Feminists using wrong M word

[Vagabond]

So, so, close (yet so far away)

mzteris  (1000+ posts)      Sat Jan-17-09 12:32 PM
Original message
"They want us to be stupid things"
 Advertisements [?]
Afghan Girls, Scarred by Acid, Defy Terror, Embracing School

KANDAHAR, Afghanistan — One morning two months ago, Shamsia Husseini and her sister were walking through the muddy streets to the local girls school when a man pulled alongside them on a motorcycle and posed what seemed like an ordinary question.

“Are you going to school?”

Then the man pulled Shamsia’s burqa from her head and sprayed her face with burning acid. Scars, jagged and discolored, now spread across Shamsia’s eyelids and most of her left cheek. These days, her vision goes blurry, making it hard for her to read.

But if the acid attack against Shamsia and 14 others — students and teachers — was meant to terrorize the girls into staying home, it appears to have completely failed.

Today, nearly all of the wounded girls are back at the Mirwais School for Girls, including even Shamsia, whose face was so badly burned that she had to be sent abroad for treatment. Perhaps even more remarkable, nearly every other female student in this deeply conservative community has returned as well — about 1,300 in all.

“My parents told me to keep coming to school even if I am killed,” said Shamsia, 17, in a moment after class. Shamsia’s mother, like nearly all of the adult women in the area, is unable to read or write. “The people who did this to me don’t want women to be educated. They want us to be stupid things.” . . .


http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/14/world/asia/14kandahar...


(Here's an interesting bit: In the five years since the Mirwais School for Girls was built here by the Japanese government JAPANESE government? Who knew? )

This is a case of real oppression of women buy men in (which society and religion?) society.  I'd like to congratulate mzteris for actually posting some information about real oppression of women.

mzteris  (1000+ posts)      Sun Jan-18-09 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. violence against women
 is it just ingrained in the typical male psyche? What is it about men that fear women becoming their equals? Why are they so insecure? Why are they so violent?

Women raped, murdered, assaulted, just because they *are* women. Women subjugated and kept economically in chains - and in some countries - educationally ignorant (though it seems education may not matter so much given the incidence of violence in this country, too. The woman who posted about her neighbors daughter being beaten as one recent example.)

Anger, fear, rage, dominance, exploitation, insecurity, violence . . . how can this be changed the world over - crossing cultural and religious boundaries. (Though sometimes I think religion is the culprit for much of the "justification" men use.)

Sorry, this is just a very sore (and real) point with me.


(BTW - Present company, excluded, of course! I did say "typical male".)

D'oh!  Learning, it's not just so the rat can find the cheese.  Which society is it again?  Here's a clue mzteris, starts and ends with m.

bliss_eternal  (1000+ posts)        Sun Jan-18-09 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. I recall so much sexism dictated....
 Edited on Sun Jan-18-09 04:17 PM by bliss_eternal
...in Catholic, Christian and non-denominational churches. Even before I discovered feminism, I was uncomfortable (and frustrated) by that. I had many discussions (that turned into arguments) w/friends regarding religious doctrine dictating sexism.

One of the last times I attended Catholic church, the priest was on this "women" rant. About how it was our duty to 'procreate', make good homes and support our families. That a woman was nothing unless she had a family. I'm sure that wasn't the first time I'd heard such sentiments offered in church. But that particular day it struck me.

I'm not sure that any one sect or denomination is more or less sexist. Though, if I had to pick I'd say I've been pleasanty surprised by some of the episcopalian churches and their support of women and women's issues.

So the last time you were in a Catholic church you made up a bouncy because you didn't want to here what the priest was really saying.  What do you think he maybe would have said if were perhaps an imam instead?  I'm thinking something along the lines of she stays in the house or stone the whore!  But, that might just be me.

ismnotwasm  (1000+ posts)      Sun Jan-18-09 11:55 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. It's the pathology of patriarchy
 When I get some time, I'm going to look up some studies. Patriarchy really is the problem. It evolved as a social system for whatever reason, those in power always look to keep power or at least ignore the processes to power, and we end up with a ****ing social disaster.

Men by definition are the patriarchy, but many are just ignorant, lazy, or angry. Not all. What the problem is to me, is there is far to much violence against women to NOT call it a very serious pathology, a social disease rivaling a physical one like cancer, A Big Problem That Needs To Be Fixed Yesterday.

What we get are apologists or justifiers. Your point about religion is well taken and is a similar process and part of the beginning. The classic patriarchal religions are one thing, Christianity, Islam and Judaism, but take a good look some of the others. The non religion religion of Buddhism. Like the rest it has some damn fine ideas. But it's not pro woman at all at BEST it's simply not misogynist.

Neither is Hinduism, (Even though If I ever need a God, I'm calling on Kali--She rocks)Which does have misogynist aspects and we won't even talk about Confucius. All my agnostic searching led me to realize that other than certain animist and Aboriginal religions, and not many of those by a long shot, every one of them treated women as property or baby incubates, or worse.

Patriarchy does it to Gays men and women also by a similar process, Gay men are "feminized" and therefore have no value, actually negative value as evidenced by the homophobic violence against Gay men; Gay women are A)"bulldykes" (too ugly to get a man) or B)a walking, talking porn fantasy considered to really 'want' men.

Sick, Sick, Sick. These acid throwers are mentally ill individuals, driven there by, yes, the patriarchy. That one of the many reasons I love IBTP. No punches pulled at that site, no quarter given

(Off soapbox, how the hell are you Thomcat? It's good to read you around DU, you've been kicking a bit of electronic ass here and there I notice)

Ah yes, it's the patriarchy.  Anything to avoid the dread m word.

whathehell  (550 posts)      Sat Feb-14-09 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #3
7. I have to disagree with you a bit...Some of it is religious..but let's
 Edited on Sat Feb-14-09 11:03 AM by whathehell
face it, religion is often a part of, and reflective of, the culture from which it springs -- I don't know about EVERY religion, but I know of NONE which endorses beating or raping

I think a good deal of it is just sheer bullying..."because they can"..That's the answer a feminist writer gave to another woman who asked why men have traditionally enslaved and abused women.

I'll give you a hint....mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

ismnotwasm  (1000+ posts)      Sat Feb-14-09 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Not currently, perhaps.
 Plenty of rape stories in the bible for instance. And under some crazy-assed fundamentalists interpretation of the Quran, women are sentenced to beating. It makes the news. Patriarchy is a socially evolved system of human interaction. Men hold most of the power, and for many years, the only power women held, and the only value they were considered to have, were fetus receptacles or future receptacles. Some of your greatest Christan minds-- incredible thinkers-- held that women were a sort of failed male.

Thomas Aquinas, in particular, disappoints me in this respect.

Women have been fighting for years. They didn't call themselves feminists. I love to post this one by Margeret Fell, although I doubt people actually read it;
Women's SpeakingJustified, Proved, and Allowed of by the Scriptures, All such as speak by the Spirit and Power of the Lord Jesus.

And how Women were the first that Preached the Tidings of the Resurrection of Jesus, and were sent by Christ's own Command, before he Ascended to the Father, John 20. 17.

http://www.qhpress.org/texts/fell.html

And this site is fun to look around at

http://www.suppressedhistories.net /


I would question if bulling is a gender trait or a socially evolved, adaptive one. What holds minds in place, or in their place? What happens when you repeatedly tell a people that they have little value, or only a certain value and back it up with force? What do you get out of it as a gender, as a color, as a culture, as a religion, as a nation? One outcome is simply a bunch of ridiculous dichotomies, Order/chaos, peace/war, rich/poor Madonna/whore. "Because they can" isn't answer enough for me.

Where women are making forward strides, these destructive dichotomies lessen. Long way to go.

Lets' skip gender for a moment. What happened when Native Americans, were that they are primitive, ignorant, that their way of life is disgusting, their way of worship was evil, and do this while you're kicking their ass, what is the psychological outcome for the first generation, the next? The next? Currently? What passes down, what is saved?

Religion tends to have violent beginnings. Currently, there are people of faith all over the world trying desperately to reject this violence, but isn't this what most of the stories and myths are founded on?

Jesus seemed to be a bit of a revolutionary, although historically it's my understanding he was an observant Jew, and back then, women were property. There were certain rules, and codes of behavior.


I just read "American Gods" by Neil Gaiman. It's ok. But the lack of strong female "goddess" figures-or the ones that were present were whores or "nature" goddesses first irritated me, then I thought within the context of the story, of course their wouldn't be strong female characters in America. He got it right. Sad.

So, in a time when any work was hard work, and by forty you'd lived a long life, and child birth was an extremely dangerous activity you are surprised that men took the lead?  Or are you yet another woman trying to tell me that all men and all women are equal in all things?  As far as cultures being geographically replaced with other cultures, it's happened throughout history, and the "native americans" did it to the culture they pushed out.
 




 


 

[Mike220]

Please make the stupidity stop.

[Celtic Rose]

This is something that seriously annoys me.  DU can take an example of true oppression, and somehow compare their own experiences to it  

These are young schoolgirls who have been painfully scarred for life to trying to go to school, when the f*** have you ever been punished for daring to get an education?  Your complaints are that abortions aren't free enough, and that men get better jobs.  Their complaints are that they are forced into marriages as children, that they are stoned for being raped, that they have acid thrown on them on their way to school.  How dare you compare the situation of women here and women there.  I thank God that I was born into a society that believes that I have value, where I am allowed to be education and where I am allowed to leave my house.  I thank God that we punish abusers and that we have numerous laws to protect children.  How about you all stop whining about the past (which in all honesty probably wasn't as bad a modern Islamic countries for most women) and start appreciating how good the present is.

[JohnnyReb]

Liberal women like to complain. They complain because men aren't wussies. Then they complain because they aren't "real men". Liberal women just like to complain.

Penis envy?

[Wineslob]

Man the DUmbasses don't like to look the monster in the eye.

MUSLIMS do this on a daily basis you shit heads!
Why do you Libtards not mention clitoral mutilation? OH, you idiots rename it!
Here, a small sampling of what MUSLIMS do to women: (bolds by me)

Clitoral Relativism - Female Genital Mutilation in “Tolerant” Islamic Indonesia
AndrewBostom.org/Blog January 20 2008
by Andrew Bostom

An August 1993 report in the British Medical Journal (abstracted here) on Female Genital Mutilation (FGM) stated plainly, in its summary conclusions:

Female genital mutilation, also misleadingly known as female circumcision, is usually performed on girls ranging in from 1 week to puberty. Immediate physical complications include severe pain, shock, infection, bleeding, acute urinary infection, tetanus, and death. Long-term problems include chronic pain, difficulties with micturition [urination] and menstruation, pelvic infection leading to infertility, and prolonged and obstructed labor during childbirth.

Not surprisingly, FGM is outlawed in the United States and most Western countries, and there are concerted efforts to eradicate this barbaric practice, globally.

But just today, the barbarism of FGM is indeed referred to “misleadingly” as “circumcision” in a quintessential culturally (or if you prefer, clitorally) relative depiction by Sara Corbett (moonbat, she likes to accuse our troops of rape, but glosses this over) published in the New York Times Sunday Magazine (1/20/08). Ms. Corbett’s ~ 1000 word essay even omits any discussion of the basic acute


(“severe pain, shock, infection, bleeding, acute urinary infection, tetanus, and death”)and chronic (“chronic pain, difficulties with micturition and menstruation, pelvic infection leading to infertility, and prolonged and obstructed labor during childbirth”)

medical complications, described in the 1993 British Medical Journal report.

Pace Corbett, in tolerant Islamic Indonesia, its progressive (you've GOT to be kidding!?)Muslim women denizens take their pre-adolescent daughters (infants, toddlers, young girls) to “free circumcision events,” apparently in droves, as “96 percent of families surveyed reported that their daughters had undergone some form of circumcision by the time they reached 14.” Here is Corbett’s nauseatingly reverent account (salvaged only by the accompanying narrative’s photos–like the one above–which capture the actual horror experienced by the victimized young girls):

I've yet to see ANY "fundies" do this here in the States.
Tell me all about the "religion of peace"   

[jukin]

The truly scary thing is that this type of PC bullshit is going on in the highest offices of the government.

[JohnnyReb]

There is such a thing as female “circumcision” to enhance womens sexuality in "certain" cases. This is abosolutely "NOT" what the Muslims do.

[Karin]

Only one person up there dared to mention Islam in very quick passing.  The rest was Catholic, Fundies, Christian this, Christian that.  "They'd keep us barefoot and pregnant if they had their way, those damned christianists." 
I hope they hook up with a muslim dude, gets entranced by their big brown eyes and exotic appeal (like Obama), and flies off with them to the homeland to meet his family.   

[TheSarge]

Our medics and doctors in Somalia were dealing with Female Genital Mutilation when I was ther in 1993.

It's a sick sick thing.

But something you'll only find in that culture they just can't bring themselves to mention.

[delilahmused]

The truly pathetic thing is, these Afghan girls are more brave than any of these DUmmpy wimmin could ever hope to be. Hell, American women need college classes to tell them their oppressed. American feminists think men are being chauvinist when they open a door for women, these young girls walk to school looking over their shoulder hoping they don't encounter men. I don't think they hold out much hope of having doors opened for them. American feminists think men are being sexist when they complement them on the way they look or whistle at a pretty girl walking by. I bet these young girls wish the only thing they have to worry about is someone whistling as they walk by. Whistling is probably a lot easier to tolerate than throwing acid on their faces. American women's minority status guarantees them preferential treatment. Afghan girl's minority status guarantees they live on the edge of fear knowing they are expendable and replaceable. And the harpies at the DUmp are outraged as if acid thrown in an Afghan girl's face somehow hurts them too. How dare they cheapen the fearlessness these young girls exhibit just for the "privilege" of going to school by pretending they share some kind of shared sisterhood. Wonder how many of these women would volunteer to walk these girls to school everyday.

Cindie

[USA4ME]

bliss_eternal

I recall so much sexism dictated in Catholic, Christian and non-denominational churches.

That's because you shouldn't take what some preacher has to say about how God expects couples to conduct themselves towards each other and, instead, go directly to the source; the Bible.

Men and women were created differently because each has a specific role to play that compliment each other.  If you were to have read, you would know that the scriptures tell a husband to love his wife, but it tells a woman to respect her husband.  A husband who loves his wife will place her on a pedestal and treat her needs and desires as he would if they were his.  A wife who respects her husband will do the same.  Only a completely selfish person would intrepret that as a "duty to procreate, make good homes and support our families," and look at those things as though that interfered with really being a woman.

I realize that with some feminists the idea of traditional roles for women is to be cast away and ignored.  It's also pretty notable just how miserable those woman are, in general, which is the same way I would be if I were to try and step out of what has been the role of men.  Personally, I view it as the rebellious "I'm not going to let some God tell me what to do" attitude.  They're fighting against something they can't win, there will be no "bliss eternal," and sadly they don't even know it.

.

[The Village Idiot]

The truly pathetic thing is, these Afghan girls are more brave than any of these DUmmpy wimmin

braver than their men, but I guess thats a given

[djones520]

I wonder how many of them wear Wolverine Boots.   

[ace61502]

That's because you shouldn't take what some preacher has to say about how God expects couples to conduct themselves towards each other and, instead, go directly to the source; the Bible.

Men and women were created differently because each has a specific role to play that compliment each other.  If you were to have read, you would know that the scriptures tell a husband to love his wife, but it tells a woman to respect her husband.  A husband who loves his wife will place her on a pedestal and treat her needs and desires as he would if they were his.  A wife who respects her husband will do the same.  Only a completely selfish person would intrepret that as a "duty to procreate, make good homes and support our families," and look at those things as though that interfered with really being a woman.

I realize that with some feminists the idea of traditional roles for women is to be cast away and ignored.  It's also pretty notable just how miserable those woman are, in general, which is the same way I would be if I were to try and step out of what has been the role of men.  Personally, I view it as the rebellious "I'm not going to let some God tell me what to do" attitude.  They're fighting against something they can't win, there will be no "bliss eternal," and sadly they don't even know it.

.

AMEN, AMEN and AMEN! Exactly what I kept thinking as I read this idiocy!

(Pulling on what's left of my flame retardant suit  )

But I was scared to say it. I've run into quite a few "conservative" "feminists," or as I prefer to call them, "want-to-be-a-manists" or "ANTIfeminists." If you ask me there is nothing more feminine than just BEING A WOMAN and doing what women were created to do. We are wired differently than men with different strengths and weaknesses.

However, if you look, NOWHERE in the Bible does it say a woman should work outside the home. No woman. The family or the church (if there was no family) was to be responsible even for widows. Men were to provide. Volunteering at the church (but not as a preacher or a teacher of men), tending the garden, other "womanly" roles, sure, but not making the living.

Which kinda sucks cuz I really like hunting and fishing. 

I have spent a LOT of time over the last year studying the Biblical roles in marriage, and found that I failed miserably. I clung onto some of it's teachings, and ignored the rest.  What was being asked of me was in direct conflict of the parts I wanted to cling to, but God's command was to trust my husband to make decisions in my best interest. By not ever trusting him to do so and instead trying to force decisions on him, I wound up pushing too hard and he didn't fulfill his Godly duty of putting me and my needs first. He pushed back and eventually pushed his way right on out the door.  I'm not giving up though. God has gotten my attention. Sure wish I hadn't been so hard headed before.

[Celtic Rose]

AMEN, AMEN and AMEN! Exactly what I kept thinking as I read this idiocy!

(Pulling on what's left of my flame retardant suit  )

But I was scared to say it. I've run into quite a few "conservative" "feminists," or as I prefer to call them, "want-to-be-a-manists" or "ANTIfeminists." If you ask me there is nothing more feminine than just BEING A WOMAN and doing what women were created to do. We are wired differently than men with different strengths and weaknesses.

However, if you look, NOWHERE in the Bible does it say a woman should work outside the home. No woman. The family or the church (if there was no family) was to be responsible even for widows. Men were to provide. Volunteering at the church (but not as a preacher or a teacher of men), tending the garden, other "womanly" roles, sure, but not making the living.

Which kinda sucks cuz I really like hunting and fishing. 

I have spent a LOT of time over the last year studying the Biblical roles in marriage, and found that I failed miserably. I clung onto some of it's teachings, and ignored the rest.  What was being asked of me was in direct conflict of the parts I wanted to cling to, but God's command was to trust my husband to make decisions in my best interest. By not ever trusting him to do so and instead trying to force decisions on him, I wound up pushing too hard and he didn't fulfill his Godly duty of putting me and my needs first. He pushed back and eventually pushed his way right on out the door.  I'm not giving up though. God has gotten my attention. Sure wish I hadn't been so hard headed before.

Proverbs 31:10-31 is a wonderful example of how a woman can be productive, and even bring in an income, while still fulfilling her role as the keeper of the home.  It talks about her selling fabric she makes, selling produce, and buying a field and planting a vineyard.

However, the idea of women working has been so ingrained in our society that it has almost become unacceptable for women to stay home.  Quite honestly, my parents wouldn't accept me living with them if I chose not to work.  From what I understand, men used to generally be able to support their families with one income, but now that sound terribly difficult.  I don't know if salaries have been reduced when compared to inflation, or if our expected standard of living has gone up, but that tends to be fairly difficult now.  A number of my friends with kids would like to be able to stay home, but they don't think they could afford it.

I went to an all girl high school, and I got blasted when I mentioned that I would like to stay at home once I had kids, they accused me of trying to move the feminist movement back decades (quite an accomplishment for one woman, don't you think ) 

[USA4ME]

AMEN, AMEN and AMEN! Exactly what I kept thinking as I read this idiocy!

(Pulling on what's left of my flame retardant suit  )

But I was scared to say it. I've run into quite a few "conservative" "feminists," or as I prefer to call them, "want-to-be-a-manists" or "ANTIfeminists." If you ask me there is nothing more feminine than just BEING A WOMAN and doing what women were created to do. We are wired differently than men with different strengths and weaknesses.

However, if you look, NOWHERE in the Bible does it say a woman should work outside the home. No woman. The family or the church (if there was no family) was to be responsible even for widows. Men were to provide. Volunteering at the church (but not as a preacher or a teacher of men), tending the garden, other "womanly" roles, sure, but not making the living.

Which kinda sucks cuz I really like hunting and fishing. 

I have spent a LOT of time over the last year studying the Biblical roles in marriage, and found that I failed miserably. I clung onto some of it's teachings, and ignored the rest.  What was being asked of me was in direct conflict of the parts I wanted to cling to, but God's command was to trust my husband to make decisions in my best interest. By not ever trusting him to do so and instead trying to force decisions on him, I wound up pushing too hard and he didn't fulfill his Godly duty of putting me and my needs first. He pushed back and eventually pushed his way right on out the door.  I'm not giving up though. God has gotten my attention. Sure wish I hadn't been so hard headed before.

I appreciated your words.  And don't worry about speaking up, people here are generally nice and polite.

Celtic Rose does bring up a good passage about women working outside the home.  I believe that passage is usually refered to as the "Virtuous Woman."  And as you already are aware, unlike what many on the left would claim, the roles of women in the Bible are anything but slavery.  Several are wonderful examples of women who have dedicated their lives in service to God having tremendous influence, including Ruth, Deborah, Esther in the OT, and Martha, several named Mary, Lydia, and other women in the NT who showed enormous faith.  These women are an inspiration to all believers in ways that men couldn't be.

[Vagabond]

AMEN, AMEN and AMEN! Exactly what I kept thinking as I read this idiocy!

(Pulling on what's left of my flame retardant suit  )

But I was scared to say it. I've run into quite a few "conservative" "feminists," or as I prefer to call them, "want-to-be-a-manists" or "ANTIfeminists." If you ask me there is nothing more feminine than just BEING A WOMAN and doing what women were created to do. We are wired differently than men with different strengths and weaknesses.

However, if you look, NOWHERE in the Bible does it say a woman should work outside the home. No woman. The family or the church (if there was no family) was to be responsible even for widows. Men were to provide. Volunteering at the church (but not as a preacher or a teacher of men), tending the garden, other "womanly" roles, sure, but not making the living.

Which kinda sucks cuz I really like hunting and fishing. 

I have spent a LOT of time over the last year studying the Biblical roles in marriage, and found that I failed miserably. I clung onto some of it's teachings, and ignored the rest.  What was being asked of me was in direct conflict of the parts I wanted to cling to, but God's command was to trust my husband to make decisions in my best interest. By not ever trusting him to do so and instead trying to force decisions on him, I wound up pushing too hard and he didn't fulfill his Godly duty of putting me and my needs first. He pushed back and eventually pushed his way right on out the door.  I'm not giving up though. God has gotten my attention. Sure wish I hadn't been so hard headed before.

Have you seen the movie Firepreoof?  There are fair criticisms of the movie, but it gave me a lot to think about.

[ace61502]

Have you seen the movie Firepreoof?  There are fair criticisms of the movie, but it gave me a lot to think about.

I have it sitting at my house and I will admit... I'm terrified to watch it. My husband is a fireman, and he now lives in New Albany (as opposed to Caleb being in Albany in the movie). There are soooo many parallels. I have never been able to sit and watch even the whole trailer. I never see all of it for the blurry vision it causes every time.  I love horror movies and will watch them alone any time, but not that movie. Not watching it alone. No way.

[AllosaursRus]

I am married to the hardest workin' woman I have ever met in my life! She works 10 hour days occasionally and yet still makes sure my clothes are clean, my dinner on the table and my house spotless!

She wouldn't have it any other way! God I luv that woman!!!!!!!! She's definitely the apple of my eye.

I in return mend the fences, catch the criminals, feed the horses and cut the wood. It seems to be a pretty fair trade.

Most decisions are made mutually, but I always have the last word when it comes to family. I guess mainly because I'm an obstinate asshole, according to the FemiNazis!

[Vagabond]

I have it sitting at my house and I will admit... I'm terrified to watch it. My husband is a fireman, and he now lives in New Albany (as opposed to Caleb being in Albany in the movie). There are soooo many parallels. I have never been able to sit and watch even the whole trailer. I never see all of it for the blurry vision it causes every time.  I love horror movies and will watch them alone any time, but not that movie. Not watching it alone. No way.

There are only two seens where anyone is in danger.  Most of the movie deals with the Caleb's struggle to win his wife back.  It isn't the most original movie, but the Love Dare sounds interesting.

[DarkHalo]

How typical of the moonbats to say it is a 'male' thing when it is actually a 'muslim' thing. They are so controlled by their political correctness. You would think after so many years of reading that sewer pit I wouldn't be surprised by anything they said no matter how stupid, sexist and racist. But they continue to surprise me with their idiocy.

[ace61502]

There are only two seens where anyone is in danger.  Most of the movie deals with the Caleb's struggle to win his wife back.  It isn't the most original movie, but the Love Dare sounds interesting.

It's not the seeing a firefighter in danger that I'm worried about. It's not that at all.

[Vagabond]

It's not the seeing a firefighter in danger that I'm worried about. It's not that at all.

Well, if it helps, Caleb is a real jerk at first.  He won't do the grocery shopping, cook, clean the dishes, or the house.  Apparently his days off are taken up dreaming about his boat and internt porn.  He complains to his best friend that his wife doesn't respect him.  His wife isn't perfect, she has an emotional affair with a doctor and shut down those oh so critical lines of communication.

I think it happens in a lot of marriages.  You wake up and find that the person you are married to and promised to love for all time has become a sort of enemy.

[ace61502]

Well, if it helps, Caleb is a real jerk at first.  He won't do the grocery shopping, cook, clean the dishes, or the house.  Apparently his days off are taken up dreaming about his boat and internt porn.  He complains to his best friend that his wife doesn't respect him.  His wife isn't perfect, she has an emotional affair with a doctor and shut down those oh so critical lines of communication.

I think it happens in a lot of marriages.  You wake up and find that the person you are married to and promised to love for all time has become a sort of enemy.

Yep, sounds a lot like us except the emotional affair was his and there was no porn issue. That's what scares me. I'm going to have a serious breakdown basically seeing us on the screen and knowing he's not seeing it. Although.... I bought 4 extra copies and a guy from my church is going to deliver them to the fire stations. Surely one of the firemen will want to watch it and maybe he'll see it. Even if it doesn't touch him, maybe it will help someone.

[delilahmused]

Proverbs 31:10-31 is a wonderful example of how a woman can be productive, and even bring in an income, while still fulfilling her role as the keeper of the home.  It talks about her selling fabric she makes, selling produce, and buying a field and planting a vineyard.

One of the saddest things I hear, even from conservative women is that they could NEVER stay home with or homeschool their kids because they couldn't stand to be around them all day. Sometimes they laugh a little...that little "you know what I mean" defensive laugh. I can't imagine feeling that way about my children. Don't get me wrong, having boys is like having little wild animals running around. There's nothing like the sound of a soccer ball sailing through the air at a brand new lamp. Of course neither were responsible...we had the rare soccer balls that could launch themselves across the living room. There were definitely times when dad took them fishing on the weekend whether he was planning to or not, lol. But why bother having them if being home with them would drive you crazy?

I absolutely don't accept the "we can't afford it" option. The savings from not having to buy as much gas, pay for day care, lunches, new clothes, "quickie" dinners,  is pretty substantial. We adjusted our lifestyle for the benefit of our family, we didn't adjust our family for benefit our lifestyle. Children (even teenage boys) need their mommies more than they need $150 pair of Nikes.

Both of my boys tell me that when they were kids it was sometimes frustrating when their friends got a new video game system that we couldn't afford but that now they're adults they tell me they were luckier than their friends. I know it's true because I have a 24 year old Marine who still calls me as often as he can to say prayers at bedtime. You can't buy that with any salary and it sure the hell beats the "need" for a new car every few years.

The proof of the detriment to society is pretty apparent if you look around. We've got a couple generations (the Messiah being a prime example) who don't spend enough time with family to offset the liberal blather they get in school. It saps them of their independent spirit and saps our country of its greatest asset. We have a generation of WWII vets going to their grave having to watch their country slowly sink into the fascism they fought against. It breaks my heart.

Cindie