We're not going to reach our goal this fund drive. Let's talk.

[Ballygrl]

Subdivisions  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) 
Fri Aug-20-10 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #65
586. SEGREGATE the Progressives???? Are you kidding me?
   
Let me see if I have this right... Progressives are uncivilized, espouse third-party candidates, and need to be shuffled off to their own room, away from the civilized people? And, to top it all off, you want to eliminate Progressives from having their posts recced, like in the DU 9/11 dungeon?

I'm appalled.

[DefiantSix]

Bally, I'm curious what that DUmmy thinks Skins Island of Misfit ****-ups is for, if not to segregate the "progressives" from the rest of productive society.

Well, that and to separate DUmbshits from their pot and Cheetos money.

Good find. 

[Ballygrl]

Bally, I'm curious what that DUmmy thinks Skins Island of Misfit ****-ups is for, if not to segregate the "progressives" from the rest of productive society.

Well, that and to separate DUmbshits from their pot and Cheetos money.

Good find. 

That thread was a freaking nightmare to get through, I ended up speed reading through the thread. I find it so amazing though that people keep citing the economy yet no 1 talks about who's at fault. This video was posted here by someone and it needs to be seen by as many people as possible:

[youtube=425,350]9ssIhiD8kKM[/youtube]

[Carl]

Imagine if during the Bush Administration, Democratic Underground had welcomed people who thought the president was doing a bad job, *and* people who thought the president was doing a good job. DU would have sucked. Sure, it might have been worth the effort to stop by every once in a while to argue with conservative idiots, but nobody would have felt like DU was their home, their safe-haven, their community.

You spineless piece of emo shit.

Btw skins,your spawn isn`t angry because they are debating policy.
They are insane with rage because they really thought life was going to be a free ride for them and it isn`t.
It is what leftisim and socialism always bring...misery to all.

[AllosaursRus]

but nobody would have felt like DU was their home, their safe-haven, their community.

Yeah right Skins! We all know you try and keep the your mental patients locked up for fear the country might, just might, figure they're all BatShit CRAZY!

More like their frikkin' asylum!

[Texacon]

Skinner should just announce that if you don't donate we'll know you're a mole.

 

KC

[dandi]

Desperate times for der $kimmenfuhrer:

Skinner  ADMIN  (1000+ posts)  Journal  Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Fri Aug-20-10 09:29 AM
Original message
We're not going to reach our goal this fund drive. Let's talk.   Updated at 9:29 AM
   
So, it's now Friday, and as I post this we haven't even reached 600 donations yet. Unless we experience some kind of miraculous and unprecedented turn-around, we aren't going to reach our goal of 1000 donations by Sunday night. But before you stop reading, the point of this post is not to beg you to dig deep and donate and put us over the top. On the contrary, the point of this post is to tell you this:

Message received.

You don't like what DU has become. Maybe you have very specific complaints, or maybe you don't really know exactly what it is that you don't like. But what you do know is that you wish it was more like the old DU. A community. A place that was special. Where we had big disagreements, but at least you felt like we all had something in common.

Yeah, I miss that DU, too.

I miss it so much that it makes my heart ache. I lie awake at night agonizing over it. I can barely bring myself to read my email anymore. I'm burned out and tired.

We (the DU Admins) knew that having a Democratic Administration would make things a lot more complicated and difficult here on DU, but I don't think we really had any clue how difficult it would be. I know that many of you believe the solution is simple. I know this because you send me scolding shame-on-you emails demanding that I do {whatever} and then DU would be better. I wish I shared your certainty.

We have been very cautious and deliberate in our attempts to improve the way we run DU, and I think -- especially on the moderator-side -- we have made a lot of very important progress. But the whole effort has the feeling of rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. Our approach has been to "do what we've always been doing, only better," but I am starting to think that much more radical change is necessary.

Here's the problem in a nutshell: Back when Bush was President, he represented the center of gravity in politics -- the focal point that determined "Which side are you on?" -- and everyone on DU actually was on the same side. Now that Barack Obama is President, he has become the center of gravity. I think it's clear that we still broadly agree on the issues, but we disagree on how best to get there, how long it should take, and how much compromise we are willing to accept. Those are the disagreements that matter now. To be blunt, we are not all on the same side anymore.

Imagine if during the Bush Administration, Democratic Underground had welcomed people who thought the president was doing a bad job, *and* people who thought the president was doing a good job. DU would have sucked. Sure, it might have been worth the effort to stop by every once in a while to argue with conservative idiots, but nobody would have felt like DU was their home, their safe-haven, their community.

This is the situation we face. Nobody is "safe" anymore. DU doesn't "belong" to anyone. We all want this to feel like a community, but we have two fairly large groups of people who each seem to believe that they are the rightful heirs to this community, and that the other side doesn't even have a legitimate claim to be here.

And here I am, grasping to the naive and outdated hope -- against all the available evidence -- that maybe we can all figure out a way to share DU.

I could "solve" our problems pretty easily by picking a side. If I did that, at least the people who would remain here would know that they own DU. They would know that they have a home and a safe haven again. And they would take comfort from knowing (finally) that the DU Admins are on their side, rather than cold, distant, unpredictable creatures whose allegiances are not entirely clear and who could turn on them at any moment.

But I am not prepared to give DU to either side. I see all the people who are still here (thank you for still being here, by the way, despite everything) -- some posting and some, sadly, only lurking -- and I see the people who built this community. Great people. Generous, big-hearted, smart, interesting people. Some of you might post strange and unpleasant things now -- including some things that cut very deeply -- but I remember what you were like before, and I remember how much I liked you then.

So we keep doing what we're doing. But I harbor this simmering doubt. I feel obligated to censor people, even though I have never liked doing it, and like it even less now than I ever have. I feel obligated to serve as an authority figure to a community of people (including myself) who are naturally skeptical of authority. I feel obligated to keep deleting posts and banning people, even though I know that each time I do it serves as "proof" that I have already picked a side, that I am already hopelessly biased, and that I cannot be trusted. I long to let you all take responsibility for yourselves, to give the community the ability to police itself and set its own limits, but in the past our efforts to do so have been rejected almost every time.

I think it might not be a bad thing that we're not going to reach our goal this fund drive. Perhaps it will provide us with justification to experiment with some really radical changes to this place. The Admins have discussed a lot of ideas, but we honestly don't know what's going to work, or what you all will be willing to accept. I think, to start, we're probably going to post some kind of member survey next week to better understand your attitudes, and get feedback on a bunch of different ideas. I'll be curious to learn if you are willing to try any of them.

Thanks for listening. And thank you for being part of this community.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x8981504


Massive bonfire with lots of butt-smooching on Skinner and squibble-squabbling amongst the Neanderthals.

[jukin]

Me thinks that the Hillary supporters were both more sane and more well off.

[BEG]

How ****ing pathetic, Skinner is blaming Bush for DU's failure. This just proves that liberals are just a bunch of children.

[Texacon]

How ****ing pathetic, Skinner is blaming Bush for DU's failure. This just proves that liberals are just a bunch of children.

 

KC

[JakeStyle]

Wow that thread is hilarious, DUmmies calling each other out left and right!  I don't think there is any way Skinner is going to salvage this mess, he needs to just flush the whole thing.

[miskie]

Dont worry skins - after November's results, I'm sure you will have a common enemy once again that will make life better for DU.

[soleil]

Dont worry skins - after November's results, I'm sure you will have a common enemy once again that will make life better for DU.

I am inclined to agree actually.

[thundley4]

WillPitt claiming poverty as the reason he hasn't donated.

[Ballygrl]

What a cluster you know what of a thread!

FrenchieCat  Donating Member  (1000+ posts)
Fri Aug-20-10 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
965. I think there are a variety of views here at DU.....
   
Edited on Fri Aug-20-10 04:49 PM by FrenchieCat
However, I believe that some folks' disagreements have become personal beyond what should be acceptable.

When my name is actively used via DU PMs to recruit posters to another site whose main pastime is to criticize DU posters and the DU administration (you Skinner) along with the Democratic President and his administration, then I have to start believing that those same folks don't have good intentions towards this community, and that cannot be good for you, for DU in general, and for the Democratic party at large. I have also concluded that same folks don't really care so much about issues as they claim....but rather are engaging in personal Vendettas of elementary porportion. Not only am I and others used as recruitment bait, but there are more threads started at other sites about some of us who post here personally than about any "issues".......

I came to DU looking for some hope and likeminds at a dark time, and I have steadily engaged in believing that politics as the art of the positively possible; not the art of personally destroying other posters....and yet I and some others have been called every name in the book; racists, cheerleaders, sycophants, fans, woodchucks, DLC, Homophobes, etc, etc, etc.....and for me, it is that negative outright contempt that I consider to be over the top, very destructive, meaningless and I believe that at this point, has little to do with politics as a whole, and more with game playing and identity politics....something which will get us progressives nowhere.

So I'm just going to work my state politics more, try to stay off of DU (they won!), and continue being hopeful and working towards getting accomplished those things that are possible in this hateful skeptical and negative political climate. That's why I got into politics, and so, I'm not about to get distracted by folks who believe that because I don't want to pile onto this administration it makes me an unfair biased and bad person. I don't believe that....and I never will.

And whomever gave the me the donor Star; thank you (I'm sure they'll be a thread over there even about this, or a poll or something....but Skinner knows who gave it to me....even though I never will). I'll try to make you proud of what it is that my real aim is.....and it ain't to get caught up in the foolishness that accomplishes nothing positive, and only generates negative energy that increases the likelyhood that folks will feel defeated even before they go to the polls. That's not energy I think will feed the children, or house the homeless, or even convince DLC Democrats or Republicans to vote for good progressive legislation....and that's what I'm in it for; progressive legislation that make the difference in many lives, even if it ain't always mine.

dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts)
Fri Aug-20-10 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #965
996. at least you have whole threads dedicated to you... i only get called names in passing....
   
can you teach me how to be a bigger villian to them?

:D

FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts)
Fri Aug-20-10 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #996
998. I'm not sure what it takes........
   
Whatever it is, it appears that "I've got it".....

dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts)     
Fri Aug-20-10 05:01 PM
Response to Reply #998
1003. oh yes, you got it!
   
:hi:

BootinUp Donating Member (1000+ posts)     
Fri Aug-20-10 05:03 PM
Response to Reply #965
1007. Good post Frenchie. nt

Bobbie Jo Donating Member (1000+ posts)
Fri Aug-20-10 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #965
1037. Excellent post, Frenchie.
   
...and yet the same posters are in this very thread lamenting the "lack of respect" around here.

Blows my mind.

saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts)
Fri Aug-20-10 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #965
1046. I am a proud member of other sites and do not know of any that have used
   
Edited on Fri Aug-20-10 05:38 PM by saracat
Frenchie or anyone else as "bait". People join websites for many reasons but it is delusional to think entire websites are formed around one individual , or even several. There are many diverse POV on DU , but some are not tolerant of any but their own. That is one reason I do not participate as much on this board. And those that have repeatedly told me I am not welcome and my vote is not needed are the reason why.

I am disgusted by the vulgarity ,and outright ignorance teamed with arrogance I have seen expressed by some. If one can't express an opinion without reducing himselfto vulgarity and constant use of obsenity that it is likely that opinion has little merit. Many do not even know the rules of the Democratic party and throw their ignorance around like a badge. It really doesn't do to defend the Admin with ignorance.

I too am devoting my time to get my favorite local democrats elected, but then, I always have. Unlike some, this isn't "new" to me.

FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts)
Fri Aug-20-10 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #1046
1084. That's good that you moderate the other site.
   
Edited on Fri Aug-20-10 06:03 PM by FrenchieCat
I've provided the DU moderators with what I think they need to make their own determination as to whose names are being used to recruit via PMs, and what that site is truly focused on....or one can simply compare via topics and post counts of "Issues" vs. the count of posts "ridiculing DUers" to know what's most important to that site.

As for what vulgarity is, that's obviously relative. I don't count words so much as vulgar, as their intent. A word doesn't have to be a curse word to still connotate a vulgar attitude towards others.

As for activism being new or not new, I'll admit that I started 10 years ago, and really not much before. I don't find that as something worthy of snark or something that should be poo-pooed. And in a way, that's what I mean by vulgar being relative, as well as who actually holds this "Truth" many seem to believe they have the corner market on.

saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts)
Fri Aug-20-10 07:58 PM
Response to Reply #1084
1231. The site moderators are not entitled to read PM's.That is a violation of privacy and the fact
   
Edited on Fri Aug-20-10 08:01 PM by saracat
that you would encourage them to do such a thing says volumes about you. DU is a better place than that. Whatever problems DU may have, they have never intruded on privacy or broken their code. I am finding really hard to believe that anyone who is a Democrat would even suggest such a thing.That is despicable and worthy of Bush era tactics. I suppose you support FISA too?
And another thing. Sometimes vulgar is just vulgar, and it nearly always indicates a lack of imagination when used frequently.

FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts)
Fri Aug-20-10 08:59 PM
Response to Reply #1231
1292. Nobody is even talking about what you are implying......
   
if a few received these "invitations" and chose to relay them to me, there's no FISA in that. If same folks decide to share these "invitations" with the admin, that's their right to do so.

Whatever you are talking about, since it doesn't make sense to me, I'll refrain in responding in kind.

saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts)
Fri Aug-20-10 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #1292
1296.  Baloney.And I do find it hilarious that of all people you would be the one
   
talking about making sense!

Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts)
Fri Aug-20-10 09:03 PM
Response to Reply #1084
1297. So you can, or know someone who can, read PMs?
   
Please do tell.

[Chris_]

What a marvelous train wreck.

[Ballygrl]

WillPitt claiming poverty as the reason he hasn't donated.

Did he really? I couldn't even find his post, there's way too many posts in that thread.

[AllosaursRus]

What a marvelous train wreck.

Heh, heh! Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of DUmmies!

The way Skinner started out, I almost got my cookies! I thought he was gonna pull the plug since he's not gonna be able to take that cruise this year if the DUmbasses don't pony up!

I just don't see Skimmer footin' the bill to keep the site up and runnin' for his current clientele, especially if he has to pay their way!

[Allentownjake]

I win 

[Chris_]

I win 

I'm waiting for Skinner to announce that DU has been sold to the highest bidder. 

[AllosaursRus]

Look who showed up! Our favorite kickin' dog!

[Allentownjake]

I'm waiting for Skinner to announce that DU has been sold to the highest bidder. 

He's ruined what little left he had of his brand, he has been doing so for most of the term of this President.  All of the people on this site, disagree with me on more than a few issues.  Fact is, I can come here and discuss it with you.  We can attempt to reason with each other.  

People don't donate to websites that will purge posters in the middle of the night for political disagreements while reinstating members who were banned for breaking overt rules set in stone.  

Skinner is a young kid, he might learn a lesson about human nature, or he might continue to just be a douche.  

[Allentownjake]

Look who showed up! Our favorite kickin' dog!

Yes the dipshit is here.  Have to go to some of your economic threads to see if you guys are seeing what I see in the markets.

[Ballygrl]

Yes the dipshit is here.  Have to go to some of your economic threads to see if you guys are seeing what I see in the markets.

Make sure you post your POV about the markets, I'm interested in reading it.

[Allentownjake]

I'm waiting for Skinner to announce that DU has been sold to the highest bidder. 

I think his real job, is treating him quite well.  DU is the equivalent of his weekend catering gig.