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Offline Chris_

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #25 on: July 22, 2008, 11:27:42 PM »
Quote from: rich_t on July 22, 2008, 11:22:50 PM
Quote from: Vonne on July 21, 2008, 12:41:18 PM
Do you believe in legislating morality?


Morality can not be legislated.  Nor should there be any attempt to do so.
Morality is the BASIS for legislation -- it is quite different than legislating morality.
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Offline rich_t

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #26 on: July 22, 2008, 11:27:53 PM »
Quote from: MrsSmith on July 21, 2008, 01:08:29 PM
We already legislate morality.  We always have.  We always will.

I disagree.  We have legislation that punishes certain behaviors deemed unaccpetable by what is currently unpoplular.   I personally do not equate that to morality.

Is it moral to be gay?  Not IMO.  Is it illegal?  Not these days.   Hell, there is hardly even a social stigma against it in many places.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #27 on: July 22, 2008, 11:28:26 PM »
Quote from: Toastedturningtidelegs on July 22, 2008, 08:02:16 PM
Quote from: Wineslob on July 22, 2008, 02:49:57 PM
No, but you can't have sex outside.  :tongue:   Dipshit
Sure you can I have many times! :-)

Two words: thorns.  sand.
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Offline rich_t

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #28 on: July 22, 2008, 11:41:37 PM »
Quote from: rich_t on July 22, 2008, 11:27:53 PM
Quote from: MrsSmith on July 21, 2008, 01:08:29 PM
We already legislate morality.  We always have.  We always will.

I disagree.  We have legislation that punishes certain behaviors deemed unaccpetable by what is currently unpoplular.   I personally do not equate that to morality.

Is it moral to be gay?  Not IMO.  Is it illegal?  Not these days.   Hell, there is hardly even a social stigma against it in many places.

I know I worded my previous post poorly.

What I was trying to convey is that the perception of "moral" has changed over the years as our society has changed.

When I stated that morality shouldn't be legislated, I was thinking along the lines of making pre-marital sex (which many find immoral) illegal, as an example.


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Offline MrsSmith

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #29 on: July 23, 2008, 09:40:30 PM »
It seems that the only "morals" that should not be legislated are the sexual ones.   :whatever:
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Offline rich_t

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #30 on: July 23, 2008, 10:05:05 PM »
Quote from: MrsSmith on July 23, 2008, 09:40:30 PM
It seems that the only "morals" that should not be legislated are the sexual ones.   :whatever:

I'm not sure that anyone has stated that.  I was merely using one or two examples from the top of my head.

What sort of immoral behavior, if any ,do you think should be legislated?

What some find immoral, I might not and vice versa.  Which is why I am always a tad concerned when the topic of legislating morality comes up.

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Offline rich_t

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #31 on: July 23, 2008, 10:21:34 PM »
Quote
Our laws are biblically based, no matter how people deny that today.

Some are.  Many more are not.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #32 on: July 23, 2008, 11:09:35 PM »
Quote from: rich_t on July 23, 2008, 10:21:34 PM
Quote
Our laws are biblically based, no matter how people deny that today.

Some are.  Many more are not.

The USC is based on Biblical concepts.  All laws flow from that and thus are, indeed, Biblically based.
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Offline rich_t

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #33 on: July 23, 2008, 11:12:07 PM »
Quote from: freedumb2003 on July 23, 2008, 11:09:35 PM
Quote from: rich_t on July 23, 2008, 10:21:34 PM
Quote
Our laws are biblically based, no matter how people deny that today.

Some are.  Many more are not.

The USC is based on Biblical concepts.  All laws flow from that and thus are, indeed, Biblically based.


Some parts of it may be.  I don't think others are...  Such as the laws concerning firearms, FCC regulations, EPA regulations, political campaigning etc.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #34 on: July 23, 2008, 11:13:32 PM »
Quote from: rich_t on July 23, 2008, 11:12:07 PM
Quote from: freedumb2003 on July 23, 2008, 11:09:35 PM
Quote from: rich_t on July 23, 2008, 10:21:34 PM
Quote
Our laws are biblically based, no matter how people deny that today.

Some are.  Many more are not.

The USC is based on Biblical concepts.  All laws flow from that and thus are, indeed, Biblically based.


Some parts of it may be.  I don't think others are...  Such as the laws concerning firearms, FCC regulations, EPA regulations, political campaigning etc.

The framework is Biblical -- you confuse the items with the container.
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Offline rich_t

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #35 on: July 23, 2008, 11:20:48 PM »
Quote from: freedumb2003 on July 23, 2008, 11:13:32 PM
Quote from: rich_t on July 23, 2008, 11:12:07 PM
Quote from: freedumb2003 on July 23, 2008, 11:09:35 PM
Quote from: rich_t on July 23, 2008, 10:21:34 PM
Quote
Our laws are biblically based, no matter how people deny that today.

Some are.  Many more are not.

The USC is based on Biblical concepts.  All laws flow from that and thus are, indeed, Biblically based.


Some parts of it may be.  I don't think others are...  Such as the laws concerning firearms, FCC regulations, EPA regulations, political campaigning etc.

The framework is Biblical -- you confuse the items with the container.


No.. I don't confuse the items with the container.  I was intentionally speaking about the items.  And I was doing so for a reason.

The comment I responded to read:

Quote
Our laws are biblically based, no matter how people deny that today.

Any blanket statement that says our laws are bibically based is incorrect.  Now if the statement had read that the framework of our laws is bibically based... I would have agreed.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #36 on: July 23, 2008, 11:21:35 PM »
Quote from: rich_t on July 23, 2008, 11:20:48 PM
Quote from: freedumb2003 on July 23, 2008, 11:13:32 PM
Quote from: rich_t on July 23, 2008, 11:12:07 PM
Quote from: freedumb2003 on July 23, 2008, 11:09:35 PM
Quote from: rich_t on July 23, 2008, 10:21:34 PM
Quote
Our laws are biblically based, no matter how people deny that today.

Some are.  Many more are not.

The USC is based on Biblical concepts.  All laws flow from that and thus are, indeed, Biblically based.


Some parts of it may be.  I don't think others are...  Such as the laws concerning firearms, FCC regulations, EPA regulations, political campaigning etc.

The framework is Biblical -- you confuse the items with the container.


No.. I don't confuse the items with the container.  I was intentionally speaking about the items.  And I was doing so for a reason.

The comment I responded to read:

Quote
Our laws are biblically based, no matter how people deny that today.

Any blanket statement that says our laws are bibically based is incorrect.  Now if the statement had read that the framework of our laws is bibically based... I would have agreed.
If the framework is Biblically based then the laws are.
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Offline The Night Owl

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #37 on: July 24, 2008, 07:01:07 PM »
Quote from: freedumb2003 on July 23, 2008, 11:21:35 PM
If the framework is Biblically based then the laws are.


So, if a brick house has a wooden frame, it should be called a frame house? That doesn't seem right.
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Offline MrsSmith

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #38 on: July 24, 2008, 09:39:14 PM »
What were our original laws, before our legislature decided to start impressing everyone with their verbosity?  Those were absolutely Bible-based.  The additions are largely garbage.

Quote
What sort of immoral behavior, if any ,do you think should be legislated?

What some find immoral, I might not and vice versa.  Which is why I am always a tad concerned when the topic of legislating morality comes up.

Quote
Murder is immoral, yet we legislate against it. 

Theft is immoral, ditto. 

Perjury, ditto. 

Adultery, ditto. 

Incest... 

Sexual abuse of children...

Sexual abuse of animals...

Sexual abuse of the dead...

We also legislate against free speech from Christians, even on private property

We legislate against adults driving or riding in cars without seat belts

We legislate against smokers

How many pages of legislation deal with the proper way to slaughter cattle, or house kennel dogs?  How many pages of legislation deal with transporting fruit?  How about the pages...pages?  books...of legislation dealing with taxation in all it's forms.   We legislate everything.  Why on earth would anyone care if we also legislated sex outside marriage?  Is that the "holy grail" that the government isn't allowed to touch?   ::)
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Offline The Night Owl

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #39 on: July 25, 2008, 11:40:52 AM »
Quote from: MrsSmith on July 24, 2008, 09:39:14 PM
How many pages of legislation deal with the proper way to slaughter cattle, or house kennel dogs?  How many pages of legislation deal with transporting fruit?  How about the pages...pages?  books...of legislation dealing with taxation in all it's forms.   We legislate everything.  Why on earth would anyone care if we also legislated sex outside marriage?  Is that the "holy grail" that the government isn't allowed to touch?   ::)

To paraphrase Christopher Hitchens... I really don't think that people in the time before the Bible or the Commandments thought that things like theft, rape, and murder are okay. If they had thought that, humanity probably wouldn't have survived. The truth is that the Bible got its morality from mankind, not the other way around.
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Offline RobJohnson

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #40 on: July 25, 2008, 11:52:57 AM »
Quote from: The Night Owl on July 22, 2008, 01:14:55 PM
Quote from: RobJohnson on July 22, 2008, 12:58:34 AM
Having "thoughts" and acting on those thoughts are two different things.

Let me try this a different way...

A lot of people consider sex outside of marriage to be immoral. Should government legislate against sex outside of marriage?

No.

I don't think sex outside of marriage is immoral.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #41 on: July 25, 2008, 12:53:01 PM »
Quote from: The Night Owl on July 24, 2008, 07:01:07 PM
Quote from: freedumb2003 on July 23, 2008, 11:21:35 PM
If the framework is Biblically based then the laws are.


So, if a brick house has a wooden frame, it should be called a frame house? That doesn't seem right.

You once again demonstrate your complete ignorance.  It is pointless trying to school you.
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Offline rich_t

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #42 on: July 25, 2008, 01:48:12 PM »
Quote from: freedumb2003 on July 23, 2008, 11:21:35 PM
Quote from: rich_t on July 23, 2008, 11:20:48 PM
Quote from: freedumb2003 on July 23, 2008, 11:13:32 PM
Quote from: rich_t on July 23, 2008, 11:12:07 PM
Quote from: freedumb2003 on July 23, 2008, 11:09:35 PM
Quote from: rich_t on July 23, 2008, 10:21:34 PM
Quote
Our laws are biblically based, no matter how people deny that today.

Some are.  Many more are not.

The USC is based on Biblical concepts.  All laws flow from that and thus are, indeed, Biblically based.


Some parts of it may be.  I don't think others are...  Such as the laws concerning firearms, FCC regulations, EPA regulations, political campaigning etc.

The framework is Biblical -- you confuse the items with the container.


No.. I don't confuse the items with the container.  I was intentionally speaking about the items.  And I was doing so for a reason.

The comment I responded to read:

Quote
Our laws are biblically based, no matter how people deny that today.

Any blanket statement that says our laws are bibically based is incorrect.  Now if the statement had read that the framework of our laws is bibically based... I would have agreed.
If the framework is Biblically based then the laws are.


Nonsense.

What is the bibical basis of the recently overturned D.C. handgun ban?
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Offline Wineslob

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Re: Curious Question
« Reply #43 on: July 25, 2008, 04:18:11 PM »
Quote from: Toastedturningtidelegs on July 22, 2008, 08:02:16 PM
Quote from: Wineslob on July 22, 2008, 02:49:57 PM
No, but you can't have sex outside.  :tongue:   Dipshit
Sure you can I have many times! :-)


Well, ya the wife and I did in Hawaii  :hyper:, but ya had to be on the lookout.  :uhsure:
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