the report states.
Outages could take months to fix, the researchers say. Banks might close, and trade with other countries might halt.
"Emergency services would be strained, and command and control might be lost," write the researchers, led by Daniel Baker, director of the Laboratory for Atmospheric and Space Physics at the University of Colorado in Boulder.
While the enactment of martial law is not specifically referenced by this FOX article, I am secure in the fact that conditions resulting in the simultaneous collapse of power, food, water, medicine, banking, communication, and transportation systems, all of which are referenced, necessitates the institution of martial law. It is no great leap that the "loss of command and control" requires the enablement of some other system of command and control, with such a system obviously being martial law itself.
I apologize if my vague reference to "martial law" gave the impression I somehow intended to discuss the political merits of martial law in a science forum, or seemed to imply that martial law was in any way being implemented at this time. Neither of those were ever my intent.
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Trip, get the **** off of my thread. Start your own if you want to keep it up.
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:panic: Trip's entire world is immersed in conspiracy and doomsday theories. :panic:
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:panic: Trip's entire world is immersed in conspiracy and doomsday theories. :panic:
I hate it when someone hijacks my thread. :hammer:
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I hate it when someone hijacks my thread. :hammer:
BOOBIEZ!
(http://www.tropicsgirls.com/headers/fiesta-string-bikini.jpg)
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<<<<<SIGHHHHH>>>>>
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I hate it when someone hijacks my thread. :hammer:
Hijack your thread.. you mean by actually discussing science? And keep what up, exactly? What cause do you have for such vitriol?
In the first 25 responses to your thread, not-a-one beyond EagleKeeper had any real contribution to the subject matter except feeble attempts at humor. Your own contribution to the thread in the OP itself, beyond referencing a brief article, was to indicate it was "snuggle time". No one has even addressed what the implications of "four poles" might be for earth, which is the topic of the thread, but not anywhere actually referenced in your OP.
My only "guilt" here is to respond factually, with supporting references, to JohnnyReb's comment about the 1859 CME, You also chose to respond to JonnhyReb's comment about that CME, but seemed to limit the scope of the damage to "electronic communications". My response was intending to demonstrate the scope of that possible disaster extends well beyond just electronic communications... and, yes, even involves the possibility of the need to institute martial law.
One would think you'd actually be grateful... unless you believe the purpose of "your thread" is to display a command of double entendres ... in the name of 'science'.
And generally, if anyone believes my post has anything to do with "conspiracy" or unsupported "doomsday theories", then their beef is with NASA, the National Academy of Sciences, and a whole array of science institutions, not with me.
Here's an article from NASA detailing just how interconnected and vulnerable our infrastructure is to a large CME:
Severe Space Weather: Social and Economic Impacts (http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2009/21jan_severespaceweather/).
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Well, far be it from me to wade in on a science topic (I'm a musician, after all, and what I know about science could fill a thimble -- maybe), but as we're now slinging shit around, I figure I can get involved with that activity too.
I'll probably get some of that stuck to me, but oh, well. That's what soap was made for.
Trip, in reviewing the OP, it would be my own perception based on several months of good-natured ribbing and humor that CG and I, and others, have routinely engaged in -- never "feeble", mind you, sometimes rather gut-busting if I say so myself -- that CG's OP had NOTHING to do with science.
It had to do with glowbull warming. You know, that chicanery that some of the more unscrupulous "scientists" have engaged in in order to further their respective agendas.
But I dare say, you wouldn't be in tune with that, since you have used this web site for your own personal depository for all manner of science -- most of which is far beyond me.
You see, I like to learn a thing or three while on these pages and don't normally have a problem with somebody swooping in and making grandiose, scientific statements once in awhile. Gives me pause to think about the subject at hand.
So it ain't all bad -- just a little unsettling at times.
But don't talk trash about how some of us make light of "science" --
Or the utter lack of it.
Have a great day!
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Here is an interesting commentary on the "Carrington Effect", named for the British Astronomer Richard Carrington, who witnessed the 1859 CME event.
Warning: This will likely be the only warning you will get! (http://www.chuckharder.com/warning.html)
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Actually Trip, you would be better off to leave a comment like this out
The above from you is nothing but speculation, just stick to the facts and nobody will mention conspiracy or tin foil.
Also please inform me of the exact SOP the goverment uses.
:popcorn:
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Okay this is your only warning on this.
Stick to the facts and the op. The op has nothing to do with martial law or executive orders. This is the end of that subject matter in this forum. If you can't stick to the facts, then don't post. You want to post things about executive orders that have been around a lot longer than Obama and specualtion on them knowing that a massive solar flare is coming and are making plans.........post it in the correct forum.
He won't do it. You've shown him and made him look bad...hence the retarded cheap shots at the end of his last couple posts....now his ego won't let him do anything else but post long winded sermons on how right he is and how stupid the rest of us are.
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He won't do it. You've shown him and made him look bad...hence the retarded cheap shots at the end of his last couple posts....now his ego won't let him do anything else but post long winded sermons on how right he is and how stupid the rest of us are.
The same could be said for owebuma.
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I see that most here have no grasp on the concept of what a diffusion of the suns magnetic field would have on the earth.
So let me enlighten you a bit if i may. Here is an exercise that will show you what dangers there are.
Take a compass and set it on your kitchen table. then take two magnets with opposing polarity just far enough apart you can old them still and then slide them nearer the compass. The end result is a vassolating effect of the compass (which is another magnet). Now imagine the earth doing what that compass is doing rapidly.
This will result in earth wobble, rapid change in weather and wind patterns, tide changes, oceanic water flows... etc...
You all make lite of the potential problems while they could be potentially devastating to the earth and its INHABITANTS! Sadly when the sun goes into one of these states the geologic history shows the earth receives massive CME blasts due to the suns instability. This also weakens the earths magnetic field making it more prone to CME effect. The Wobbles change patterns on the earth and generally precede ice ages..
While Trip's posts are lengthy, he is dead on accurate... take the time to read his links, after all this is supposed to be a forum about science... disparagement helps no one...
PS: geologic time scales are interesting animals except when an ice age starts. they start abruptly and in as short as 30 years spans.. were at 15 now with no warming... 1998 is when the suns instability started... Food for thought..
Sea Ice increasing massively this year..
http://wattsupwiththat.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/n_stddev_timeseries2.png
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I see that most here have no grasp on the concept of what a diffusion of the suns magnetic field would have on the earth.
:yawn:
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:yawn:
Yawning wont help you...
Ignorance by choice? bad move... IMHO
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Hijack your thread.. you mean by actually discussing science? And keep what up, exactly? What cause do you have for such vitriol?
In the first 25 responses to your thread, not-a-one beyond EagleKeeper had any real contribution to the subject matter except feeble attempts at humor. Your own contribution to the thread in the OP itself, beyond referencing a brief article, was to indicate it was "snuggle time". No one has even addressed what the implications of "four poles" might be for earth, which is the topic of the thread, but not anywhere actually referenced in your OP.
My only "guilt" here is to respond factually, with supporting references, to JohnnyReb's comment about the 1859 CME, You also chose to respond to JonnhyReb's comment about that CME, but seemed to limit the scope of the damage to "electronic communications". My response was intending to demonstrate the scope of that possible disaster extends well beyond just electronic communications... and, yes, even involves the possibility of the need to institute martial law.
One would think you'd actually be grateful... unless you believe the purpose of "your thread" is to display a command of double entendres ... in the name of 'science'.
And generally, if anyone believes my post has anything to do with "conspiracy" or unsupported "doomsday theories", then their beef is with NASA, the National Academy of Sciences, and a whole array of science institutions, not with me.
Here's an article from NASA detailing just how interconnected and vulnerable our infrastructure is to a large CME:
Severe Space Weather: Social and Economic Impacts (http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2009/21jan_severespaceweather/).
Stick it, dweeb. It's my thread. If you want to use 5000 words when 50 will do, start your own thread. You aren't capable of comprehending to what I was referring.
I'm done with you and your tripe. You are now in the permanent INGORE status. Congratulations.
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I really don't get very worked up about any topic that is a doomsday cataclysmic prediction. In my lifetime none of them have ever come true. If they did come true I wouldn't be around to congratulate the person who predicted it. I do love it though when the time comes that the latest cataclysm predictor has to eat their words when the cataclysm day they predicted comes and goes. I have seen plenty of them.
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I really don't get very worked up about any topic that is a doomsday cataclysmic prediction. In my lifetime none of them have ever come true. If they did come true I wouldn't be around to congratulate the person who predicted it. I do love it though when the time comes that the latest cataclysm predictor has to eat their words when the cataclysm day they predicted comes and goes. I have seen plenty of them.
For sure. Many people live in a doom and gloom world.
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Yawning wont help you...
Ignorance by choice? bad move... IMHO
Oh look...another of trip's sock puppets comes to his rescue. :whatever:
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Yawning wont help you...
Ignorance by choice? bad move... IMHO
:panic: <-- there is a whole bunch of meds on the market for that you know.
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:panic: <-- there is a whole bunch of meds on the market for that you know.
Ignorance doesn't need any meds. It's all natural without any additives, including knowledge.
Bill is about 200 miles from Yellowstone. That puts him inside the range of pyroclastic flows which travel at speeds of 450 mph, reach 1,800 °F, and have boiled people's brains inside their skull where they stand. He has had direct contact with the geologists working on site, and he's personally experienced the impact of the uptick in volcanism, with his well suddenly becoming artesian, his water pH changing abruptly, and even his dogs providing advance alert of quakes.
I'm on the east coast. I can afford to be laid back about it. He and his family cannot. He's not relying on the governmental hazard alerts, as he's seen the lock-down on information first hand, even monitoring personal channels of communication.
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I really don't get very worked up about any topic that is a doomsday cataclysmic prediction. In my lifetime none of them have ever come true. If they did come true I wouldn't be around to congratulate the person who predicted it. I do love it though when the time comes that the latest cataclysm predictor has to eat their words when the cataclysm day they predicted comes and goes. I have seen plenty of them.
Gloom and Doom???
nope..
I live in the initial kill zone around Yellowstone. I am personal friends with some of the vulcanologists who service Yellowstone. I have had my communications monitored to the point of ending friendships.. this is PERSONAL...
I watch because the information flow from our government has ceased!
You can call me a "gloom and doomer" if you so choose. I really dont care..
I watch and listen.. I also inform when I can..
its a matter of choice.. a matter of life and death for me.. if I miss the signs it kills my family.
so lets recount what is going on..
land mass rise of a 200 mile radius around Yellowstone, almost 2 feet in the last ten years.
water table flow changes out to 350 miles..
quake swarms, many of which are shallow (less than a mile in depth)
changes in geyser activity throughout Yellowstone
changes in the Magma chamber which have triggered multiple surveys by USGS (one in dead of winter)
movement of USGS office staff to a place outside initial blast and ash fallout zones.
subsurface temperatures in excess of 115 degrees F at 16" of depth.
drilling of monitoring wells throughout Yellowstone and surrounding areas some which are now steam vents.
this just scratches the surface of what I can personally confirm..
you all want to play the belittling game... ?? that's on you.. I came to share... to inform...
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:panic: <-- there is a whole bunch of meds on the market for that you know.
I see a sock puppet here some where... maybe he can get you the real scoop...
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Gloom and Doom???
nope..
I live in the initial kill zone around Yellowstone. I am personal friends with some of the vulcanologists who service Yellowstone. I have had my communications monitored to the point of ending friendships.. this is PERSONAL...
I watch because the information flow from our government has ceased!
You can call me a "gloom and doomer" if you so choose. I really dont care..
I watch and listen.. I also inform when I can..
its a matter of choice.. a matter of life and death for me.. if I miss the signs it kills my family.
so lets recount what is going on..
land mass rise of a 200 mile radius around Yellowstone, almost 2 feet in the last ten years.
water table flow changes out to 350 miles..
quake swarms, many of which are shallow (less than a mile in depth)
changes in geyser activity throughout Yellowstone
changes in the Magma chamber which have triggered multiple surveys by USGS (one in dead of winter)
movement of USGS office staff to a place outside initial blast and ash fallout zones.
subsurface temperatures in excess of 115 degrees F at 16" of depth.
drilling of monitoring wells throughout Yellowstone and surrounding areas some which are now steam vents.
this just scratches the surface of what I can personally confirm..
you all want to play the belittling game... ?? that's on you.. I came to share... to inform...
Uhhh - I never mentioned you or anyone else by name. What the hell's your problem? And what does your long winded post have to do with this topic?
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:lmao: I feel like vesta has gotten to each and every one of you :panic:
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:lmao: I feel like vesta has gotten to each and every one of you :panic:
The "Ignore" feature here works very well.
Just sayin'............
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Uhhh - I never mentioned you or anyone else by name. What the hell's your problem? And what does your long winded post have to do with this topic?
Cause it's all about Yellowstone dude.
(http://www.spacepub.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/The-Truth-Is-Out-There.jpg)
To live in such a constant state of total despair would prompt any SANE person to just freakin move. Not our Billy_Bob. He's living the dream, and with followers such as Trip to adorn him what's not to love...
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Cause it's all about Yellowstone dude.
(http://www.spacepub.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/The-Truth-Is-Out-There.jpg)
To live in such a constant state of total despair would prompt any SANE person to just freakin move. Not our Billy_Bob. He's living the dream, and with followers such as Trip to adorn him what's not to love...
So now I'm Billy_Bob's "follower"? I thought he was mine, or even me! Of all the silliness...
No one is in any sort of state of despair, constant or otherwise. Recognition of the reality, whatever it may be, and how to deal with it, allows for people to be in a state other than despair. Recognition of the truth enables them, rather than disables them. The truth about Yellowstone, or even solar CMEs, is that they can be dealt with far more effectively than just pretending they don't exist and pulling the covers over one's head.
Among other things, 'science' allows us to understand the world around us and be more than just victims of happenstance, more than just fleas on a dog, along for the ride, and wondering why the 'earth' is shaking.
And if you're gonna do it, do it right ...
(http://i425.photobucket.com/albums/pp337/tjmccann/Personal/WantToBelieve.jpg)
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vesta has 2 sock puppets ? Why am I always the last to hear these juicy breaking news stories ?
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vesta has 2 sock puppets ? Why am I always the last to hear these juicy breaking news stories ?
You should wish I'm Vesta.
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I see that most here have no grasp on the concept of what a diffusion of the suns magnetic field would have on the earth.
So let me enlighten you a bit if i may. Here is an exercise that will show you what dangers there are.
Take a compass and set it on your kitchen table. then take two magnets with opposing polarity just far enough apart you can old them still and then slide them nearer the compass. The end result is a vassolating effect of the compass (which is another magnet). Now imagine the earth doing what that compass is doing rapidly.
This will result in earth wobble, rapid change in weather and wind patterns, tide changes, oceanic water flows... etc...
You all make lite of the potential problems while they could be potentially devastating to the earth and its INHABITANTS! Sadly when the sun goes into one of these states the geologic history shows the earth receives massive CME blasts due to the suns instability. This also weakens the earths magnetic field making it more prone to CME effect. The Wobbles change patterns on the earth and generally precede ice ages..
While Trip's posts are lengthy, he is dead on accurate... take the time to read his links, after all this is supposed to be a forum about science... disparagement helps no one...
PS: geologic time scales are interesting animals except when an ice age starts. they start abruptly and in as short as 30 years spans.. were at 15 now with no warming... 1998 is when the suns instability started... Food for thought..
Sea Ice increasing massively this year..
http://wattsupwiththat.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/n_stddev_timeseries2.png
Okay, so what do we do?
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Gloom and Doom???
nope..
I live in the initial kill zone around Yellowstone. I am personal friends with some of the vulcanologists who service Yellowstone. I have had my communications monitored to the point of ending friendships.. this is PERSONAL...
I watch because the information flow from our government has ceased!
You can call me a "gloom and doomer" if you so choose. I really dont care..
I watch and listen.. I also inform when I can..
its a matter of choice.. a matter of life and death for me.. if I miss the signs it kills my family.
so lets recount what is going on..
land mass rise of a 200 mile radius around Yellowstone, almost 2 feet in the last ten years.
water table flow changes out to 350 miles..
quake swarms, many of which are shallow (less than a mile in depth)
changes in geyser activity throughout Yellowstone
changes in the Magma chamber which have triggered multiple surveys by USGS (one in dead of winter)
movement of USGS office staff to a place outside initial blast and ash fallout zones.
subsurface temperatures in excess of 115 degrees F at 16" of depth.
drilling of monitoring wells throughout Yellowstone and surrounding areas some which are now steam vents.
this just scratches the surface of what I can personally confirm..
you all want to play the belittling game... ?? that's on you.. I came to share... to inform...
Suffice to say...
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You should wish I'm Vesta.
Yeah? Why's that, Trip?
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I see that most here have no grasp on the concept of what a diffusion of the suns magnetic field would have on the earth.
So let me enlighten you a bit if i may. Here is an exercise that will show you what dangers there are.
Take a compass and set it on your kitchen table. then take two magnets with opposing polarity just far enough apart you can old them still and then slide them nearer the compass. The end result is a vassolating effect of the compass (which is another magnet). Now imagine the earth doing what that compass is doing rapidly.
This will result in earth wobble, rapid change in weather and wind patterns, tide changes, oceanic water flows... etc...
You all make lite of the potential problems while they could be potentially devastating to the earth and its INHABITANTS! Sadly when the sun goes into one of these states the geologic history shows the earth receives massive CME blasts due to the suns instability. This also weakens the earths magnetic field making it more prone to CME effect. The Wobbles change patterns on the earth and generally precede ice ages..
While Trip's posts are lengthy, he is dead on accurate... take the time to read his links, after all this is supposed to be a forum about science... disparagement helps no one...
PS: geologic time scales are interesting animals except when an ice age starts. they start abruptly and in as short as 30 years spans.. were at 15 now with no warming... 1998 is when the suns instability started... Food for thought..
Sea Ice increasing massively this year..
http://wattsupwiththat.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/n_stddev_timeseries2.png
Waitaminnute...are you suggesting the sun's magnetic field has an effect on earth's precessional motion? The Sun and Moon's gravitation cause the wobble, not the sun's magnetic field. It's nowhere strong enough to affect earth's movement or relationship to its axis or center of gravity, and never will be. Not even a normal star with a more powerful magnetic field, suddenly substituted for the sun, could do that. You'd need a magnetic field in the billions of gauss, more like a neutron star's magnetic field, to do that. It'd have to be pretty close, too, much closer than 1 AU, at which point we'd have bigger problems than its magnetic field.
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The last time I looked one AU was 96 million miles.
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The last time I looked one AU was 96 million miles.
93 million...by definition earth's average distance from the Sol is 1 AU. but I'm not sure what your point is. I meant that for a stellar object's magnetic fields to actually affect the earth's iron-nickel core and precessional motion, it would not only have to have magnetic fields substantially stronger than a normal star's, but that also it would have to be much, much closer than 1 AU.
Edited to change "distance" to "average distance"
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93 million...by definition earth's distance from the Sol is 1 AU. but I'm not sure what your point is. I meant that for a stellar object's magnetic fields to actually affect the earth's iron-nickel core, it would not only have to have magnetic field's substantially stronger than a normal star's, but that also it would have to be much, much closer than 1 AU.
Sorry about the 96 instead of the 93. The last time I saw it I must have been looking at an incorrect number. I only said it for any who came across AU, and might be thinking it was the abbreviation for gold.
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lets look at this from a magnetic stand point.
gravometric waves (even at 1AU) are linking. Whether you want believe it or not. The exercise I explained was to show how the magnetic center and poles will react to a diffused and reduced magnetism. Even the moon is affected as the outside influence changes. minor fluctuations on the cores will have an effect..
while the moon is the close gravity and has the greatest influence the suns influence is not to be discounted.
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lets look at this from a magnetic stand point.
gravometric waves (even at 1AU) are linking. Whether you want believe it or not. The exercise I explained was to show how the magnetic center and poles will react to a diffused and reduced magnetism. Even the moon is affected as the outside influence changes. minor fluctuations on the cores will have an effect..
while the moon is the close gravity and has the greatest influence the suns influence is not to be discounted.
I don't disagree that our magnetic field and poles are affected by the sun's; but what I do disagree with (and have never heard an astrophysicist propound) is that the sun's magnetic field affects earth's precessional motion.
If you're talking gravity--gravimetry--then we're talking about something other than magnetic fields and certainly the sun and moon's gravity are directly responsible for earth's precessional motion (and, to a much lesser degree, the other planets of Sol system affect this motion). Thus far gravity has not been unified in any field theory I know of with the electroweak interaction.
So all I was saying was that the Sun's magnetic field does not affect earth's precessional motion. Sol's and the Mooon's gravity are responsible for it, of course.
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I repeat, Billy_Bob, what do we do (http://www.conservativecave.com/index.php/topic,72112.msg864710.html#msg864710)? Why are you still living in the initial kill zone if all signs are pointing at a massive eruption in the near future? What the USGS is saying publicly obviously does not jibe with what you and Trip know to be true. Are you guys still working from the two different (public and actual) data sets?
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He won't do it. You've shown him and made him look bad...hence the retarded cheap shots at the end of his last couple posts....now his ego won't let him do anything else but post long winded sermons on how right he is and how stupid the rest of us are.
Got his last warning and still managed to throw it in two different posts... :confused:
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Sunspot AR 1476
Washington Post: "Super-sized sunspot region eyes Earth, may eject big flares" (http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/capital-weather-gang/post/super-sized-sunspot-region-eyes-earth-may-eject-big-flares/2012/05/09/gIQAoOLLDU_blog.html)
FOX News: "Monster Sunspot Threatens to Unleash Powerful Solar Flares" (http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2012/05/08/monster-sunspot-threatens-to-unleash-powerful-solar-flares/)
EarthSky:"Huge Sunspot AR1476 Turned Our Way, Might Produce X-flare" (http://earthsky.org/space/huge-sunspot-ar1476-turned-our-way-might-produce-x-flare)
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Billy_Bob, in reference to your post here (http://www.conservativecave.com/index.php/topic,72112.msg862266.html#msg862266), I asked you what do we do. It's all fine and good to post a mountain of data and speculation, but it all comes down to "okay, what do we do?".
Second, I asked why it is you continue to live in the initial kill zone (http://www.conservativecave.com/index.php/topic,72112.msg862926.html#msg862926) of a super volcano if you have a deep suspicion that it is going to blow and end life as we know it. Since I have been accused of having ulterior motives and trying to pry into your personal life, let me expand and give you some kind of idea why I ask this.
I live in an area that would be the #2 target (behind Washington DC) in the event of a nuclear strike. If I were to be listening to my radio and hear the EMS broadcast that the balloon had gone up (ICBM launch), there would be precious little I could do to survive it. Missile flight time from Russia, over the pole, is about 30 minutes; much less (around 15 minutes) for a launch from a SSBN. At that point, it would make sense to hug and kiss my family, climb up on the roof and get a front row seat for the end my little area of the world. Point being, I understand there is a bit of a fatalistic attitude when it comes to events of mass destruction that one can do nothing to alter or abolish.
However, if I had ample warning of such an event, I would be doing everything that I could to move my family as far away from that area and to a more safe one; one in which I could eventually join them. That, in my opinion, would be the safe thing to do. Trip and yourself have been sounding the alarm on Yellowstone for well over a year and it seems that the longer it goes, the less you seem to "hear" from anyone that may be able to pass you data and the more serious the situation seems to become. It would seem that would be enough to get my family moving somewhere safer than where you are.
That, Billy_Bob, and nothing else is the basis for my question. If you find your way back here, I would like to know why it is you continue to stay where you are with the knowledge you have.
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MENACE UNREALIZED: After more than a week of solar storm warnings, sunspot AR1476 is turning away from Earth with a mostly unblemished record of quiet. The decaying behemoth never lived up to its potential as a source of X-class solar flares. It did, however, make a great target for astrophotographers. Even now the sunspot is decorating sunsets around the world:
http://www.spaceweather.com/
:whatever:
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Billy_Bob, in reference to your post here (http://www.conservativecave.com/index.php/topic,72112.msg862266.html#msg862266), I asked you what do we do. It's all fine and good to post a mountain of data and speculation, but it all comes down to "okay, what do we do?".
Second, I asked why it is you continue to live in the initial kill zone (http://www.conservativecave.com/index.php/topic,72112.msg862926.html#msg862926) of a super volcano if you have a deep suspicion that it is going to blow and end life as we know it. Since I have been accused of having ulterior motives and trying to pry into your personal life, let me expand and give you some kind of idea why I ask this.
I live in an area that would be the #2 target (behind Washington DC) in the event of a nuclear strike. If I were to be listening to my radio and hear the EMS broadcast that the balloon had gone up (ICBM launch), there would be precious little I could do to survive it. Missile flight time from Russia, over the pole, is about 30 minutes; much less (around 15 minutes) for a launch from a SSBN. At that point, it would make sense to hug and kiss my family, climb up on the roof and get a front row seat for the end my little area of the world. Point being, I understand there is a bit of a fatalistic attitude when it comes to events of mass destruction that one can do nothing to alter or abolish.
However, if I had ample warning of such an event, I would be doing everything that I could to move my family as far away from that area and to a more safe one; one in which I could eventually join them. That, in my opinion, would be the safe thing to do. Trip and yourself have been sounding the alarm on Yellowstone for well over a year and it seems that the longer it goes, the less you seem to "hear" from anyone that may be able to pass you data and the more serious the situation seems to become. It would seem that would be enough to get my family moving somewhere safer than where you are.
That, Billy_Bob, and nothing else is the basis for my question. If you find your way back here, I would like to know why it is you continue to stay where you are with the knowledge you have.
:popcorn:
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http://www.spaceweather.com/
:whatever:
Wow, awkward....
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http://www.spaceweather.com/
:whatever:
Chicken Little foiled again.
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Chicken Little foiled again.
"Chicken Little, the sky isn't falling! That's just he 'neighbor's house'!"
- SUBSIDING STORM: A radiation storm around Earth is subsiding. The storm began during the early hours of May 17th when a strong M5-class flre accelerated a fusillade of solar protons in our direction. At its peak, the S2-class storm was capable of confusing spacecraft imaging systems and causing 'single event upsets' in orbiting electronics.
The explosion tthat caused the radiation storm also hurled a coronal mass ejection (CME) into space. SOHO recorded the cloud racing away from the sun faster than 1500 km/s:
(http://www.spaceweather.com/images2012/17may12/cme_strip2.jpg) (http://www.spaceweather.com/images2012/17may12/cme_anim.gif)
The speckles in the movie are caused by energetic protons hitting the observatory's detector. This kind of "snow" is a sign that a radiation storm is underway.
This CME is not heading for Earth. It will, however, deliver a glancing blow to Mercury. According to a forecast track prepared by analysts at the Goddard Space Weather Lab, the cloud will reach the innermost planet on May 17th at 15:09 UT (+/- 7 hr).
http://www.spaceweather.com/
And it didn't even release an x-class flare.
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I find it incomprehensible that any single object could have more than two magnetic poles. It seems to go against all things Physics. All of this seems like a LOT of hype to me. While I may not possess any papered degrees, I have 37+ years of hands on experience in electricity/ electronics. It could actually be more were I to use the dates when I first started working with electronics. But, in my earlier years, I didn't have the textbook education/ formal schooling which I do now.
[tin foil hat] Maybe a massive CME will happen on Dec 21st of this year? [/tin foil hat] :rotf: :rotf: :tongue:
As far as Yellowstone, the "kill zone" is massive and would affect a good majority of the US. It's after-effects would probably throw us into another ice-age.
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Thanks for restoring the topic, Thor.
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Thanks for restoring the topic, Thor.
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Questions from a very confused old lady.
We all play with maginetes as kids and learn putting in batterys what end to place in first the + or -.
Oppisits attract they say, so would anything with 4 different poles just implode or explode if the ends do not match ??
Now how on earth can any object spinning about causing graverty change poles ?
I can understand how a huge metor strike can cause the earth to tilt and a climate change.
What I do not understand is why on a coupas we have 2 norths, the magnitic north and the off a few degrees the compas setting.
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Questions from a very confused old lady.
We all play with maginetes as kids and learn putting in batterys what end to place in first the + or -.
Oppisits attract they say, so would anything with 4 different poles just implode or explode if the ends do not match ??
Now how on earth can any object spinning about causing graverty change poles ?
I can understand how a huge metor strike can cause the earth to tilt and a climate change.
What I do not understand is why on a coupas we have 2 norths, the magnitic north and the off a few degrees the compas setting.
Been smokin' crack again, vesta? Either that or your bra is too tight. Loosen it a bit so you can get some air.
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I want to meet the dude that's going to dig the holes for those 4 poles.
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I want to meet the dude that's going to dig the holes for those 4 poles.
Bring concrete. Lots and lots of concrete. :fuelfire:
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I want to meet the dude that's going to dig the holes for those 4 poles.
One pole site is said to be in Poland.
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Been smokin' crack again, vesta? Either that or your bra is too tight. Loosen it a bit so you can get some air.
Sorry I do type fast and with arthritis I do tend to hit the wrong keys quite often. When spell check goes down as it does often I just say frog it and post anyway.
So how would 4 poles of magnetism affect the sun??? Is not the sun made of gas, sort of like how can magnetism effect a burning candle ???? Too bad Watch Mr. Wizard is off the air.
In answer to the question of why anyone would live in a dangerous area-------Tell me why early settlers set out with woman and children to head West even as news came of massacres of others doing the same thing.
To me it is the natural disasters that get people, these droughts out West of me, who can prepare for them ??
Climate Change, silly people naturally there will be some doozies, most take thousands of years to evolve but when Krakatoa went up, the dust in the sky gave this area a couple of years with no summer. My great grandmother told me about her mother who told her.
Back on topic, magnetism fascinates people, we spend millions of bucks to buy beds and jewelry with magnets in them for health reasons------Scam artists will take us every time.
Magnetic resonances or some such idea that humans and animals have a magnetic Aurea. So claimed Yuri Geller.
So still want to know what is the difference between magnetic north and compas north by degrees.
BTY, what is a load stone and how did it years ago help navigation ???
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Yeah, he lives there until he's evicted by those burro farts. They're really nasty at this time of year.
And I thought they smelled bad on the outside.