Author Topic: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.  (Read 7099 times)

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Offline ardentconservative

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Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« on: July 13, 2010, 03:40:55 PM »
The dc7600 computer I have only has two internal SATA connections.  I need to add some SATA connections and am thinking of buying a PCIe x1 or x16 as I have one each bus in my computer.  But when I go to sites to look at the SATA cards they are talking about something called Raid.

What is it?

Offline Chris_

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #1 on: July 13, 2010, 03:55:53 PM »
Redundant Array of Independent Disks

RAID is for instant data backup across multiple drives or for using multiple drives as a single logical disk to increase storage.  You should be able to find non-RAID SATA expansion cards or disable the RAID function for the drives to act independent of each other.

I found multiple non-RAID cards on newegg.com
« Last Edit: July 13, 2010, 04:08:03 PM by chris_ »
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Offline Thor

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #2 on: July 13, 2010, 04:18:10 PM »



Just sayin'..........
"The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of the children, the people will happily endure almost any curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation."- IBID

I AM your General Ne'er Do Well, Troublemaker & All Around Meanie!!

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Offline ardentconservative

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2010, 05:33:24 PM »



Just sayin'..........

Sorry you think my question are dumb Thor.  But maybe, just maybe, I did, and didn't understand what little I found.

Jus sayin'...........

Offline ardentconservative

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2010, 05:33:47 PM »
Redundant Array of Independent Disks

RAID is for instant data backup across multiple drives or for using multiple drives as a single logical disk to increase storage.  You should be able to find non-RAID SATA expansion cards or disable the RAID function for the drives to act independent of each other.

I found multiple non-RAID cards on newegg.com

Thanks Chris.

Offline Chris_

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2010, 05:36:20 PM »
RAID is covered in basic PC repair manuals.  You really should drop by the library and pick up some reference material.  Even if the books are ten years old, it should cover the important stuff.
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Offline ardentconservative

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #6 on: July 13, 2010, 05:44:39 PM »
Ok guys, I want to thank everyone who has helped me as I have tried to learn something about computers, but a guy will only take so much abuse, the  :bolt: :bolt: :bolt:

Offline Thor

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2010, 06:42:16 PM »
I'm sorry that you feel "abused", but many of these questions could have been answered by a simple Google search. Google searches are what helped me to learn a lot or even troubleshoot some problems. I can't tell you how many hours I've spent on web searches for different things. If we keep telling you the answers, which I really don't mind, myself, we're doing your work for you. Remember back to school, when the teacher would instruct a student to go look it up instead of just handing out the answer. That is my intention. Yeah, I'm a hard ass, but I can say that the techs (Avionics) that developed under my leadership knew what they were doing.

That said, if you DO get stuck, feel free to as for some clarification..........
"The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of the children, the people will happily endure almost any curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation."- IBID

I AM your General Ne'er Do Well, Troublemaker & All Around Meanie!!

"Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those specifically enumerated."-Thomas Jefferson

Offline PatriotGame

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2010, 08:57:05 AM »
Redundant Array of Independent Disks

RAID is for instant data backup across multiple drives or for using multiple drives as a single logical disk to increase storage.  You should be able to find non-RAID SATA expansion cards or disable the RAID function for the drives to act independent of each other.

I found multiple non-RAID cards on newegg.com
Back in the old days - mid 1980's, when RAID was theorized/invented, it meant "Redundant Array of Inexpensive Disks". The main and original objectives of RAID was fault tolerance whereas a storage device in an "array" of many (hard drives) could fail but the data would remain protected. The data was recorded/stored/retrieved across several hard drives in a striped and parity safeguarded fashion with several hard drives being treated as a storage 'volume' rather than as individual storage devices.
RAID 5 is/was the most prominent as it was at the time the most fault tolerant.

The first time I came across RAID was in 1989 while working at Kwajalein in the data processing department on a DEC VAX 8800 and a multi-drive disk farm. Those were the days of 200 MEGA-BYTE hard drives the size of dishwashers and had removable diskpacks.
The hard drive controller, called an DEC HSC (Hierarchical System Controller) was the size of a modern day kitchen range and cost over 1 million dollars.

« Last Edit: July 14, 2010, 09:08:05 AM by PatriotGame »
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Offline PatriotGame

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #9 on: July 14, 2010, 08:59:42 AM »



Just sayin'..........
Hmm...asking a question about computer terminology in a computer topic sub-forum because the terminology escapes them...
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Offline PatriotGame

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #10 on: July 14, 2010, 09:06:47 AM »
Ok guys, I want to thank everyone who has helped me as I have tried to learn something about computers, but a guy will only take so much abuse, the  :bolt: :bolt: :bolt:
If you want to discuss the intricacies of RAID technologies, their various levels (now 1-10) and applications, I'll help you out. RAID technology is about 25 years old and rather cheap to implement these days. The Alienware laptop (that everyone hates) I am typing this on has two 200 Gig SATA hard drives in a RAID 0 configuration for speed - nothing more, nothing less.
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Offline Thor

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #11 on: July 14, 2010, 10:57:32 AM »
Hmm...asking a question about computer terminology in a computer topic sub-forum because the terminology escapes them...

Excuse the **** out of me for being a little facetious........
"The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of the children, the people will happily endure almost any curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation."- IBID

I AM your General Ne'er Do Well, Troublemaker & All Around Meanie!!

"Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those specifically enumerated."-Thomas Jefferson

Offline PatriotGame

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2010, 11:24:37 AM »
Excuse the **** out of me for being a little facetious........
Sorry...I left off the sarcasm smiley...!

I am NOT your enemy dude...
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Offline dutch508

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2010, 11:27:30 AM »
Sorry...I left off the sarcasm smiley...!

I am NOT your enemy dude...

you're all whiny little *************-******* and *******
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Offline Eupher

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #14 on: July 14, 2010, 11:41:25 AM »
I'm going to gingerly step in here at this point, just to illustrate that one does not have to participate in a thread to appreciate it and learn from it.

AC's questions have really been a series of them -- and I can well imagine that until Thor suggested that he Google at least some of them, there was every likelihood that the series of questions would continue. On and on.

Thor has made some very pointed suggestions for AC to THINK about his question before he asks it, and to provide all the pertinent information relating to the question so that the respondent -- Thor being perhaps one of just a couple -- can answer the question without having to dig for information in response. Thor illustrated a bit of frustration in having to do that, seems to me.

Gradually, it became clear that it was less important to answer the question and more important to get AC to THINK.

I'm not saying that AC doesn't think. But I have seen plenty of evidence that he'll use the forum as his personal treasure trove of information relating to computers. Is that wrong? Maybe. Maybe not. I'm just an observer here and am not being judgmental.

Thor knows a helluva lot about computers. He built my wife's machine and I've called him on the telephone many, many times to help me through a problem. He is patient and willing to help, but I think it's fair to say that he's willing to help those who help themselves first.

That said, maybe Thor could acknowledge PG's apparent knowledge in this area and simply exit the thread.

AC could perhaps appreciate Thor's point -- to spend some time and develop a question after a fair amount of research is done. AC's claim that he did some research about RAID doesn't seem quite on target, since the information he's asking is pretty well out there. Furthermore, AC didn't ask about a particular element of RAID, his question was simply, "What's this RAID thing all about?" That tells me that little to no effort was expended, and I dare say that that was obvious to Thor as well.

The old adage "The only dumb question is the one that isn't asked" is old, outdated, and no longer applies. There are so many avenues of knowledge available to use with just a couple of mouse clicks away that there is no excuse not to spend at least a few minutes to answer your own question.

There is no harm in doing research and the odd thing is, that information generally stays with you (generic 'you' here) because YOU MADE AN EFFORT TO GET IT.

That's my two zlotys.

And thanks for all of these threads. I learn something even though I'm not an active participant -- uh, that is, until now.   :shucks:

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Offline Thor

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #15 on: July 14, 2010, 01:06:48 PM »
Point of order, Eupher, I'm CERTAIN that there are those on the forum that know far more than I.

That said, you're pretty much right on (or is that "right arm"??)  :)
"The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of the children, the people will happily endure almost any curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation."- IBID

I AM your General Ne'er Do Well, Troublemaker & All Around Meanie!!

"Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those specifically enumerated."-Thomas Jefferson

Offline PatriotGame

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2010, 03:21:05 AM »
I'm going to gingerly step in here at this point, just to illustrate that one does not have to participate in a thread to appreciate it and learn from it.

AC's questions have really been a series of them -- and I can well imagine that until Thor suggested that he Google at least some of them, there was every likelihood that the series of questions would continue. On and on.

Thor has made some very pointed suggestions for AC to THINK about his question before he asks it, and to provide all the pertinent information relating to the question so that the respondent -- Thor being perhaps one of just a couple -- can answer the question without having to dig for information in response. Thor illustrated a bit of frustration in having to do that, seems to me.

Gradually, it became clear that it was less important to answer the question and more important to get AC to THINK.

I'm not saying that AC doesn't think. But I have seen plenty of evidence that he'll use the forum as his personal treasure trove of information relating to computers. Is that wrong? Maybe. Maybe not. I'm just an observer here and am not being judgmental.

Thor knows a helluva lot about computers. He built my wife's machine and I've called him on the telephone many, many times to help me through a problem. He is patient and willing to help, but I think it's fair to say that he's willing to help those who help themselves first.

That said, maybe Thor could acknowledge PG's apparent knowledge in this area and simply exit the thread.

AC could perhaps appreciate Thor's point -- to spend some time and develop a question after a fair amount of research is done. AC's claim that he did some research about RAID doesn't seem quite on target, since the information he's asking is pretty well out there. Furthermore, AC didn't ask about a particular element of RAID, his question was simply, "What's this RAID thing all about?" That tells me that little to no effort was expended, and I dare say that that was obvious to Thor as well.

The old adage "The only dumb question is the one that isn't asked" is old, outdated, and no longer applies. There are so many avenues of knowledge available to use with just a couple of mouse clicks away that there is no excuse not to spend at least a few minutes to answer your own question.

There is no harm in doing research and the odd thing is, that information generally stays with you (generic 'you' here) because YOU MADE AN EFFORT TO GET IT.

That's my two zlotys.

And thanks for all of these threads. I learn something even though I'm not an active participant -- uh, that is, until now.   :shucks:


O
I will have to say three things here:
1: Your post, while not really computer 'stuff' related, *IS* very nice and appreciated.
2: Thor *IS* very knowledgeable and a force in his computer skill set.
3: ...I forgot #3 butt it is...something...


Oh and as I used to teach my Wonderware students, "the hard parts have already been done. The technology is ALREADY invented. All we need to do is learn it and implement it!"
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Offline PatriotGame

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2010, 03:41:04 AM »
you're all whiny little *************-******* and *******
Computer nerds have very small dicks that they try to "swing" in very large ways.  :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)

Jest sayn'...
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Offline LC EFA

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #18 on: July 15, 2010, 04:08:35 AM »
Computer nerds have very small dicks that they try to "swing" in very large ways.  :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)

Jest sayn'...

Don't mind him.

He's just upset that a nerd didn't show up to teach him how to use the DVD of pron that came with his peach cobbler.

Offline zeitgeist

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #19 on: July 15, 2010, 05:57:08 AM »
Back in the old days - mid 1980's, when RAID was theorized/invented, it meant "Redundant Array of Inexpensive Disks". The main and original objectives of RAID was fault tolerance whereas a storage device in an "array" of many (hard drives) could fail but the data would remain protected. The data was recorded/stored/retrieved across several hard drives in a striped and parity safeguarded fashion with several hard drives being treated as a storage 'volume' rather than as individual storage devices.
RAID 5 is/was the most prominent as it was at the time the most fault tolerant.

The first time I came across RAID was in 1989 while working at Kwajalein in the data processing department on a DEC VAX 8800 and a multi-drive disk farm. Those were the days of 200 MEGA-BYTE hard drives the size of dishwashers and had removable diskpacks.
The hard drive controller, called an DEC HSC (Hierarchical System Controller) was the size of a modern day kitchen range and cost over 1 million dollars.



Good answer.  The pic brings back memories.  Ever try disposing of one of those systems?  DRMO can be a hoot when they see the cost vs value.
< watch this space for coming distractions >

Offline Thor

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #20 on: July 15, 2010, 01:41:58 PM »
Three months from now, my new computer can be built for less than what I scrimped and saved for to get it built  last week. A year down the road, it'll probably be half the cost. Three years, it will not even be worth 1/3rd of what it originally cost
"The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of the children, the people will happily endure almost any curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation."- IBID

I AM your General Ne'er Do Well, Troublemaker & All Around Meanie!!

"Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those specifically enumerated."-Thomas Jefferson

Offline thundley4

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #21 on: July 15, 2010, 01:45:09 PM »
Three months from now, my new computer can be built for less than what I scrimped and saved for to get it built  last week. A year down the road, it'll probably be half the cost. Three years, it will not even be worth 1/3rd of what it originally cost


If you order a computer online, it's outdated before it's delivered.

Offline Thor

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #22 on: July 15, 2010, 01:53:44 PM »
If you order a computer online, it's outdated before it's delivered.

It depends on what one orders. The AMD PhenomII X6 core processor won't be outdated for a bit.
"The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of the children, the people will happily endure almost any curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation."- IBID

I AM your General Ne'er Do Well, Troublemaker & All Around Meanie!!

"Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those specifically enumerated."-Thomas Jefferson

Offline thundley4

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #23 on: July 15, 2010, 01:59:37 PM »
It depends on what one orders. The AMD PhenomII X6 core processor won't be outdated for a bit.


True, but I was mainly referring to buying a complete computer from one of the major brands.  They always run behind on technology.

Offline PatriotGame

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Re: Ok, guys, what is this Raid thing.
« Reply #24 on: July 15, 2010, 03:17:59 PM »
It depends on what one orders. The AMD PhenomII X6 core processor won't be outdated for a bit.
You know what is REALLY fracking cool about AMD processors?
Their Opteron processors POWER the biggest, fastest, most powerful petabyte SUPER computer in the world! 

[youtube=425,350]WuFG-8BCB_Q[/youtube]

And to think I cut my teeth on a Cray XMP...



...then Y-MP back in the 1989 days...

« Last Edit: July 15, 2010, 05:08:55 PM by Chris »
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