Don't Run Away, BuzzClik. I have a question for you.

[Skul]

Like a moth to flames.
The camera continues to run.

[Carl]

Okay. I get it.

You're not interested in a discussion at any level.

Done and done.

Nice try to run away when you idiotically talk yourself into a corner.
Try to answer this then.


Did the pizza place provide a catering service...yes or no?

Did the question asked of them apply to a service they did not provide...yes or no?

Did they ever say they would refuse to sell a pizza to a person for any reason in the course of their normal business operations...yes or no?


Three simple questions,three simple answers,can you do it?

[Bad Dog]

Buzzy, how do you feel about Ron Paul?

[Big Dog]

no

There, that wasn't so difficult, was it?

You previously stated that you believe Christian business owners have no right to refuse service to anyone based on their (the Christians') moral beliefs. You were consistent in stating the same about Muslim businesses, at least Muslim bakeries.

Now, it is reasonable to conclude that the homosexual baker is morally opposed to the Westboro Baptist Church's religious beliefs. It is also reasonable to conclude that the Christian pizza people in Indiana are morally opposed to participating in a homosexual wedding (or wedding reception). 

So, why do you believe the homosexual's moral opposition is a valid reason to discriminate, but the Christians' is not?

[BuzzClik]

Buzzy, how do you feel about Ron Paul?

Interesting question.

I voted for Paul in 1988 because I was in a libertarian phase (still there in part), and he offered an alternative to Bush. I liked Paul's message at the time, but I've drifted further left since that time. Most of the libertarian candidates after Paul were a bit unhinged.

Paul's political views have wandered about over the years. He was outspoken against the invasion of Iraq in 2002, which was good, but the hard-core libertarian approach is not as appealing to me now as it once was. I admit that I lost track of him during the later years of his terms in the House.

[Bad Dog]

Interesting question.

I voted for Paul in 1988 because I was in a libertarian phase (still there in part), and he offered an alternative to Bush. I liked Paul's message at the time, but I've drifted further left since that time. Most of the libertarian candidates after Paul were a bit unhinged.

Paul's political views have wandered about over the years. He was outspoken against the invasion of Iraq in 2002, which was good, but the hard-core libertarian approach is not as appealing to me now as it once was. I admit that I lost track of him during the later years of his terms in the House.

Neckbeard!  Pats self on back.

[Movie buff- The Sequel]

I have no idea what questions you asked. I either missed them or ignored them. Repeat them here or tell me where to look, and I consider answering them.

Buzz, it was Docstew slightly amending the hypothetical question he asked you:
Let's say that the cake in question did not have any obscene or blatantly offensive content  on it, just a regular- looking cake, but someone from Westboro Baptist Church deliberately made the request from a homosexual- run bakery, as a way to add insult to injury? In that case, do you believe the baker would have the right to refuse service?
btw, I'm equally interested in how you'll answer this question.

[Carl]

Nice try to run away when you idiotically talk yourself into a corner.
Try to answer this then.


Did the pizza place provide a catering service...yes or no?

Did the question asked of them apply to a service they did not provide...yes or no?

Did they ever say they would refuse to sell a pizza to a person for any reason in the course of their normal business operations...yes or no?


Three simple questions,three simple answers,can you do it?

You responded on this thread which means you saw this...where are your discussion worthy yes or no answers?

[BuzzClik]

You previously stated that you believe Christian business owners have no right to refuse service to anyone based on their (the Christians') moral beliefs. You were consistent in stating the same about Muslim businesses, at least Muslim bakeries.

Now, it is reasonable to conclude that the homosexual baker is morally opposed to the Westboro Baptist Church's religious beliefs. It is also reasonable to conclude that the Christian pizza people in Indiana are morally opposed to participating in a homosexual wedding (or wedding reception). 

So, why do you believe the homosexual's moral opposition is a valid reason to discriminate, but the Christians' is not?

The gay baker is refusing to make a cake bearing a hateful slur. If the baker refused to bake the cake because he hates Baptists, that would be unacceptable. But, I'm guessing the same hypothetical baker would refuse to similarly decorate a cake ordered by Nazis or a cake ordered by Will Pitt saying, "F*ck you, Karl Rove, you f*cking f*ck." If he provided the Pitt/Rove cake and not the Nazi/Westboro cake, he'd be in trouble.

[HawkHogan]

The gay baker is refusing to make a cake bearing a hateful slur. If the baker refused to bake the cake because he hates Baptists, that would be unacceptable. But, I'm guessing the same hypothetical baker would refuse to similarly decorate a cake ordered by Nazis or a cake ordered by Will Pitt saying, "F*ck you, Karl Rove, you f*cking f*ck." If he provided the Pitt/Rove cake and not the Nazi/Westboro cake, he'd be in trouble.

You claimed that you were once a libertarian but you think the government can compel businesses to provide services against their will. 

Quite the libertarian!

[Carl]

The gay baker is refusing to make a cake bearing a hateful slur. If the baker refused to bake the cake because he hates Baptists, that would be unacceptable. But, I'm guessing the same hypothetical baker would refuse to similarly decorate a cake ordered by Nazis or a cake ordered by Will Pitt saying, "F*ck you, Karl Rove, you f*cking f*ck." If he provided the Pitt/Rove cake and not the Nazi/Westboro cake, he'd be in trouble.

So leftists would then make false claims about his business to try to shut him down?

[Carl]

Why can`t you answer my yes or no questions above?

Are you unable to honestly?

[Big Dog]

The gay baker is refusing to make a cake bearing a hateful slur. If the baker refused to bake the cake because he hates Baptists, that would be unacceptable. But, I'm guessing the same hypothetical baker would refuse to similarly decorate a cake ordered by Nazis or a cake ordered by Will Pitt saying, "F*ck you, Karl Rove, you f*cking f*ck." If he provided the Pitt/Rove cake and not the Nazi/Westboro cake, he'd be in trouble.

So you believe it is not the actions of the business owner which are "unacceptable", it is his motive. As long as he can justify his discrimination to your satisfaction, it's OK. Good for me, bad for thee, right?

Note: The baker is not hypothetical, Buzz. There is a homosexual cake baker in Topeka- I know him. To my knowledge, Shirley Phelps Roper (whom I have a history with; which you would already know if you had done some "opposition research"- your friend Pitt can help you with that, BTW) has not demanded a cake from his business.

[Big Dog]

You claimed that you were once a libertarian but you think the government can compel businesses to provide services against their will. 

Quite the libertarian!

Yeah, I call double bullshit on that one. I guess when ol' Buzz "drifted to the left", to use his words, he fell off the edge of the free world.

[ChuckJ]

I'm beginning to wonder if Buzz has some sort of S&M fetish because I've treated him nothing but politely, and I don't think he's answered my question.

[BuzzClik]

So you believe it is not the actions of the business owner which are "unacceptable", it is his motive. As long as he can justify his discrimination to your satisfaction, it's OK. Good for me, bad for thee, right?

Certain forms of discrimination are acceptable under the law; "no shirt, no shoes, no service", for example. You cannot, however, discriminate against entire groups of people (race, color, religion, sexual orientation).

...which you would already know if you had done some "opposition research"- your friend Pitt can help you with that...

First, I do not consider you the opposition (life is too short), and I'm too lazy to do such research (ditto). Second, Will Pitt is a dick. I've told him so many times. I'm pretty sure the feeling is mutual.

[Carl]

Since you won`t answer my first question and in light of you being proven a liar regarding the pizza place video,maybe you can deal with similar hypotheticals.

Let`s say you run a graphic design business (and just fired Atman McGrath) and three people enter your building.

The first one says they are an atheist and they want 500 posters saying "God is an evil myth"

The second one says that they are a Muslim and they want 750 posters saying "Christians and Jews are the enemy of peace"

The third one says that they are a devout Christian and they want 500 posters saying "Abortion and homosexuality are a perversion"


What do you do buzzy?

[Big Dog]

Certain forms of discrimination are acceptable under the law; "no shirt, no shoes, no service", for example. You cannot, however, discriminate against entire groups of people (race, color, religion, sexual orientation).

Do you believe "law" = "morality"?  Does the State define right and wrong for you?

And you have a Las Vegas Leviathan sized hole in your argument. Do you know what it is?

First, I do not consider you the opposition (life is too short), and I'm too lazy to do such research (ditto). Second, Will Pitt is a dick. I've told him so many times. I'm pretty sure the feeling is mutual.

There may be hope for you yet.

If you had looked before you leaped, you would have learned that I was one of the founding members of the Patriot Guard in Kansas, and was the National Captain (like the national commander of the American Legion or the VFW) from 2007-2008.

CNN interview, 2008

I have a long history with the Westboro Baptist Church.

[obumazombie]

Certain forms of discrimination are acceptable under the law; "no shirt, no shoes, no service", for example. You cannot, however, discriminate against entire groups of people (race, color, religion, sexual orientation).

First, I do not consider you the opposition (life is too short), and I'm too lazy to do such research (ditto). Second, Will Pitt is a dick. I've told him so many times. I'm pretty sure the feeling is mutual.

One aspect of libs that conservatives (and libertarians hate) is you won't admit when you are wrong, and you won't admit when you have been caught red handed in a lie.
You denying that you're lying when you were caught red handed does not persuade a conservative to your assertions of innocence.
That only works on your fellow libs.
We call it grubering.

I have already told you there is no such thing as sexual orientation.
There is only sexual preference.
It is the act that makes the deviant.

[BuzzClik]

If you had looked before you leaped, you would have learned that I was one of the founding members of the Patriot Guard in Kansas, and was the National Captain (like the national commander of the American Legion or the VFW) from 2007-2008.

Whoa. Dude, you are a hero.

[thundley4]

Quote from: BuzzClik on Today at 02:47:37 PM
Certain forms of discrimination are acceptable under the law; "no shirt, no shoes, no service", for example. You cannot, however, discriminate against entire groups of people (race, color, religion, sexual orientation).

Funny thing is though, when communities or businesses have laws or rules against wearing your pants down to your knees, the left starts screaming about racism, even though the rules and laws apply to all people.

[Ptarmigan]

I'm beginning to wonder if Buzz has some sort of S&M fetish because I've treated him nothing but politely, and I don't think he's answered my question.

I am thinking that too.

[Big Dog]

Whoa. Dude, you are a hero.

No, I am not.

[obumazombie]

No, I am not.

You know what ?
I really think Buzzy is mixing up Big Dog and Bad Dog.
Just another good example of how loose of a grip libs have on reality.


edit - g

[BuzzClik]

I am thinking that too.

I don't recall your question. On this thread? Another? Please direct me to your question or, maybe, just re-ask.