2008 Baseball season

[Red October]

Yes ladies and gentlemen, the most high-octane offense in the National League just lost 1-0 at home to the Washington Nationals. 



Apparently, last year's 4-12 start was so much fun they want to relive the drama.

They want to go 3-13 this time! 

Jamie Moyer helped stop the bleeding last year.  He starts today.  Hopefully he can lock-up Murderer's Row with high-inside heat he can bring on that 72 MPH fastball.

[BlueStateSaint]

Hey--it wasn't his arm!  The Mets will put Pedro on the 15-day DL.  The pen did good, until the tenth . . . You're going to win 60 no matter what you do, and you're going to lose 60 no matter what you do.

I had the "over" in the number of pitches . . . 

Did he ice his arm last night?

We'll be alright.  We've had a couple of bad seasons.  But considering the past decade and a half, I'd say we were due.
No, his leg.

Both Hudson and Glavine have needed ice lately . . . in their stiff drinks after watching the Braves bullpen blow their pretty good efforts . . .

I take it that you concede the point, then?

Braves' bullpen stinks.  That's like saying the sky is blue.  everyone knows that, it's always been that way.

And the Mets' strength, starting rotation, looks like it will end up being the weakness.

What the deuce are you smoking?  Right now, as I type, there's a guy a the top who has two Cy Youngs.  Then, the guy who won last night won 15 games last year, and had a pretty good spring.  Then, going tomorrow night against the Squaws, is another 15 game winner from last year, who has gotten a lot better with his slider, to the point that Peter Gammons thinks that he's the #2 of the staff.  1 through 3 I'd put against any in the league--certainly Hudson, Smoltz, and Glavine, maybe even Webb, Haren, and Johnson.  Maybe even against Peavy, Hensley (or whoever SD's #2 is), and Maddux.  I wouldn't be so high on the chances of Smoltz not missing 4-5 starts this season.  Glavine had a pretty good first outing, but you can't expect him to go even seven innings every game.  If you have no bullpen, you don't win a lot of games.

[Rebel Yell]

We won the division, your division, for 16 years without a bullpen.  We'll see how the season plays out.  I really think it'll come down between us and y'all.  The Phillies won't repeat last years success.

[BlueStateSaint]

We won the division, your division, for 16 years without a bullpen.  We'll see how the season plays out.  I really think it'll come down between us and y'all.  The Phillies won't repeat last years success.

Umm . . . I think it was 13 years, because of the strike season in '94. 

But, you're right on the second point--the Phillthies won't repeat last year's success.  A lot of things had to go exactly right for them.  The chances of that happening two years in a row are pretty poor.  And, Pedro will be back in June.  Bet on it.  And he'll be mad at himself for losing that time.

The Mets have essentially the same pitching staff they did that year, in Maine, Perez, El Duque (April 13th), and Pedro for half of the year.  Yeah, there were other guys--Geremi Gonzalez  and Jose Lima  and the one major subtraction from that staff is Glavine.  He's two years older now, and we've replaced him with, arguably, the best pitcher in baseball.

I've heard the name "Rich Harden" beig thrown around as a future acquisition by the Braves.  Thing is, he's had two good starts so far.  I'd wait until at least Memorial Day before looking at how he's doing.  With his injury history, he could do something next start that would put him right onto the 60-day DL for the rest of the year.  Plus, would Atlanta want to cough up the king's ransom that Billy Beane would want for him?

[BlueStateSaint]

We won the division, your division, for 16 years without a bullpen.  We'll see how the season plays out.  I really think it'll come down between us and y'all.  The Phillies won't repeat last years success.

Umm . . . I think it was 14 years, because of the strike season in '94. 

But, you're right on the second point--the Phillthies won't repeat last year's success.  A lot of things had to go exactly right for them.  The chances of that happening two years in a row are pretty poor.  And, Pedro will be back in June.  Bet on it.  And he'll be mad at himself for losing that time.

The Mets have essentially the same pitching staff they did that year, in Maine, Perez, El Duque (April 13th), and Pedro for half of the year.  Yeah, there were other guys--Geremi Gonzalez  and Jose Lima  and the one major subtraction from that staff is Glavine.  He's two years older now, and we've replaced him with, arguably, the best pitcher in baseball.

I've heard the name "Rich Harden" beig thrown around as a future acquisition by the Braves.  Thing is, he's had two good starts so far.  I'd wait until at least Memorial Day before looking at how he's doing.  With his injury history, he could do something next start that would put him right onto the 60-day DL for the rest of the year.  Plus, would Atlanta want to cough up the king's ransom that Billy Beane would want for him?

[Rebel Yell]

We won the division, your division, for 16 years without a bullpen.  We'll see how the season plays out.  I really think it'll come down between us and y'all.  The Phillies won't repeat last years success.

 And, Pedro will be back in June.  Bet on it.  And he'll be mad at himself for losing that time.

Don't get me wrong, I liked Pedro in Montreal and Boston, but he better have more than 86 mph on his fastball come June.

[Red October]

  Woohoo!  We avoided the opening-series sweep!  We've already improved on last year. 

Man I was getting thisclose to torching my Phillies hat ----> 

But the bandwagon's wheels hold on for another day

[Red October]

But, you're right on the second point--the Phillthies won't repeat last year's success.  A lot of things had to go exactly right for them.  The chances of that happening two years in a row are pretty poor.  And, Pedro will be back in June.  Bet on it.  And he'll be mad at himself for losing that time.

One of the things that went right was the #1 offense in the NL.  And another thing would be our record against the Mets.  Just sayin'.     If nothing else, it's good enough for Wild Card contention.  If we stay any degree healthier this year than we were last year, the 90+ win plateau is not out of the question.

[BlueStateSaint]

But, you're right on the second point--the Phillthies won't repeat last year's success.  A lot of things had to go exactly right for them.  The chances of that happening two years in a row are pretty poor.  And, Pedro will be back in June.  Bet on it.  And he'll be mad at himself for losing that time.

One of the things that went right was the #1 offense in the NL.  And another thing would be our record against the Mets.  Just sayin'.     If nothing else, it's good enough for Wild Card contention.  If we stay any degree healthier this year than we were last year, the 90+ win plateau is not out of the question.

If the Mets had the 'tude that they did going into last season, then I would say that you might have a point.  But, as Rebel Yell is finding out, if the bullpen can't hold the gains made by the offense and/or the starting staff, you're screwed (another loss by the Atlanta bullpen).  Oh--BTW, guess who's on the DL--again?

Hampton placed on disabled list
Strained left pectoral muscle to sideline southpaw for 15 days
By Mark Bowman / MLB.com

ATLANTA -- While there have been times when it seemed Mike Hampton's injury woes couldn't get any worse or more unbelievable, history continues to prove nothing is impossible when it comes to Hampton and his health.

Minutes from making his first start in nearly three full years, Hampton was forced to face the fact that his body had created yet another reason that he couldn't pitch. As he was warming up before Thursday night's game against the Pirates, the Braves southpaw felt discomfort in his left pectoral muscle.

Immediately, Hampton was scratched from his scheduled start, and a few hours later, he found himself back on the disabled list yet again.

"Nobody is more disappointed than I am," Hampton said after Thursday's 4-3, 10-inning loss to the Pirates. "I've worked pretty hard to get to this day. I hate it for [Braves manager] Bobby [Cox]. I hate it for the team and myself, mostly because of the work I put into it."

His last good year was . . . when?  2000, with the Mets? 

The rest of the article is at:

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080403&content_id=2489401&vkey=news_atl&fext=.jsp&c_id=atl

But, I digress.  To reiterate, if the bullpen can't hold the gains made by the starting staff and the offense, it's going to be a long season.  One of the big reasons that the Mets collapsed down the stretch last year is that the bullpen was absolutely shot.  So, what did they do?  They went out and got Matt Wise (who hung a changeup, and led to the Mets' first loss), and got rid of Guillermo "Mogas" Mota (plus not guaranteeing a spot to Duaner Sanchez, making him work for it).  Rebel Yell says that the Braves went on that long run without a bullpen, but someone had to protect the leads established by Larry and Andruw (does the name of John Rocker ring a bell?).  Hudson, Glavine, and now this Jeff Bennett have had decnet pitching performances blown by the bullpen.

As for the Phillthies' vaunted offense, two words for you:  Tim Redding.  Hole Camels had a great pitching performance, yet the O wasn't there.  What did they get off of Redding, one hit, maybe?

There's holes on every team.  Some of the perceived ones on the Mets are a lot smaller than one makes them out to be, and some on the Braves and Phillies are a tad larger than one can admit.

[Red October]

As for the Phillthies' vaunted offense, two words for you:  Tim Redding.  Hole Camels had a great pitching performance, yet the O wasn't there.  What did they get off of Redding, one hit, maybe?

There's holes on every team.  Some of the perceived ones on the Mets are a lot smaller than one makes them out to be, and some on the Braves and Phillies are a tad larger than one can admit.

True.  Sometimes you just gotta tip your cap to the opposition.  Redding was nearly flawless. 

On the other hand, it was April 2, it was cold, and the Phillies were pressing.  Let's see Redding throw the same game against us a month from now.  Hell, our bats came alive yesterday and overcame a 6-1 defecit.  And Chris Coste's solo HR in the 3rd was the only HR (which would have been a HR anywhere), so you can't blame it on the park.

[BlueStateSaint]

As for the Phillthies' vaunted offense, two words for you:  Tim Redding.  Hole Camels had a great pitching performance, yet the O wasn't there.  What did they get off of Redding, one hit, maybe?

There's holes on every team.  Some of the perceived ones on the Mets are a lot smaller than one makes them out to be, and some on the Braves and Phillies are a tad larger than one can admit.

True.  Sometimes you just gotta tip your cap to the opposition.  Redding was nearly flawless. 

On the other hand, it was April 2, it was cold, and the Phillies were pressing.  Let's see Redding throw the same game against us a month from now.  Hell, our bats came alive yesterday and overcame a 6-1 defecit.  And Chris Coste's solo HR in the 3rd was the only HR (which would have been a HR anywhere), so you can't blame it on the park.

Considering the bandbox that is CBP, I'd be hard pressed to blame the lack of HRs on the park.  If the game had been at RFK, then yeah, a case like that would be sustainable.

And, as I said above, I've hear it said that you're going to win 60 no matter how bad you play, and lose 60 no matter how good you play.  It's the other 42 that you have to worry about ('86 Mets and '98 Yankees notwithstanding).

[Red October]

As for the Phillthies' vaunted offense, two words for you:  Tim Redding.  Hole Camels had a great pitching performance, yet the O wasn't there.  What did they get off of Redding, one hit, maybe?

There's holes on every team.  Some of the perceived ones on the Mets are a lot smaller than one makes them out to be, and some on the Braves and Phillies are a tad larger than one can admit.

True.  Sometimes you just gotta tip your cap to the opposition.  Redding was nearly flawless. 

On the other hand, it was April 2, it was cold, and the Phillies were pressing.  Let's see Redding throw the same game against us a month from now.  Hell, our bats came alive yesterday and overcame a 6-1 defecit.  And Chris Coste's solo HR in the 3rd was the only HR (which would have been a HR anywhere), so you can't blame it on the park.

Considering the bandbox that is CBP, I'd be hard pressed to blame the lack of HRs on the park.  If the game had been at RFK, then yeah, a case like that would be sustainable.

And, as I said above, I've hear it said that you're going to win 60 no matter how bad you play, and lose 60 no matter how good you play.  It's the other 42 that you have to worry about ('86 Mets and '98 Yankees notwithstanding).

I was talking about the Coste HR.  You can't lay that one just on the park.  And my main point is how we overcame a large defecit without home-runs, hence our offese is as good as advertised.  That can't be laid on the park either. 

But you are right, it's way too early to make any accurate predictions, other than we're going to win at least 60.     I live in northern Maryland, and I get the Washington/Baltimore broadcasts.  Good God, you should hear the Nats broadcasting crew talking these guys up like they're already on their way to the World Series.    Did you know that as soon as a Nats reliever enters the game, the current score will be the final score?  Did you know ever Washington starter has the most electric stuff in the game and are virtually unhittable?  Did you know Nick Johnson and Ryan Zimmerman are Green Berets in the offseason and lead combat missions in Iraq just for practice???  Man will somebody humble these guys, already!

[Red October]

Phil Sheridan's account:

The Phillies made four errors before the Washington Nationals made four outs. Jimmy Rollins and Chase Utley committed the first two, contributing to that five-run Washington first.

"If I knew how to explain it, how to stop it, I would," manager Charlie Manuel said. "Sloppiness is not good."

In the season opener Monday, the Phillies lost because they couldn't pitch.

In their second game Wednesday, the Phillies lost because they couldn't hit.

Now they had finally put it all together: bad pitching, poor hitting and lousy fielding. The crowd, which had precious little to like, began to turn surly. Sarcasm was the only thing hurled at the players, but the point was well taken. The Phillies were playing without their heads or their hearts in the game.

And then they were.

"It was nice to see our offense do it how they did it," Moyer said.

There was the sixth inning, which saw the power-hitting Phillies hit seven consecutive singles. Rollins broke the string by being hit with a pitch. Then Shane Victorino hit a bases-loaded single - the eighth single of the inning - to give the Phillies a 7-6 lead.

There was the seventh inning, which saw Adam Eaton inserted as a pinch-runner. He didn't actually run anywhere, but at least he didn't give up any runs.

There was the ninth inning, which saw Tom Gordon trot in from the bullpen to boos and walk to the dugout to cheers. In between, Gordon loaded the bases but worked out of the jam without allowing a run.

And then there was the 10th inning, which proved that you can watch baseball for years and still not see everything.

The Phillies, who played like dopes in the first two innings, won in the 10th on sheer baseball smarts and audacity. A team that was shut out on one hit Wednesday manufactured the game-winning run without getting the ball out of the infield.

"We played a small game today," Victorino said.

http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20080404_Phil_Sheridan__Small_ball_lets_Phillies_come_up_big.html

[Rebel Yell]

BSS-  I got an idea.

Let's say whoever makes the most starts this year, Pedro or Hampton, get's the bragging rights.

Odds are in your favor.  Pedro -5.

[Rebel Yell]

As for the Phillthies' vaunted offense, two words for you:  Tim Redding.  Hole Camels had a great pitching performance, yet the O wasn't there.  What did they get off of Redding, one hit, maybe?

There's holes on every team.  Some of the perceived ones on the Mets are a lot smaller than one makes them out to be, and some on the Braves and Phillies are a tad larger than one can admit.

True.  Sometimes you just gotta tip your cap to the opposition.  Redding was nearly flawless. 

On the other hand, it was April 2, it was cold, and the Phillies were pressing.  Let's see Redding throw the same game against us a month from now.  Hell, our bats came alive yesterday and overcame a 6-1 defecit.  And Chris Coste's solo HR in the 3rd was the only HR (which would have been a HR anywhere), so you can't blame it on the park.

Considering the bandbox that is CBP, I'd be hard pressed to blame the lack of HRs on the park.  If the game had been at RFK, then yeah, a case like that would be sustainable.

And, as I said above, I've hear it said that you're going to win 60 no matter how bad you play, and lose 60 no matter how good you play.  It's the other 42 that you have to worry about ('86 Mets and '98 Yankees notwithstanding).

I was talking about the Coste HR.  You can't lay that one just on the park.  And my main point is how we overcame a large defecit without home-runs, hence our offese is as good as advertised.  That can't be laid on the park either. 

But you are right, it's way too early to make any accurate predictions, other than we're going to win at least 60.     I live in northern Maryland, and I get the Washington/Baltimore broadcasts.  Good God, you should hear the Nats broadcasting crew talking these guys up like they're already on their way to the World Series.    Did you know that as soon as a Nats reliever enters the game, the current score will be the final score?  Did you know ever Washington starter has the most electric stuff in the game and are virtually unhittable?  Did you know Nick Johnson and Ryan Zimmerman are Green Berets in the offseason and lead combat missions in Iraq just for practice???  Man will somebody humble these guys, already!

Did you know Johnson and Zimmerman are actually the twin sons of TiT?

[Red October]

As for the Phillthies' vaunted offense, two words for you:  Tim Redding.  Hole Camels had a great pitching performance, yet the O wasn't there.  What did they get off of Redding, one hit, maybe?

There's holes on every team.  Some of the perceived ones on the Mets are a lot smaller than one makes them out to be, and some on the Braves and Phillies are a tad larger than one can admit.

True.  Sometimes you just gotta tip your cap to the opposition.  Redding was nearly flawless. 

On the other hand, it was April 2, it was cold, and the Phillies were pressing.  Let's see Redding throw the same game against us a month from now.  Hell, our bats came alive yesterday and overcame a 6-1 defecit.  And Chris Coste's solo HR in the 3rd was the only HR (which would have been a HR anywhere), so you can't blame it on the park.

Considering the bandbox that is CBP, I'd be hard pressed to blame the lack of HRs on the park.  If the game had been at RFK, then yeah, a case like that would be sustainable.

And, as I said above, I've hear it said that you're going to win 60 no matter how bad you play, and lose 60 no matter how good you play.  It's the other 42 that you have to worry about ('86 Mets and '98 Yankees notwithstanding).

I was talking about the Coste HR.  You can't lay that one just on the park.  And my main point is how we overcame a large defecit without home-runs, hence our offese is as good as advertised.  That can't be laid on the park either. 

But you are right, it's way too early to make any accurate predictions, other than we're going to win at least 60.     I live in northern Maryland, and I get the Washington/Baltimore broadcasts.  Good God, you should hear the Nats broadcasting crew talking these guys up like they're already on their way to the World Series.    Did you know that as soon as a Nats reliever enters the game, the current score will be the final score?  Did you know ever Washington starter has the most electric stuff in the game and are virtually unhittable?  Did you know Nick Johnson and Ryan Zimmerman are Green Berets in the offseason and lead combat missions in Iraq just for practice???  Man will somebody humble these guys, already!

Did you know Johnson and Zimmerman are actually the twin sons of TiT?

   H5 +1

[BlueStateSaint]

As for the Phillthies' vaunted offense, two words for you:  Tim Redding.  Hole Camels had a great pitching performance, yet the O wasn't there.  What did they get off of Redding, one hit, maybe?

There's holes on every team.  Some of the perceived ones on the Mets are a lot smaller than one makes them out to be, and some on the Braves and Phillies are a tad larger than one can admit.

True.  Sometimes you just gotta tip your cap to the opposition.  Redding was nearly flawless. 

On the other hand, it was April 2, it was cold, and the Phillies were pressing.  Let's see Redding throw the same game against us a month from now.  Hell, our bats came alive yesterday and overcame a 6-1 defecit.  And Chris Coste's solo HR in the 3rd was the only HR (which would have been a HR anywhere), so you can't blame it on the park.

Considering the bandbox that is CBP, I'd be hard pressed to blame the lack of HRs on the park.  If the game had been at RFK, then yeah, a case like that would be sustainable.

And, as I said above, I've hear it said that you're going to win 60 no matter how bad you play, and lose 60 no matter how good you play.  It's the other 42 that you have to worry about ('86 Mets and '98 Yankees notwithstanding).

I was talking about the Coste HR.  You can't lay that one just on the park.  And my main point is how we overcame a large defecit without home-runs, hence our offese is as good as advertised.  That can't be laid on the park either. 

But you are right, it's way too early to make any accurate predictions, other than we're going to win at least 60.     I live in northern Maryland, and I get the Washington/Baltimore broadcasts.  Good God, you should hear the Nats broadcasting crew talking these guys up like they're already on their way to the World Series.    Did you know that as soon as a Nats reliever enters the game, the current score will be the final score?  Did you know ever Washington starter has the most electric stuff in the game and are virtually unhittable?  Did you know Nick Johnson and Ryan Zimmerman are Green Berets in the offseason and lead combat missions in Iraq just for practice???  Man will somebody humble these guys, already!

Did you know Johnson and Zimmerman are actually the twin sons of TiT?

   H5 +1

    Ditto on the H5!

My computer screen, however, got some Cherry Coke Zero on it . . . 

[BlueStateSaint]

As for the Phillthies' vaunted offense, two words for you:  Tim Redding.  Hole Camels had a great pitching performance, yet the O wasn't there.  What did they get off of Redding, one hit, maybe?

There's holes on every team.  Some of the perceived ones on the Mets are a lot smaller than one makes them out to be, and some on the Braves and Phillies are a tad larger than one can admit.

True.  Sometimes you just gotta tip your cap to the opposition.  Redding was nearly flawless. 

On the other hand, it was April 2, it was cold, and the Phillies were pressing.  Let's see Redding throw the same game against us a month from now.  Hell, our bats came alive yesterday and overcame a 6-1 defecit.  And Chris Coste's solo HR in the 3rd was the only HR (which would have been a HR anywhere), so you can't blame it on the park.

Considering the bandbox that is CBP, I'd be hard pressed to blame the lack of HRs on the park.  If the game had been at RFK, then yeah, a case like that would be sustainable.

And, as I said above, I've hear it said that you're going to win 60 no matter how bad you play, and lose 60 no matter how good you play.  It's the other 42 that you have to worry about ('86 Mets and '98 Yankees notwithstanding).

I was talking about the Coste HR.  You can't lay that one just on the park.  And my main point is how we overcame a large defecit without home-runs, hence our offese is as good as advertised.  That can't be laid on the park either. 

But you are right, it's way too early to make any accurate predictions, other than we're going to win at least 60.     I live in northern Maryland, and I get the Washington/Baltimore broadcasts.  Good God, you should hear the Nats broadcasting crew talking these guys up like they're already on their way to the World Series.    Did you know that as soon as a Nats reliever enters the game, the current score will be the final score?  Did you know ever Washington starter has the most electric stuff in the game and are virtually unhittable?  Did you know Nick Johnson and Ryan Zimmerman are Green Berets in the offseason and lead combat missions in Iraq just for practice???  Man will somebody humble these guys, already!

Did you know Johnson and Zimmerman are actually the twin sons of TiT?

   H5 +1

That was very worthy . . . H5 +1 . . .

[Wretched Excess]

I feel like I this thread needs to be stickied.

[Odin's Hand]

I feel like I this thread needs to be stickied.

Do it, WE.

[BlueStateSaint]

I feel like I this thread needs to be stickied.

I double-dog dare ya! 

[Red October]

My my, look who's 0-4.     I'm sure there's no need to sound the alarm bells yet.  After all, Cleveland could always wind up blowing the entire month of September out their posteriors... 

[BlueStateSaint]

My my, look who's 0-4.     I'm sure there's no need to sound the alarm bells yet.  After all, Cleveland could always wind up blowing the entire month of September out their posteriors... 

"No bullpen" disease.  Teams in the NL have it, too . . . 

[Taxman]

My my, look who's 0-4.     I'm sure there's no need to sound the alarm bells yet.  After all, Cleveland could always wind up blowing the entire month of September out their posteriors... 

Make that 0-5.  No bullpen and no offense.  Going to be a LONG LONG LONG year for Tigers' fans. 

[Wretched Excess]

I feel like I this thread needs to be stickied.

I double-dog dare ya! 

baseball is very important to me.  I don't want to sticky the thread, because I don't want baseball to be confined to one thread.

I encourage our baseball fans to branch out, and start new threads.