Prius designer says industry must lose oil addiction

[jtyangel]

And desire for profitability apparently. Look at the line I bolded. LOSING money on a hybrid to produce it is supposed to be attention to ramp up production? Now I understand with new products, initially there is sometimes a loss while development costs are covered and costs are still high, but it seems a lot of peeps both conservatives and liberals would like automobile companies to hasten their production of these vehicles at great financial risk to themselves. The average consumer has yet enmasse to vote this technology in with their wallets. Well, my concern is we all know where this is going. There are groups who would and probably already do put pressure on the gov to step in and provide the pressure via funding to make things move quicker.

Even Reinhardt, who helped design the Prius, seems to understand they need the money to develop new technology, but I get a sense he is decrying that those profits may go out to stockholder's rather then being reinvested in what he deems as worthwhile technology.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=aoCSD7m5zHhA&refer=exclusive

Jan. 23 (Bloomberg) -- Bill Reinert, who helped design Toyota Motor Corp.'s Prius hybrid, hovers in a helicopter 1,000 feet over Fort McMurray, Alberta. On this clear November morning, he's craning for a look at one of the world's largest petroleum reserves where there's not an oil well in sight.

Instead, in a 2-mile-wide pit below, trucks head to refineries with loads of sand weighing more than Boeing 747s. Yellow flames shoot skyward as 900-degree-Fahrenheit (482- degree-Celsius) heat liquefies any embedded petroleum. Floating scarecrows and propane-powered cannons do their best to chase migrating birds from lethal wastewater ponds.

Eventually, nuclear reactors may surround the crater 270 miles (435 kilometers) northeast of Edmonton, Alberta, delivering the power required to wring oil from sand.

``This is what the end of the age of oil means,'' says Reinert, 60, who plans the vehicles Toyota will make in a quarter century as national manager for advanced technology at the U.S. sales unit in Torrance, California. ``The car-based culture, the business-as-usual of building cars and trucks, is going to change dramatically.''

snip

The company earns about $6,000 before taxes in the U.S. on an SUV. That compares with a $1,000 profit on a Corolla and a small loss on a Prius, says David Healy, an analyst at New York- based Burnham Securities Inc.

[Uhhuh35]

It seems the future may belong to Hybrid Diesels:
http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=493

"It's called the VW 2 Liter, which means it sips just 2 liters of fuel every 100 kilometers. That's about 117.53 miles per gallon in US terms.

[jtyangel]

It seems the future may belong to Hybrid Diesels:
http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=493

"It's called the VW 2 Liter, which means it sips just 2 liters of fuel every 100 kilometers. That's about 117.53 miles per gallon in US terms.

Yes, I've heard of those. I believe there is talk of making luxury cars with this mix isn't there?

[DixieBelle]

While he's flying around Canada in a heliocopter (how much fuel does THAT take??) he should buzz over to the nickel mine in Ontario that can be seen from space. Toyota supposedly takes 1000's of tons of nickel (for the Prius batteries) ships it to England, then China and finally to Japan before it ends up in the car. Doesn't sound very "ecological" to me.

There was a report done in 2006 called "Dust to Dust" that basically said the Hummer (3 I think?) was more envoirnmentally friendly than the Prius. Toyota is now crying foul and claiming the report is not accurate because it wasn't "peer reviewed' and the methodology wasn't revealed. Yet, Toyota offers no concrete proof of their own on the claims. And they claim that the mine is "100 years old - the vegatation was killed years ago!" and that the amount of carbon emissions from their nickel extractions are "minor".

I read the report and I don't see any major flaws. I'm no statistican though...

http://cnwmr.com/nss-folder/automotiveenergy/

Here they tackle their critics -
http://cnwmr.com/nss-folder/automotiveenergy/Response%20to%20Pacific%20Institute.pdf

Suck it Prius!!! 

[Chris_]

It seems the future may belong to Hybrid Diesels:
http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=493

"It's called the VW 2 Liter, which means it sips just 2 liters of fuel every 100 kilometers. That's about 117.53 miles per gallon in US terms.

Yes, I've heard of those. I believe there is talk of making luxury cars with this mix isn't there?

Audi (owned by VW) has a turbo-diesel sport setup.  That sucker will howl...

[Uhhuh35]

Yes, I've heard of those. I believe there is talk of making luxury cars with this mix isn't there?

That would be fine with me. I'm sure hybrids are the future. And I have no problem with the so-called "green technology" but it damn well better well perform as good if not better than my current car and cost no more if not less.

[jtyangel]

Yes, I've heard of those. I believe there is talk of making luxury cars with this mix isn't there?

That would be fine with me. I'm sure hybrids are the future. And I have no problem with the so-called "green technology" but it damn well better well perform as good if not better than my current car and cost no more if not less.

Agreed.

And Chris, that is what my other half has his eye on: an Audi.

[Lacarnut]

It seems the future may belong to Hybrid Diesels:
http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=493

"It's called the VW 2 Liter, which means it sips just 2 liters of fuel every 100 kilometers. That's about 117.53 miles per gallon in US terms.

I might be interested in autocrossing that car but a 1,500 pound doodle bug on the road is not my idea of feeling safe. If a 4,000 or 5,000 SUV or car hits that thing at anything over 30mph, you are seriously injured or dead. China is getting ready to bring those small death traps to the US.

Hyrid cars are more expensive and depreciate more rapidly. If the tax advantages were taken away, these things would not sell. Then there is the expense of replacing the batteries and no one talks about the env. impact of dumping millions of those dead batteries.

Recently an Air Force C5 flew coast to coast with a mixture of Aviation Gas and a mixture of natural gas and coal mixture. This derivative cost between $45 and $70 per barrel. This could be used in automobiles in the next few years.     

[Chris_]

If the auto industry (or technology in general) doesn't come up with something more efficient that the lithium-ion battery, we will be facing the same high prices and supply pinch from LIO that we have now with oil in ten years.  South America has the largest reservoir of mineral deopists for manufacturing LIO's but to replace every car on the road w/ a hybrid would deplete those supplies even faster than petroleum.

[Rebel]

I see no one has asked for my input on this subject yet.