http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x3190899Oh my.
On this particular matter, franksolich mildly agrees with the primitives, although unlike the primitives, franksolich thinks these things aren't such a good idea on principle, not for selfish reasons.
Primitives just don't want other people to have nice lawns, and George Bush is president.
That's all there is to it, the primitive reasoning.
orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Tue Apr-22-08 03:03 AM
Original message
"Poison In The Grass: The Hazards And Consequences Of Lawn Pesticides"
"As the use of lawn chemicals and pesticides has grown, questions have arisen regarding safety hazards and environmental consequences. This report gives factual findings to help answer many of these concerns. Some of them may seem shocking, since the chemical pesticide industry has made every effort to keep this information from the public. Everything that follows in this report is documented and supported by the U.S. Federal Government, private agencies, and other experts.
"Contrary to what lawn "care" companies would like people to believe, herbicides (weed killers) and other pesticides are not "magic bullets". They are broad spectrum biocides, and by their very nature can harm organisms other than targeted species. This includes homeowners and their families, neighbors, pets, and all other forms of life. The pesticide industry downplays this by claiming their chemicals are heavily diluted, but doesn't mention the toxins are still extremely dangerous in small amounts. They also are unwilling to mention all of what is in their mixtures. Many components are classified as "inert", which allows them to be kept hidden from the public and not listed on product labels. These are more than just fillers or solvents. "Inert" does not mean "inactive" - some, such as benzene and xylene, are more toxic than listed chemicals.(1,2)
"Listed chemicals can be just as dangerous. They include components of war-time defoliants like Agent Orange, nerve-gas type insecticides, and artificial hormones. Some the Federal Government has even prohibited from use on it's own property. Many pesticides are not safe when dry. Water evaporates, but most pesticides remain and continue to release often odorless and invisible toxic vapors. In areas where lawn spraying is common, they accumulate in a toxic smog throughout the entire season. Some pesticides remain active for years after application. DDT is still showing up in higher rates in women's breast milk than the government permits in cow's milk.(4) Fat soluble pesticides accumulate over time in our bodies, then are released at potentially toxic levels when illness or stress results in our fat reserves being metabolised. A large portion of a woman's lifetime exposure to such pesticides is released in the breast milk for her firstborn child.(37)
"It is a violation of U.S. Federal law to claim pesticides are "safe when used as directed" since nothing can assure safety.(2,3,5) (However, Agriculture Canada, the federal agency responsible until recently for licensing pesticides in Canada, routinely used this statement, adding for good measure that "most pesticides are safer than table salt". Fortunately, pesticides in Canada are now licensed by Health Canada.) Some pesticides labeled "bio-degradable" degrade into compounds more dangerous than the original. Examples include Mancozeb, which degrades into a substance that is an EPA-classified probable carcinogen.(6) The pesticide industry also implies that "organic" means safe and natural (for example, "Nature's Lawn"), knowing that the term legally may be applied to any compound containing carbon and hydrogen. ChemLawn and other lawn "care" companies and manufacturers have often been sued for fictitious claims.
more at
http://www.safe2use.com/ca-ipm/02-09-27e.htm
this article was probably written in 1994 (that is the latest reference it lists) but i believe it is still relevant. my dog and i were out in our backyard the other day--and i smelled that "green chlorine" smell of a sprayed neighbor's lawn. my dog is really sick now--i've been googling and ran across this.
Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Tue Apr-22-08 03:12 AM
Response to Original message
1. I picked up several sick baby raccoons, a sick bird and an adult raccoon several years ago. I took them to a local wildlife rehab center, which said that they had all been poisoned by lawn fertilizer and/ or weed killers. The bird and one of the raccoons survives, but were brain damaged (the raccoon went to live as a pet with an older gentleman because he was too damaged to be returned to the wild). The rest of the animals were put down or died on their own. I never sprayed my lawn, but my neighbors sure do. I'm not surprised by any of the information in the article.
I hope that your dog recovers soon. I'd take him/ her to the vet as soon as possible-there are treatments that can help avert some of the damage those chemical can cause.
orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Tue Apr-22-08 03:25 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. thanks. we went today (monday) for a major blood test. we'll find out more tomorrow.
my neighbors spray their lawns.
i was thinking someone should start a "clean neighborhood" campaign (in our neighborhood) with info on these lawn sprays and chemicals and how they affect pets/children/wildlife.
i'm so sick of this yard spraying shit--i can't even begin to tell you.
truedelphi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Tue Apr-22-08 04:15 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. One major tonic for animals affeted by spraying is a tincture
Sold in health food stores.
It is called "devil's claw" and it will help the animal eliminate the toxins.
If you decide to get it, it should be the African tuber, which helps open up all the organs so they can excrete the toxins. (There is another plant called Devil's Claw that is an american plant and it doesn't do very much in the way of helping with toxin removal.)
My son and I saved a small kitten we had just adopted after it strayed into a neighbor's toolshed attic and got sprayed with heavy duty fumigants. After examining the animal, the vet said the kitty would die. But the Devil's Claw saved it.
Took almost the whole bottle, watered down and eye droppered into the kitty over a fifteen hour period.
sfexpat2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Tue Apr-22-08 03:27 AM
Response to Original message
6. Anyone who has ever bought a bottle of pesticide at HomeDepot
and then, actually looked at the tiny print on the back label can't help but be appalled.
You read that (if you can see it) and you have to think, what the hell am I doing?
The sort of tiny print on the back label that one sees on bottles in abortion businesses, one imagines.
PetraPooh (1000+ posts) Tue Apr-22-08 04:26 AM
Response to Original message
9. I totally agree that they can be/are toxic; however the idea of every yard being left in its natural state would mean fleas, ticks, ants, bilge bugs, and so many other critters that would have their own toxic effects on our environment. AND the "all natural" stuff isn't really any better, particularly now that it is becoming a possibility that the natural pesticides have nicotine in them and may be one of the causes of the bees disappearing.
I don't think there is a great answer currently to the problem, but not spraying I think would be equally disastrous.
Perhaps just returning to the cheaper and safer ones like sevin spray or dust, and the sulphur dust; but I don't know if they are really any safer or if that's just my impression.
Hmmm.
I wonder if the petrified excrement primitive has noticed my descriptions of the William Rivers Pitt in the "General Discussion" forum here; there's three or four of them.
crispini Donating Member (1000+ posts) Tue Apr-22-08 04:42 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. completely untrue
100% organic yard for 10 years and have had none of those problems you mentioned. A well nourished organic yard has its own natural defenses against pests. Google Howard Garrett if you want to know more. Great resource for organic gardening
Hmmm.
I wonder if the Krispy Kreme primitive has noticed my descriptions of the William Rivers Pitt in the "General Discussions" forum here; there's three or four of them.
El Pinko (1000+ posts) Tue Apr-22-08 04:46 AM
Response to Original message
12. Unbelieveable that people put chemicals on LAWNS.
My little backyard looks great and we don't put anything on it. No bug sprays, and we pull weeds by hand.
Unbelievable people would want that toxic shit where their KIDS PLAY.
I hope the el finko primitive hasn't noticed my descriptions of the William Rivers Pitt in the "General Discussions" forum here, as the el finko primitive already has a lousy opinion of small-town people anyway.
JCMach1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Tue Apr-22-08 07:28 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. You need a diverse lawn... Monoculture only feeds such infestations
Try several different varieties of grass. I did this in my lawn in Florida. I mixed centipede (very old variety) and 4 different species of St. Augustine. Some were good for shade... others good for other things. In short, it worked very well.
Even if I got an infestation, it would generally only go so far as typically the bugs would just target the one species.
Nature tends to do the job best. Got mole crickets? Let the moles flourish. Go bugs? Start attracting birds to your lawn with seed. Soon, they will also want a little protein with that seed.
Seriously, if a grass is eaten up you have the wrong grass for your area (try something new). Or, better yet, try several new things.
And remember, grass was never meant to be a carpet.
leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Tue Apr-22-08 08:05 AM
Response to Reply #16
21. grass was never meant to be grown as lawns here in America especially in the South. I believe the British brought that great idea here.
The heftchick primitive must've been reading Pedro Picasso about a year ago, when he whined about large lawns.
blindpig (1000+ posts) Tue Apr-22-08 09:08 AM
Response to Original message
29. Lawns are an abomination, double for goof courses.
