Alaska governor sees 'perfection' in son with Down syndrome

[Kimberly]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3295337#3295342

BigDaddy44 (620 posts)      Sat May-03-08 06:48 PM
Original message
Alaska governor sees 'perfection' in son with Down syndrome
 Advertisements [?]Source: Associated Press

JUNEAU, Alaska (AP) - The results of Gov. Sarah Palin's prenatal testing were in, and the doctor's tone was ominous: "You need to come to the office so we can talk about it."

Palin, known for a resolve that quickly launched her from suburban hockey mom to a player on the national political stage, said, "No, go ahead and tell me over the phone."

The physician replied, "Down syndrome," stunning the Republican governor, who had just completed what many political analysts called a startling first year in office.

She had arrived at the Capitol on an ethics reform platform after defeating the incumbent Republican in the primary and a former two- term Democratic governor in the general election. Her growing reputation as a maverick for bucking her party's establishment and Alaska's powerful oil industry quickly gained her a national reputation.

Read more: http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D90EECIO0&show_article=1

This last post really sums up the entire thread.

ulysses  (1000+ posts)       Mon May-05-08 08:20 PM
Response to Original message
210. wow. this is kind of a horrifying thread.

 

Here's some highlights:

shraby  (1000+ posts)       Sat May-03-08 06:54 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. And who will do the caretaking when
 she becomes too old to do it? A Down's child is a lifetime plus commitment. 

nodehopper (1000+ posts)      Sun May-04-08 10:14 AM
Response to Reply #4
85. aborting a fetus is not the same as killing a child
 let's not lapse into RW rhetoric.

of course, it is her choice. I would have made a different one.

hack89 (1000+ posts)      Sun May-04-08 10:04 PM
Response to Reply #85
113. If it is wanted it is a child - mine certainly were. nt

  It is always a child,  no matter what the mother decides.

tpsbmam  (622 posts)      Sat May-03-08 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #3
42. Wow, so by that reasoning all children with serious disabilities.....
 should have been aborted? As a person with a serious disability (though not at birth) and a disability advocate, I resent the hell out of this. This is an incredibly difficult decision for pregnant women and their partners and there is no right or wrong here. The only wrong I see is people who judge these parents based on what I'm not sure since you didn't elucidate. 

Fire_Medic_Dave (593 posts)      Mon May-05-08 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #127
138. So you agree with government enforced poulation controls?
 That wouldn't make you very liberal, so you may want to rethink that policy.

David

Check out this person's posts. I'm not going to copy all of them, but they are all similarly stupid and disgusting . 

bean fidhleir (728 posts)     Mon May-05-08 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #138
141. Yes, I do agree with population control, and would want it guaranteed by
 mandatory sterilization after one-half a live birth per person. Both people involved get the knife. And any guy who gets more than one woman pregnant at a time loses his nuts.

My reason? No matter what the whackjobs say, humans are not special or immune from natural law. Overpopulation always means suffering, disease, and starvation. What's unique about humans is our ability to spread the suffering around, til now our mishegoss involves the whole world. What kind of mind would it take to accept innocent children dying of disease or starvation just so some psychopath can have a bigger religion, bigger army, or a bigger pool of cheap labor?

The idea that you, a medic, wouldn't already be way ahead of me on this is baffling.

A rabid lefty vegan peta supporter can't ratchet up a smidgen of compassion for a down syndrome baby. What a surprise. 

LeftyMom  (1000+ posts)       Sat May-03-08 07:37 PM
Response to Original message
11. NO mention of the high risk of heart and digestive tract issues. 
 There's more at stake, in choosing to carry a Down's Syndrome child to term, than just the significant cognitive issues- there are a lot of associated physical conditions, ranging from the mild to the potentially deadly.

She's opted to bring a child into this world who has no hope of self-sufficiency, and who has a very high risk of disabling physical conditions as well. As an older mother she can't make a commitment to that child for life, so she's essentially stuck one or more of her kids with decades of caring for an aging body with a grade schooler's mind. That's simply a cruel and irresponsible thing to do to her four existing kids. 

LeftyMom  (1000+ posts)       Sat May-03-08 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #22
30. Sure, but some choices are irresponsible. 
 I support her right to choose, but I have the right to say her choice was a very bad one, and will have significant lifelong consequences for all five of her children. Since shes a FFL pro-life nutjob, she probably didn't give the responsibility she's saddling her other kids with any thought, and I think that's appalling. 

Here's some of the more reasonable people on this thread:

fed_up_mother (211 posts)      Sun May-04-08 10:44 PM
Response to Reply #30
115. Appalling?
 Screw you.

I adopted special needs kids. I guess I am beyond the pale in your book, since my healthy children will be saddled with their little siblings according to your point of view.


What a ****ed up world we live in.

AngryOldDem  (1000+ posts)      Mon May-05-08 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #30
136. Duly noted.
 You would have made a different choice. But how do you know that she and her family didn't discuss all of these issues before the birth? How can you justify being so judgmental? Because her decision runs counter to what you *think* she should have done?

I am just so amazed how the "pro-choice" argument only seems to run one way. Just as the pro-lifers make such a joke of themselves, the pro-choice rhetoric gets a little hard to take at times as well.

Kajsa  (1000+ posts)       Sat May-03-08 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #11
23. He's her son, disabilities and all.
 Edited on Sat May-03-08 08:14 PM by Kajsa
If she's willing to take on the challenges-
and God knows, there are lots of challenges,
of raising him then that is her choice to make.

me, I'm
- an older woman with disabilities of her own,
raising a son with autism.

He is one of the biggest challenges AND joys in my life.

 

LeftyMom  (1000+ posts)       Sat May-03-08 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #23
31. Yeah, but in a few decades, he'll be her kids' responsibility. 
 More than likely, they'll have to deal with caring for a disabled child in an adults body for decades longer than she will. It's really not fair to do that to them, when she had a choice in the matter and they did not. 

tpsbmam  (622 posts)      Sat May-03-08 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #31
48. Okay, then -- let's not try to save people seriously injured in car accidents,
 or people who have cancer or other people who develop other serious injuries and illnesses. After all, they're likely going to be a "burden" on someone.

I hope you never get seriously ill, though the chances that you won't are slim these days. YOU may then be the one who is a "burden" to someone. Maybe your family should take a vote before they decide whether to care for you or toss you in a nursing facility.

Your logic fails me and your view of disability disgusts me.

There's plenty more but I would like to give kudos to Blue_In_AK for some very nice posts in defense of Governor Palin and her children.  And to all the DUers who are raising disabled children and to DUers who are disabled themselves, God bless you. Now you know how little your fellow DUers value you.

[franksolich]

You know, that's a really big bonfire, with lots of primitives and sub-primitives on it.

However, I was really surprised that Ms. Ed the unappellated eohippus hasn't been there.

It was Ms. Ed who a couple of months ago said that a new foundation to find homes for children with Downs' Syndrome was a bad idea; that the infants should be aborted.

Oh my.

And as for birth defects, where some primitives and sub-primitives are advocating that all less-than-"perfect" infants be aborted automatically, well, that would have extincted Skins's island, what with many primitives and all sub-primitives having been born with the defects of missing a brain, a heart, and a soul.

Such silly little people, the primitives and sub-primitives.

[Carl]

As in all things to do with the primitives abortion has never really been about issues like this.

It has always been a safety valve for an irresponsible,hedonistic lifestyle.

[Chris_]

Nice to see there are some actual human beings on DU, although Skinner will TS them all by tomorrow morning.

[rich_t]

As in all things to do with the primitives abortion has never really been about issues like this.

It has always been a safety valve for an irresponsible,hedonistic lifestyle.

I concur.

[jukin]

I bet the DUchebags would be all praises for the governor if she were a democrat.

Threads like this really shine a light on the cockroaches.

[delilahmused]

LeftyMom  (1000+ posts)       Sat May-03-08 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #23
31. Yeah, but in a few decades, he'll be her kids' responsibility.
 More than likely, they'll have to deal with caring for a disabled child in an adults body for decades longer than she will. It's really not fair to do that to them, when she had a choice in the matter and they did not.

What a selfish bitch! Bet her kids are damn glad they're "normal"...nothing like a mother's love! Wonder what she'd do if one of her children developed MS, went blind, fell out of a tree, hit their head, and suffered brain damage, or was hit by a car and ended up in a wheel chair. Sometimes (especially with things like Autism) you don't even know your child has it until they're a little older. Good thing she wasn't pregnant with Helen Keller or Beethoven. What would she do, drop them off at an institution, stab them in the back of their head with a knitting needle, leave them out in the snow to die of exposure?

What's the difference, really...pre-birth, post-birth...the important thing is not to overly burden oneself or one's family with values like commitment and the importance of taking care of all God's creatures (even human ones that we didn't have the prescience to suck out of our womb because we just couldn't see little Billy would get hit by that drunk driver and end up mentally and physically challenged). It's all a crap shoot anyway...maybe it's just best to abort everyone, then we don't have to be bothered with silly little things like responsibility to one's family.

I didn't "ask" for my brothers and sisters (some came as package deals with new step parents), but you can bet I'd take care of any one of them for as long as they needed. My sister has 6 kids, I didn't ask for them either, but if anything happened to her (God forbid) I promised to raise them and homeschool them. Family should be a refuge, a sacred bond, she treats it with the cavalier attitude of deciding whether to take Main Street or Washington Blvd. to the store. Nobody gets a perfect family but if you treat it as the blessing it is you can find many truly beautiful pockets of wonderful.

Cindie

[Chris_]

LeftyMom  (1000+ posts)       Sat May-03-08 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #23
31. Yeah, but in a few decades, he'll be her kids' responsibility.
 More than likely, they'll have to deal with caring for a disabled child in an adults body for decades longer than she will. It's really not fair to do that to them, when she had a choice in the matter and they did not.

What a selfish bitch! Bet her kids are damn glad they're "normal"...nothing like a mother's love! Wonder what she'd do if one of her children developed MS, went blind, fell out of a tree, hit their head, and suffered brain damage, or was hit by a car and ended up in a wheel chair. Sometimes (especially with things like Autism) you don't even know your child has it until they're a little older. Good thing she wasn't pregnant with Helen Keller or Beethoven. What would she do, drop them off at an institution, stab them in the back of their head with a knitting needle, leave them out in the snow to die of exposure?

What's the difference, really...pre-birth, post-birth...the important thing is not to overly burden oneself or one's family with values like commitment and the importance of taking care of all God's creatures (even human ones that we didn't have the prescience to suck out of our womb because we just couldn't see little Billy would get hit by that drunk driver and end up mentally and physically challenged). It's all a crap shoot anyway...maybe it's just best to abort everyone, then we don't have to be bothered with silly little things like responsibility to one's family.

I didn't "ask" for my brothers and sisters (some came as package deals with new step parents), but you can bet I'd take care of any one of them for as long as they needed. My sister has 6 kids, I didn't ask for them either, but if anything happened to her (God forbid) I promised to raise them and homeschool them. Family should be a refuge, a sacred bond, she treats it with the cavalier attitude of deciding whether to take Main Street or Washington Blvd. to the store. Nobody gets a perfect family but if you treat it as the blessing it is you can find many truly beautiful pockets of wonderful.

Cindie

That's the problem, Cindie. They hate family, responsibility, and humanity in general, all because they are told to. The hatred destroyed any small amount of humanity they had left inside them.

[JakeStyle]

I have twin nephews that were born with Down Syndrome.  As far as I and everyone else in my family are concerned they are perfect.  These ******* ghouls at DU make me sick to my stomach.   

[BlueStateSaint]

God's Image Is in every child, born or unborn.  Since most of them deny God's Very Existence, they would deny that God Is present in every child--born or unborn.

[DumbAss Tanker]

Lotsa little Mengeles hiding in the woodwork over there, it seems.  'Specially the Beanster.

 

[JohnnyReb]

"This is an incredibly difficult decision for pregnant women and their partners"

Uh, when did DUmmies include us guys in the decicion making? ....I thought it was a woman's 'sole' right to make that decision? We men only get to pay for their 'mistakes'.

Nevermind. It just dawned on me that they must be talking about lesbian couples only. 

[RGSG99]

This is absolutely vile.  How is it up to us to decide whether a person lives or dies?  That is God's job.  I am very happy that the mother of this beautiful child feels the same way.

[VivisMom]

I am just...enraged. 

It is the hope of every mother that her child be born healthy. I know when I was pregnant, I used to worry about whether or not my child would be born with autism or Down's Syndrome or a host of other things I couldn't even have imagined before I was pregnant. But never once would I even have considered aborting her if she weren't perfect.

Who are these people who think eugenics is not just acceptable, but should be law?? I don't understand this. So what if a kid has a developmental disability? They're still a person, a living and breathing and feeling human being with as much dignity as anyone else.

This is the kind of thread that needs to be passed on to Rush and other conservative media types, so they can expose the Dummies for what they are.

[Toastedturningtidelegs]

sarmark (1 posts)      Sun May-04-08 02:27 AM
Response to Reply #60
72. Howdy
 OK, after reading here for a long time finaly a subject came up that I gotta respond to.
To those who don't believe a child with a genetic condition should be allowed to be be born, I want to thank you very much for not having been the folks who concieved me. I'm very grateful to you because I really like being alive. As ya can probably guess, i was born with a genetic condition, mine being Neurofibromatosis. Whoever it was that gave birth to me thought enough of me to allow me to be born. I was given up and adopted by the world's best parents when I was 13 months old. I don't know if the NF had anything todo with me being given up or not and it really doesn't matter. No way could I have wound up with better parents that I had. For those here who support the "Master Race" theory I have only sympathy. Your narrow minded bigotry must make you truly unhappy people. And to think that you might occasionally have to gaze upon us less than perfect humans out in public. The Horror. No need to worry though. We are not contagious. We are though, by and large far happier in who we are than you are.
Mark

I just had to make this one response. I am happy to see the favorable replies to the Governor's decision. Politicaly I'm worlds apart from the vast majority of you but I do enjoy reading here. I'm not going to be saying a lot, and I know this is a Democrat site and I respect that so I won't be doing any trolling. That 1 lady just kinda hit a nerve and this time I couldn't keep my mouth (fingers?) shut.
Si Vis Pacem Parabellum

Very well said sarmark...you're a dead man, but very well said

[jtyangel]

LeftyMom  (1000+ posts)       Sat May-03-08 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #23
31. Yeah, but in a few decades, he'll be her kids' responsibility.
 More than likely, they'll have to deal with caring for a disabled child in an adults body for decades longer than she will. It's really not fair to do that to them, when she had a choice in the matter and they did not.

What a selfish bitch! Bet her kids are damn glad they're "normal"...nothing like a mother's love! Wonder what she'd do if one of her children developed MS, went blind, fell out of a tree, hit their head, and suffered brain damage, or was hit by a car and ended up in a wheel chair. Sometimes (especially with things like Autism) you don't even know your child has it until they're a little older. Good thing she wasn't pregnant with Helen Keller or Beethoven. What would she do, drop them off at an institution, stab them in the back of their head with a knitting needle, leave them out in the snow to die of exposure?

What's the difference, really...pre-birth, post-birth...the important thing is not to overly burden oneself or one's family with values like commitment and the importance of taking care of all God's creatures (even human ones that we didn't have the prescience to suck out of our womb because we just couldn't see little Billy would get hit by that drunk driver and end up mentally and physically challenged). It's all a crap shoot anyway...maybe it's just best to abort everyone, then we don't have to be bothered with silly little things like responsibility to one's family.

I didn't "ask" for my brothers and sisters (some came as package deals with new step parents), but you can bet I'd take care of any one of them for as long as they needed. My sister has 6 kids, I didn't ask for them either, but if anything happened to her (God forbid) I promised to raise them and homeschool them. Family should be a refuge, a sacred bond, she treats it with the cavalier attitude of deciding whether to take Main Street or Washington Blvd. to the store. Nobody gets a perfect family but if you treat it as the blessing it is you can find many truly beautiful pockets of wonderful.

Cindie

Not to mention some disabilities can not be detected in womb. I'm the mother of an autistic child(diagnosed at age 3) and my children even at a young age are aware that they will help keep an eye on him someday when we are gone. Life is filled with responsibilities and trials...our 'normal' children are not immune from them, but somehow they like to see it as they are all in this together and not saddled down by their special needs brother. I'm proud to say my oldest puts her brother on the bus and kisses him goodbye and worries if he gets too far away. And my youngest now, only 4(almost), also gets worried if his brother runs too far off. They love him and neither feel 'saddled' by having him for a brother.

you learn to deal with it, but it takes a bit of self-sacrifice and delayed gratification...something that DUers are not good at. Kudos for the DUers who actually show some basic human compassion.

[USA4ME]

Oh, good grief!  Every newborn life is precious, it doesn't matter if the child has Down's or something else, it's life and it's precious.  Only selfish, ungodly fools start trying to rationalize why it'd be better to kill the child in the womb rather than let it live.  These people are simply trash.

.

[DixieBelle]

Disgusting trash. I'm just flabbergasted once again.

[Splashdown]

God's Image Is in every child, born or unborn.  Since most of them deny God's Very Existence, they would deny that God Is present in every child--born or unborn.

Well said!

[mamacags]

At what point do the morons at DU deem a child perfect enough to carry through to delivery alive?  What defects are acceptable and which ones are worth killing the baby over?

[Lauri]

bean fidhleir  (728 posts)     Mon May-05-08 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #138
141. Yes, I do agree with population control, and would want it guaranteed by
 mandatory sterilization after one-half a live birth per person.

that is the stupidest thing ive read today on DU.. 

and how does that cover the gay people? since the women can only have one live birth and the men cant have any.. do the gay men get sterilized as well?

it would be interesting to go back to the 70s and read all those articles about the coming population explosion which was already supposed to have wiped mankind off the face of the earth several times over ... if they had been right.

[BEG]

These people are sub-human.  They disgust me.  Especially LeftyMom, you are a pig

[Chris_]

These tests are not 100% accurate.  Had a young lady in our church who was told her unborn child would have DS.  She carried it to term and had a perfectly normal baby...no DS. 

[Lauri]

These tests are not 100% accurate.  Had a young lady in our church who was told her unborn child would have DS.  She carried it to term and had a perfectly normal baby...no DS. 

exactly!  doctors are often wrong about in utero situations and usually do more harm than is necessary.. remember all those forceps deliveries that left kids with permanent marks on their skulls?

how we turned pregnancy and childbirth into some sort of illness/disability is just a wonder..

[mamacags]

These tests are not 100% accurate.  Had a young lady in our church who was told her unborn child would have DS.  She carried it to term and had a perfectly normal baby...no DS. 

Same thing happened to my old best friend's brother and his wife.  In fact they had several tests that said the baby had DS and they were all wrong.  Of course it would have been nice if they had done a test to show that the husband was NOT the father, but that is a whole other story.