Author Topic: Texas church shooting leaves many dead  (Read 10623 times)

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Offline thundley4

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #25 on: November 06, 2017, 11:11:13 AM »
What if the Air Force didn't tell the FBI about the domestic assault?

Then that is the fault of the federal government and the laws they have passed regarding background checks.

I've always assumed that federal agencies should share information that would affect gun rights.

Offline Eupher

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #26 on: November 06, 2017, 11:58:45 AM »
If he was convicted of assaulting his wife or had a DD both disqualifies him from owning a gun.

If he purchased the guns from a licensed dealer it is the states fault for not denying the purchase when his background check was performed.

The State of Texas does not require a background check. That is a federal requirement.

If the perp bought the rifle from a private seller, that would circumvent the intent to keep wife-beaters from buying weapons. But if he bought it from a licensed dealer, there should have been a background check.

Let's talk about the dumbass form that is used to initiate the background check - I'm too lazy to look up the number right now.

It's a series of questions for the purchaser that asks things like "Are you a fugitive from justice?"

That's federal law for you.  :whatever:
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Offline Old n Grumpy

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #27 on: November 06, 2017, 11:58:57 AM »
What if the Air Force didn't tell the FBI about the domestic assault?

then the gubermint is guilty allowing a disqualified person from getting a gun.
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Offline thundley4

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #28 on: November 06, 2017, 12:02:05 PM »
The State of Texas does not require a background check. That is a federal requirement.

If the perp bought the rifle from a private seller, that would circumvent the intent to keep wife-beaters from buying weapons. But if he bought it from a licensed dealer, there should have been a background check.

Let's talk about the dumbass form that is used to initiate the background check - I'm too lazy to look up the number right now.

It's a series of questions for the purchaser that asks things like "Are you a fugitive from justice?"

That's federal law for you.  :whatever:

I read that he bought the rifle from a sporting goods store.

Offline Old n Grumpy

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #29 on: November 06, 2017, 12:02:30 PM »
The State of Texas does not require a background check. That is a federal requirement.

If the perp bought the rifle from a private seller, that would circumvent the intent to keep wife-beaters from buying weapons. But if he bought it from a licensed dealer, there should have been a background check.

Let's talk about the dumbass form that is used to initiate the background check - I'm too lazy to look up the number right now.

It's a series of questions for the purchaser that asks things like "Are you a fugitive from justice?"

That's federal law for you.  :whatever:

it is a 4473
link:https://www.atf.gov/file/61446/download
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Offline Eupher

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #30 on: November 06, 2017, 12:03:42 PM »
I read that he bought the rifle from a sporting goods store.

Then that store will be getting lots of visits from the feds. They're gonna be asking lots of questions.
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Offline Eupher

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #31 on: November 06, 2017, 12:04:31 PM »
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Offline thundley4

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #32 on: November 06, 2017, 12:08:34 PM »
Thanks.

This form is a joke.

OTOH, it does allow for federal prosecution if the person lies on it.

Offline Eupher

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #33 on: November 06, 2017, 12:37:49 PM »
OTOH, it does allow for federal prosecution if the person lies on it.

Generally only if the firearm is used in conjunction with another felony. Prosecutions for lying on the form are rare.

IOW, it's yet another mostly useless document that is used to restrict law-abiding people from their 2nd Amendment rights. This is what we trade away in the illusion of "security" and "safety".
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Offline BlueStateSaint

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #34 on: November 06, 2017, 01:16:30 PM »
Bearing Arms found the reason . . .

https://bearingarms.com/tom-k/2017/11/06/texas-church-killer-purchased-four-guns-four-years/

The pertinent paragraph:

Quote
For what it’s worth, it sounds like the shooter’s court-martial conviction didn’t get added to the database used by the NICS.

However, before that, Tom Knighton manages to include this little item:

Quote
In April 2016, [the shooter] purchased the Ruger AR-556 rifle he allegedly used in the shooting from a store in San Antonio, Texas, a law enforcement official said. There was no disqualifying information in the background check conducted as required for the purchase, a law enforcement official told CNN.

At one point, the shooter tried to get a license to carry a gun in Texas but was denied by the state, Abbott said, citing the director of Texas’ Department of Public Safety.

“So how was it that he was able to get a gun? By all the facts that we seem to know, he was not supposed to have access to a gun,” Abbott said. “So how did this happen?”

Someone screwed the pooch.
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Offline Old n Grumpy

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #35 on: November 06, 2017, 04:37:30 PM »
Then that store will be getting lots of visits from the feds. They're gonna be asking lots of questions.

You can bet your ass the BATF will be going through their records with a fine toothed comb. Any 4473 that is missing a dotted I or a uncrossed T will be written up.

Obviously this is a case of the records not being complete. his domestic violence conviction is a cause for denial as well.
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Offline dutch508

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #36 on: November 06, 2017, 06:55:03 PM »
You can bet your ass the BATF will be going through their records with a fine toothed comb. Any 4473 that is missing a dotted I or a uncrossed T will be written up.

Obviously this is a case of the records not being complete. his domestic violence conviction is a cause for denial as well.

according to a report on Weaslezippers, the Air Force did not file the conviction paperwork.  :argh:
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Offline Ptarmigan

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #37 on: November 06, 2017, 09:27:36 PM »
Devin Kelley's troubled past included divorce, domestic battery, and time in the stockade
http://www.ksdk.com/article/news/nation-now/devin-kelleys-troubled-past-included-divorce-domestic-battery-and-time-in-the-stockade/465-da30c007-039b-45c1-92b5-9610ae667888

Quote
NEW BRAUNFELS, Tex. – The 26-year-old gunman responsible for the deadly mass shooting at a Texas church had a long, troubled past – divorce, domestic battery and a failed U.S. Air Force career that ended with time in military prison – before he carried out the macabre attack on Sunday worshipers, authorities said.

Investigators are still probing what led Devin Kelley to target the First Baptist Church in the small town of Sutherland Springs, Texas, but authorities noted he was embroiled in an ongoing domestic dispute with his wife’s family. His mother-in-law had attended the church, but his in-laws were not at Sunday’s deadly service.

“We can tell you that there was a domestic situation going on within his family,” said Texas Department of Public Safety regional director Freeman Martin. “The mother-in-law had attended this church. We know she had received threatening texts from him.”

Shouldn't Devin Kelley gotten a dishonorable discharge since he broke the child's skull? That is really bad. I know he got a bad conduct discharge is above dishonorable discharge.
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Offline Ptarmigan

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #38 on: November 06, 2017, 10:22:42 PM »
Officials: Family threats preceded mass shooting at First Baptist Church
http://www.expressnews.com/news/local/article/Officials-Family-threats-preceded-mass-shooting-12336722.php

Quote
No divorce records for Kelley are on file in Comal County, where he lived. Three years ago, sheriff’s deputies responded to a suspected domestic disturbance at Kelley’s address on FM 2722 two months before his marriage to Danielle Shields, records show.

A friend had called authorities after Shields sent text messages complaining she was being abused by her boyfriend. The deputies’ report identifies the male subject involved as “Devin,” but says no action was taken and describes the situation as “a teenaged drama.”

Kelley was also named as a suspect in a reported sexual assault four years ago, according to redacted records released by the Comal County Sheriff’s Office on Monday. The report was taken at 11:44 p.m. on June 17, 2013, and lists the offense as “rape by force.” The name of the victim is redacted, and no additional details were available Monday.

He was under investigation for sexual assault. I wonder why he did not go to prison for that.
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Offline Ptarmigan

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #39 on: November 06, 2017, 11:04:39 PM »
From the now deleted LinkedIn page.

Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.
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Offline RobJohnson

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #40 on: November 07, 2017, 02:22:34 AM »
Speaking of twitter:
Quote
Obama sent out a two-part message on Twitter Sunday evening, repeating his usual call for gun control.
“We grieve with all the families in Sutherland Springs harmed by this act of hatred, and we’ll stand with the survivors as they recover. May God also grant all of us the wisdom to ask what concrete steps we can take to reduce the violence and weaponry in our midst,” Obama stated.

http://dennismichaellynch.com/obama-responds-to-texas-shooting-on-twitter-dml-hits-back/

Offline Ptarmigan

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #41 on: November 07, 2017, 09:36:37 PM »
Texas church shooter Devin Kelley once escaped from a psychiatric hospital while in the Air Force
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/11/07/texas-church-shooter-devin-kelley-once-escaped-from-psychiatric-hospital-while-in-air-force.html

Quote
Texas church shooter Devin Kelley escaped from a psychiatric hospital five years before carrying out the worst mass killing in Texas history, according to a police report released on Tuesday.

The report stated that El Paso police were advised Kelley, then 21, was a danger to himself and others as he had been caught smuggling firearms onto Holloman Air Base in New Mexico and was trying to carry out death threats against military superiors.

Kelley stormed the First Baptist Church in Sutherland Springs, Texas, on Sunday as services were being held, killing 26 people, including an 18-month-old and a pregnant woman, and wounding 20 others. Officials said that before the shooting Kelley sent threatening texts to his mother-in-law who attended the church but wasn’t there Sunday.

Making a death threat against military superiors is grounds for a dishonorable discharge on top of nearly killing the child. That is really bad.  :mad: :argh:

He should of never been in the Air Force. How did he end up in the Air Force?  :mental:
« Last Edit: November 07, 2017, 09:40:43 PM by Ptarmigan »
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Texas church shooting leaves many dead
« Reply #42 on: December 08, 2017, 11:12:54 AM »
Twitter is full of leftist idiots.

Eugene Gu, MD‏
https://twitter.com/eugenegu/status/927271620703645697
 :bird:
 :bird:

Who else BUT mindless twits would even bother to go there?
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