DUmmie argues with a libertarian on facebook jasmeel (1000+ posts) Mon Mar-09-09 09:50 AM
His point from his 25 things on Facebook:
14. I am staunchly Right to Life. I do not believe in second class humans, no matter what stage of development they are in. I have run though all the abortion-choice arguments and they are either de-humanizing, misleading or just plain false. This is my biggest disagreement with the Libertarian Party and will most likely be the reason we part ways. I invite all and especially libertarians to go to l4l.org (libertarians for life) and review their arguments. I also find it ironic that our own Mr. Macko, who the LPO sees as a bigoted, sexist, anti-semitic, homophobic, holocaust denying, white supremacist, believes that all humans have the same rights from conception to natural death, while other leaders in our party seem to think that rights are given to the developing child by the mother when she feels like it. It makes me beg the question, “If rights are given to us arbitrarily from somewhere outside ourselves, can they not be justifiably and arbitrarily taken away from us by something outside of ourselves?†and “ If the government allows a mother to decide when her pre-born child has rights, isn't it then the government who is actually giving those rights to the child by proxy?†if so then I could argue that all rights come from the government to the people and can be taken away from the people by the government which would make the foundations of libertarianism (and the U.S. Constitution) false. If you wish to present your abortion-choice arguments to me, please read the library at l4l.org before doing so. It will save us both time.
Pretty good for a libertarian, now if only he realizes that these natural rights come from creation and the creator.....
My Counterpoint (sort of a joke)
1:58pm March 8
Does my kidney have the same rights as my fetus?? I don't know how I'm going to send it to college!!
This would depend, can your kidney live outside of you?
His dickish response (note the misspelling)
at 12:41am March 9
Thank you Georgette for reinforcing my arguement. Your quip was dehumanizing to a developing baby. Again, please read the library at l4l.org. It covers your dehumanizing comparison of baby = tissue mass. Also, the DNA in your kidney is the same as the DNA in your heart, your developing baby's DNA is different than your kidney's, that is to say it is his or her own individual DNA.
He is right again, but not to worry. This DUmmie won't realize who is really being the dick here.
My return response (note the logic, facts and reason)
9:29am March 9
Modern science tells us that some cells within the developing fetus are in fact not pluripotent. Thus,your kidney does have a good deal in common with your fetus (which has cells that are not pluripotent). It depends on surface antigens expressed on certain cells within the developing fetus whether they can become any cell (pluripotency) or have a predetermined cell fate. (King et al 2009 stem Cells Dev.)
Also, your logic in point #14 is flawed. Your argument assumes you are correct from the outset rather than arguing your point based on facts. To refer to a fetus as a pre born child assumes it's a child which of course presumes that one who gets an abortion is killing a child which is of course indirectly assumes the fetus is a child. This is called circular logic.
And yet, you're kidney is not capable of living outside of you and never will be. The fetus on the other hand will develop and eventually be able to live completely independent of you. No small difference, that.
On to the peanut gallery....
BluePatriot21 (118 posts) Mon Mar-09-09 09:47 AM
Response to Original message
1. If you would...
If you would like to debate me on abortion and the wonders of the female body and its cell structure kindly get your own vagina first and then come talk to me, until then keep your dick in your pants so the women in the world wont need to immediately run out and have an abortion because they had sex with you and got pregnant. Thank you.
PS Stop acting like such a little *****, it in no way makes you qualified to discuss how I deal with mine.
Does that retort work for you? Sorry if I have offended anyone's flower by using those words
Ah yes, it's the men don't have the right to discuss abortion because they can't get pregnant tack. It neatly avoids the whole notion that fetuses are people and therefore have the right to not have their mother kill them deliberately. Oh, and as for DUmmie women BP, I have seen the pics. I wouldn't hit it with a 2x4.
tavalon (1000+ posts) Mon Mar-09-09 09:48 AM
Response to Original message
2. You're trying to teach a pig to fly
It's going to drive you crazy and probably piss of the pig. It's pointless. These people have no ability to reason or problem solve.
This is just funny come from a bunch of chemical addled welfare addicts.
jasmeel (1000+ posts) Mon Mar-09-09 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. I'm waiting to see how long until I get defriended from his
Edited on Mon Mar-09-09 09:52 AM by jasmeel
acct of Facebook. That's my goal.
Maybe he'll find some logic on his libertarian website... Somehow I doubt it.
Then you can post another "I lost a friend over politics thread".
plantwomyn (516 posts) Sun Apr-05-09 10:49 AM
Response to Original message
10. You can question him about his own statements.
"This is my biggest disagreement with the Libertarian Party" and "If the government allows a mother to decide..." Libertarianism is all about LIBERTY. Until an human becomes an individual their is no right to "individual liberty". A fetus is in essence at best symbiotic with it's host. Morning sickness is the hosts first clue that her body is attempting to reject a "foreign" object. Once the "relationship" is no longer "mutualistic" it becomes parasitic like a tape worm for example. Tape worms have distinct DNA from their host. So does your Mr. Facebook promote laws to make the removal of tapeworms illegal?
Ah yes, the fetus is just another parasite tack. Problem is that the fetus is verifiably, genetically human. The tapeworm is not, and therefore renders you're argument moot.
