What percentage of the world's 1.6 billion Muslim population "is bound by the entire Islamic doctrine?"

[georgephillip]

Get your head checked.  That's soverign Israeli soil. 

You uses the term "settler" as if it were a crime to live on land that you have legitimate claims to. All claims to the West Bank by Jordan were dropped decades ago, which leaves Israel the sole legal authority, both by UN Resolution and the laws of land warfare. If settling on such land is a crime, then Mohammed's taking of Medina and Mecca, and the Islamic colonization of the formerly Christian kingdoms of North Africa and the Levant must be far greater crimes, as was the Jordanian, Egyptian and Syrian invasions of Israel in 1948, 1967 and 1973. However, these arguments are based on facts and history, not narrow minded factually inaccurate bigotry like you're putting forth.

In fact, the hundreds of thousands Jewish settler inhabiting the Occupied Territory of the West Bank are there in violation of established  international law:

"The Occupying Power shall not deport or transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies."

The key word is "territory".
It doesn't matter what the Jordanian claims were decades ago.
All of the Jewish settler-colonialists who have moved into the West Bank since 1967 are there illegally.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_Geneva_Convention#Section_III._Occupied_territories

[txradioguy]

In fact, the hundreds of thousands Jewish settler inhabiting the Occupied Territory of the West Bank are there in violation of established  international law:

"The Occupying Power shall not deport or transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies."

The key word is "territory".
It doesn't matter what the Jordanian claims were decades ago.
All of the Jewish settler-colonialists who have moved into the West Bank since 1967 are there illegally.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_Geneva_Convention#Section_III._Occupied_territories

No they are there legally.  As was shown to you previously by Odysseus.  Jordan gave up their claims.

But then you already knew that.

And you've still not addressed that pesky issue about U.N. Resolution 181 from back in 1948.

Why is that?

[biersmythe]

No they are there legally.  As was shown to you previously by Odysseus.  Jordan gave up their claims.

But then you already knew that.

And you've still not addressed that pesky issue about U.N. Resolution 181 from back in 1948.

Why is that?

 

[georgephillip]

No they are there legally.  As was shown to you previously by Odysseus.  Jordan gave up their claims.

But then you already knew that.

And you've still not addressed that pesky issue about U.N. Resolution 181 from back in 1948.

Why is that?

Because USGR 181 was a purely advisory resolution which required both Jew and Arab acceptance in order to take effect.
Arabs didn't understand why one-third of the population of Mandate Palestine was "given" 55% of the land.
In retrospect, the Arabs should have chosen earlier western inflicted partition plans:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Partition_Plan_for_Palestine#Earlier_proposals_for_partition

"The League of Nations granted Britain a mandate over Palestine as part of the Partitioning of the Ottoman Empire following World War I. A British census of 1918 estimated 700,000 Arabs and 56,000 Jews.[6]

"In the 1917 Balfour Declaration, the British foreign secretary stated that the British government viewed “with favour the establishment in Palestine of a National Home for the Jewish people [with the understanding that] nothing should be done to prejudice the civil and religious rights of the existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine . . . .” .[6]

"Neither partition nor statehood was mentioned as the means of accomplishing the National Home. Lord Curzon, who later succeeded Balfour as foreign secretary, wrote a memorandum expressing concern about what would become of the Arab inhabitants of Palestine who had 'occupied the country for the best part of 1,500 years' and would 'not be content either to be expropriated for Jewish immigrants, or to act merely as hewers of wood and drawers of water to the latter.' [6]

In 1937, the Peel Commission proposed a Palestine divided into an Arab state, a much smaller Jewish state (about 15%), and an international zone. The Arab leadership rejected the plan.

"The two main Jewish leaders, Chaim Weizmann and Ben Gurion had convinced the Zionist Congress to approve equivocally the Peel recommendations as a basis for more negotiation.[7][8][quotations 1][9]

"These proposals contained provisions for the relocation of Arab population to areas outside the borders of the new Jewish state, modelled on the population exchange between Greece and Turkey; they were also rejected by the Arab side."

[obumazombie]

Again with the mythical Palestine. Again with the wikipedia references. The least credible, the least accurate, the most biased source.

[txradioguy]

Again with the mythical Palestine. Again with the wikipedia references. The least credible, the least accurate, the most biased source.

He'd rather deal in propaganda that supports his racist belief than deal with reality. He's no better than the 9/11 truthers.

[obumazombie]

He'd rather deal in propaganda that supports his racist belief than deal with reality. He's no better than the 9/11 truthers.

That seems to be fleshing out just as you describe.

[georgephillip]

Again with the mythical Palestine. Again with the wikipedia references. The least credible, the least accurate, the most biased source.

No myth:

"His Majesty's government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine..."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balfour_Declaration

[obumazombie]

I say again, mythical palestine the borders of which are nebulous, and again with the wikipedia. It actually served to reinforce my point. Thank you george for agreeing with me.

[Mr Mannn]

Mods, Admins please ban this racist asshole. and please move these two race-hate threads out of the terrorism forum at least. or disappear them please.

[Rebel]

No myth:

"His Majesty's government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine..."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balfour_Declaration

Well, I guess the Pseudostinians can always rise up and take back what they perceive as "their" lands. That would be fun to watch.

Jews have been in those lands for 5000 years, dumb****. Their lands were stolen by the Muzzies when those goat-****ing cavemen left Saudi on their quest for global domination. The lands were returned to them in 1948. Here's an idea, why don't you take your moonbat ass over there to protest against the Jooooo "occupation" in the spirit of Rachel Corrie?

[georgephillip]

I say again, mythical palestine the borders of which are nebulous, and again with the wikipedia. It actually served to reinforce my point. Thank you george for agreeing with me.

Obu...the Balfour Declaration is not mythological. It was submitted in 1917, about six years after the Royal Navy switched from coal to oil to power its imperial fleets. Do you think the timing was a coincidence?

"November 2nd, 1917

"Dear Lord Rothschild,

"I have much pleasure in conveying to you, on behalf of His Majesty's Government, the following declaration of sympathy with Jewish Zionist aspirations which has been submitted to, and approved by, the Cabinet.

"His Majesty's Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country."

"I should be grateful if you would bring this declaration to the knowledge of the Zionist Federation.

"Yours sincerely,

Arthur James Balfour"

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/balfour.asp

[georgephillip]

Mods, Admins please ban this racist asshole. and please move these two race-hate threads out of the terrorism forum at least. or disappear them please.

What's the point of visiting an internet political message board if you don't debate with people you couldn't discuss politics with for five minutes in the same room?

[Zathras]

What's the point of visiting an internet political message board if you don't debate with people you couldn't discuss politics with for five minutes in the same room?

You're just posting articles from biased websites, unwilling to use your own words to discuss anything. That's not debating....that's called trolling.

[txradioguy]

What's the point of visiting an internet political message board if you don't debate with people you couldn't discuss politics with for five minutes in the same room?

Because we don't tolerate or respect racists.

[Odysseus]

Because USGR 181 was a purely advisory resolution which required both Jew and Arab acceptance in order to take effect.
Arabs didn't understand why one-third of the population of Mandate Palestine was "given" 55% of the land.
In retrospect, the Arabs should have chosen earlier western inflicted partition plans:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Partition_Plan_for_Palestine#Earlier_proposals_for_partition

"The League of Nations granted Britain a mandate over Palestine as part of the Partitioning of the Ottoman Empire following World War I. A British census of 1918 estimated 700,000 Arabs and 56,000 Jews.[6]

"In the 1917 Balfour Declaration, the British foreign secretary stated that the British government viewed “with favour the establishment in Palestine of a National Home for the Jewish people [with the understanding that] nothing should be done to prejudice the civil and religious rights of the existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine . . . .” .[6]

"Neither partition nor statehood was mentioned as the means of accomplishing the National Home. Lord Curzon, who later succeeded Balfour as foreign secretary, wrote a memorandum expressing concern about what would become of the Arab inhabitants of Palestine who had 'occupied the country for the best part of 1,500 years' and would 'not be content either to be expropriated for Jewish immigrants, or to act merely as hewers of wood and drawers of water to the latter.' [6]

In 1937, the Peel Commission proposed a Palestine divided into an Arab state, a much smaller Jewish state (about 15%), and an international zone. The Arab leadership rejected the plan.

"The two main Jewish leaders, Chaim Weizmann and Ben Gurion had convinced the Zionist Congress to approve equivocally the Peel recommendations as a basis for more negotiation.[7][8][quotations 1][9]

"These proposals contained provisions for the relocation of Arab population to areas outside the borders of the new Jewish state, modelled on the population exchange between Greece and Turkey; they were also rejected by the Arab side."

Again, false.  Let's start with the 55% canard.  Mandatory Palestine included both sides of the Jordan River.  The British arbitrarily separated the eastern territory to create the state of Transjordan, later just Jordan, as a reward to the Hashemites for services rendered.  This constituted taking over 77% of the Palestine mandate and creating a whole new Arab state.  The Jews received 55% of the remaining 23%, or 12.65% of the mandate, less than even the Peel Commission suggested (and, BTW, you ought to mention why the Peel Commission existed in the first place, which was to analyze the causes of the perpetual Arab/Muslim violence against Jews in the mandate, and which cited Arab intransigence as the primary cause).  And, this also excludes the territories given to France under the Sykes-Picot Treaty (remember that the Roman province was "Syria Palestina" or Syrian Palestine).  As the map of the original mandate demonstrates, the Israelis would have received a minute piece of land under the partition agreement.



Remember that Jerusalem, which had a Jewish majority going back centuries, was to be made into an open city, not part of either territory, something that the Arabs also objected to.  No solution except 100% of the region being given to the Muslims/Arabs would have satisfied them, and once that was accomplished, they would have resumed their persecution of Jews and Christians, and given the number of former Nazis harbored by them, and the genocidal leanings of many of the Arab leaders, that persecution would have simply extended Hitler's policies. 

Once again, you present half-truths as facts and ignore facts in order to present false arguments.  

[georgephillip]

Again, false.  Let's start with the 55% canard.  Mandatory Palestine included both sides of the Jordan River.  The British arbitrarily separated the eastern territory to create the state of Transjordan, later just Jordan, as a reward to the Hashemites for services rendered.  This constituted taking over 77% of the Palestine mandate and creating a whole new Arab state.  The Jews received 55% of the remaining 23%, or 12.65% of the mandate, less than even the Peel Commission suggested (and, BTW, you ought to mention why the Peel Commission existed in the first place, which was to analyze the causes of the perpetual Arab/Muslim violence against Jews in the mandate, and which cited Arab intransigence as the primary cause).  And, this also excludes the territories given to France under the Sykes-Picot Treaty (remember that the Roman province was "Syria Palestina" or Syrian Palestine).  As the map of the original mandate demonstrates, the Israelis would have received a minute piece of land under the partition agreement.



Remember that Jerusalem, which had a Jewish majority going back centuries, was to be made into an open city, not part of either territory, something that the Arabs also objected to.  No solution except 100% of the region being given to the Muslims/Arabs would have satisfied them, and once that was accomplished, they would have resumed their persecution of Jews and Christians, and given the number of former Nazis harbored by them, and the genocidal leanings of many of the Arab leaders, that persecution would have simply extended Hitler's policies. 

Once again, you present half-truths as facts and ignore facts in order to present false arguments. 

Once again, your "facts" are false.
By 1948 650,000 Jews and 1.2 million Arabs lived between the River and the sea.
UNGR 181 bestowed 55% of that land on one third of the population of Palestine.
The solution that both Jew and Arab sought in Palestine would have been obtained at the ballot box, but obviously that wouldn't have produced a Jewish state dependent upon western imperial powers for its existence.

[Rebel]

but obviously that wouldn't have produced a Jewish state dependent upon western imperial powers for its existence.

Hmm, last I checked, we didn't send divisions into Israel to protect them from the Muzzie dirtbags that declared war on them.

Once more...

Well, I guess the Pseudostinians can always rise up and take back what they perceive as "their" lands. That would be fun to watch.

[Dori]

Hmm, last I checked, we didn't send divisions into Israel to protect them from the Muzzie dirtbags that declared war on them.

If anyone read some Soviet history, they would soon find out that it was Russia who instigated that whole thing to begin with.

[georgephillip]

Hmm, last I checked, we didn't send divisions into Israel to protect them from the Muzzie dirtbags that declared war on them.

Once more...

Well, I guess the Pseudostinians can always rise up and take back what they perceive as "their" lands. That would be fun to watch.

Are you ready to provide the "Pseudostinians" with a level playing field?

"Military aid and procurement[edit]

"Israel is the largest cumulative recipient of military assistance from the United States since World War II, followed by Afghanistan, Iraq, Egypt, and Pakistan.[22]

"Since 1987, the U.S. has provided an average of $1.8 billion annually in the form of Foreign Military Sales (FMS), Foreign Military Financing (FMF) and funds to support research and development.[2]A bilateral memorandum of understanding was signed in January 2001, at the end of the Clinton administration, under which defense aid was increased to $2.4 billion annually from $1.8 billion, while the $1.2 billion of economic aid would be eliminated."

Or does a fair fight scare you?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel%E2%80%93United_States_military_relations#Military_aid_and_procurement

[obumazombie]

^You obviously have never heard of the Powell doctrine.

[Zathras]

More lame assed racist bull shit

[txradioguy]

Are you ready to provide the "Pseudostinians" with a level playing field?

"Military aid and procurement[edit]

"Israel is the largest cumulative recipient of military assistance from the United States since World War II, followed by Afghanistan, Iraq, Egypt, and Pakistan.[22]

"Since 1987, the U.S. has provided an average of $1.8 billion annually in the form of Foreign Military Sales (FMS), Foreign Military Financing (FMF) and funds to support research and development.[2]A bilateral memorandum of understanding was signed in January 2001, at the end of the Clinton administration, under which defense aid was increased to $2.4 billion annually from $1.8 billion, while the $1.2 billion of economic aid would be eliminated."

Or does a fair fight scare you?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel%E2%80%93United_States_military_relations#Military_aid_and_procurement

The Palestinians had their chance at a "level playing field" in 1948 and they refused.

And as far as aid to the Palestinians:

"Since the signing of the Oslo Accord in 1993, the U.S. government has committed more than $1.3 billion in economic assistance to the West Bank and Gaza Strip.

Since the end of 2000, Arab states have transferred to the Palestinian Authority monthly financial aid of $45 million (since April 2002 this sum was increased to $55 million). The European Union (EU) transfers to the PA approximately $9 million monthly. By the end of 2001, the Palestinians had received $4 billion (the figure is now closer to $5.5 billion) since the 1993 Oslo agreements.

This is the equivalent of $1,330 per Palestinian. By comparison, the Marshall Plan to rebuild Europe after World War II provided $272 per European (in today's dollars)."

The CIA - World Factbook, as of Sep. 27, 2006, estimated the amount of economic aid received by the West Bank and Gaza Strip and explained the methodology used to arrive at its estimate:

"Economic aid - recipient: $2 Billion from US (2004 est.)" [Total contributions over 50 + years] "This entry [economic aid estimate], which is subject to major problems of definition and statistical coverage, refers to the net inflow of Official Development Finance (ODF) to recipient countries. The figure includes assistance from the World Bank, the IMF, and other international organizations and from individual nation donors. Formal commitments of aid are included in the data. Omitted from the data are grants by private organizations. Aid comes in various forms including outright grants and loans. The entry thus is the difference between new inflows and repayments. These figures are calculated on an exchange rate basis, i.e., not in purchasing power parity (PPP) terms."

The European Union (EU), in a section on its website (accessed Sep. 26, 2006) titled "The EU's Relations with West Bank and Gaza Strip," stated the following:
"Since the outbreak of the second Intifada in September 2000... the European Community shifted much of its assistance from more long-term institution-building to badly needed humanitarian assistance and support to refugees through the United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA)... The Council of the European Union, together with the European Parliament, endorsed the use of budget support in this context."

http://israelipalestinian.procon.org/view.answers.php?questionID=000592

All of that money.  If it had been used properly the Palestinians should be living rather nicely and have all kinds of modern utilities and services for their people.  Instead they use that money for this:

The Palestinian Authority is spending more than $5 million per month in salaries for 5,500 convicted and alleged terrorists imprisoned in Israel -- payments that defy congressional rules for U.S. funding to the PA, according to a new report from an Israeli research institute.

Palestinian Media Watch released a report last week that found that all Palestinian and Israeli minority Arabs in Israeli prisons for terror acts have been legally receiving a monthly salary from the PA under a new law passed in April that simply “formalizes what has long been a PA practice.”

“The U.S. funds the PA’s general budget. Through the PA budget, the U.S. is paying the salaries of terrorist murderers in prison and funding the glorification and role modeling of terrorists,” the report reads.

The average salary of a prisoner is greater than Palestinian civil servants – prisoners on average receive 3,200 in Israeli shekels a month compared with 2,800 for civil servants.

The U.S. government provided nearly $600 million to the PA last year, including $225 million in direct budgetary assistance to the PA, the report stated. But the PA’s new law may violate congressional rules for providing financial aid to the region.

Under a 2010 funding legislation that lays out the rules for supplying money to the West Bank and Gaza, the secretary of state “shall take all appropriate steps to ensure that such assistance is not provided to or through any individual, private or government entity, or educational institution that the secretary knows or has reason to believe advocates, plans, sponsors, engages in, or has engaged in, terrorist activity,” according to the report.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/08/04/palestinian-authority-pays-millions-in-salaries-to-jailed-terrorists-with-help/

[georgephillip]

If anyone read some Soviet history, they would soon find out that it was Russia who instigated that whole thing to begin with.

Do you have a link for your belief that "Russia...instigated the whole thing to begin with."

Russia lost twenty million people fighting Hitler.
In parts of that country, one in three buildings was totally destroyed.

The last thing Russia needed at the end of WWII was a multi-generational arms race with a continental superpower whose homeland infrastructure and civilian population were virtually untouched.

[obumazombie]

Do you have a link for your belief that "Russia...instigated the whole thing to begin with."

Russia lost twenty million people fighting Hitler.
In parts of that country, one in three buildings was totally destroyed.

The last thing Russia needed at the end of WWII was a multi-generational arms race with a continental superpower whose homeland infrastructure and civilian population were virtually untouched.

Not counting Pearl Harbor.